End game... Bored. The facts.

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Originally Posted by Davionx

The whole "rush to cap and raid" gameplay is dead. Maybe play the game less than 8 hours a day doing fates over and over again until you hate the game. Just glad I got over the whole rushing to cap to raid when it was viable.

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Some of you guys do realize this is the second version of FF14 right?

I never grow tired of seeing people rush to lvl cap to complete everything asap then complaining nothing to do. I have yet to play an MMO where this does not happen aside from FFXI. Your own fault nothing to do because you rushed it.

So what is up with all the people on Sargatanas? I believe the most complaining comes from that server.

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Originally Posted by coffeepotz

So what is up with all the people on Sargatanas? I believe the most complaining comes from that server.

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It's a Legacy server?

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Originally Posted by Alfarjamie

That's why i liked XI so much, because even though it was kinda bad in ways, it was completely unique and that's what made it fun rather than being like every other MMO.

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Fact of the matter is YoshiP deliberately opted in favour of a "safe" MMO, which is replicating features from established MMOs, a bit of adjusting, and putting a FF skin on it. Considering how 1.0 went, it is understandable, though I'm not really happy with it. In my opinion what we have now is ~mediocre, and I don't see that much interesting stuff on the horizon. I still hope for Crystal Tower being absolutely awesome

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Originally Posted by Ladon

Some of you guys do realize this is the second version of FF14 right?

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This. They rebuilt the game from scratch and already had in mind that a large group of players were already at end game, with new players coming in they purposely made lvls 1-49 to be a joke. If that's the case then is there really an excuse for poor foresight in this situation? Remember this is their 2nd iteration of the same game.

That's not to say that the game isn't enjoyable. Personally I like the game so far since I haven't cleared things as quickly as everyone else. But if I were in many of these peoples shoes who have the time to commit more than a few hours a night then I would be upset. If I was still in school like I was when 11 came out and cleared everything that quickly then I would be peeved too. So the OP does have a valid point.

For me right now it's really log on Monday, knock out Coil 1-4 in an hour, 4 AK runs and log off. Since T5 is down right now, this week is pretty much shot. I'm working on leveling other classes, but this is a poor excuse for endgame that yes most MMO's have trended to.

Fact is, I would have rather had a launch in November with CT and Coil, with BL coming in 2.2 + extra content to the existing dungeons. What gets me is releasing CT(a raid that will more than likely drop Ilvl 80 gear and be easier than your current content). It won't be long before Twintania is on farm now that she will be getting fixed. So basically, it's log in and clear Coil + CT in a night, cap Myth and wait for 2.2.

2.2 is going to decide a lot about the game, and they need to release their plans for at least the first year so the community can see what kind of direction they are taking the game. It's a fantastic game, but it wasn't ready for a full release with the lack of content imo.

It's like companies don't look at why other MMO's fail before making their own(Rift, Tera, Warhammer, AoC)

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Originally Posted by Orsnoire

Yeah....it doesn't matter the specific timeframe. If you "rush" through content without bothering to do lateral progression, you're rushing and doing it wrong...at least in this game.

The entire conflict in this thread is about the core game mechanic for FF XIV: it's designed to get you to develop more than a single job. If you decide not to play that mechanic, I really have only 2 things to say to you:....

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Try and stay away from making silly ad hominem arguments, not helping your case.

Every MMO has "lateral progression", we call it rolling an alt. The only difference here is that it's all in one character and that instead of redoing your quests you just farm FATEs all day every day. It really isn't anything revolutionary and it won't save the game anymore than it has saved any of the other games that tried to have rerolling as their main end game.

lol, so basically you hate all current end game content and are already hating the upcoming content before you even tried it.

Why are you even here?

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Originally Posted by traja

Try and stay away from making silly ad hominem arguments, not helping your case.

Every MMO has "lateral progression", we call it rolling an alt. The only difference here is that it's all in one character and that instead of redoing your quests you just farm FATEs all day every day. It really isn't anything revolutionary and it won't save the game anymore than it has saved any of the other games that tried to have rerolling as their main end game.

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The difference is, rolling alts in a different game doesn't give you benefit for your main. So no, it's not at all the same thing.

The fact that you believe it is betrays your misunderstanding of the basic premise of XIV.

Just a REALLY obvious case in point: if player A doesn't have his or her cross class abilities done, then he or she is quite literally gimped for endgame content, and has objectively not finished even basic progress for his or her primary job.

That person then claiming that this game has nothing to do and that they've run out of content is ignoring their own most basic progress, and, as I said before, is doing it wrong.

