On another note, I'd like to vent about people voting to abandon parties after one or two wipes. The newest raid is so bad about that - everyone rage quits on that one guy and it's like... well, you're not going to get past him giving up either.
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12-26-2017, 06:42 AMLittleChickenNugget
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12-26-2017, 07:31 AMErim-NelhahI've only done Rabanastre once, but I didn't think it was that bad. Not even Hashmal. I'm sure I'll run into a bad group soon enough, tho.Quote:
Originally Posted by LittleChickenNugget
As for a story, I was in a weeping city yesterday that had a MT who'd never tanked it before, so we ended up nearly wiping to Forgall (no HG for hell wind and me not paying attention meant that he ate a few people before I picked him up), and then the fun one: people tunnel ozma toward the end, and I ended up soloing the last 1-2%, literally killing him about 1 second before walking dead (LD) falls off and kills me. That netted me 6 comms. Run was actually pretty smooth other than that. :)
--Erim Nelhah -
12-26-2017, 07:35 AMTridusIIRC that ability can also be interrupted on the first boss, so that's not just on you. :)Quote:
Originally Posted by VanilleFang
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12-26-2017, 07:49 AMVanilleFangOh right, I forgot to mention. All three others were new to the dungeon. So the tank didn't know and I forgot to tell him.. xDQuote:
Originally Posted by Tridus
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12-26-2017, 09:17 AMKleeya
The more i am doing some savages, the more i find funny these players that, after one wipe, two at best, say "NO ONE knows the mechanics !!!" and then quit the group right away. "NO ONE" said like they are the only one in the group to be a pgm while all other are noobs that are charging blindly without a clue of what to do. Talk about an inflated ego.
Especially when the wipes are coming from one or two players max, and all the others are doing well.
And even more especially when entering a training group with a "first time trying this" comment in the party finder. What did you expect, to have free loot right away ? XD -
12-26-2017, 09:38 AMHyoMinParkTo be fair, when I am joining farm groups (specifically farm groups, not learning or clear parties), I have a three-strikes rule: three wipes, and I leave because some of the groups are just that hopeless. I'd rather leave and find a more competent group when I'm looking to farm content with PUG groups. This is for Savages and Extremes. My tolerance is lower if the group is advertising "fast, easy clears; high DPS only".Quote:
Originally Posted by Kleeya
Learning parties and clear parties are a different story, but my tolerance with farm groups has gone down a lot the past month because of how bad a lot of them can be (I'm talking wiping to Alte Roite or barely able to make it past the first Long Drop in V2S).
Oh, consider yourself blessed. I run Rabanastre anymore just for the meme-runs. They can be...very disastrous. The one I did this morning wiped to Mateus because everyone completely ignored the Aqua Spheres and there was no safe spot to stand for Blizzard IV.Quote:
Originally Posted by Erim-Nelhah
There weren't any other wipes, but the three bards in my party died close to 30 times between them. The BLM died 6 or 7 times. Can't remember, but it was a lot. -
12-26-2017, 10:27 AMKanitezzThey definitely shouldn't generalize like that.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kleeya
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12-26-2017, 04:56 PMChloeGraceUntil you get some idiot MNK or DRG that has stun in their "rotation". Then you're screwed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tridus
Stun should never be part of any rotation at 50. -
12-26-2017, 11:12 PMMoroMurasakiIt was a while ago but I had a Rabanastre run where I cast 24 raises within my own party. No wipes either, just all the deaths. My cohealer and the SMN in the party apparently forgot where their SC/Raise buttons were... y'know, when they weren't dead.Quote:
Originally Posted by HyoMinPark
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12-26-2017, 11:29 PMTridusI had someone argue with me today, claiming that RDM shouldn't use Verraise because it hurts their DPS... as if making me hardcast Raise while someone else is dead is somehow not hurting group DPS far more.Quote:
Originally Posted by MoroMurasaki
I don't even... -
12-26-2017, 11:33 PMMoroMurasakiSo I know people argue that healer DPS skills are for soloing content and that's why they don't have to use them on group play... which, of course, is monumentally stupid. If a RDM isn't supposed to be raising with their built in Swiftcast for free what are they using that button for? o.OQuote:
Originally Posted by Tridus
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12-27-2017, 12:02 AMkupokage
Tired of seeing i255 vendor geared players in a level 67 dungeon. SE wants to sync me DOWN because I may be strong for some content but they have zero issue with players being too weak for the same content.
