Gender locked race?

Wasn't the concept art for Viera shown simply as a "we considered this, but instead we went with au'ra" rather than a "this is viera, it is coming, hold us accountable to it"?

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

Wasn't the concept art for Viera shown simply as a "we considered this, but instead we went with au'ra" rather than a "this is viera, it is coming, hold us accountable to it"?

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If that's the case then that was an incredibly stupid move by SE because by doing this they set themselves up to have a huge amount of players disappointed in them. If they were already sure that they weren't going to have viera, then they should have said nothing about them.

Make bad decisions, expect bad results. I won’t stick around if they go onstage to reveal another cat race and no male Viera. If they for some reason decide to still be coy about this, then I’m gonna be coy about buying Shadowbringers until I see what I want. The people who are into mods might not be affected by this that much, but since I don’t want to bother with that nonsense if there’s no male Viera officially released, then I’ll have no way to play as one. No one should have to do this for content that was teased years in advance to only be backstabbed now.

https://www.dualshockers.com/viera-f...cept-revealed/ Oh yeah, it was just concept art to show off creative ideas from the art team at a random FATE event in Japan. They also showed different concept ideas for the au'ra in the same panel.

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

https://www.dualshockers.com/viera-f...cept-revealed/ Oh yeah, it was just concept art to show off creative ideas from the art team at a random FATE event in Japan. They also showed different concept ideas for the au'ra in the same panel.

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That art work has haunted them for a long time, which is a shame as it is interesting to see the design process.

Though given design work on male was being done at an early stage I don't get why they would not follow it up. That said I don't really get any of the design and lore decisions with the Veria we have seen so far.

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Originally Posted by Shippuu

And yoshida has commented that he didn't really want to show everyone the Viera concept art because of exactly what is happening now.

I'm not saying SE doesn't shoulder some blame for why people are angry about it, but they shouldn't be held hostage just because people are angry about something. In the end it is SE's decision to make, just like it was their decision to make Blue Mage as a limited job even though they knew it would make people angry too. People in this thread continue to grossly overstate the blowback and impact this will cause if it happens.

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And it IS our decision to stop supporting a company that doesn't do right by its playerbase. You seem to be under the impression that people are saying that SE's stock will go down further than it did with 1.0 when most are only speaking for themselves. I personally support that if they do something as astoundingly dumb as gender-locking Dancer (which would be even harder to do development-wise since they'd have to block you from using the job if you Fantasia to male, so they'd have to actively be <kupo> to do it), I'll cancel my sub right there and then, not to mention I haven't pre-ordered ShB until Tokyo Fan Fest because I want to know I'm getting my money's worth, be it with Dancer as a playable job and/or male Viera.

But Yoshi-P said... Must we point to Alleo's signature about housing? Which, I may remind, the timer was only instituted after player blowback (And that whole "Personal housing will be separate from FC housing!").
But we can't take the artwork for granted... Well, no but it does point out that they were actively working on it and it's not making a whole bunch of assets from scratch.
But there's no way everyone will like the final design... So since not everyone will be content, then no one should? Even the people who are ok with (what we assume about) the Hrothgar think it's off to have two gender-locked races.

And even if the official forums don't represent the majority of the fanbase, it does represent quite a few. They're talking about this in English Forums, French and Japanese (I don't read German, can't know it it's an issue there, too), on Reddit, on JP Twitter! It may not be the controversy surrounding, say, EA after Star Wars Battlefront II, but it's not as small as you make it out to be.

Guess all those Concept-Cars are stupid moves from car companies then, wait no, people who see them don't go crazy when they can't have it because they know they will probably never be released.
Same logic applies to Concept Arts because it is just that, a concept, not bound by anything between creators and consumers.

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

https://www.dualshockers.com/viera-f...cept-revealed/ Oh yeah, it was just concept art to show off creative ideas from the art team at a random FATE event in Japan. They also showed different concept ideas for the au'ra in the same panel.

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A good idea in that case would be to say "we're bringing Viera but take the concept art with a pinch of salt".

Except at that point they WEREN'T bringing Viera. That's the point.

