Info about the Chinese Cash Shop "Level Jumping Potions"

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Originally Posted by Dragon_Sanders

For a long term (until today, I'm afraid), new players as potion takers are unwelcomed among the Chinese. You can imagine the reason--they immediately reach lv50, do not understand the MSQ, do not know most skills and mechanics, some even do not know what to do after lv50.
Despite the ones who learn quickly, complaints about potion takers in team play are just like "can they read a little guide before joining us" "can they at least put on proper gears""can they buy something useful with the gils"...Both sides are unhappy with this: potion takers feel hard to continue the game, others feel hard to teach the potion takers.
However the Chinese agent don't care----you buy the potion, they get your money, their mission ends; leaving the potion takers and the angry old players quarreling themselves. Many people bought the game because of the potion, and left soon for the same reason.
Maybe you feel jealous about not having it, but in most occasions it is nothing more than toxic.

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+1. this is what i feel would happen if we get those jump potions. the impatient people who "jumped" would have 0 clue about what goes on in the end game or how to play their character properly and in doing so they would most likely to not get invited (or kicked from) into PF's and statics and are as likely to quit playing the game (due to this) same as those who feel overwhelmed by the amount of quests they have to do from ARR if they didn't "jump".

the patient ones who do use it would likely spend the time to learn but would end up getting bored faster since there's not much left to do (currently prior to 4.0 majority of the game's content is the journey, not the destination)

This fits perfectly with the new additional actions system. Why do you think that is also changing? Now people skip to lvl 60 and possibly story and just get all additional skills without leveling other classes. They are taking the essence of this game little by little. Now its like every other game 1 job for 1 character YAY!!!!

I guess I don't really care about leveling potions. If someone wants to skip, let them, it don't impact me. People complain they won't know how to play their job. That already happens. In 2.0 people FATe grind to level cape. There is no rotations in fates. Just spam AOE as fast you can. Rotations at 40 are different than they are at 60, they just have to relearn anyway.

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Originally Posted by Astyrah

the impatient people who "jumped" would have 0 clue about what goes on in the end game or how to play their character properly and in doing so they would most likely to not get invited (or kicked from) into PF's and statics and are as likely to quit playing the game (due to this) same as those who feel overwhelmed by the amount of quests they have to do from ARR if they didn't "jump"...

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Yes, the "impatient" issue is quite serious. Some Chinese complain that even they have enough patience to teach and help, they hardly get a patient learner. Some taught hard, offered everything they can give, finally got a message saying their saplings were AFK.
We can tell ourselves not all the potion takers are impatient, but how well can the situation be, if they even do not bother to finish lv1-50? I find people would abandon their gain much faster if they get it by money, rather than by long-term effort.

So it's about $13 for someone to generate 300,000 gil out of thin air? That's probably about what you get from the msq up to that point, but it seems a bit odd to let them print gil like that on the fly. Some supplies (teleport tickets, potions) along with the feathers they already get for gear sounds more reasonable.

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Originally Posted by Dustytome

So it's about $13 for someone to generate 300,000 gil out of thin air? That's probably about what you get from the msq up to that point, but it seems a bit odd to let them print gil like that on the fly. Some supplies (teleport tickets, potions) along with the feathers they already get for gear sounds more reasonable.

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The potion will only give you exp, no gil. I hope.

Well, they can go back and edit the rather good but sometimes poorly paced story-line so that a week or two of fairly casual play gets you caught up to the latest expansion, or charge extra money to skip it.

What do you think they're going to go with?

A disadantage to the jumping potion nobody seems to have noticed yet (unless it was in the 5 pages or so i skipped). Since we got effecively rid of tell RMT spam by imposing a min lvl to your char. The only places you get "/say" spam is in the 3 starting cities its so bad there i turn off the 'say' channel when in those cities. Now imagine the advertising bots being able to use their "/say" spam in every region, and again use "/tell" spam since they would be the same level as every other character. Please god NO.

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Originally Posted by Jandor

Well, they can go back and edit the rather good but sometimes poorly paced story-line so that a week or two of fairly casual play gets you caught up to the latest expansion, or charge extra money to skip it.

What do you think they're going to go with?

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And then have to do it again with the next one.

And the next one.

