Hi SE, can we get rid of the current card system in next expansion, pls?

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Originally Posted by PyurBlue

I agree. The new card system has issues, but it's better base to build an interesting system off of than the old cards. AoEing cards all the time was a bit boring in hindsight and seals have a lot of potential, they just need to do something more substantial than they do now and need to be more controllable by the player.

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I'd still argue that Expand easily could have been balanced against Extend and Enhance, by having it split its effect over player count, starting from an initial doubling, as not to be "balanced" only in 4-man content, while allowing multiple cards to affect an ally at the same time (including treating the stronger Enhance and weaker Extend each as separate effects from the normal) and giving Enhance the 200% effect it ought to have.

In such a case, it'd generally still be better to give out single-target cards to your best DPS where the effect is fitting (Spear Bard/Monk, Arrow BLM, Balance for anyone), where -- if returned -- TD would synergize least with Expand and (old) Celestial Opposition would synergize best with it.

But, I'd also be fine with Seals taking over that role. I just want each of my available options to at least have situations by which they are the best choice.

The best thing, is that Divination is locked behind that god-awful cd.

Like, yall expect me to pop Lightspeed (Which I don't bc it's a waste imo) so I can weave malefics while tossing whatever on the pleb dps, to get Divination to match their raid buffs, but Divination doesn't even line up with getting 3 cards with arcana, after the first Divination? That's just really poor design. Another thing is, why were the lord and lady buffs in PVP upped to a 30 second duration, while still being 15 seconds, in PVE content?

The second best thing, is that the RNG isn't even gone. It just became "Melee/ranged card RNG" instead of "I got a spire but even that had more uses" RNG. Like hell, I would be fine getting the old system back even if they made the potencies 5%. Just feels like they went this route because they didn't know what to substitute for TP being removed, and MP if they were so adamant on giving MP issues.

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Originally Posted by Brightshadow

My issue with the whole rework in 5.0 is that the card system they implemented is nothing more than a illusion of choice. There is no difference in the current card system to for example a buff ability such as divination other than the enforced role RNG.

The reason many of us loved AST was because we had different buffs we could supply the party with: We had defense, attack, haste, refresh, crit +, regain. Sure balance fishing was a bit hard to discourage, but they simply could have buffed the other cards to make them more on par with balance, or if necessary nerf the balance card.

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The old system could have been fixed with a simple tuning of numbers. Instead they reworked the system without actually fixing any of the problems. Like let's be honest the fact that it went live with three stacks of redraw was SE just slapping a bandaid on the issue. We still fish for cards with seals and this time it's mind numbingly frustrating. Before I could redraw or store the card or consume it with royal road. Now I can only redraw and I've lost count how many times it's just danced between the two cards I don't need.

In addition to that every card is the exact same. It's just straight damage. It's uninteresting and flies in the face of lore. Someone new to the game is going to be actually confused as to how bole protects allies by just doing what every other card does.

I am begging them to please return the old card system to us. Make spire direct hit. The only other problem was when you got unlucky and got a bunch of utility cards in a row instead of balance. Well simply rename redraw and give it the ability to only return damaging abilities like arrow, balance, spire, and spear.

Thing is, half of an AST's dps buffs come from Divination, and another 20-25% from Minor Arcana. As long as this skill exists, the six base cards will remain laughably weak, and nothing more than seals fodder.
That's right, cards which were the core mechanic of the class are now just fuel for a weaker Technical Step.


Oh, and just to twist the knife, as said above, PvP cards are now 10% dps/mitigation for 30s. Two PvP cards have more different effects than 8 PvE cards. Outstanding move, Square.

Gee, I really wonder why AST is the least played healer, in all content and by a huge margin, despite being the strongest.

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Originally Posted by CrimsonGunner

the idea isn't flawed but its execution severely is and it must be changed ,either to the old card system or a new system or even have them rebuilt this seal fishing system from the ground up. whatever SE decides to do, it need to give the cards and using them meanings again.

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This is close to how I feel too. Currently we have a good idea executed poorly. SE has stated their position, and if they don't want to change it now they won't, but that might change in the future. I'd encourage people to promote the changes they'd like to see, even if they're different from mine.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

I'd still argue that Expand easily could have been balanced against Extend and Enhance...

But, I'd also be fine with Seals taking over that role. I just want each of my available options to at least have situations by which they are the best choice.

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I hadn't really thought about tweaking the other RR options, but I suppose that could work in balancing them all out. In the end I'd just like more variety and choice as well.