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

Except at that point they WEREN'T bringing Viera. That's the point.

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Dur. I meant when they announced them.

In fact, they could have done it any time over the years when the topic came up ("if we ever brought in Viera..."), much like how they dealt with BLU being difficult to implement. The question of which other race would be added is not a new one and Viera were expected for 5.0. They've had ample time to disown that concept art.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Dur. I meant when they announced them.

In fact, they could have done it any time over the years when the topic came up ("if we ever brought in Viera..."), much like how they dealt with BLU being difficult to implement.

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They did. Yoshi said he thought male Viera would be weird.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

They did. Yoshi said he thought male Viera would be weird.

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Are you referring to the interview pre-dating this art?

If they don't release male Viera it'll honestly be a pretty smart and shady move from SE.

> Announce new highly requested playable race, but make one of the genders a "what if" for last fanfest
> Start pre-orders right after
> Make it so pre-orders give you redeemable codes right before the last fanfest starts
> Make sure codes are redeemed so refunds will be impossible
> Officialize genderlock
> Proceed with the stage as if nothing happened

This is something I don't want to see happening, but if it does happen it would explain the tactical money-making decision behind it.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Are you referring to the interview pre-dating this art?

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Yes, but you just said, they could have said it at any point over the years.

It's very much like Blue Mage.
Years ago Yoshi said he thought a true blue mage wouldnt work, and now we get it as a limited job to much backlash.

These things take years to implement, and they stick to their plans.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

Yes, but you just said, they could have said it at any point over the years.

It's very much like Blue Mage.
Years ago Yoshi said he thought a true blue mage wouldnt work, and now we get it as a limited job to much backlash.

These things take years to implement, and they stick to their plans.

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Nah, what I just said was they could've addressed that concept art over the years and ruled it out as a basis for what to expect from Viera. That art is close on 5 years old. Also, that interview is worded in pretty non-committal language:

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Q38: In terms of new races, what kind of races are you looking into and will mixed races be introduced?

A38: I don’t think we’ll have mixed races for a while. Since it seems like Viera is popular around the world we have been proactively looking into this, but since having a rabbit male might be kind of weird, maybe we’ll look into having a separate race for the male counterpart.

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Originally Posted by BillyKaplan

Your views of the matter are so twisted. some blame for why people are angry about it? What?

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So I should have used majority instead of some.

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If the concept art was really such a taboo for Yoshida then he should never have shown the concept art in the first place. It's almost as though being transparent with your playerbase implies you're committing yourself to what you're showing them, alternatively be transparent all the way and say, out right, it will never be used

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Yoshida often makes it a point to never commit strong language towards NOT doing something, because things can always change. He has been incredibly transparent when it comes to male Viera, such as flat out saying he would probably do a male only race equivalent as a counterpart to viera, or after showing concept art of viera he still claimed the males looked too cute. People just don't like that he held those beliefs and so refuse to give those comments any merit or consideration.

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If he showed it to us then he needs to grow up as a person and as a professional and deal with it.

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That's hilarious. No one is saying he shouldn't "deal with it" if it comes to backlash against the race. But as a professional, and the director of the game, if he chooses to do one thing, that's his choice. He doesn't need to kowtow to the playerbase just because he decided to go a different direction over something as trivial as a player race.

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Originally Posted by Penthea

Being held hostage? That's a massive overstatement. It's not like people are unsubbing in protest, or intentionally creating problems in the game to get SE's attention.

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You clearly haven't read through a lot of this thread (I don't blame you). Plenty of people have threatened to unsub if they don't get what they want. One individual even demanded Yoshida should resign if they don't get bunny men.
But then I never said SE WAS being held hostage, I was stating it because plenty of individuals here have acted like they SHOULD be. That they should be absolutely required to do something just because of some concept art, that if they don't deliver on that it'd be such a huge negative to the game (it wouldn't be).

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What you're labelling as extreme behaviour is actually very tame.

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I'm labelling it as an extreme over-reaction to something that absolutely won't be as big of an issue as many here seem to imply. If Viera don't get males, people will be upset and stamp their feet and that's it. Yoshida will probably be pestered about it during some Q&A maybe, and that's it. He may add them later, who knows.