Changing the previous story stuff (in ways that make it still work, since they are clearly committed to tell a cohesive story) would be a lot more work than I think people realize - rewriting in multiple languages, testing all the triggers to make sure those work, deciding how to handle anyone who happens to be in the middle on a part they want to cut. Imagine having to reevaluate that every few years for the entire breadth of the game's story...with the risk of pissing off those who like the story as it is. That would pull resources (time at the very least, if not money) from content being added...

It's not just about choosing the profit generating option.

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Originally Posted by JCharms

There's no chance at all of them allowing anyone to skip paying for HW via this method.
I don't know how or why you would even assume this?

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Did you not read the OP? It autocompletes the scenario.

Hold on, can brand NEW players use this if they want?

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Originally Posted by Xiao_

"people will get to max level with no idea how to play!"
have you been in dutyfinder lately? no one knows how to play!

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People use this argument time and time again and this can't possibly be as bad as people think.
I must be damn lucky because playing since Beta phases in 2.0 I've rarely had BAD players.
This game is so easy, I do stuff in RF/DF all the time as I'm pretty 'solo' player.
If anything, you all should blame FATE's and MAYBE POTD because all you need to do is
mindlessly spam crap and play follow the leader 1-10 levels reset over and over while watching Netflix all day.
Game pretty much caters to going Zombie mode.

Also, since SE is too lazy to cut MSQ in half, they outta start then. Also also, you want people to instant level
while skipping a lot of dungeons and stuff, you needa start cutting down a lot of low level stuff then.
No point in trying to shove old content down our throats if people will all be end-game lol.
Needs to be cut, thrown away or added in higher level's. Getting a little tired of running 3 year old dungeons tbh...

This doesnt affect any of you BUT still complain like the spoiled kids you all are "I worked too hard for this, they need to work as hard as I did".

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Originally Posted by Keikun

This doesnt affect any of you BUT still complain like the spoiled kids you all are "I worked too hard for this, they need to work as hard as I did".

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It affects many people - for the reasons they've stated. It's not really your business to decide what does and does not effect somebody else's enjoyment of the game or their experience. If you want to argue in favour of the potion in question then do so - there's little need to be snide or try to brush off opposing opinions as irrelevant when it's crystal clear that it's a divisive issue.

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Originally Posted by Caitlinzulu

A disadantage to the jumping potion nobody seems to have noticed yet (unless it was in the 5 pages or so i skipped). Since we got effecively rid of tell RMT spam by imposing a min lvl to your char. The only places you get "/say" spam is in the 3 starting cities its so bad there i turn off the 'say' channel when in those cities. Now imagine the advertising bots being able to use their "/say" spam in every region, and again use "/tell" spam since they would be the same level as every other character. Please god NO.

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But you have to pay for the potion.

Unless they really think that they'll be able to get to a new, untapped (and willing to pay, natch) marketplace by buying the jump potion, I don't think they're going to do that.

My concern with this thing is that it might bring a lot of new impatient players. Those that leave a dungeon before it starts or when they see a new player message or start to berate a newbie as soon as they make their first mistake. While it has been a while and things might have changed, it required quite a bit of patience to get through the story and the early, as many describe it, slow paced combat. Which in return turned at least few people away from the game and that might be not a bad thing. Why is patience even of importance? Well, because the community is being described as 'generally nice' and a significant part of that is people are patient, especially with newcomers. What functions now as some sort of filter will be bypassable.

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Originally Posted by Mugiawara

If anything, you all should blame FATE's and MAYBE POTD because all you need to do is
mindlessly spam crap and play follow the leader 1-10 levels reset over and over while watching Netflix all day.
Game pretty much caters to going Zombie mode.

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this is exactly my point though, that one argument against it is meaningless because we already having people get to 60 with no idea how to play their class, due to braindead leveling. honestly i think ESPECIALLY potd is to blame because it gives people the idea that they're playing well, besides the fact that all the mobs and even bosses are super easy compared to even just dungeons

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Originally Posted by Xiao_

this is exactly my point though, that one argument against it is meaningless because we already having people get to 60 with no idea how to play their class, due to braindead leveling. honestly i think ESPECIALLY potd is to blame because it gives people the idea that they're playing well, besides the fact that all the mobs and even bosses are super easy compared to even just dungeons

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It's not pointless. Those players have to do put time and effort into getting where they are. Surely they're learning something in the process. The duty finder is a mixed bag, sure, but why add to the problem of dubious players by encouraging even more players not to invest in the game itself but the fabled 'end game' which they may not even be able to invest in anyway?

