Punishing divas who jump ship before a dungeon even begins.

Idea a diva buff that shows you left. Plz SE I want to be a diva 24/7. Cuz I'm fierce.

Roulettes, low level especially, as referenced in the OP, are designed to populate lower level dungeons with higher level players. A player can bail on whatever dungeon they choose, for low DPS, slow pace, or what have you, but when a person is bailing on roulettes specifically, there is an issue. It's a waste of time for every single player involved, yet the penalized player is the least affected. The leaver incurs a 30 minute in game penalty, while they craft, FATE, or log off entirely for their lockout. The players left behind must choose to wait for a replacement, which takes a varying amount of time depending on the required role, or disband and queue again, which means it takes them that much longer to get the same reward that they already queued for, waited for, and got into an instance for. All because the person rolling roulette wasn't feeling the dungeon, despite knowing full well that it had a chance of coming up.

If you simply can't stand the thought of rolling DD or AV, then select the dungeon you want to play and play it. No roulette bonus, but no surprises. If you want to throw your hat in the ring for a game of chance, you should know that not every outcome will be favorable to you. If you can't handle that, there are other options for you to acquire experience or tomestones in a setting of your choosing. No one is forcing you to do roulettes, but when you do and decide to bail, you're forcing the rest of the party to wait an unnecessary, undetermined amount of additional time because you chose to sign up for an optional, randomized piece of content. Just have a little courtesy and complete the content you signed up for.

I'll tell ya what, throw in a rare dye as a reward and I'll heal AV with lvl 47 white geared tanks n deeps.

I like the idea of forfeiting your bonus if you quit the dungeon/trial.

I outright refuse to do some dungeons so if i get them in a roulette im leaving straight away. Thousand maws for example, nobody should have to suffer through that or if i've had that same dungeon/trial consistantly over the last few roulettes (brayflox, steps)

You need to balance punishment in you incentive to join a que meant to populate dungeons that many people have little reason to enter past the max level of the dungeon (hunts are and some quests these only populate dungeons for a limited time). While it can be annoying to have someone leave AV it gives you more than a fair chance to get lost of if not all of your party. The more punishment the less people run it. Same with reward less reward less runs (I only use low for leveling).

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Originally Posted by MeiUshu

then I must be a minority too beause I like it too..there is nothing hard in there, unless the tank pulls too many mobs more then he can chew...there is nothing hard and gives a hell lot of exp. Why people hate it is something I find it hard to understand.

Anyways, if people leave and eat the penalty, they have my respect, they didnt waste my time they decided to go as an adult should, we can disbanned and requeue or wait for replacement. If you are in a roulette, requeuing for one shouldnt be too long and you probalby wont come back to AV...so really not sure why peopel complain.

Besides, all those that consider themselves Mr or Mrs perfect, you sure you ALWAYS were in that situation where you needed no help AT ALL from anybody ? especially in a new dungeon you have never done ? ...no need to answer I already know it ...

Why people have so little patience...I Wonder.

Mei

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Healers hate it because it's a poison filled shitehole.

You are constantly dispelling, people walking in all the swamps taking more damage and the idea of clicking on an item to remove poison doesn't work for half of the people i grouped with and i had to force heal through all the damage.

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Originally Posted by Assirra

Healers hate it because it's a poison filled shitehole.

You are constantly dispelling, people walking in all the swamps taking more damage and the idea of clicking on an item to remove poison doesn't work for half of the people i grouped with and i had to force heal through all the damage.

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I hate it because people are stupid. Avoiding aggro is too much to expect, as is dodging telegraphed attacks that don't have a floor mark.

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Originally Posted by Reynhart

Simple penalty : "If you withdraw from your Roulette, you'll lose the bonus for the day"

Want the reward ? Play by the rule !