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Originally Posted by Astrololol

The best thing, is that Divination is locked behind that god-awful cd.

Like, yall expect me to pop Lightspeed (Which I don't bc it's a waste imo) so I can weave malefics while tossing whatever on the pleb dps, to get Divination to match their raid buffs, but Divination doesn't even line up with getting 3 cards with arcana, after the first Divination? That's just really poor design. Another thing is, why were the lord and lady buffs in PVP upped to a 30 second duration, while still being 15 seconds, in PVE content?

The second best thing, is that the RNG isn't even gone. It just became "Melee/ranged card RNG" instead of "I got a spire but even that had more uses" RNG. Like hell, I would be fine getting the old system back even if they made the potencies 5%. Just feels like they went this route because they didn't know what to substitute for TP being removed, and MP if they were so adamant on giving MP issues.

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It isn't gone, but it is mitigatable.

But also, Melee/Caster only has a chance of slightly lesser effect, and rarely to the same extent that, say, Bole or Spire (after already getting Expand RR) did. And it's due solely to whether your best dps in party happens to be ranged or melee, not any particular failing on the part of the card effect itself. Which 8-man doesn't have a single Melee member who does at least half the dps of your best Ranged? As long as you have a viable target, the Melee/Ranged distinction in itself isn't really "RNG"; it's simply a matter of targeting, a concept we'd already be used to if we had had more viable options than just Expand. It's basically the same as F&C vs. WT back in Heavensward. It wasn't a chance of getting screwed over for potency, it was just a (needlessly irritating) obstacle that caused you to delay positioning, at no actual cost except to immediate use of Jump when unfortunately synced.

The only significant rDPS-affecting RNG are the Seals, and they at least allow for significant mitigation through player actions. This is largely because of the Divination CD. Because you have a Draw per Divination (or four, when including Sleeve Draw) that cannot newly add a Seal, only replace an existing one, over half of your attempts can be spent replacing bad Seals when you exhaust Redraws (the 1% to all being of course superior to the 2% further damage of Crown on any one dps) and then simply get the excess Draws at 33% increased Card strength via Minor Arcana.

That's not to say I like the Melee/Ranged distinction. I don't. I hate things that differ by types that have no further interaction. (I dislike RDM's Black/White mana for that reason; I think half the related toolkit therefore ends up mere bloat because there's no actual difference between White and Black therein apart from their names.) But the Seals at least present types that do have further interaction. And that would even better -- far better -- if we just still had varying card effects.

I like the new card system in most scenarios. Yes, it is linear and there is no problem solving like there was in 4.0. Keeping it clean and simple is nice as I can focus on mechs and healing, instead of my cards. I'm glad all the cards are equal, you wouldn't dare find me looking for a Spire in 4.0 but I'm glad (at times) to see one.

My problem comes with dungeons, anytime I see no melee DPS, or even no ranged DPS, I get pretty mad knowing I'm at half power because of matchmaking.

i have big trouble for using cards in the new alexander raid,too much healing to do,so i can't really allow myself to switch frequently targets to give cards to the appropriate persons (after the water man unleashed his 1st raid buster) ,if we havent got the "melee / ranged" thing for the cards then it would be probably easier to handle but now it's just hell

I mean it was 100% fine for me in savage tier but alex ultimate put too much pressure that it gave me this issue i talked above,and if a ast don't give frequently buff then what is the point of bringing it

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Originally Posted by Vitreus

The only other problem was when you got unlucky and got a bunch of utility cards in a row instead of balance. Well simply rename redraw and give it the ability to only return damaging abilities like arrow, balance, spire, and spear.

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You know, that's actually a great idea. A common counterargument for the RNG nature of the cards is they're not reliable (despite that literally being the point of RNG but whatever) and you couldn't even use Bole when needed. Soooo since the cards are already separated into two groups [offensive - Balance, Spear, Arrow, and utility - Bole, Spear, Ewer], why not make MA switch the card into the opposite group. As in ohh nooo, I got Spire, well just MA it and you'd have a guaranteed Arrow, Spear, or even Balance. It's still RNG but you would be trading a bad card for one that would definitely help, and IF you still think Arrow/Spear are not good enough and want to challenge RNGesus, Redraw is still there.

Funny and ironically enough, Ewer would come in handy to AST now. To think that card was laughed at hmmm?

I mean, if we really had to make every card an attack-up card, couldn't they have at least allowed us to apply elemental weapons based upon the elemental affinity of the card?
And maybe represent the additional damage as a separate tick of +# element.

At least there'd be some flavor.