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Originally Posted by ErdrickLoto

But you have to pay for the potion.

Unless they really think that they'll be able to get to a new, untapped (and willing to pay, natch) marketplace by buying the jump potion, I don't think they're going to do that.

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Umm they use stolen credit cards or their own cash to pay account subs so a potion is hardly going to break the bank.

And if these potions can be gifted there will be a likely rise in RMT trying to sell them cheaper.

I don't really care if people know the story, that won't affect me when I run a random dungeon with them. However, if e.g. Mr. Paladin doesn't even know his attack buttons and what stance to use, THAT affects me majorly.

If this potion comes to us, I will seriously consider quitting. Not because I am "jealous" that people get what I worked for by paying, but because an already rotten DF with horrible players will get nothing but unbearable. Think of people that bought an account and their lack of knowledge.


Also, it's pretty clear that some people here close their eyes towards what P2W (Pay to Win for those that don't know) entails. Our current cash shop is not P2W. Why? Because by buying a glamour or a dye, you do not gain any progression in the game. Mounts all have the same speed so they are not P2W either. P2W is ANYTHING that helps your progress faster in the game. That also includes levels. Not to mention that the chinese packages also include other stuff like gil and the feathers. It's so P2W it is screaming in your face. All F2P games are P2W to a certain extend, that is how they survive. However, FFXIV is a SUBSCRIPTION game. Subscription games in my opinion should have some advantages:

- Certainty that with a decent amount of subs, there will be regular content of high quality
- All PROGRESSION content is exclusively available in-game
- F2P retards are kept out because of the monthly fee. This should mean the community is more mature, alas it isn't always true
- All content is available to everyone on an equal basis (minus seasonal events)

FFXIV already wavers on some of these points (content quality, maturity of the community, some shop-exclusive items) but right now, in my opinion, it's minor. It's not SEs fault the community is pretty much rotten and I don't care about some ugly mounts and seasonal items being available in the shop.

Fortunately, after also having checked the Japanese Forum, I am confident that this potion will not be available. It would be crossing a line this game will not recover from and the next step would most certainly be going F2P.

From a dev standpoint i would be annoyed by a jump potion, only because the devs work hard on story stuff. If i worked on this game i would be irked that my hard work would just go ignored. But that's just me.

From a business standpoint though, imagine all that sweet sweet money.

And from a player outlook, I wonder how people who use it are going to gear up if they are a newbie. I mean we can complain about bad players and all but will this potion come with gil and how much will it cost?

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Originally Posted by Keikun

This doesnt affect any of you BUT still complain like the spoiled kids you all are "I worked too hard for this, they need to work as hard as I did".

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Actually it does.

If SE releases a jump potion and use it as an excuse never to fix the leveling process (and the MSQ one) when vertical expansions rolls out, it is going to be an issue for everyone.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

Actually it does.

If SE releases a jump potion and use it as an excuse never to fix the leveling process (and the MSQ one) when vertical expansions rolls out, it is going to be an issue for everyone.

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How would you propose they fix the levelling process and how do they account for the ever expanding MSQ?

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Originally Posted by Belhi

How would you propose they fix the levelling process and how do they account for the ever expanding MSQ?

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a) by decreasing the XP required to level up till the players reach the new expansion level range.
b) by making each expansion MSQ independent (as in FFXI).

It's common sense, I m not inventing anything.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

a) by decreasing the XP required to level up till the players reach the new expansion level range.
b) by making each expansion MSQ independent (as in FFXI).

It's common sense, I m not inventing anything.

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(a) could be done probably pretty easy.

(b) is another matter entirely. Maybe if their questing system wasn't tied to progression but it is. Apparently just letting people go back and replay old story quests would require resetting a players progression all the way back to that point. Its also the reason the Journal can't take into account story choices when it replays cutscenes. I complete overhaul of the questing system would likely be a pretty major amount of work.