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The forums exist for feedback and players saying they want male viera is feedback. And it's not baseless feedback either. Genderlocking has been frowned upon by the playerbase for a very long time to the point that any that was present in 1.0 was removed in 2.0, and SE have already shown us male viera.

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[Citation Needed] on where I said players couldn't, or even shouldn't give their feedback on this? And sure most people don't agree with genderlocking, but it does exist in this game in many cosmetic forms, and just because past racial genderlocking was undone doesn't exclude future ones from happening, especially when the director himself said he might do it for Viera specifically. There was also additional motivation to undo 1.0's genderlocking that is currently not present right now.

Showing concept art =/= it will be added to the game.

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Originally Posted by DevilsDontFly

If they don't release male Viera it'll honestly be a pretty smart and shady move from SE.

> Announce new highly requested playable race, but make one of the genders a "what if" for last fanfest
> Start pre-orders right after
> Make it so pre-orders give you redeemable codes right before the last fanfest starts
> Make sure codes are redeemed so refunds will be impossible
> Officialize genderlock
> Proceed with the stage as if nothing happened

This is something I don't want to see happening, but if it does happen it would explain the tactical money-making decision behind it.

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Or, they think everyone will expect male Viera, then 'Surprise! Its even better Hrothgar!'
At least from their point of view.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

Nah, what I just said was they could've addressed that concept art over the years and ruled it out as a basis for what to expect from Viera. That art is close on 5 years old. Also, that interview is worded in pretty non-committal language:

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First of all, expecting him to be like "oh that art we showed in a small JP community event 5 years back? yeah even though that's only concept art and we only use a small amount of the art we generate, don't base your ideals on this." is pretty far-fetched. People keep linking the picture and propagating this idea that this is what Viera look like, which isn't on Yoshi. It was a panel that was showing concept art, that's it. Wasn't a teaser, wasn't a hint, was just something to show an audience. Also I think as a game director he chose right to give a vague non-committal answer to something that was obviously super far out in development. He gave his views on the issue, but didn't rule anything out. I still think him giving his views is good to keep in mind.

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

First of all, expecting him to be like "oh that art we showed in a small JP community event 5 years back? yeah even though that's only concept art and we only use a small amount of the art we generate, don't base your ideals on this." is pretty far-fetched. People keep linking the picture and propagating this idea that this is what Viera look like, which isn't on Yoshi. It was a panel that was showing concept art, that's it. Wasn't a teaser, wasn't a hint, was just something to show an audience. Also I think as a game director he chose right to give a vague non-committal answer to something that was obviously super far out in development. He gave his views on the issue, but didn't rule anything out. I still think him giving his views is good to keep in mind.

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It's not far-fetched at all. They should be well aware of the fact that this art has been propagated multiple times in suggesting how Viera might look if added in the game, much like they should have been - and were - aware of the expectations on them if they introduced BLU. Managing expectations is on them. Secondly, let's see what the source you linked said:

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Within every MMORPG community, speculation on new races always runs rampant, especially when a game is based on an established IP like Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn.

Before the announcement of the Au Ra for the Heavensward expansion, the bunny-like Viera from Final Fantasy XII came up quite often in that kind of discussion, doubtlessly because Fran has always been a favorite among fans.

Turns out, as revealed today during a livestreamed panel at Nico Nico Chokaigi, that the Viera were actually considered as an additional race for the game, but ultimately the idea was discarded in favor of the Au Ra.

One of the main objections among fans to the addition of the Viera was the idea that they lent themselves to be a female-only race (at least for playable characters) due to the peculiar looks and lore behind the race’s males, but Square Enix’ concept artist had already overcome that obstacle, creating a concept for a male viera, that you can see alongside those for females just below.

