Compiled SAM threads against 6.1 changes / Kaiten removal

Either die a hero or live long enough to become DNC or worse

A healer

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Originally Posted by cjbeagle

Did Meikyo Shisui not exist back then? (I started FFXIV last summer - I actually don't know).

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Meikyo Shisui has existed since the job released in 4.0

Kaiten and Hagakure also existed since then, but Hagakure got the removal treatment in 5.0 only to be returned in a much weaker, but admittedly balanced state.

Now it's Kaiten turn to suffer it seems. Unfortunate. It's too baked into my reflexes now that using Shinten to fill the void of its removal still feels off.

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Originally Posted by xAFROx

Meikyo Shisui has existed since the job released in 4.0

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Thanks for the reply!

"hakaze, shifu, kasha,. hakaze, jinpu, kaiten, higabana,, gekko, meikyo, yuki, kasha, kaiten, midare... was basically the start of every encounter through 5.0"

Was trying to make sense of that opener - I realize now that the missing link was Ikishoten.

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Originally Posted by cjbeagle

Did Meikyo Shisui not exist back then? (I started FFXIV last summer - I actually don't know).

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Yup

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Originally Posted by cjbeagle

Thanks for the reply!

"hakaze, shifu, kasha,. hakaze, jinpu, kaiten, higabana,, gekko, meikyo, yuki, kasha, kaiten, midare... was basically the start of every encounter through 5.0"

Was trying to make sense of that opener - I realize now that the missing link was Ikishoten.

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Meikyo existed but it didnt apply your speed / damage buffs in 5.0 like it does currently

Not the exact sequance i used

here's an example of a 5.0 sam opener.
5 gcds and then kaiten higabana. which is basically where i estimated 12 seconds from in the earlier post.

Wow that's a lot of threads. Neat idea to put them all together for reference! Helps demonstrate just how upset the community is. Tank u for doing all this hard work, greatly appreciate it!

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Originally Posted by Dzian

here's an example of a 5.0 sam opener. 5 gcds and then kaiten higabana. which is basically where i estimated 12 seconds from in the earlier post.

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I remember another post of yours stating " more buttons doesn't equal better gameplay ". Yet I would argue " less buttons doesn't always equal better gameplay either ".

Quite the distance you travel to go against many SAM main opinions if you read any of threads and quotes. Kaiten is not devalued by how easy you find to weave it. It was enjoyable to cast, it was harder to manage then what we have now, it is skill expressive in comparison to post 6.1 and players loved it.

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Originally Posted by Dzian

Adniteddly only recently 90 but at level 80 you pretty much did kaiten after 12 ish seconds. but either way whatever the 90 opener is you'd still be pressing kaiten at the same times in every encounter..

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Accordingly to the Lodestone you're a Lv54 Samurai. I will take your word for it that you have this imaginary account with a recently Leveled Lv90 Samurai... yet you admit it yourself to not knowing the rotation... to then speak of how easy the rotation is to execute against Samurai mains? okey dokey...

Lets go that route,... players use XivAnalysis. I don't, I like improving but not to the point of going crazy, figuring out everything you missed on optimally performing.
- Over Healing
- Dots uptime
- Missing Positional
- Missing cooldowns not being used
- Your pot timing

Players miss many things because they aren't perfect. We aren't machines. And when I play I don't think of " I cast Kaiten at 12 seconds and at 5:26 after the next mechanic biep-boop " like what? no... Kaiten will be miss timed becuase it is skill expressive, it had a layer that required you to think a little more. Shinten or whatever we have right now does not.

We find value in Kaiten for many different things. If you're trying to dismiss something of what many players value when you don't enjoy it yourself or even play it as you " Adniteddly " put it, not knowing rotation at Lv90?... Well... then I am searching the reasoning behind you complaining about it honestly... I mean you can I just...I don't get it...

People like me loved Kaiten, miss Kaiten, I guess you don't. Then again you don't play SAM to the point you know the rotation... I... where are we going with this :|

I'm sensing a theme here lol. Thanks OP for hopfully helping people see that they might be crying a little too much

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Originally Posted by deadman1204

I'm sensing a theme here lol. Thanks OP for hopfully helping people see that they might be crying a little too much

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What in the world gave you that idea? I swear some of you people don't even read the actual topic.

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Originally Posted by Roxus

What in the world gave you that idea? I swear some of you people don't even read the actual topic.

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Some people get a kick out of seeing other classes suffer the same fate that their class was struck with. Others complain people about forum littering threads, only to enter those threads and litter them with meaningless posts i.e crying etc, quite contradicting... I won't kink shame, everyone has their fetishes.

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Originally Posted by deadman1204

I'm sensing a theme here lol.

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He has a point. We Complain > so others Complain > about us Complaining
" I'm sensing a theme here lol ".

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Originally Posted by CelestiCer

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...E-doesn-t-care


Sorry if I missed anyone, this was quite the read... emotionally even... it doesn't matter the reasoning...

- Rather it's Optimized damage
- Rather it's the feel of the Rotation
- Rather it's Samurai identity Aesthetically
- Rather it's gameplay feel and satisfaction
- Rather players were in love with Kaiten

Bottom line is that many players aren't pleased
with the 6.1 SAM changes, PERIOD

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Can I join please?

https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...tead-of-Kaiten