We should have a "Lance mage", "Ninja Sword mage", "Fist mage"

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Originally Posted by SovereignAegis

IT IS A FLAT OUT DPS LOSS OF CATACLYSMIC LEVELS.

Bard feels like a Black Mage, spamming cast times nonstop in a fight. It does not feel anything close to how Bard did before. It isn't the job we all opted to play! If we wanted to play BLM we would bloody well play BLM.

I feel like everyone who says Bards should suck it up should have their melee DPS get cast times just to see how jarringly differently it plays. It feels COMPLETELY different.


*Oh and you lose auto attacks too.

*Oh yes let me not forget that the majority of your 50+ skills are also linked directly to this ability and inaccessible outside of it.

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Originally Posted by Aiselia

I'm pretty sure that this post has nothing to do with those abilities getting nerfed, but thanks for your contribution.

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Originally Posted by Panasync

Because if you don't you might as well be a BLM running around using only scathe. The only way your comment would be remotely valid is if you weren't punished for being outside of WM, but you're severely punished.

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People are stating that The class itself is Losing DPS which is Straight up untrue. Saying that it's DPS Without WM is the equivalant of being a BLM only casting scathe?
Really? Which is what i was Posting about in the first place.

All these BRDs do have one point.

The class changed too dramatically.
That's not really an excuse for being bad, but on a design level their argument holds water.

They could've implemented things that change the class less drastically to achieve similar results without making it feel very different. Granted, people would complain about that as well, but the ability to run and gun like BRDs did just wasn't going to stay because it provided too much mobility and too much virtual dps. I mean, BRDs did not suffer the dps side effects of having the move out of an aoe, for example.


I thought limiting auto attacks while moving would be an elegant enough solution to force BRDs to stand still, and provide a relatively minor dps loss for moving. Alternatively the inability to engage an ability while moving so stutterstepping is a skill that BRDs/MCHs would need to learn would also have been a solution.

It's also pretty shitty that in a video they specifically showed off the machinist's mobility when it's not a real feature at high levels. So people were expecting that the ranged classes were staying mobile, when they really weren't.

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Originally Posted by Skypirate

People are stating that The class itself is Losing DPS which is Straight up untrue. Saying that it's DPS Without WM is the equivalant of being a BLM only casting scathe?
Really? Which is what i was Posting about in the first place.

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What are you talking about, the class isn't losing DPS outside of WM? Are you serious? If you are I can eli5 for you. Obviously I was being a tad hyperbolic, but I thought that was obvious. If you're willfully staying out of WM, you're losing DPS by a nice chunk.

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Originally Posted by SovereignAegis

Wanderer's Minuet wrecked everything about the Bard's playstyle, from weaving off-GCD abilities through GCD abilities and mobility to keep up with their healers and give them mana. Do you realize how horribly hard it is in a challenging fight to keep up with a WHM kiting AoE's/other mechanics with a cast timer? Obviously not, so let me explain. IT IS A FLAT OUT DPS LOSS OF CATACLYSMIC LEVELS.

Bard feels like a Black Mage, spamming cast times nonstop in a fight. It does not feel anything close to how Bard did before. It isn't the job we all opted to play! If we wanted to play BLM we would bloody well play BLM.

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The healers have cast times, too. You should be able to keep up. Your casts are 1.5s before skill speed. If you're not able to keep DPS, and move with that much wiggle room between GCD's, the problem isn't WM, it's you.

And no, it doesn't make you a BLM. BLM's have 3s long casts for their main spells, and they have no option to flick off a buff to have instant spells for less damage until they can turret again, but BRD's can.

Note: You can begin moving at 1.3s of your 1.5s cast without interrupting it, and have even more time between GCD's to move around, and throw out your oGCD's moves.

Wait a second. It adds a 1.5s casting time to skills and bards are complaining about that? I thought it was 2.5s. But 1.5s? really?

And OP said it feel like blackmage where BLM skills has 2.5-3 and 4 seconds casting time. I would kill to have 1.5s casting time on my skills

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Originally Posted by hallena

I would kill to have 1.5s casting time on my skills

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And I'd like to be doing damage on par with black mages, but that ain't happening either.

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Originally Posted by ChloeGrace

And I'd like to be doing damage on par with black mages, but that ain't happening either.

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Well then you should be complaining about your damage and not the laughable casting time you got on your skills.
(also sure if you want to deal as much damage as blm, we'll remove all your utility and give all your skills a 3s casting time aswell as giving you an enochian equivalent) see how you like it to be locked out of your main ability for 30 seconds when lot of movement is involved

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Originally Posted by hallena

Well then you should be complaining about your damage and not the laughable casting time you got on your skills.
(also sure if you want to deal as much damage as blm, we'll remove all your utility and give all your skills a 3s casting time aswell as giving you an enochian equivalent) see how you like it to be locked out of your main ability for 30 seconds when lot of movement is involved

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It's got little to do with the length of the cast, rather the fact you have to cast at all. Doesn't matter if it's half that of anything, bolting casting times onto any of the jobs that didn't have it previously would be equally as jarring and bad in a design sense. 1.5/2/3/4 seconds, a cast is a cast, to have to do double the amount of a casting job like BLM is pretty bad any way you look at it.

Oh and we are locked out of our main damage ability when not in WM.

Melee has positionals they need to hit to do optimal dps. Ranged were given the cast times to balance that out-- remove mobility to increase damage-- because obviously positionals wouldn't work. They actually handled it well with MCH. I can't speak intelligently on BRD because I don't play the class, but it seems like they got it a bit worse than us as they don't have the procs or rapid fire to mitigate the mobility loss. I know it also sucks to have abilties locked behind a wall. If they'd rather keep their mobility, they lose out on using some good abilities, so they feel kind of forced into using WM.

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Originally Posted by Panasync

It's got little to do with the length of the cast, rather the fact you have to cast at all. Doesn't matter if it's half that of anything, bolting casting times onto any of the jobs that didn't have it previously would be equally as jarring and bad in a design sense. 1.5/2/3/4 seconds, a cast is a cast, to have to do double the amount of a casting job like BLM is pretty bad any way you look at it.

Oh and we are locked out of our main damage ability when not in WM.

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A cast isnt just a cast. The lenght matter a lot when it come to mobility. If the boss target you with an aoe. you are MUCH more likely to finish your 1.5s cast than a 3s one.
WM isnt comparable to enochian because it doesnt have a duration. it doesnt expire when you move too much or have to cancel casts