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Whether due to the writer of this getting something wrong, or not, it's pretty easy to see why people have been forming expectations based on this art, particularly since this addresses what was ultimately, to most players, an objection raised in a very obscure interview that I can assure you the vast majority are not aware of, couched in extremely tentative wording.

i think the issue is they cascaded that male Viera concept art within the Heavensward art books. They have added Female Viera and their design is provocative to say the least, hell they could only be more so if they decided to not bother with clothes at all, and even then it doesn't leave much to the Imagination. To then make the race gender locked gives off an impression that in my view has no place in today's world.

Lore wise you can argue that there are so few male Viera's that they would never leave the jungle, but that doesn't sit right. There is Always someone who will decide to leave for a whatever reason.

If you add Male only Hrothgar - where is the lore to explain the females? What impression does that give? Are they all locked up by the males in a pen somewhere? Sorry it doesn't sit. Obviously this is conjecture at this point, but that impression is not good.

In terms of the number of Viera's in the field, well that's easy, canonically only the WOL you play is actually there and aside from the generic "You and Your friends" mentions, the WOL does everything alone at least from the Lore front and that means by extension there are no other "male Viera's" and even if there were, the numbers would be small compared to the population size. Lets not forget that the Lore we have isn't from a reliable source. Its from a NPC in world, who reiterates what he personally knows. That doesn't make it accurate or true and it could simply be that when he says "For us its as though the male viera Don't exist" what he means is, they don't exist where we would expect to find them.

Male Viera have been accorded a role of protector of the villages but are not part of the village. If we were to go there and not meet one, or worse we meet them as NPC's or enemy Mobs and they still don't add them as a playable race, then in my opinion, it brings the game down and i will be vastly disappointed in Yoshi-P.

It isn't that male viera would look odd, which is probably true, its about having the freedom to choose. After all that is said and done, the appetite for Viera is huge and its never been stated "we want female Viera" it was always Viera, e.g both half's of the race. To not deliver on that, would be foolish at best and there is no legitimate reason to not do so other an a personal choice which, i think in a game this big, should have no grounds.

I think my biggest gripe with a potential male exclusive Hrothgar race would be that it's their very own original creation, and Square would be very actively choosing to genderlock it.

You want to cite "lore" or "past appearances/consistency" as a reason to genderlock Viera? Sure, fine.
But what reason could Square possibly have to genderlock their very own FF14 exclusive race? They, of all companies, should know what kind of shitstorm you bring about when you do something like that.

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Originally Posted by Skos

I think my biggest gripe with a potential male exclusive Hrothgar race would be that it's their very own original creation, and Square would be very actively choosing to genderlock it.

You want to cite "lore" or "past appearances/consistency" as a reason to genderlock Viera? Sure, fine.
But what reason could Square possibly have to genderlock their very own FF14 exclusive race? They, of all companies, should know what kind of shitstorm you bring about when you do something like that.

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No, there is no reason to genderlock either of them because FFXIV has already demonstrated that it is not 100% responsible for following the lore of other games. Do not buy Shadowbringers unless you feel satisfied in what you're getting.

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Originally Posted by Skos

I think my biggest gripe with a potential male exclusive Hrothgar race would be that it's their very own original creation, and Square would be very actively choosing to genderlock it.

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...and yet that's exactly what they did with the Viera. Across multiple games, no less.

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Originally Posted by Lauront

It's not far-fetched at all. They should be well aware of the fact that this art has been propagated multiple times in suggesting how Viera might look if added in the game, much like they should have been - and were - aware of the expectations on them if they introduced BLU. Managing expectations is on them. Secondly, let's see what the source you linked said:



Whether due to the writer of this getting something wrong, or not, it's pretty easy to see why people have been forming expectations based on this art, particularly since this addresses what was ultimately, to most players, an objection raised in a very obscure interview that I can assure you the vast majority are not aware of, couched in extremely tentative wording.

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The article doesn't address that interview at all, it says the fans were objecting to Viera because of those reasons, not Yoshi. And again, I believe it is extremely ridiculous to think he has to comment on every player's fantasy when he never gave the impression that Viera was coming until now. So while you think it not far-fetched, I happen to disagree.