More to the point (b) would undermine one of the things I most love about FF14's story: the sense of continuation and progression of narrative. My character has a history and it is recognised and impactful on the world. I walk into 4.0 with all that history behind me and the allies I have made along the way and it sets the tone for the story I will play. Changing this is something I would most definitely be against.

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(b) is another matter entirely. Maybe if their questing system wasn't tied to progression but it is. Apparently just letting people go back and replay old story quests would require resetting a players progression all the way back to that point. Its also the reason the Journal can't take into account story choices when it replays cutscenes. I complete overhaul of the questing system would likely be a pretty major amount of work.

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In order to make any given storyline optional you just have to modify the prerequisite from the first HW (or stormblood) quest.

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More to the point (b) would undermine one of the things I most love about FF14's story: the sense of continuation and progression of narrative. My character has a history and it is recognised and impactful on the world. I walk into 4.0 with all that history behind me and the allies I have made along the way and it sets the tone for the story I will play. Changing this is something I would most definitely be against.

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The jumping potion already does just that, so I don't really understand what your point is.

Nope. Please SE, don't follow World of Warcraft :(

so i am just curious to understand how anybody can be against this. I've played xi for years hardcore, played xiv since alpha release hardcore, leveled a crapton of classes to max, i've been playing for so long i lost the count.

But i can tell you something for sure, after you played xiv trough main scenario quest once, you can not do that again, you can not get the same xp boost you get from these quests because you already have done these, so you are left into a mindless fate grinding or spamming the same dungeons (you have been doing) over and over.

Now can please someone sane explain me where is the fun in that for you to complain about intruducing a leveling potions? If you have fun in doing what i've just explained, just do it, the potion wont remove anything from you, go ahead, your choice, but why do you have to complain about an alternative?

It is quite objective that leveling is extremely boring, especially since you can not benefit from the main scenario quests xp and gils. When FATEs came out everyone was complaining about how boring was that system, yet it was never changed. Now complaining because someone doesnt want to do a repetitive boring grinding that litterally doesnt help you trough anything (unless you are new to the game, in that case i can understand but still you have a choice to play the game trough MSQ or not) in particular, makes me laugh honestly.

It is a good thing and personally i'd just let people have all old MSQ completed even if they are new to the game, full access to Heavensward to everybody and 1 class already at 50 as soon as you start the game.

Are you one of these players that love storyline, read all the text, do all the quests? do it, no one prevents you to
Are you one of these players who gets bored after the same quest over and over, click here, teleport there, talk with this npc, talk with that npc, report to that npc? buy the potions and skip it.
Are you one of these players who love to bild your character step by step, level by level, you want to grind and love to exp at your own pace? go do it.
Are you one of these players who doesnt like to level other classes after your main because it is just repetitive mindless grinding on a game that is already so much repetitive with weekly lockouts and recycled content? buy the potion and skip it.

Everyone is happy, not sure why you want to deny other people to be happy too, sounds selfish to me.

Oh and in case you pulling out the card of "but people dont learn their class if they get boosted to 50", that is simply bs, there are people that played for years and they are still crap, so skipping 50 levels wont make the difference between a good and a bad player. if you understand how the game works you'll be fine.

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Originally Posted by DarkB

It is quite objective that leveling is extremely boring

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Hardly. Since I can tell you that I had a good deal of fun leveling everything up, and feel a tad bored with end-game progression by comparison. That might not be your experience, but saying that leveling is boring is an objective fact is objectively wrong.

Now yes, you do have a point. I would utterly ignore these potions, they would not influence how I choose to experience the game in the slightest. I'm free to delve as deeply into the game's world as I like as I always have. Those who choose to just skip everything? Their loss.

But while that is true, I and many others I'm sure, feel that it sets a worrying precedent. It has been mentioned previously in this thread that, contrary to what some like yourself claim, such potions have had a negative influence, and oftentimes create more problems for those who use them than they solve. Moreover, I personally feel that encouraging such outright lazy options will only encourage further lazy behavior; both in players and, more worryingly, in the developers. Now I can't say that this is a certainty, merely a [potentially unfounded and paranoid] fear of mine. But all the same, regardless of how little an impact they may have on my personal experience, I will maintain that such things are a bad idea, plain and simple.

