Mentor needs to mean something again

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Originally Posted by MPK

I doubt people actually go up to mentor for advice.

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People ask questions in Novice Network all the time.
Rarely does anyone physically go up to another player character for interactions beyond a trade.

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Originally Posted by frijole

I think about this a lot, especially as a relatively new player to this game. Why are commendations able to be given to anyone, even if they do not contribute anything in terms of communication? Seems like most people get commendations based purely on playing a tank or healer class (not that I don't think that merits some form of recognition in certain types of content). Is there no way to program something in that opts for a commendation to be given to someone if say, for example, they wrote something into chat?

But then again, maybe I am just assuming the commendation is for good communication and not taking into account actual performance.

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Commendations are for whatever you want, there's no guidance to them provided. Comm the tank/healer for allowing you into the place. Comm the DPS that actually does their rotation. Comm the tank that steals the LB at the last moment because the DPS was just going to waste it as a finisher anyway. Comm the one that actually says "Hello!" and "Have a nice day!" in your dungeon even though no actual communication is needed as everyone has been there 800 times already.
The power is yours. This is also why it's not really a good measure of competency but more of compliancy.

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Originally Posted by frijole

Someone mentioned earlier that they had 5000 commendations but can still be toxic to other players regardless of a mentor badge or not.

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I'm 99% sure you misunderstood their point. It's in the eyes of others they are toxic only because of the crown.

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Originally Posted by technole

I get annoyed with single pulls, because as a tank you should pull all the things to the wall unless damage is severely impaired. Your anxiety has to go away at some point, because it's really just a matter of you using your AoEs to hit all the things. Aggro is stupid easy now.

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It's not just about aggro, though. There are cases when I go with single pulls simply because I clearly see that healer can't keep me alive despite me using CDs, food, not eating AoEs and being generally geared maybe not in BiS, but good enough to be okay with most healer. Just same as sometimes a healer doesn't have time to DPS, because his Tank doesn't use anything except 1-2-3.

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It was great to get rid of bads in the last wave with too low of commendations. Which is a good formula to determine someone isn't "bad" with people. Whether it's social skill, doing decent damage, not being a 0 dps healer, etc. The more comms you have, the more likely you've done random party content for a considerable amount of time.

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And then we open "Why do you give a commendation" type of threads and see how many people give their likes for... nice looking faces and cool glamours, or even races. Or people not giving commendations because member didn't say "hi", and it doesn't matter if he played well. Or people who stays in Duty until everyone else left so there's a higher chance they'll get commendation. Or, on the opposite, those who leave instance immideately after its done so people won't have time to commend them even if they wanted (I personally had plenty of cases when person I wanted to commend left the duty before I could even open the commendations menu). A very reliable factor of understanding if player is good or not, indeed (it isn't). Commendations do give some kind of an info about player, yes, but they're nowhere near as informative as they're supposed to be.

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Originally Posted by Canadane

I'm 99% sure you misunderstood their point. It's in the eyes of others they are toxic only because of the crown.

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I have to respectfully disagree since the next paragraph is about how they dislike single pulls, as if aggro is the only thing that matters when trying to clear certain content. I think it would be a fair assumption that what they were trying to say was that commendations are not a good indicator of permitting a mentor badge, especially when those who have tons of commendations can (admittedly) act in a toxic matter.

Regardless, I hope there is some way to monitor and utilize existing (or new) ways of mentorship in content because I just really want help without staring at another monitor LOL

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Originally Posted by frijole

Regardless, I hope there is some way to monitor and utilize existing (or new) ways of mentorship in content because I just really want help without staring at another monitor LOL

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Mentors overall are looked down upon in this game. Many people who like helping people, advising, answering questions, etc., refuse to wear the mentor crown or be part of the NN because of how many of the people who wear the crowns act (not all act badly, but enough rotten apples has spoiled the bunch). Probably the best way to get help, info, advice is to join a helpful FC or LS.

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Originally Posted by Arillyn

Mentors overall are looked down upon in this game. Many people who like helping people, advising, answering questions, etc., refuse to wear the mentor crown or be part of the NN because of how many of the people who wear the crowns act (not all act badly, but enough rotten apples has spoiled the bunch). Probably the best way to get help, info, advice is to join a helpful FC or LS.

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I can't speak for all servers but the novice network in general is a great place to ask for help. Rarely do your questions go unanswered. Hell, I use it loads as a a mentor too.
On my server you can even get mentors to hop into dungeons with you and/or help with your queue times. And I've seen similar things when jumping servers in my data center. I feel like many people that complain about mentors have either had some sour interactions and are really focusing too hard on those or have weird expectations for what a mentor is. In my 4-ish years I can probably only count on one hand the bad mentor interactions I've witnessed. The amount of mentors I've played with is huge and they're vastly all just silent for the ride.

To be fair, when has mentor ever actually meant something?

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Originally Posted by EaMett

I can't peak for all servers but the novice network in general is a great place to ask for help. Rarely do your questions go unanswered. Hell, I use it loads as a a mentor too.
On my server you can even get mentors to hop into dungeons with you and/or help with your queue times. And I've seen similar things when jumping servers in my data center. I feel like many people have had some sour interactions and are really focusing too hard on those.

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I'm sure that's true for some servers. I have alts over a few servers on a couple of data centers, and it's hit or miss how the novice network is. The times I was in NN (on various servers) the amount of just wrong info given by mentors was pretty staggering. I've also seen some pretty rude behavior. It was enough that I just noped out of NN in total. I've also had several friends in the NN - new people and mentors - who just got so aggravated they left as well. And while I agree that may not be the case in all novice networks, it's been enough in my personal experience to stay away from them.

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Originally Posted by Arillyn

I'm sure that's true for some servers. I have alts over a few servers on a couple of data centers, and it's hit or miss how the novice network is. The times I was in NN (on various servers) the amount of just wrong info given by mentors was pretty staggering. I've also seen some pretty rude behavior. It was enough that I just noped out of NN in total. I've also had several friends in the NN - new people and mentors - who just got so aggravated they left as well. And while I agree that may not be the case in all novice networks, it's been enough in my personal experience to stay away from them.

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All in all it wouldn't hurt to make a few tweaks to the system. But, with the lack of a general chat the NN will always reflect the rest of the player base. No better, no worse. It's just that people have much higher expectations from mentors than from the rest of the community.

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Originally Posted by EaMett

All in all it wouldn't hurt to make a few tweaks to the system. But, with the lack of a general chat the NN will always reflect the rest of the player base. No better, no worse. It's just that people have much higher expectations from mentors than from the rest of the community.

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But if a mentor system is supposed to be helpful and an actual mentor system, then it should have a higher expectation than the general community. Sadly, many mentors just want the crown by their name and a mount. Not all, but enough do and that's why overall I think the mentor system is looked down upon and why some people who really are good mentors don't bother with the mentor system.

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Originally Posted by Arillyn

But if a mentor system is supposed to be helpful and an actual mentor system, then it should have a higher expectation than the general community. Sadly, many mentors just want the crown by their name and a mount. Not all, but enough do and that's why overall I think the mentor system is looked down upon and why some people who really are good mentors don't bother with the mentor system.

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Lets be honest for a second. No mentor that doesn't enjoy helping people is ever getting that mount. I'm just going to put that out there. If you don't genuinely enjoy helping others you're never making it through that grind.
The crown could/should be changed to a book imo.