Edit: also, it's poisoning the well, not ad hominem. Pointing out a clearly observable fact (your level) isn't an attack on you personally. It undermines your credibility, but that's why it's a poisoning the well fallacy and not ad hominem. Try to actually understand what fallacies you're going to call people on before using them, as it further undermines your credibility when you use them inappropriately.

(fun fact: your statement

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not helping your case

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is a poisoning the well fallacy as well, so hey pot, this is kettle, you're black)

This game will never have enough content for you to spend 8+ hrs a day grinding through the perceived fast path to gear. You are better off spending your money on a 1mil pc puzzle cause that model is gone guys.

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Every MMO has "lateral progression", we call it rolling an alt.

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If your on a different character it's not exactly "Lateral", as it is a different character that in turn has to do all over again:

- Profession
- Gathering

They also don't have:

- Cross-classing

Not to mention you have to create a totally different character.

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Originally Posted by Starlord

If your on a different character it's not exactly "Lateral", as it is a different character that in turn has to do all over again:

- Profession
- Gathering

They also don't have:

- Cross-classing

Not to mention you have to create a totally different character.

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Yes but the current end-game contradicts this system because lock-outs and token caps are shared per character not per job. What's the point in leveling up another job if you are just going to spend all of your Myth on your main job and then use that job to do your 1 run a week Coil run?

Right now you are actually better off creating a completely new character if you want to level up something else because you'll also get an whole new set of timers that don't conflict with your main job.

// What's the point in leveling up another job if you are just going to spend all of your Myth on your main job and then use that job to do your 1 run a week Coil run?//

which is why I always say to my self that it's better to just make a whole new character if planning to make an alt, and yes this I believe you raised a strong point, cross classing is only useful for the cross class buffs.

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Originally Posted by Ladon

Yes but the current end-game contradicts this system because lock-outs and token caps are shared per character not per job. What's the point in leveling up another job if you are just going to spend all of your Myth on your main job and then use that job to do your 1 run a week Coil run?

Right now you are actually better off creating a completely new character if you want to level up something else because you'll also get an whole new set of timers that don't conflict with your main job.

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Cross class abilities
Gear repairs
Gathering your own mats

All want a word with your incorrect argument.

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Originally Posted by Ladon

Yes but the current end-game contradicts this system because lock-outs and token caps are shared per character not per job. What's the point in leveling up another job if you are just going to spend all of your Myth on your main job and then use that job to do your 1 run a week Coil run?

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When you get your Job you have 1 other class to take from ( up to level 34ish). ( If you kept making Alts for the sole purpose of 1 Job, You will be missing out on 5 other skills to take from that class.) Making alts for that purpose is pointless.

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What's the point in leveling up another job if you are just going to spend all of your Myth on your main job and then use that job to do your 1 run a week Coil run?

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Well, they do have a choice to level up another class that they like and get all the awesome stuff for the class as well. In this game it's not just 1 class/Job, if it was SE would have just did it like any other MMO 1 Character= 1 class.

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Originally Posted by glim

// What's the point in leveling up another job if you are just going to spend all of your Myth on your main job and then use that job to do your 1 run a week Coil run?//

which is why I always say to my self that it's better to just make a whole new character if planning to make an alt, and yes this I believe you raised a strong point, cross classing is only useful for the cross class buffs.

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So you don't need swift cast and sure cast as a SMN?

reeeeally....

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Originally Posted by Orsnoire

So you don't need swift cast and sure cast as a SMN?

reeeeally....

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So you have to level Thaumaturge on another character to 26? What is this, half a days work at most? Seems like a small price to pay to actually be able to get Myth gear and do another run of Coil a week.

As far as I'm aware, usable cross class skills pretty much end at level 34. Getting two additional classes up to these levels to support your main is trivial in ARR.

To be 100% perfectly honest, vanilla WoW--which I decided to play recently on a 3rd party server for comparison--was a better MMO than ARR. More content, more useful crafted items, bigger/better zones, better leveling curve (slower but with far more zones, quests, and dungeons to enjoy), WAY more endgame content even at the time of its release, endgame content that provided you with a chance at more than 40 "points" at the end, etc. FFXI through ToAU was also a far, far better experience than ARR. It still is, really.

I think the current trend for MMO's doesn't fit the P2P model. Companies keep banging their head up against a wall to make an ultra-casual P2P MMO, but none are successful. Even WoW is losing ~2 million players every year now (according to their own press release archives).

The fact is, not very many people will actually continue paying for an ultra-casual MMO, even if it's what they think they want. The proof is in the pudding.