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That's actually pretty smart :O

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Originally Posted by xLucia

That's actually pretty smart :O

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It is. No doubt it can also punish people that have real reasons for dropping out of the blue like new parents who need to AFK at a moments notice or people taking care of a family member, important call, etc but it's usually not the case. Another good addition I think could be to add a second layer to the rule. Something like: If withdraw and before the first 10 minutes then forfeit bonus, since usually the people who cherry pick the instances do it right at the start. By the time 10 minutes have passed they'll probably be past the first or getting to the second boss so a bigger chance they'll just stick with the rest of the run.

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Originally Posted by BloodPact

It is. No doubt it can also punish people that have real reasons for dropping out of the blue like new parents who need to AFK at a moments notice or people taking care of a family member, important call, etc.

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I'm a "new" parent, and if I HAVE to withdraw for something important IRL, I couldn't care less about losing one day of daily bonus on one of my roulette.

Daily Roulette are not something you absolutely have to do each day, it's something that rewards you each day...or you really need to rethink about what is a "game". :p

err no...lol...I am not sure why you say all because it is e rare...I have played healer all my time since back in 2013, I have done AV a zillion times cant even remember the number, people walking in the poison happens but is just a question of telling them once, what healers dont like, is heal constantly or better said work, which at times is just a pain especialyl when barely geared for it, I can grant this...other then that is a pretty easy dungeon, difficulty is just with the cyclope, where most people forget to move when giant look at them or dont focus on the giant to see when he is about to cast his swing or swipe.

the only real problem I had was with tanks not geared or pulling entire rooms and over estimating their capacity to hold aggro..other that there is nothing hard in there.

Everybody makes it evil, when is just THE dungeon in my eyes to level to cover the last mile to reach 50.

Each to their own really...and is true ..Patience is a virtue that even Saints at time lose

Just me though

Mei

Punishing people does nothing.
I can always choose not to play the game since I have more than enough things to do (and other games to play).
More punishments leads to more people avoiding DF, which then causes longer queues, etc.

What SE needs to do is add more incentive for us to actually bother with those dungeons.
That's how you get people to participate, not by scaring them away.

Use some common sense, people.

PS: If I want my bonus, I'll queue up with friends/FC. So arguing that way is pointless as well.

Have you ever tanked aurum vale or Darkhold with a bunch of green leaf noobs ? not exactly a good time.

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Originally Posted by Adventica6

Have you ever tanked aurum vale or Darkhold with a bunch of green leaf noobs ? not exactly a good time.

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That shouldn't be reason to just quit from a dungeon. I've handled tanks who only pulled 1 to 2 mobs in Thousand maws dungeon throughout the entire way. Beginners gotta start somewhere, suck it up and enjoy the ride.

I did try going through to see it it was mentioned why people quit at the beginning but...

Obviously those that don't want to spend time in that dungeon quit...or have to leave.

In quite a few cases, people are funneled into a dungeon that no one in the party needs. No worries if someone wants to quit. As a person who has started out as a DPS I know the feeling of long queues and will stay if people need it. But if no one needs it, the game has no way of determining that I quit for X reason - so punishing someone for a longer time than already there doesn't discriminate why a person left a dungeon.

Speeding up queues for friends before a player has to log out. In the case of a lot of dungeons, queue times are ridiculously long, especially MSQ especially. It's faster to queue in for a DPS if a healer is in the party for that content and go on without a healer (they eventually get replaced a good number of times) and the MSQ is quite easy with them missing anyways.

Another reason are bots. Sorry not gonna waste any time being in queue with bots.

Now if they can base a penalty system on people quitting on those that are IN NEED of said dungeons and 2 those in need players are not bots. I'm all for it. But if people are quitting because the instance a bunch of 50 players are getting is Tam Tara (and they don't need it). I don't see taking the regular penalty is a problem.

This isn't going to solve everything because Yoshi P has designed the current state for players to be able to take longer breaks from it anyways because he does want players to go play other games and come back to it, instead of being on it so much you burnout and quit. So a longer penalty isn't going to work. Forcing a dungeon on al lower level dungeon until you complete it, is going to make me avoid that roulette for a long time, and getting tomes isn't that hard. Leveling roulette is useless unless I was leveling a job :P

It may be also good have a penalty for thread necromancers, maybe one day of forum post locking for each month the thread was old, is sufficient to have some well known people necroing just once per year!

