the viera and the hat

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Originally Posted by Driavna

The reason I responded to you was: is not hard to understand that Churro is salty, and he/she is right about being salty, with SE with how they have cut corners with the two new races. It's clear that he/she knows more hairs and headgear is coming but is still a limited selection. If you happen to like certain hairstyle or headgear and it's never added... bad luck.

Is she/he trollish? Sure. Does matter? Not really.

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Of course I am. They come out with 2 half races, no headgear, extremely limited options, and hrothgar cant even change the hair without a fantasia. They are stuck with what they chose initially, and the chose to let them be able to change fur patterns that you can barely see, and even when you can most outfits have a chestpiece covering it almost completely. If they can't even do hairstyles on the full release of the races they have claimed are complete, I hold little to no hope they will put in the time or effort to make hats for viera heads - at least properly (not just clipping).

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Originally Posted by Ardox

I agree with Arngrim_Greyashe, you are all over the place with that first post: even contradicting yourself saying both the Miqo'te ears being shown and not shown.. It is, like he say, rather incoherent. The truth is, we don't know and getting rilled up now won't change the outcome positively.

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It is not all over the place, some hats do have holes for miqo'te* ears such as the sun hats, others like many of the bard hats, have ear points sticking out of the top of the hat, or ear armor; slots to put the ears in. Effectively, the ears are just hidden. Someone who has played a miqo'te extensively (like me) and used these hats can confirm this.

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Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho

I have no doubt. If anything, SE can adjust the headgear for miqo'te which is already in the game.

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Doubtful. Miqo'te ears are smaller, and more on the side of their heads - they are also all one shape. Viera ears are varied, and some of them could be more difficult to implement properly without them looking odd. Not to mention viera ears have a slider that enlarges these ears.

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Originally Posted by Arngrim_Greyashe

To me, and this is purely speculation on my behalf, I have to wonder if the assortment of ear options for both races poses a new challenge to them when regarding helmets and hats. Both Viera and Hrothgar have multiple ear shapes, some not similar to the others. *looks at the bent viera ears* But maybe those pose no issue and I'm way off! Who knows?

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Wow! It looks like we actually agree!

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Good reply, I totally agree. Especially the first ears which aren't sticking straight up, and the floppy ears. The selection will always be extremely limited, and the work required to make it proper will probably never be done.

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Originally Posted by Arngrim_Greyashe

Perhaps they've already started work on some of these things? Obviously none of us will know unless one of you works for SE and can give us the confirmation. But I would like to think they've started work on some of these aspects, even as a background project while they focus on the new raids, dungeons, and balancing. Might be a naive hope, however. They're likely still very busy! :)

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Based on statements made, it sounds like some of the styles and head pieces are being worked on, but they're not bringing over everything. That is he odd part to me.

I found it bizarre that they knew Viera and Hrothgar were coming out but that the AF headpieces were made to be incompatible with them. I have limited expectations for any updates to the hair/hat situation for Viera because things that would make sense seem to be too much to do for some reason. I have limited expectations for Hrothgar too. I wish they could get new hairs because I find that too many of the few Hrothgar I see look too similar and I would like my Hrothgar character to stand out more. However if with every new hair I have to buy more fantasias then I will have to revert him to Roegadyn because that is asking to much from me.

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Originally Posted by Skivvy

Perhaps this is a naive question, but they managed just fine with Au Ra, which I assume took some tweaking of meshes and textures. Why can't they do the same with Viera? A new race is obviously going to take effort, and at this point it just feels like Viera were incredibly rushed.

I could understand if they couldn't meet he Shb deadline, but now that we are past the launch, why cant they go back and start work on fitting all hairstyles and hats to the new races? I'm really struggling to understand this one.

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Honestly speaking? I think they took on more than they could chew and just flat out ran out of time. During the fanfest when Hrothgar were unveiled it was revealed that the models had only /just/ been made presentation worthy the day before, and when the Viera were likewise showcased for the first time you'll noticed that each literally has almost the same exact face as the others with just slight variations. Given how different Viera face models actually are it seems odd that for the reveal trailer what we're shown is basically just one preset out of the four, unless the other three weren't even ready to be shown at that point. Now as to whether or not this was an upper management problem or a problem with the art team is unclear, but I very firmly believe that if they held the races back another few months most of these issues likely would have been fixed.