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Originally Posted by Anvaire

i think the issue is they cascaded that male Viera concept art within the Heavensward art books. They have added Female Viera and their design is provocative to say the least, hell they could only be more so if they decided to not bother with clothes at all, and even then it doesn't leave much to the Imagination. To then make the race gender locked gives off an impression that in my view has no place in today's world.

Lore wise you can argue that there are so few male Viera's that they would never leave the jungle, but that doesn't sit right. There is Always someone who will decide to leave for a whatever reason.

If you add Male only Hrothgar - where is the lore to explain the females? What impression does that give? Are they all locked up by the males in a pen somewhere? Sorry it doesn't sit. Obviously this is conjecture at this point, but that impression is not good.

In terms of the number of Viera's in the field, well that's easy, canonically only the WOL you play is actually there and aside from the generic "You and Your friends" mentions, the WOL does everything alone at least from the Lore front and that means by extension there are no other "male Viera's" and even if there were, the numbers would be small compared to the population size. Lets not forget that the Lore we have isn't from a reliable source. Its from a NPC in world, who reiterates what he personally knows. That doesn't make it accurate or true and it could simply be that when he says "For us its as though the male viera Don't exist" what he means is, they don't exist where we would expect to find them.

Male Viera have been accorded a role of protector of the villages but are not part of the village. If we were to go there and not meet one, or worse we meet them as NPC's or enemy Mobs and they still don't add them as a playable race, then in my opinion, it brings the game down and i will be vastly disappointed in Yoshi-P.

It isn't that male viera would look odd, which is probably true, its about having the freedom to choose. After all that is said and done, the appetite for Viera is huge and its never been stated "we want female Viera" it was always Viera, e.g both half's of the race. To not deliver on that, would be foolish at best and there is no legitimate reason to not do so other an a personal choice which, i think in a game this big, should have no grounds.

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It's weird that people both argue against lore reasons for something not existing/existing, yet also ask for lore reasons for something existing/not existing. Also it's funny that a lot of people read the lore to fit their own desires. We have no lore on any new race because if there is a new race, it's a big surprise. Or was supposed to be one.

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

The article doesn't address that interview at all, it says the fans were objecting to Viera because of those reasons, not Yoshi. And again, I believe it is extremely ridiculous to think he has to comment on every player's fantasy when he never gave the impression that Viera was coming until now. So while you think it not far-fetched, I happen to disagree.

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I'm aware but since it post-dates the interview, which contained exactly the same objection albeit worded even more loosely, it's clear to me why reliance has been placed on that art on what Viera might look like, especially given its source and that it was shelved at the time due to the inclusion of Au ra, only for Viera to now re-surface. Meanwhile, the 2013 interview is lost to obscurity, and for all intents and purposes, those aware of it would be justified in thinking that the Viera art teased could mean his objections on the matter were overcome given the commentary referenced in the dualshockers article.

He doesn't have to address "every player's fantasy", but it'd be a very good idea to address that specific concept art, since it is prolific material and from SE itself. They pretty much soft-confirmed Viera at the NA fanfest and speculation has been rife about their addition ever since ShB was first hinted at (putting a certain other source of information that surfaced to the side for now...)

Of course, that is assuming that the gender-lock holds true and is not just something we're assuming will occur.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

...and yet that's exactly what they did with the Viera. Across multiple games, no less.

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Gender-locks in single player games or games with preset characters are a non-issue. Virtually no one complains about them. At least, not relative to what you see in games like 14 where we create our own characters. Gender-locking Viera or "Hrothgar" in 14 is not equivalent to not getting a male Fran in 12.

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Originally Posted by Tabbs

Gender-locks in single player games or games with preset characters are a non-issue. Virtually no one complains about them. At least, not relative to what you see in games like 14 where we create our own characters. Gender-locking Viera or "Hrothgar" in 14 is not equivalent to not getting a male Fran in 12.

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I think gender locks are silly. I've said as much throughout this thread. Yet as long as there's an equivalent it's not nearly as damning as some are making it out to be.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I think gender locks are silly. I've said as much throughout this thread. Yet as long as there's an equivalent it's not nearly as damning as some are making it out to be.