There are certain dungeons, trials etc I just have no interest in suffering through, so I rather take my 30 penalty and be done with it. The party will fill again, no harm, no foul.

TitanMen does find the best threads to necro.

At least this one has some relevance I suppose...

When I see all those threads coming back to life I start feeling old.

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Originally Posted by Ryaz

Even when tanking I'm not exactly sure why someone would leave and take a 30 minute lockout. Chances are, even with the slowest players, you're going to finish in about 30-40 minutes, so you might as well suck it up. I think the only time I've left a group as a tank so far was at the end of SV as we wiped four times because the healer didn't even try dodging the boss' line AoE and kept dying. I literally watched him stand there, move to one side and then the next and then just give up on trying to move out.

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I find that people who are in a rush always end up wasting their own, and everyone else’s time.
No idea why. Completely counterproductive..

For example: I’ve seen impatient tanks leave 3/4 of the way through a dungeon that was running a tiny bit slower, saying they were going to just queue up all over again, starting from the beginning with a new party, in hopes of getting a faster group. They seemed completely oblivious to the fact that they would have been done within 5 minutes if they just continued through the dungeon..

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Originally Posted by Hayward

OK, these princess tanks who bail out of Dzemael Darkhold and Aurum Vale have pushed me to the limit. S-E really needs to consider one of two things to stop this garbage:

*Gray out the Leave button in Duty Finder for 5 or 10 minutes into the beginning of the Dungeon.

*Impose a 60 minute penalty for leaving inside of the same time period.

All of these special snowflakes who think they're too good to participate in dungeons really need a reality check.

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It's 2020 who still uses the words "snowflake" as an insult lol

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Originally Posted by FF16Necromancer

It's 2020 who still uses the words "snowflake" as an insult lol

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it WAS 2015 when the poster started the thread....

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Originally Posted by Hayward

OK, these princess tanks who bail out of Dzemael Darkhold and Aurum Vale have pushed me to the limit. S-E really needs to consider one of two things to stop this garbage:

*Gray out the Leave button in Duty Finder for 5 or 10 minutes into the beginning of the Dungeon.

*Impose a 60 minute penalty for leaving inside of the same time period.

All of these special snowflakes who think they're too good to participate in dungeons really need a reality check.

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Intentionally holding people hostages in duty will just cause them to act out more. They're doing you a favor by leaving right away so just let them leave.

Why do people think Aurum Vale is hard? Stay close to the left going in, do not pull EVERYTHING at once, eat the fruits when you get 2 stacks the first time and 3 stacks in the last dungeon. Use your AOEs and make sure that in between pulls are not too large for either the tank or the healer. Been doing that since the very beginning (way before overbearing and over leveling became a thing) and it still works.

The trick to any dungeon is for the party to communicate. If your tank or healer is uncomfortable with large pulls, just say so. If someone is new and doesn’t know a mechanic, stop and explain it to them. Don’t simply say, “watch the video for next time”.

People that run out of dungeons should just not join a roulette. If you join, see it through.

I personally think if you abandon duty prior to a certain time elapsing that your bonus for doing said roulette should be consumed, don't give a queue penalty, but just outright consume the bonus for it. But alas this is a bad idea because then people would only AFK the duty which only impedes on the other players in the duty- It's genuinely sad that people have this mentality towards duties.

In any case it is sad to think in quite a few cases the people being punished the most aren't even the ones bound by the 30 minute penalty. But rather those that genuinely needed to queue for the duty in order to complete a quest, level up, for grand company ranking, or even for story, which is a problem/

Do people really have an issue with Darkhold and Aurum Vale so bad that they leave? I've done those dungeons so many times and sans like the first 2 times I did Vale I haven't really encountered groups that struggle. People who leave dungeons like that should be forced to play toto-rak 5 times in a row and experience true suffering.

Point being, out of all the dungeons out there, I feel like there are more "leave-worthy" ones that exist...

