Lets have class only abilities and spells

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Originally Posted by Denmo

Or they could introduce endgame solo content that's challenging enough to require the solo survivability that only Class offers.

I really don't understand why you guys want to take 1 step forward, 3 steps backward by getting rid of either jobs or classes. It's a cool system that just needs more development to flesh it out.

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The purpose of Solo content in endgame? I played many mmo and the only solo content there ever was for end game was crafting. I'm not saying to get rid of classes but as they are now they feel useless so they should tweak them to give them a better purpose.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

Or they could introduce endgame solo content that's challenging enough to require the solo survivability that only Class offers.

I really don't understand why you guys want to take 1 step forward, 3 steps backward by getting rid of either jobs or classes. It's a cool system that just needs more development to flesh it out.

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There is no need for it, which is his point and I completely agree, if BLM isn't strong enough to solo maybe SE should look into why that is and boost its survivability some how, if that happened there would be no reason to have THM.

And as for taking THM to Ifrit that just acts as a crutch for people to play badly and get away with it. (for example raising a scrub who can't avoid plumes and eruptions)

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Originally Posted by Onidemon

The purpose of Solo content in endgame?

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To challenge your own skills as a player.

A side thing when you can't find a group but still want to play.

A solo dungeon could provide different rewards than just EXP and gil. Guild Marks are still going to be a thing, if I'm not mistaken. OK I could be mistaken, but there's other avenues not explored yet for obtaining new and varied rewards.

Hell, maybe even take it a step further and make solo dungeons tailored to each class. Like a Test at the end of your 'guild training'. That way each class has its own unique challenge.

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There is no need for it, which is his point and I completely agree, if BLM isn't strong enough to solo maybe SE should look into why that is and boost its survivability some how, if that happened there would be no reason to have THM.

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Tweaking jobs to be more survivable will make them loose their uniqueness in party play. Which was the original reason for adding jobs, if you recall.

It sounds to me like you just want FFXI.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

To challenge your own skills as a player.

A side thing when you can't find a group but still want to play.

A solo dungeon could provide different rewards than just EXP and gil. Guild Marks are still going to be a thing, if I'm not mistaken.

Hell, maybe even take it a step further and make solo dungeons tailored to each class. Like a Test at the end of your 'guild training'. That way each class has its own unique challenge.

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devs said they have no plans to start using guildmarks again

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Originally Posted by Jinko

There is no need for it, which is his point and I completely agree, if BLM isn't strong enough to solo maybe SE should look into why that is and boost its survivability some how, if that happened there would be no reason to have THM.

And as for taking THM to Ifrit that just acts as a crutch for people to play badly and get away with it. (for example raising a scrub who can't avoid plumes and eruptions)

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They could Cap Classes to L30 and then force you to take on a job with multiple job choices per class. Classes could be kind of like the Novice Job in Ragnarok online. kind of a starting point for each character where you learn how to play the basics and learn your first spells/abilities. Then you chose a job in order to decide which role you want to play in the game. Remove the ability of using spells from other classes when using a class and make that a Job thing which would enable Jobs to solo content all the way to max level.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

And as for taking THM to Ifrit that just acts as a crutch for people to play badly and get away with it. (for example raising a scrub who can't avoid plumes and eruptions)

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I disagree with this~ If anything THM is more useful for PUGs simply because of the other people that wipe...

In a situation: Oh great, i'm the only ranged alive... Shit i'm on BLM! Well, guess one of the WHM is going to have to raise... Damn it! the other WHM let the tank die >_<"

It happens ALL the time in PUGs and going BLM is only acceptable when someone else can handle backpacking the newer players in the fight. When it comes down to it, DPS is the only thing that matters in ifrit... Dead BLMs don't = DPS and only experienced players should go BLM. Far too often I see new players going BLM just to die, waste a raise and die again.

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Originally Posted by Sabaku_Usagi

I disagree with this~ If anything THM is more useful for PUGs simply because of the other people that wipe...

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Isn't that what I said though, its a crutch so that people can play poorly and fall back on someone to raise them.

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Originally Posted by Elexia

This is really it. Especially since people forgot that Ifrit used to be "STACK LANCERS!" Then people realized that took actual thinking to do and now they fall back on THM purely for having access to additional raises.

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Especially this:

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Originally Posted by Sabaku_Usagi

It happens ALL the time in PUGs and going BLM is only acceptable when someone else can handle backpacking the newer players in the fight.

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Assuming newer players will automatically just flatout suck is the biggest problem. I've won plenty of Ifrits with pickup groups because said newer players actually did their research and actually studied how the battle goes.

Sure knowing is half the battle, but those who don't even attempt to do said half are why as said, it's basically a crutch, otherwise there's almost no reason to go THM over BLM beyond bad playstyle...hell I seen a LNC (who is absolutely new to the game) do better than a "veteran/omg elite" LNC/DRG that couldn't get a combo off to save his life.

You people are so closed minded it's painful. What purpose would removing Classes serve? How would that improve the game in any way?

Classes give the ability to create Solo Content. Jobs give the ability to maximize your potential in a single party role. It allows players to have more play style options without degrading either play style. Classes do not hurt jobs in any way. There is no downside to having both.

This is like people Claiming that we should have nothing but instanced raids even though some people want non-instanced content. There is no down side to having both. It is just more stuff in the game.

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Originally Posted by Kiote

You people are so closed minded it's painful. What purpose would removing Classes serve? How would that improve the game in any way?

Classes give the ability to create Solo Content. Jobs give the ability to maximize your potential in a single party role. It allows players to have more play style options without degrading either play style. Classes do not hurt jobs in any way. There is no downside to having both.

This is like people Claiming that we should have nothing but instanced raids even though some people want non-instanced content. There is no down side to having both. It is just more stuff in the game.

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There is very little point to having classes at the same time, you are just saying lets keep them because they are in the game.

I would rather SE remove them and work on maximising roles, lets not forget that having multiple classes as well as jobs tacked on is just asking for balancing issues later on when the level cap raises.

Part of me likes the idea that one class can have multiple jobs, but then i think about it for a minute and realise that a separate job of its own would be much more unique and easier to balance.

You may think that's close minded I just think its being objective.