I had to get on my alt to get examples, but this is what I meant:

Ear holes, ear covering, ear armor

https://i.imgur.com/EgPQA1s.png

https://i.imgur.com/H8Jn8ZQ.png

https://i.imgur.com/gC0rtCy.png

https://i.imgur.com/xi2z9CY.png

https://i.imgur.com/QNS8Ryl.png

https://i.imgur.com/7ZrQ15E.png

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Originally Posted by official_coconut

I found it bizarre that they knew Viera and Hrothgar were coming out but that the AF headpieces were made to be incompatible with them. I have limited expectations for any updates to the hair/hat situation for Viera because things that would make sense seem to be too much to do for some reason. I have limited expectations for Hrothgar too. I wish they could get new hairs because I find that too many of the few Hrothgar I see look too similar and I would like my Hrothgar character to stand out more. However if with every new hair I have to buy more fantasias then I will have to revert him to Roegadyn because that is asking to much from me.

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They flat out just make excuses, and put it off. Yeah, as a hrothgar you might as well just fantasia to ROE rather than switch to a different hair/face. You would get not only hairs back, but all headgear as well.

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Originally Posted by Enla

Honestly speaking? I think they took on more than they could chew and just flat out ran out of time. During the fanfest when Hrothgar were unveiled it was revealed that the models had only /just/ been made presentation worthy the day before, and when the Viera were likewise showcased for the first time you'll noticed that each literally has almost the same exact face as the others with just slight variations. Given how different Viera face models actually are it seems odd that for the reveal trailer what we're shown is basically just one preset out of the four, unless the other three weren't even ready to be shown at that point. Now as to whether or not this was an upper management problem or a problem with the art team is unclear, but I very firmly believe that if they held the races back another few months most of these issues likely would have been fixed.

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That, but the fact they have doubled down, accepted the races as limited rather than overcoming those limitations, and settled give us placations instead. Not what I like to see. Missing gender, missing headgear, missing hairstyles, and more!

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

That, but the fact they have doubled down, accepted the races as limited rather than overcoming those limitations, and settled give us placations instead. Not what I like to see. Missing gender, missing headgear, missing hairstyles, and more!

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I don't disagree. While I understand why stuff took so long and why things will continue to take awhile to fix, I very much wish they had held the races back instead of pushing them out in this state. I get the point of new races being an expansion seller but if your poor art team has to double-crunch just to fix an issue that poor planning brought about then you really need to consider whether or not it's worth releasing the product in the state it's in. People would have been mildly upset about the delay in the races being implemented but I think the majority of us would have been accepting of the reason if we were told about it up front.

Considering the modeling/mesh team used their personal time to enable the use of glasses before launch is a sign of good faith. Like many I have my suspicions as to SE keeping their word. Yoshi P had said things in the past and they've never been done or have been done in a half-assed manner just to make people stop whining for 15 minutes.

I'd like to think they'll keep to their word, but the history of SE doing things they say is more than a little shaky at best.

first I need say I am sorry I haven't figure out how post image on forum I use google doc but I still tried figure it out

I just want the extra hairstyles from drop and MGP are available to use for Viera.

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Originally Posted by Enla

and when the Viera were likewise showcased for the first time you'll noticed that each literally has almost the same exact face as the others with just slight variations. Given how different Viera face models actually are it seems odd that for the reveal trailer what we're shown is basically just one preset out of the four, unless the other three weren't even ready to be shown at that point.

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I wouldn't really be surprised at that considering that the Fran that appeared in game was likely a reuse of her model and animations from Zodiac Age. The Viera in the trailer were pretty much just Fran with different haircuts and hair colors.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

I had to get on my alt to get examples, but this is what I meant:

Ear holes, ear covering, ear armor

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I'm pretty certain the models with ear holes are legacy 1.X models.

Most of the ear pockets/coverings/armor is actually them cheating a bit. I remember seeing a image comparison that showed that the pockets don't actually line up with Miqo'te ears for several models.

One of the big problems is that all 4 of the Viera ear types need different holes. Even the two different straight ear styles would pop out of head gear differently.