A plea to reconsider Inner Beast changes

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Originally Posted by Paikis

If you're getting 2k out of Inner Beast (I haven't seen one for much less than this in quite some time. No crit, no Berserk, just Maim and SE)

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i'm gonna call bullshit on that only bravura but the strength offset is more than enough.

plus i love this quote, it's my quote of the day.

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Originally Posted by Kitru

I know how to play WAR. I also know exactly *why* the whole L2P argument is fundamentally flawed and is really only an excuse that ego-driven elitists use to justify their performance when it's really just healers making up for the inadequacies of the class that they just don't want to admit to.

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edit: here's a crit with berserk/ir/maim/se debuff i highly doubt people are getting much more than 3k IB heals.

Some people just refuse to be convinced Paikis. I'm more than happy to accept differing opinions on the new IB, after all it can really be seen as a buff in some content (especially prior to gearing) but it's really sad how grossly misinformed a lot of WAR are over the intricacies of the current IB. People will fight you tooth and nail to tell you how wrong you are regardless of what numbers you show them. Given the upcoming change I'm at least glad I won't have to have the same tired discussion about it.

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Originally Posted by Jaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaam

Some people just refuse to be convinced Paikis. I'm more than happy to accept differing opinions on the new IB, after all it can really be seen as a buff in some content (especially prior to gearing) but it's really sad how grossly misinformed a lot of WAR are over the intricacies of the current IB. People will fight you tooth and nail to tell you how wrong you are regardless of what numbers you show them. Given the upcoming change I'm at least glad I won't have to have the same tired discussion about it.

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I have come to this conclusion as well.

I have posted a screenshot previously of me hitting 1194 Inner Beast without the group STR buff. But I can't be arsed digging it out for people who wont be convinced anyway. I'm sure it's just because I'm an ego-driven elitist who is just being carried by his healers. Whatever.

Anyways, yes I would prefer seeing the DR put onto Steel Cyclone. That would give us a choice, do I want the huge heal? Or do I want the damage reduction?

Math> opinions.
The two of you are wrong thanks.

Inner Beast DR component is a band-aid fix.
To solve the Inner Beast damage vs. healing needed problem without turning WARs into re-skinned PLDs, it should use a partially static number mechanic based off your max HP, so ideally it would look like "deals x amount of damage and creates a shield absorbing <15% of your maximum HP +300% of IB damage> points of damage". This way it would scale much better with gear and still be more interesting to play around with Berserk/Maim.

Yeah, with some tuning that's another perfectly viable route they could have taken. VIT scales much better alongside incoming damage than STR does, alleviating any concerns for the foreseeable future.

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Originally Posted by Leiron

Math> opinions.
The two of you are wrong thanks.

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What math? All I see is blind delusion. The reality as it is very, very rare for IB to result in any loss of healing, the few times it does is either a case of just... not popping it or still going ahead with it because regardless of the minor healing loss, it's often the safer option. It doesn't matter if you effectively lost 200 HP, you negated the risk of getting finished by an auto-attack or maybe even something like MB.

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Originally Posted by Leiron

Math> opinions.
The two of you are wrong thanks.

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Funny, my maths is the only stuff I see in this thread. All I ever see is statements that there is maths, maths has happened at some point, and this maths that happened means I'm wrong!

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Originally Posted by Paikis

Funny, my maths is the only stuff I see in this thread. All I ever see is statements that there is maths, maths has happened at some point, and this maths that happened means I'm wrong!

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*points at Kitru's signature*
*points at game's signature*

All of the information is there, and shows that Inner beast is a weak cooldown in comparison to the multiude of cooldowns Paladins possess.


@Jam: The math that is in several topics in this forum, the math which is very easily found if you chose to try and contradict yourself than play ignorant. INner beast does not scale nearly as quickly as incoming damage, for it to do so would require it to be more thana 300 potency ability, and because it is reactive, it means that unless you are exceptionally organized, you can contribute to overhealing, which is wasted healing, which is wasted mitigation. Which weakens you because of the cost to your healing bonus.

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Originally Posted by Leiron

All of the information is there, and shows that Inner beast is a weak cooldown in comparison to the multiude of cooldowns Paladins possess.

@Jam: The math that is in several topics in this forum, the math which is very easily found if you chose to try and contradict yourself than play ignorant. INner beast does not scale nearly as quickly as incoming damage, for it to do so would require it to be more thana 300 potency ability, and because it is reactive, it means that unless you are exceptionally organized, you can contribute to overhealing, which is wasted healing, which is wasted mitigation. Which weakens you because of the cost to your healing bonus.

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*sigh* OK, I'll bite. Who is game anyways?

The maths in Kitru's signature is comparing DPS between PLDs in Sword Oath and WARs outside of Defiance. What exactly has that got to do with Inner Beast, when you should use it, or it's heal versus the healing bonus of Wrath? For that matter, what has *anything* that has to do with Paladins got to do with using Inner Beast or not? Did you even read the thread, or are you just mindlessly fanboying?

Also, we're back to no maths. Just more statements that maths was done and is somewhere and I'm wrong.

EDIT: I just re-read the thread, and it basically comes down to Kitru twisting situations around to fit his/her view point and then just stating that something is true, with no maths to back it. In the majority of cases, you should be using Inner Beast after the spike, and NOT holding your stacks.

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Originally Posted by Paikis

I have posted a screenshot previously of me hitting 1194 Inner Beast without the group STR buff. But I can't be arsed digging it out for people who wont be convinced anyway. I'm sure it's just because I'm an ego-driven elitist who is just being carried by his healers. Whatever.

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I'd be very interested in seeing this as by all accounts with your current gear (388 STR 237 Det) your maximum Inner Beast with Maim,Storm's Eye, Berserk, and Crit should be 1032. Even with party buff you'll only get to 1058. So I'm curious how you managed to pull this wonderful feat of hax damage.