When you start very late a game, it's very often that you misses the community action.
For example in multiplayer game, unless it's very popular game,, it's not unusual to have hard time finding people to play with, because the lobbies are empty and most players have moved on.
It's also true for MMO. It's not unusual for "newbie towns or newbies activities" to be deserted, which its kinda of shame since it's the opposite of what MMO should be, you should not be alone.

A real example that happens to me in FF XIV:

I took more than a 2 year break from the game and have come back for a little less than 2 months. Right after I joined I did all the MSQ + SQ that had been released since I quitted and then gained access to Heavensward.
I was really looking to explore around and also enjoying all these new Fates. Right............... Excepted there is kind of nobody doing fates, besides the rare players doing quickly few fates for their Anima.
And soloing Heavensward fates is slow and painful compared to ARR. So I asked my friends about it, and they said everybody was doing Fates when Heavensward was released. But now it's kind of dead, and sadly I was hoping to level my alt-classes doing these new fates.( I know some will say go level alt in POTD or whatever, but I really enjoy leveling-alt classes in Fates, and I'm not interested in POTD.)

That's just one aspect of the game but there are others that are less active. Trying to complete old duties if you play at odd hours, is like falling asleep waiting for the queue to pop in Duty Finder. And it's very unlikely you wind find a group with the Party Finder for old duties even during populated hours, leaving you only to use the DF with random people. PF-wise most of the action is the current end content or people farming ex-trials for Khloe in PF. :p

Basically coming late to the game, leveling becomes more of a chore than originally because of lack of potential teammates to share in the activities matching your progression. So I understand why someone new to the game would want to start at the current stage where most of the community is active, so they can enjoy where most of the action in the game is currently at.

So while I'm not interested in using jump potions, I understand if someone wants to use a potion that would allow an unique class per character to be boosted to the level entry for the current expansion, with a basic set of gear, and the previous MSQ completed.

I am however against JOB potions like on the Chinese servers. Having an unique class auto-leveled is enough to enjoy the last released content with the rest of the community. Having the possibility to level-up every classes on a single character with just potions is just a luxury and I don't think it's necessary, I personally don't welcome it.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

In order to make any given storyline optional you just have to modify the prerequisite from the first HW (or stormblood) quest.

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If that was true then replaying quests would be much simpler and wouldn't require the reset on progression of all other MSQ quests set after it.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

The jumping potion already does just that, so I don't really understand what your point is.

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No it doesn't because the people using the Jump Potion are choosing to opt out of the story progression. For them it would be like starting on the 5th chapter of the book. They might get a summary of the earlier 4 chapters but the book would just continue on as if you have already read the first 4. No effect on me since I wouldn't use the Jump Potion.

On the other hand if SE has to go out of their way to Streamline the MSQ as much as possible to allow people to rush through it, or design it so that it doesn't require previous knowledge it will effect me as a player which frankly bothers me a lot more.

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Originally Posted by Belhi

If that was true then replaying quests would be much simpler and wouldn't require the reset on progression of all other MSQ quests set after it.



No it doesn't because the people using the Jump Potion are choosing to opt out of the story progression. For them it would be like starting on the 5th chapter of the book. They might get a summary of the earlier 4 chapters but the book would just continue on as if you have already read the first 4. No effect on me since I wouldn't use the Jump Potion.

On the other hand if SE has to go out of their way to Streamline the MSQ as much as possible to allow people to rush through it, or design it so that it doesn't require previous knowledge it will effect me as a player which frankly bothers me a lot more.

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Nobody is asking SE to streamline stuff or to change how they are making quests (actually we could discuss this but that's beside the point). They could just make it so, as an option, the first story quest of the new expansions to be accessible before finishing the MSQ from the previous expansion. And to avoid people who d accidentally take that quest before finishing the previous storyline, they could just add a text disclaimer before you take it if you didn't complete the previous MSQ.

Concerning you're first point, I m puzzled because I don't really know what you're talking about. Nobody is asking to replay stuff or whatever (or that's another issue and beside the topic at hand).

There are no problems, only solutions. The only thing making SE "solving" that issue with boosting potion is pure greed and trying to monetize the tedious aspects of FFXIV. But if we learned something from microtransactions in video games, usually trying to get money out of the tedious aspects of a video game doesn't work. The most successful F2P games are always those in which players are happy to spend money on completely neutral or optional stuff on a gameplay standpoint (see league of legends, as an example).

