Summoner - The whining needs to stop.

Cant even use bane on trash mobs? Then when do we get to use it? when it's single mob i guess lol

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Originally Posted by Hyrist

Makes me wonder if the Summoner that's supposedly pulling hate off these endgame tanks is managing their hate correctly.

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No its not. The problem is Bane really. If a tank is not AOE taunting then a summoner will pull agro from the mobs the tank isen't focusing. To be fair I don't play SMN much as I went with SCH but I can't say I have ever been asked to not use Bane. End of the day, in most cases (not sure about coil) you pull agro just run to the tank and let them get it back. Trash is mostly harmless unless you get lots of them.

Any tank will see the deeps or healer has pulled agro and I assume do what they need to do to get agro. Not a big issue really.

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Originally Posted by pandabearcat

It is almost completely impossible for a paladin (not sure about warriors) to hold sustained max AoE (esp with thunder Dotting as well) vs a relic+1 summoner.
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If your tank wants you to stop, stop! What do you get by antagonizing your group lol. The point is to get through whatever run you're doing, and especially new tanks or pug tanks or people you haven't worked with all have their own idea of how they want to play the game.

So yes, the whining does need to stop, and it is YOUR whining.

Your team is a team. Work with them. If you're refusing to cooperate, you are the problem, regardless of how fast or how much damage you think you do.

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Screw that. If we have relic weapons and we're running AK or WP then I'll just run into the tank after Bane and Shadowflare and take a few hits. Healer should be good enough to not let both of us die, especially since DL+relic is way overgeared for AK/WP.

I haven't been asked to not use Bane, but I have pulled aggro with my DoTs occationally. It's normally not a problem since DoTs are only a portion of our DPS, the rest of it should be going towards the marked target. Any half decent tank should be able to hold threat on just that. Even if aggro is pulled on the other enemies, it's far more likely they'll be heading for the healer instead of me... at which point I'll just summon Titan and let him help with tanking.

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Originally Posted by PiedPiper

As a paladin, its your job to never, ever, for any reason, ever, under any circumstance, need to ask a dps to slow down. You can tactically call for quelling, but they should still be able to dps full power. If they are able to put the damage up, you should be able to keep up. If you are consistently loosing out, step up. The only way to get better is to challenge yourself, and I promise you could be better. Everyone, including me, could be.

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If I'm a tank having threat issues then yes, I have the right to ask for the DPS to slow down on AoE damage. I'm not fantastically geared, but I'm still gearing up. No DPS should ever assume that an Artifact Paladin grinding currency for Darklight gear can keep up with a full Darklight DPS with a relic (or +1). I've had BLMs in groups that were WAY overgeared (only thing they didn't have was any coil drops) and perpetually bitched that I couldn't keep stuff off of them. The first boss in Castrum Meridianum is an excellent example because one BLM with relic +1 made that dungeon hell. After his first Astral Fire rotation there was nothing me or the other tank could do to pull it off of him. Nothing. Provoke didn't do anything, spamming everything we had, using all MP on Flash, etc. I was only able to buy him a few second with Cover when it was up, but nothing the warrior tank did even phased it. And during all that bitching about taking damage it never occurred to that BLM to SLOW DOWN. He had one speed on his damage output that he was unwilling to adjust, and it's stuff like that that makes a lot of tanks either bitter or just quit.

Any DPS in any game should know what their and their tank's limitations are as well how to adjust their playstyle to the situation.

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Originally Posted by Darkoray

End of the day, in most cases (not sure about coil) you pull agro just run to the tank and let them get it back. Trash is mostly harmless unless you get lots of them.

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Oh I wish they would do this. I really, really wish they would, but it seems that the expectation to move is just as absurd for some of them as well.

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Originally Posted by LostCody

when I was doing longstop,the tanks were just learning how too mark and I remembered being told also too not use bane.
but doing ak runs if your a smn and your not using bane,prepare for people too ask whats up or flat out yell at you.

it's a low lvl/low experience thing and as soon as people get a few more dungeons under there belt it should stop.

p.s we have great single target dps.

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Got the same crap with my WHM Medica, was told its never used in end game and i listened for the first few runs, Worst advice ever

I was in a DF Brayflox today as BLM. When I saw that the other DPS was SMN, I prepared myself for a quick AoE festival of a run.

Nope. PLD started marking targets to be slept, CNJ (yes, a CNJ who was level synched down) started sleeping them and then DPSing. SMN woke them up with Bane, so I started using Fire/Blizzard 2, only for the tank and WHM to say "DON'T WAKE UP THE MOBS." The SMN and I both explained what Bane is, how it works, that it would be faster if we just AoE'd everything... Silence. Next mob pack, there's no Bind marker up, but the WHM sleeps 2 of the mobs anyway. They get wakened. PLD and WHM are yelling "DON'T USE BANE IT WAKES UP THE MOBS" because apparently the extra DPS from a CNJ (who should have been a WHM by then) is better than the AoE from a BLM and a SMN.

I always thought Bane kept the mob asleep. Either way that spell is awesome, wish it hit all mob.

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Originally Posted by NeonC

I always thought Bane kept the mob asleep. Either way that spell is awesome, wish it hit all mob.

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Bane doesn't wake mobs on its own; it's the DoT tick that wakes them.

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Originally Posted by Calyanare

Bane doesn't wake mobs on its own; it's the DoT tick that wakes them.

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DoT ticks don't wake monsters.

DoTs getting applied does.