Square Enix, please think about both Casual AND Hardcore crafters..

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Originally Posted by Kabooa

I'm skeptical, but I'm mostly happy about cutting down action bloat and Ishgard housing basically being confirmed. Ishgard being another venue for crafter progression alleviates my concerns from the other side of the fence, as it'll likely be the source of Crafting progression and won't be tuned to difficult extremes.

However, moving on from there, if they then make the actual crafting recipes outside Ishgard more difficult, they have a progression road in place for all crafters through Ishgard. If newer recipes also additionally use materials provided through ishgard, it provides a meaningful route to catch up for all Crafters (Sell the end game material for gil, use gil to meld materia).

Plenty to be excited for, but I'm still in a wait-and-see boat.

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I believe Ishgard can be used for newer crafters to level up and gain exp, and it’ll probably be a new way to earn exp for levels 1-50 also. For endgame crafters, the benefits would be: hairstyles, glamour, mounts, (possibly tools), and just having fun I guess.

That’s great and all, but the endgame nerfs and difficult recipes they said they added is what is going to determine the future of crafting, because after 5.1 - 5.2, I doubt they are going to change it again.

I dont really follow patch update and stuff like this, but i see in my twitter that some people said crafting is no more. After looking more info i see this translation from a QnA/live letter session.

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"We believe there are a lot of players that have leveld and geared their crafters/gatherers, but have no idea on what they are doing "Someone please give me a macro" and that is okay of course, but we simplified it so more people might be able to enjoy and understand crafting/gathering better"

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Although funny thing is you can apply this to DoW and DoM too.
Now, if only people read the tooltip probably this wont happen. I build my own macro if i mass craft something since im not 80 yet.

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Originally Posted by CookiesNCreams

All I know for certain is that since they acknowledged that HQ’ing endgame recipes is too easy, they will nerf SOMETHING to make it not 100% guaranteed all the time like it is now. Either that, or, somehow, this new crafting revamp will involve SKILL. Also, they will somehow make this to where macro’ing things is NOT OPTIMAL, or is a bad choice to HQ things.

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isnt this already a thing? with the poor/normal/good/excelent condition. manual will always optimal than macro
although im agree that once you got full rotation, HQ-ing is easy.

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Originally Posted by Tomoebi

I dont really follow patch update and stuff like this, but i see in my twitter that some people said crafting is no more. After looking more info i see this translation from a QnA/live letter session.



Although funny thing is you can apply this to DoW and DoM too.
Now, if only people read the tooltip probably this wont happen. I build my own macro if i mass craft something since im not 80 yet.




isnt this already a thing? with the poor/normal/good/excelent condition. manual will always optimal than macro
although im agree that once you got full rotation, HQ-ing is easy.

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You can’t be serious. At the moment, macro or manual, it’s irrelevant. Both HQ just fine either way, there is no thinking, no skill, no nothing involved. Just brain dead button pressing.

Please SE, make savage raid and ultimate accessible to everyone, I should get what I pay for.
I request one button savage raid, more than two button makes me anxious, with no melded geotia gear of course.

Also about housing, I need one shiro 30 and one mist 5, Im not greedy to get everything, but please, it is should be accessible to everyone, idc how much effort you put to get that plot, idc.


Sincerely,
Casual Player.

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Originally Posted by Sleeplate

Please SE, make savage raid and ultimate accessible to everyone, I should get what I pay for.
I request one button savage raid, more than two button makes me anxious, with no melded geotia gear of course.

Also about housing, I need one shiro 30 and one mist 5, Im not greedy to get everything, but please, it is should be accessible to everyone, idc how much effort you put to get that plot, idc.


Sincerely,
Casual Player.

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When trying to lampoon, it helps not to use examples where people are literally using macros to afk click to attain their plots.

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Originally Posted by CookiesNCreams

You can’t be serious. At the moment, macro or manual, it’s irrelevant. Both HQ just fine either way, there is no thinking, no skill, no nothing involved. Just brain dead button pressing.

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thats what i said lol.