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Originally Posted by Ladon

So you have to level Thaumaturge on another character to 26? What is this, half a days work at most? Seems like a small price to pay to actually be able to get Myth gear and do another run of Coil a week.

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It's just a waist of time to do it on one character then having to do it AGAIN on another.

Arcanist is a prime example, if you wanted SCH and SMN on different Characters you would have to level Arcanist ( SCH/SMN) twice all the way up to 50. Get THM to 15 and CNJ to 15.

I honestly don't think if I wanted to do alts, it would just be a waist of time.

Wait till they add more jobs that branch off from existing classes...

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Originally Posted by Starlord

It's just a waist of time to do it on one character then having to do it AGAIN on another.

Arcanist is a prime example, if you wanted SCH and SMN on different Characters you would have to level Arcanist ( SCH/SMN) twice all the way up to 50. Get THM to 15 and CNJ to 15.

I honestly don't think if I wanted to do alts, it would just be a waist of time.

Wait till they add more jobs that branch off from existing classes...

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How is it possibly a waste of time when leveling another character nets you a ticket to a SECOND SET OF ENDGAME CONTENT?

Do you not realize that you could do Coil and AK the first half of the week on one character then do it again on the second character the second half of the week and actually make progress on BOTH characters in a single week? This isn't something possible with a single character.

We're sorry you're a no lifer who rushed all the content. Yawn. Move on.

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Originally Posted by Ladon

How is it possibly a waste of time when leveling another character nets you a ticket to a SECOND SET OF ENDGAME CONTENT?

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I wasn't even talking about end-game at all in my posts. I'm speaking generally.

- Make a character all over again
- Gathering all over again
- Crafting all over again
- Main storyline again ( some parts won't allow you to skip through the texts) to even get to end-game with that character. At least with 1 Character you don't have to deal with the storyline again.

Personally, I don't think I wanna do things twice in an MMO, single player Yeah, but not in an MMO.------> which is why I DON'T play many MMO's because they follow that "do over again" mentality with a different looking character.

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Do you not realize that you could do Coil and AK the first half of the week on one character then do it again on the second character the second half of the week and actually make progress on BOTH characters in a single week? This isn't something possible with a single character.

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That only works if your the type of person that does "end-game" related stuff on a normal basis. I am the type of person that is well-rounded and doesn't stick to 1 job to dear life. and that cap is only there so they can slow down end-game progression so they can get more end-game in. Once Crystal Tower is in and maybe other End-game content we don't know about yet, they will most likely raise the cap or drop it completely. Then what? You made all those characters with only 1 job on them for nothing. ( unless you like that sort of thing then more power to ya).

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Originally Posted by Starlord

Wait till they add more jobs that branch off from existing classes...

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Yes, I'm sure they have planned for many other Jobs in the future and base classes. At a minimum though, that is atleast 6-7 months off(if it's even in 2.2) The first year in an MMO nowadays is critical. Seperate lockouts for at least CT would be nice. The thing is, if you are clearing Coil, at least the gear you are getting can be used by at least 1 other Job(WHM and SCH) for example. Myth gear is useless for cross classing. The game seems to want you to play many different jobs, but really lacks the ability to do so right now.

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Originally Posted by Pyrix

We're sorry you're a no lifer who rushed all the content. Yawn. Move on.

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Early access was, what, August 24th? How is that rushing? The leveling curve is extremely shallow in this game. And the legacy people, myself included if I actually played that character, started at 50. How long do you expect people to sit around?

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Originally Posted by Sidious

Early access was, what, August 24th? How is that rushing? The leveling curve is extremely shallow in this game. And the legacy people, myself included if I actually played that character, started at 50. How long do you expect people to sit around?

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Feeding the trolls...

The OP is a pretty dead on accurate. Most of the reasons why I will not be subbing, as well as many of my friends.

The idea Yoshi keeps saying patch 2.1.... thats ALL you hear. That or responses to what i believe are very stupid questions on the forums. Replying to battle sounds... really?

Its like he just uses patch 2.1 to get around any major issue. I guess a brand new game will be coming out in this "Patch 2.1"?

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Originally Posted by Alfarjamie

I really can't be bothered with leveling another class, or another craft... One should suffice really so don't list it as a solution.

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Late to the party but you basically just said "there's nothing to do in the game because I refuse to do the content that is available".

You do list a few real issues though. Those can only be solved with more content being added to the game. That's the problem with making games where reaching endgame is very fast, you run out of content just as fast.

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Originally Posted by Orsnoire

So you don't need swift cast and sure cast as a SMN?

reeeeally....

