My WAR & the two aspects to make you tank effectively!

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10-01-2013, 05:10 AM
CurlyBruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lhun

That's not why I suggest you use Vengeance. I suggest you use Vengeance because it causes you to counterattack every hit you're given. When you couple that with bloodbath, you are self healing for EVERY auto attack, and healing for 30-100 per enemy strike. This is higher if coupled with unchained. If your opponent is a fast striking enemy (or a group) you heal incredibly fast due to the constant auto attack hits you are dealing.

Vengeance is not gonna produce anywhere near 120-400 damage. If you are including your own auto-attacks and WSs then maybe, but even still 30-100 HP per GCD is a pittance when you are getting regularly blasted in the face for 1500-1700 from regular mob auto-attacks let alone WS.
10-01-2013, 05:11 AM
Dhex

You're not listening. Second Wind is based on Attack in your character's stat window. Unchained removes the -25% damage reduction received from Defiance.

Also you are wrong about Convalescence & Second Wind:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BVb7M27CAAE7uId.png:large

It's entirely predicated by your Attack stat. Unaffected by healing modifiers on Mantra, Convalescence, and Wrath V.

Internal Release, Wrath, and Berserk raise Attack (+50%) and Crit Rate (+25%). Second Wind can critical cure giving a higher value - but it is not modified by +15% Healing from Wrath, +20% from Convalescence, or +5% from Mantra.

Seriously - this takes all of 5 minutes to test and figure out.
10-01-2013, 05:15 AM
Lhun

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurlyBruce

Vengeance is not gonna produce anywhere near 120-400 damage. If you are including your own auto-attacks and WSs then maybe, but even still 30-100 HP per GCD is a pittance when you are getting regularly blasted in the face for 1500-1700 from regular mob auto-attacks let alone WS.

Everyone is missing this here. With vengeance up, you counterattack EVERY...HIT...YOU...TAKE...FROM WHAT YOU ARE TANKING. Including abilities! You also get health from your regular auto attacks, your ability combos, and everything else you happen to be doing at the time. Combine that with unchained as well, and the potential self healing during the duration of bloodbath is much higher.

Even though you're not getting the attack animation for Veng, it goes off every single time you are attacked by an enemy in any way, which in turn with bloodbath, heals you.
10-01-2013, 05:16 AM
Ceelo_Mage

this is great, im going to share this thread with one of my tanks

thanks for the guide looks great
10-01-2013, 05:19 AM
CurlyBruce

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lhun

Everyone is missing this here. With vengeance up, you counterattack EVERY...HIT...YOU...TAKE...FROM WHAT YOU ARE TANKING. Including abilities! You also get health from your regular auto attacks, your ability combos, and everything else you happen to be doing at the time. Combine that with unchained as well, and the potential self healing during the duration of bloodbath is much higher.

Even though you're not getting the attack animation for Veng, it goes off every single time you are attacked by an enemy in any way, which in turn with bloodbath, heals you.

And what you are not getting (cause I even pointed it out in my post) is 30-100 Healing per GCD is nothing compared to the 1200-1700 hits you take on a regular basis from Coil bosses. Even Titan hits for around 800-900 per auto-attack.
10-01-2013, 05:19 AM
Lhun

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dhex

It's entirely predicated by your Attack stat. Unaffected by healing modifiers on Mantra, Convalescence, and Wrath V.

Internal Release, Wrath, and Berserk raise Attack (+50%) and Crit Rate (+25%). Second Wind can critical cure giving a higher value - but it is not modified by +15% Healing from Wrath, +20% from Convalescence, or +5% from Mantra.

Seriously - this takes all of 5 minutes to test and figure out.

You may be hitting a stat floor in your testing currently. This is not the experience I have with this ability. I'll run some tests tonight. Thank you for taking the effort to test this.
10-01-2013, 05:21 AM
Lhun

Quote:

Originally Posted by CurlyBruce

And what you are not getting (cause I even pointed it out in my post) is 30-100 Healing per GCD is nothing compared to the 1200-1700 hits you take on a regular basis from Coil bosses. Even Titan hits for around 800-900 per auto-attack.

Where on earth are you getting 30-100HP per GCD? For the full duration of Bath and Veng (even better with unchained) you will heal anywhere from 500-1500HP for it's duration, depending on the auto-attack speed of your opponent.
10-01-2013, 05:24 AM
ChriskoOnAnotherLevel

Do you often talk in pure common sense phrases to people that already know everything that you are saying?

What any of this has to do with warrior taking entirely too much damage at all times is beyond me.
10-01-2013, 05:24 AM
Dhex

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lhun

Everyone is missing this here.

The perfect use of Bloodbath is the following and I've posted it before: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...=1#post1302097

Even with Vengeance and everything else being done perfectly your HP returns from a perfect Bloodbath self-healing cycle are going to total under 1,500HP and you'll still have a "gap" phase where the healer will have to cover you.

It's all been discussed forwards and backwards, tested, and people have sat and theorycrafted - done math - changed gear setups - materia melds - allotments - everyone is a pretty sweeping generalization.
10-01-2013, 05:25 AM
Tronic

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lhun

That's not why I suggest you use Vengeance. I suggest you use Vengeance because it causes you to counterattack every hit you're given. When you couple that with bloodbath, you are self healing for EVERY auto attack, and healing for 30-100 per enemy strike. This is higher if coupled with unchained. If your opponent is a fast striking enemy (or a group) you heal incredibly fast due to the constant auto attack hits you are dealing.

If I am to get an extra 75 attack potency healing from vengeance when coupled with bloodbath, I'd much rather save it for when I have to build up wrath quickly after busting IB and not having infuriate up. That's what I use it for. It'll still strike back, but I get back to my wrath 5 one gcd quicker, and that makes my taru a very happy tank when she's tanking hard content.

Speaking of hard content, I can't fathom using unchained at all. I'd rather hang on to that IB or infuriate.

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