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It depends on how you look at it. As far as the gender equalness goes (not really a word but 'equality' felt a bit over the top here), you're right, we get one option for male characters and one option for female characters. And looking at Au Ra, it's not like all races even have comparable options. Male Au Ras look like an Elezen's cousin while fem Au Ras take more after Miqo'te or female Midlanders.
But I feel like that's just going into the same trap as they did with Au Ra - what if people wanted a particular gender but with the 'opposite' aesthetic? We already have this with Au Ra where people wish we'd have gotten the bestial, amazonian female designs, and maybe an option for smaller males. So in this scenario they pretend to have avoided it because they're two different races! ...but at the same time they actually doubled-down on it because now people can ask for both male Vieras and female Hroths.
And this happened before, and SE caved, and Miqo'te, Highlanders and Roegadyns are all playable in either gender. It just seems like that's the inevitable conclusion we'll reach, only SE is postponing the inevitable and incurring player ire in the process

EDIT: if a gender lock is truly going to happen

Who knows, maybe Yoshi trolling with the fire and say "lol, fire killed most of them, they have to remain in the woods".

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Originally Posted by Theodric

...and yet that's exactly what they did with the Viera. Across multiple games, no less.

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My issue with Hrothgar is that the race would have been created specifically because Yoshida didn't want to have a male Viera, that's if it's gender-locked. That doesn't sit with me well. I'd rather Hrothgar not be gender-locked at all and the Viera locked than having both of them locked all because someone didn't like the idea of bunny men.

At least with time and effort, they'd end up adding in the male Viera? What lore are they going to give Hrothgar that would make it specifically male only? A mirror of Viera just the opposite? Sigh.

As for males in the other game that can be explained away; we never had any reason to see a male. With the limitations of those games and how the lore was so much smaller back then - why add in something that didn't need to be added at all that had zero ramifications on the plotline?

I'm just trying to wrap my head around how we're going to go into the Greatwood for ShadowBringers and how we're not going to end up getting attacked by the fierce wood wardens that inhabit it. What plot are they going to give us that would retcon their lore so that none of the males are there, not even NPCs? What side quests will there be, what fates! Etc

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Originally Posted by Tabbs

a male Fran in 12.

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We shall call him Francis.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I think gender locks are silly. I've said as much throughout this thread. Yet as long as there's an equivalent it's not nearly as damning as some are making it out to be.

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See the thing is, at least for me, the only male equivalent to the female viera is a male viera. Creating an entirely new race to exclude one gender as a response to another race excluding another gender doesn't fill the gap, it just creates another gap that will need to be filled.

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Originally Posted by Gwenorai

We shall call him Francis.

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Frank

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

It's weird that people both argue against lore reasons for something not existing/existing, yet also ask for lore reasons for something existing/not existing. Also it's funny that a lot of people read the lore to fit their own desires. We have no lore on any new race because if there is a new race, it's a big surprise. Or was supposed to be one.

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My point is that any lore that explains why there are only males in the hypothetical Hrothgar to my mind wouldn't stand up to interrogation. Not to mention when Aura was added there was effectively a lore void, they were just there and sprang up all over the place with no explanation of why they were suddenly there. Nor why the Ishgardians allowed them in. At least with Viera we know something about them, and will have their homeland added in the same expansion. Can the same be said of Hrothgar? who knows. But whatever their lore ends up being my point is that it can never truly justify gender-locking a race unless there is literally one remaining member of that race and the rest were annihilated and even then, that poses massive issues.

i'm not saying that lore is the final deciding factor, but it should at least be reasonable, currently i can't see how it can work with two gender locked but different races, especially when those races should have multiple clans and we know the Viera do! The base issue is that Gender locking isn't really justifiable and i find that gender-locking the Viera's with their design being what it is, frankly comes across as degrading. But i think the design is mostly due to that being their inception in 12. Either way, its problematic

I think gender locked glamours are a good example of why this won't really work. Even when going by equal numbers, at sets that have matches, if the outfits are different enough you're going to have people asking for an unlock. The bunny outfits being gender locked - and two variations at that - didn't stop people from asking for the Gambler coat to be unlocked. And we all know about the male-unlocked bunny outfits (which honestly I've seen more on guys than the Gambler outfit...).
So having equal numbers won't mean much if the quality of the product is too different.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

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Yeah, I am not trying pick a fight with you, haha. I just don't think single player games from the past can be used as evidence that it would happen here.