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did you miss the part where I said, "cross class is only useful for cross class buffs" well I should have said cross class skills, but still how is this relevant? when you do decide to play a thauramage on that same character, you can't play it optimally as you did on a SMN, cause you've spent your myth tomes on the SMN class.

edit: which is why if you're planning alts, it's better to create a whole new character, that gives you access to another 300 tomes per week and a lock out for bahamut coil.

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Originally Posted by Gilthas

Late to the party but you basically just said "there's nothing to do in the game because I refuse to do the content that is available".

You do list a few real issues though. Those can only be solved with more content being added to the game. That's the problem with making games where reaching endgame is very fast, you run out of content just as fast.

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I know everyone talks about WoW blah blah...but they had a great history with end game stuff early on and even further on. For example in BC, Black Temple was released before a world first kill of Kael'Thas happened. All of the raids in vanilla were released within ~2 months of a world first kill of a previous kill. They continued this pretty much until WoTLK where times between content got longer and more casual. That type of mentality with content is why people played and stayed for so long. Unless you were on the bleeding edge of content which very few people are, there was always something to be doing.

http://www.wowwiki.com/Timeline_%28World_of_Warcraft%29
http://www.sk-gaming.com/content/163...rld_first_list Source for dates and kills

Part 1

Part 2

People play how they want to play, casuals can be casual and raid at their pace. Hardcore can push content as quick as they can, but the OP is pretty dead on with his points. As of right now, 1 dungeon that drops sufficient enough myth tokens(Depending on your server, the time it takes to even complete can vary wildly waiting in queue). 1 raid that can be cleared in less than an hour, with still at least more than a month for another raid; which will be easier and probably drop either comparable gear to coil or worse(I suspect Ilvl 80). Then another 3 months for any kind of future content. This is a problem for this game long term. Like I said, this is a fantastic game, but the OP brings up very valid points.

I'm so sick of AK, CM, and Prae myself....=/

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Originally Posted by Onolock

Feeding the trolls...

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I'm not a troll, I'm just shallow.

ITT

People who are new to MMOs and expected more.

What's the point of leveling up another class? Its fun. If its not fun then why are you even playing this game? Your looking for something this game will never have.

It sounds like the OP is one of the typical content locusts that will never be satisfied so good riddance. I've seen posts virtually identical to this one on the boards of every mmo I've ever played.

My guild alone(which comprises hundreds of players), while perhaps not an accurate representation of the community at large, is thoroughly enjoying the game for what it is. And a good chunk of these people were around in 1.0 as well.

Just because you don't want to do what's available, doesn't mean the content isn't there.

I don't want gear handed to me, I don't mind it taking months, but it'd be nice if it was months of fun gameplay instead of grinding the same crap over and over and over. Alas, I'm still hooked, I will still sub, and continue the grind, so I can yell at whipper snappers to get off my lawn and tell them how bad I had it at the start, before the new expansion toned down the grind, to absolutely no one since that's who will care: no one. X3

lol Buys Titan run for relic in full AF, can't get a coil run, complains that there's nothing to do endgame. GG OP GG.

The best part about the OP is that he's complaining that there's nothing to do after beating Coil when he hasn't even stepped foot in it.

Stupid character limit

The only problem with this is really the fact that SE rebuilt the game from the ground up. How and why should they focus or have the time to focus on endless endgame content when they are building the game from scratch again.

Sorry you played 1.0 and leveled as much as possible as quick as possible, but guess what SE really didn't even have to rebuild the game, they could have just let XIV die and you could go back to playing XIV, WoW, or any other MMO game.Yeah the game has serious issues and SE May or may not fix them, or even handle them correctly, but the community has issues too. And sorry if you are a content locust who has to eat his/her way to endgame as quick as possible so you can complain about lack of content, go play a F2P instead so you can't complain about wasting either your money on the game purchase and a subscription, or more likely mommy and daddy's money.

If I wasn't unemployed, I might have maybe bought a sub because this game is not half bad, despite the multitude of bugs, which is common in all games now.Of course, the other big issue which SE is powerless to do anything about is the fact that 2 out of every 3 people you meet, usually on your own server and definitely in the DF are completely selfish douchebags who are wasting every else's air by being alive. For a game they didn't have to make, they did a fantastic job and because I had closed beta, open beta, early access, and my free trial time and I played quite a bit everyday, I barely made it to 50 and in the five or six weeks since launch just finished Hydra and started trying Garuda HM.


If you don't like the lack of content despite the enormous amount of content all over the little maps of EOrzea, this is not the game you are looking for and by polluting the forums with your pedantic, selfish drivel, you only make it harder for SE to look for actual things they are able to adjust/fix/take into consideration.