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Originally Posted by Kaurhz

I personally think if you abandon duty prior to a certain time elapsing that your bonus for doing said roulette should be consumed, don't give a queue penalty, but just outright consume the bonus for it. But alas this is a bad idea because then people would only AFK the duty which only impedes on the other players in the duty- It's genuinely sad that people have this mentality towards duties.

In any case it is sad to think in quite a few cases the people being punished the most aren't even the ones bound by the 30 minute penalty. But rather those that genuinely needed to queue for the duty in order to complete a quest, level up, for grand company ranking, or even for story, which is a problem/

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Some of it is the same issue with the cutscenes crowd, what i mean is... Going into levelling as a 70 something and getting sastasha nm.
The run will take as long as a level 70 dungeon, esp with a new healer/tank or whatever, but you're not going to get rewarded similarly for the time. Add on to that, the effects of low level syncing on some jobs entire toolkit. This might be the happiest medium, but i dont exactly blame people for bailing if it doesnt seem as rewarding. Perhaps they need to up the rewards to keep people in the duty, or rethink what is allowed in level sync. Dunno. Could eat your daily bonus as others suggested, but then people would just stop signing up altogether eventually(theres still 50/60/70 dungeons and cut losses). That side effect would be even more detrimental for new players who need to complete the duty just to move on in story. Whatever they do do to the current system, should they do it, is going to cost one side of the fence something. The one that suffers most will definitely be the ones who need to clear it.

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Originally Posted by ADVSS

Some of it is the same issue with the cutscenes crowd, what I mean is... Going into leveling as a 70 something and getting sastasha nm.
The run will take as long as a level 70 dungeon, esp with a new healer/tank or whatever, but you're not going to get rewarded similarly for the time. Add on to that, the effects of low level syncing on some jobs entire toolkit. This might be the happiest medium, but I don't exactly blame people for bailing if it doesn't seem as rewarding. Perhaps they need to up the rewards to keep people in the duty or rethink what is allowed in level sync. Dunno. Could eat your daily bonus as others suggested, but then people would just stop signing up altogether eventually(there's still 50/60/70 dungeons and cut losses). That side effect would be even more detrimental for new players who need to complete the duty just to move on in the story. Whatever they do to the current system, should they do it, is going to cost one side of the fence something. The one that suffers most will definitely be the ones who need to clear it.

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I would much rather the roulette, leveling in particular just give exp that is equivalent to a full level-appropriate dungeon. E.g. if you get Sastasha Normal Mode at Lv71, it should give experience equivalent to running Holminsters, I don't think giving people their entire toolkit for the said dungeon is an appropriate way of handling it, but rather just a reward which is equivalent to it (I think this is already the case, or very close to it?). Gods can only imagine a Summoner with their Level 72 toolkit going into Sastasha. I do get it, nobody enjoys pressing 1 button every 2.5 seconds for 11 minutes, but that's no reason to abandon a duty.

I absolutely blame people for bailing. It is, after all a roulette, you get what you're given and you attempt to complete said duty to the best of your ability, as should be an expectancy, really. If the group is, well in a state where said duty absolutely cannot be cleared, be it geared healers, or lack thereof, for example. Then sure there's a moment you cut losses, and vote abandon the duty, or just leave (hence the; after a certain amount of time has elapsed).

That being said I think the number of people that would openly refuse to do roulettes for the fear of not getting what you like is in the minority, fortunately. I think if a few duties are leading you down a path where you consider not signing up for duty then there's a more fundamental issue going on with the player.

I think OP is specifically talking about tanks or healers? Because that's one of the reasons why no one goes tank or healer for the most part. If a DPS leaves who cares? you still can DPS a boss so long as you follow the mechanics, but if the TANK leaves then the entire party is at a stand still with just trash. So if you put a bigger timer on these needed classes than that would further discourage tanks and healers to run dungeons or pick up the class in general. As a tank I am nervous going into any dungeon at any time because something could happen at any given time where I must leave (especially since I am a parent), but I love being a Dark Knight. I feel like the penalty is fine at 30 mins, but I think it should increase with consecutive abandons until the next reset day.