So these are "i am lazy" items?
I cannot believe they would add such a thing. How is this good for the game?
The irony is North American players get critique for sort of being lazy in a sense for not completing content, relics, etc.... and they have leveling potions.... Wow

Well I have to tell you, i will totally get these if they come out here. If only to level my alts each to 50 and clear the msq. Then all my poor ignored alts can add rooms to my fc house for more housing fun.

I hope this never comes to NA, it will ruin this game because the RMT will jump on this and take advantage of these potions.

Not only that you will have people who have no idea what they are doing, who haven't learned anything from experience of playing from the start.

It would be like the Abyss FFXI problem where 35 level went to 99 level and had no skill in weapons joining party's not knowing how to do their jobs.

RMT wouldn't use it because it will likely cost money making RMT uses not profitable.

There are already people who don't know what they are doing who have levelled normally. If anything PotD has only increased this. People who want to and will make the effort to learn will wether they start at 1 or 60.

No one is saying it should be done in a vacuum. Anyone jumping is going to need some guidance and if SE doesn't provide that it would be a disaster. Regardless the current set up is turning people off the game. The climb that a new player has to make to get to the point where they can be engaged in most group content is a long one and will only be getting longer.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

They could just make it so, as an option, the first story quest of the new expansions to be accessible before finishing the MSQ from the previous expansion. And to avoid people who d accidentally take that quest before finishing the previous storyline, they could just add a text disclaimer before you take it if you didn't complete the previous MSQ.

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This is by far the best option IMHO.

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Originally Posted by Belhi

RMT wouldn't use it because it will likely cost money making RMT uses not profitable.
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oh they would, they would mine and transfer all money off to lower lvl characters and preventing the high lvls from getting banned.

then you really wouldnt know who they were.

I personally see 2 potential problems with these "Skip 2.0 & get a lv50 Job" potions:
1) if 4.0 doesn't require 3.0 story completion, only 2.0
2) lack of being able to actually play 2.0's story if u wanted to later (unless they add quest replay funtion)

As of right now, without 4.0 added to game, all these potion's do is give u a lv50 & auto-beat all 2.0 (IE: not a lv60 & NO progress in 3.0, making curent expantion needed to be actually beaten normally). As for the "They won't know there class" problem we already have this without them (be it lazyness, Fate farming or POLD) as long as the potion ant giving them Max level & ALL Quests done for even current expansion they'll "Adapt & Learn or Give up & Quit" (most inconveniance I can see for this is frustrated "Senior"players having to wait on a replacement to them while leveling an Alt class in old/non-max Lv content)...

Just figured I'd point out they give lv50 &/or 2.0 completion ONLY, I'll probably have a different viewpoint when 4.0 is added, that & their 2 (or technically 11) different buyable items not an all-in-1 (thou I can see that being a bundle on Chinese Cash shop by 5.0) I just think the biggest question is "What would this affect when 4.0 is added?" if they wait till 4.0 it gives SE time to think up a "countermesure" for access to 4.0 if used or added... I'm gona wait till then & make another opinion about this idea if its added at that time.

I just dont understand why someone would want to skip all the game just to go into the end game fast.

I mean, there isn't even a propper end game right now. We have the raiding in normal dificulty, roulettes, Savage and Extreme and yet everything falls away when new ILVL items are set because of new content. It will be burned again in the first couple of days and the cycle of "there is nothing else to do" will begin anew. It will probably be that rythm over and over again until we reach the top level cap AND Square decides what kind of endgame we will face then. Heck, if you are not planing to do Savage or Extreme it isnt even neccesary to farm the top ILVL items right now, it will become useless in time.

So, why the rush?

Why to PAY a game to skip it?

Personally, for an alt character i can see why, you did all the story on your main class, and the post 50 lead up to HW is LONG and tedious, so being able to start an alt out in HW would be nice.

I know you don't NEED an alt in this game, but you can and a lot of people like different race/sex so options are nice.

(I have 3 alts and 2/3 are current with story line, one is 50 and not to HW yet and yeah, she likely wont be for some time )