That being said, I do have to disagree that it's not nearly as damning. Like Roda has said, I want male Viera. A male only equivalent race wouldn't really satisfy what I'm looking for, especially if it ended up being the huge beefcake lion that everyone thinks it is.

The fact is, even when Yoshi said that he didn't want to show the art, they still did it. SE knew it would spark player demand and it certainly did. Players from around the world asked for Viera and SE acquiesced... after a time. Many excuses were given as to why it would be an issue to implement, everything from resources to development time to personal bias, even then player demand only grew. Knowing the fans insatiable and unrelenting nature, i can scarcely believe they would make more work for themselves introducing not one but two gender locked races. The outcry has been monumental and we have yet to even have true confirmation if this design choice being final. If they are gender locked, i truly feel it will be only a matter of time before SE will have to acquiesce once more.

I'm also wondering why everyone wants specifically male Viera barring "hrothgar" when we know neither what male Viera or "hrothgar" look like. It seems that some of the community want little cute male bunnies and some want strong looking males like in the concept art. If we get a strong looking race that isn't a bunny, is it the lacking of the ears that will make people angry? Because I mean, they look like elezens with ears in most of the art people are throwing out there.

Edit: and then what happens with the people who want the cute version? I mean someone's gonna lose no matter what.

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

I'm also wondering why everyone wants specifically male Viera barring "hrothgar" when we know neither what male Viera or "hrothgar" look like. It seems that some of the community want little cute male bunnies and some want strong looking males like in the concept art. If we get a strong looking race that isn't a bunny, is it the lacking of the ears that will make people angry? Because I mean, they look like elezens with ears in most of the art people are throwing out there.

Edit: and then what happens with the people who want the cute version? I mean someone's gonna lose no matter what.

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Because I asked for Viera not Hrothgar. I wanted bunny males regardless of size, not this random race that not a single soul asked for. Also because gender locks are a stupid and lazy decision and I would STILL be here asking fo female Hrothgar if it was male-only Hrothgar revealed.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

I'm also wondering why everyone wants specifically male Viera barring "hrothgar" when we know neither what male Viera or "hrothgar" look like. It seems that some of the community want little cute male bunnies and some want strong looking males like in the concept art. If we get a strong looking race that isn't a bunny, is it the lacking of the ears that will make people angry? Because I mean, they look like elezens with ears in most of the art people are throwing out there.

Edit: and then what happens with the people who want the cute version? I mean someone's gonna lose no matter what.

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I can't speak for others, but for me, it's always been more than just the aesthetics, though their appearance IS still a factor. From the lore I've read, I've always thought of them as spiritual woodsy nature people. I've always loved characters like that. I also loved their stoic, calm, and wise demeanor from FF12. At least with Fran. With this new lore, I like the idea of them being these forest guardian types. So that's generally why I, personally, wanted a bun boy. Not just because #rabbitcute or whatever, but because the race as a whole has always appealed to me in that way. Idk anything about Hrothgar besides their names and what people have speculated about them, but if they're a hypermasculine type of race with a culture to match, I won't play them. I also don't like playing female characters in MMOS like this one, so I won't play a female viera either.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by cicatriz313

I'm also wondering why everyone wants specifically male Viera barring "hrothgar" when we know neither what male Viera or "hrothgar" look like. It seems that some of the community want little cute male bunnies and some want strong looking males like in the concept art. If we get a strong looking race that isn't a bunny, is it the lacking of the ears that will make people angry? Because I mean, they look like elezens with ears in most of the art people are throwing out there.

Edit: and then what happens with the people who want the cute version? I mean someone's gonna lose no matter what.

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I think it's because we don't know anything about Hrothgars outside of what that leak said and the French dialogue mentioning a mane. Those asking for Viera males have those concept artwork to work with at the very least