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although im agree that once you got full rotation, HQ-ing is easy.

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i wouldnt really called crafting a "skill" tho. you read tooltip, figure it out. you have your rotation memorized or stored in macro for 40/70/80 durability items, and you repeat it everytime. the only feedback/challenge you got from crafting is item condition (which relied on RNG), which is super easy to mitigate. and not to mention, macro sharing is a thing, so IMO crafting is already easy from the get-go.

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Originally Posted by Tomoebi

the only feedback/challenge you got from crafting is item condition (which relied on RNG), which is super easy to mitigate. and not to mention, macro sharing is a thing, so IMO crafting is already easy from the get-go.

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You're right, that is exactly the state of crafting right now. But it wasn't always that way.

Back at Lv 60 the crafts using materials from gathering favors... sure, you could use the same macros all the time without thinking, if you didn't mind having a 10% or 20% chance that a 4 mil gil craft would turn NQ. It was a risk most people weren't willing to take, so many people asked experienced crafters to do the crafts for them. It actually meant something then to be an end game omnicrafter, it was something to aspire to. Was it difficult? Well, not in terms of skill it wasn't... if you followed all the steps correctly and crafted it manually with a decent understanding of crafting you had around 97-98% chance it would HQ, assuming you had good melds and took the time to HQ the crafted materials used for the craft. You could spend 10 minutes crafting just to make a single piece of class-specific crafting gear, using raw materials that took hours of gathering from actual gatherers (pretty sure bots did not gather favors items). To begin with, I did all steps of the process myself... a single piece of class specific gear took hours, and I believe it was effectively capped at about 3 pieces of gear per week if you used your own mats only since favors were capped weekly. It was comparable to the time needed to get end game raid gear... hours just for one piece of BiS gear for one job. The crafting was not gated behind anything though, anyone could have done it completely from scratch exactly like I did, but it was too overwhelming to most players. It was not difficult in the same way that raiding was, but it was difficult enough that not many crafters attempted end game crafts.

I don't know any way to think of crafting back then other than being difficult:

dif·fi·cult
/ˈdifəkəlt/
adjective
needing much effort or skill to accomplish, deal with, or understand.

That is the definition of the word difficult. Crafting needed much effort to accomplish, therefore it was difficult. To argue otherwise is nonsense, that is the definition of the word. Did it take skill? No. Did it take understanding? Only if you wanted to improve your HQ chances. But it was difficult because of the large amount of time/effort needed.

But now? Buy a few NQ materials for like 20,000 gil on the market, click a one button macro you found online and bam, 100% guaranteed you get a piece of end game crafting gear that can be used by all crafting classes. A few minutes of effort right now get you what would have taken dozens of hours to get back then.

I agree that, End Game Crafting should be NOT EASY, same as Savage Raids, shouldn't be EASY !


Beside, Crafting right now, is easier than before, and pleople still complain - thus - making SE revamping Crafting in 5.1,


If some one, don't want to learn and read the skills how to craft, shouldn't be craftier in first place

I wouldn't mind the crafting difficulty being brought back to HW levels or even harder, honestly.

There was a lot less market board flooding going on when people had to work to get both the materials and to actually HQ something successfully.

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Originally Posted by testname

I agree that, End Game Crafting should be NOT EASY, same as Savage Raids, shouldn't be EASY !


Beside, Crafting right now, is easier than before, and pleople still complain - thus - making SE revamping Crafting in 5.1,


If some one, don't want to learn and read the skills how to craft, shouldn't be craftier in first place

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That’s also the point of this thread. If a thread is popular enough, it gets forwarded to the dev team and they consider it for future patches, etc. Since this thread is one of the most popular ones in the DoH english section, it helps a lot for raising awareness to endgame crafting’s easy difficulty and how over simplified it is.

I also believe this thread is why they are working on difficult recipes and making balanced changes for endgame crafters. (They literally acknowledged that it’s too easy to HQ stuff, I can post the source if you want.)

And if they still make it easy? This thread will just continue to raise awareness, simple as that.