I wish the game would focus on being for medcore players more.

Just git gud.

Why are we complaining the game is harder all of a sudden at level 100?

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Originally Posted by Bryson

it seems arbitrary to reduce all of DT to dungeons and trials? but even if you did do that, that doesn't change the fact that the tier is easier and fru is easier than dsr and top.

more people clearing endgame relative to previous expansions suggests to me, dt is easier... if it were harder, the clear rates would reflect that.

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Well unless I'm wrong the thread was made by someone looking for more "midcore", according to how they'd define it, something that doesn't require the same amount of preparation and effort and homework with raidplans than extreme/savage/ultimate, yet offers enough challenge that it doesn't turn into a snoozefest like the baseline (msq, dungeons etc). We've in fact have had this multiple times in the game's history, like CLL or Dalriada. That's why I specifically replied on the baseline when everything at that level has clearly gone up in difficulty, especially at specific points in expansions: SB into SHB that saw a sudden increase at the encounter level (notably DDR) to make up for the annihilation of job complexity, and EW into DT (faster pace, more visual cues, etc). I don't know why we're bringing up savage+.

But if we're speaking about savage, I've found Arcadion savage a lot harder than anything we've had previously (with the exception of EW ultimates and criterions, and superchain theory), but I know that's just me and I'm not a majority among raiders on that. I just deal extremely poorly with that kind of design.

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Originally Posted by Dastan

Just because ex trials are trivial to you at this point, doesn't mean it's not midcore or casual. Casual battle content is anything queueable and part of the roulette rotation. That is already established. And although you can technically queue for them, they are not a part of the rotation. Savage raids are punishing in the fact they require perfection or nothing. Body checks ongoing for every other mechanic (light parties and pairs) on top of mechanics that require you to stand in this specific spot or wipe the group for your mistake. Extremes have more leeway in that often, a single death does not mean you are causing a wipe and it's more easily recoverable while still being a bit challenging. Ultimate raiders will see Ex trails as "casual" because it is trivial for them. It's easy. While they are a bit pushed in savage raids. So to them, savage might be "midcore". But to the casual midcore player, savage raids are about the hardest content they will step foot in.

I don't even hope to clear an ultimate raid. It's not even on my list of things to do, because I know it's not possible for me due to the difficulty of the content. I have cleared every extreme so far in this expansion, and last tier, I wasn't able to even clear m3s through PF at all. I didn't even attempt to set foot in this tier's savage because I refuse to go through that again. And PF being able to clear a savage tier quick really depends on who's in PF. If you wait a few months to try, you won't get the same people in PF as when the content was initially released. You get the exact kind of person you are. A casual midcore type player setting foot into savage for the first time. These people are not clearing the tier in just 2 weeks. That's been my experience.

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I think it is an great example - the more accesible content would allow way more people to participate in this and at the end of the day nobody does lose anything if more people can do things.

There is always an ultimate for those who seek the greatest challange.

However what DT does prove vast majority of players just want to enjoy the game without making it an daily struggle or making it to be life accomplishment.

Completing duties or tasks does provide satisfaction & motivation to go on and continue.
More accesible content doesn't make anybody "weaker" or "worse".

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Originally Posted by CNitsah

They're trying. But they do the same error you're doing. Midcore is not a difficulty lvl. It's giving enough activities with that will procure a mild challenge, some dedication to complete while not bringing too much frustration. Difficulty can be one of the way to do that, but it can't be the only thing.

As long as the dev (and a good part of the playerbase) continue to make this confusion, it's dead.

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Hard disagree. Occult Crescent CE's would be midcore difficulty. Time spent playing the game is not Light-core, mid-core and hard-core and should never be viewed as such.

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Originally Posted by Exinias

Hard disagree. Occult Crescent CE's would be midcore difficulty. Time spent playing the game is not Light-core, mid-core and hard-core and should never be viewed as such.

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And this is why trying to frame “-cores” as difficulty based rather than effort based in near meaningless because I don’t think I know anything that would call CE’s as anything but casual

However I can fully see the argument for someone saying the grind for +2 arcanauts gear is a midcore grind. It’s not absolutely ridiculous but if you start it right now it’ll likely take at least a week to get at minimum

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Originally Posted by CNitsah

They're trying. But they do the same error you're doing. Midcore is not a difficulty lvl. It's giving enough activities with that will procure a mild challenge, some dedication to complete while not bringing too much frustration. Difficulty can be one of the way to do that, but it can't be the only thing.

As long as the dev (and a good part of the playerbase) continue to make this confusion, it's dead.

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Finally somebody with a brief and clear exposition of what Midcore as a concept is.

Difficulty is defnitely part of the equation, but not the entirety.

I think of everything DT has currently released the two closest candidates to “midcore” are +2 arcanauts and one “x of stars” title as they both have equivalent casual and hardcore grinds

For +2 arcanauts its equivalents would be either the relic atma or +0/+1 on the casual side and infamy of blood or bunny blessed on the hardcore side. +2 requires time and effort but not an incredible amount, you have to interact with forked but you don’t have to dominate it like with infamy of blood. You won’t get it in a day like you could with +0. It sits comfortably in the middle

For x of stars its casual equivalent would be the cosmic relics and its hardcore equivalent would be cosmic castle in the sky (whatever that achievement is actually called). It’s a decently lengthy grind to get one title. You can do it at a pace roughly in line with your acceptable difficulty level (fast if you can constantly do EX+, slower otherwise) and it feels decently attainable to do one but a lot to do more

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Originally Posted by Raikai

Finally somebody with a brief and clear exposition of what Midcore as a concept is.

Difficulty is defnitely part of the equation, but not the entirety.

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No. It's wrong. Because someone who does housing
designs would be considered hardcore because they do housing 5 hours a day every day. Someone who clears 2 ultimates everyday but is only logged in for an hour would be considered light-core by these interpretations. They 100% should always describe difficulty when talking about content, not time spent.

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Originally Posted by Exinias

No. It's wrong. Because someone who does housing
designs would be considered hardcore because they do housing 5 hours a day every day. Someone who clears 2 ultimates everyday but is only logged in for an hour would be considered light-core by these interpretations. They 100% should always describe difficulty when talking about content, not time spent.

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I think you're using a bad example with the Ultimate, because somebody who clears 2 per day... is on 'reclear mode', which is the content already completed, is it not? They probably spent weeks doing that, and by design of the product, that's most of the shelf life of the content.

It's also fine to label difficulty levels, but the structure of the content shouldn't be based solely on difficulty, and that's what the whole point of the midcore discussion. You need to avail a lot more than just difficulty. You should also look at acessibility, replayability and also the grind timesink.

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Originally Posted by Exinias

Hard disagree. Occult Crescent CE's would be midcore difficulty. Time spent playing the game is not Light-core, mid-core and hard-core and should never be viewed as such.

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So I won't express myself on OC before we have the full thing, but I said in other thread, I consider Exploration zones as content that can be both casual and midcore depending on how you interact with them. Doing eureka once for the story is pretty much casual, but farming it to get every eureka relics is definitely something midcore. Same goes for the extreme : clearing them on the fly is micore, but having a static, with scheldules several time of the weeks kinda lean on the hardcore side, because schelduling your life around a game is definitely something that should be considered hardcore.