It's shizz like this that make me dread leveling alt jobs. -
12-27-2017, 12:11 AMMisteI feel you....try loading into Doma Castle and getting a healer using an i210 weapon. No joke. My boyfriend and I just gave up and left instead of dealing with that. I've always said the DF needs a few more checks in it for content because getting a healer unable to heal the dungeon just shouldn't happen.Quote:
Originally Posted by kupokage
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12-27-2017, 12:51 AMTridusLevelling needs a minimum ilvl by Stormblood for sure (IMO probably by The Vault), if only to stop people from not realizing just how big a mess they're getting themselves into. Vendors sell gear that would get you past the check.Quote:
Originally Posted by Miste
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12-27-2017, 01:09 AMAmeelaYeah honestly it's really a joke.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tridus
I didn't know this until recently but you can go into Castrum Abania and any other leveling dungeon below that in level 1 gear, how is that in any way acceptable? -
12-27-2017, 02:38 AMTheAngelneer
Got one of those 0 dps healers just now on Keeper of the Lake.
A SCH that refused to even use DoTs. Seriously. I asked him to at least use his DoTs and the response was "When I'm not healing".
Well, guess I can use DPS skills when I am not Tanking either, hope he enjoyed all the glory of my Flash spam and ocasional Circle of Scorn. Things were taking forever to kill, last boss took over 7 minutes to die, but boy the catharsis felt great. -
12-27-2017, 06:40 AMAlyssaWildheart
I got a really fun Titan normal run yesterday.
The whole group was new except for me, so I had to explain all the mechanics and stuff, and everyone was talking and listening. We failed a few times, but everyone quickly learned from their mistakes and we had a fun time.
Also Titan hit me with the granite gaol thing EVERY single time...which I found amusing and had a good laugh about. -
12-27-2017, 07:18 AMAmeelaI don't get this at all...Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAngelneer
Like before SB I get it Cleric Stance was kind of a gamble and I could understand people not wanting to use it but in SB there's really no reason not to DPS, especially as a Scholar where you can heal and DPS at the same time. -
12-27-2017, 07:26 AMLilsephIt's sad because they have like 8 DPS skills in their hotbars.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAngelneer
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12-27-2017, 07:39 AMEnlaI... But... What...? The entire point of SCH is having mitigation abilities that will help you sneak in damage and /prevent/ the need to overheal your party members. Yes, SCH can be a bit of an undertuned mess at 50 these days and it's HW additions are sorely missed when doing ARR content, but there should never be any time you shouldn't be making sure to keep up your dots. Especially as many of them are INSTANT. Miasma 2 and Bio 1-2 take no time to weave in... I can understand not wanting to Bane if you need your Aetherflow stacks for a Lustrate or Sacred Soil instead, but that suggests far more problems if that was the case.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAngelneer
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12-27-2017, 08:22 AMTheAngelneerIt is the Pure Prince(ss) Healer mentality. They believe they are just a do-gooder that heals out of the purity of their hearts and can't get anywhere near those terrible spells that cause pain and suffering. No no no, bashing stuff and dealing damage is the thing those savage DPS do, they only need to make sure their hair looks good when they are casting their heals and that they stay forever innocent and pure.Quote:
Originally Posted by Enla
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12-27-2017, 08:26 AMbounddreamerI'd say they're watching Netflix, but I actually have run dungeons on healer while watching Netflix and it's still possible to heal and dps. It's that easy.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAngelneer
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12-27-2017, 08:36 AMEnlaMeanwhile the rest of us are over here, bathing in our beloved salt mine and gleefully watching it grow with every pug we encounter.Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAngelneer
https://pm1.narvii.com/6002/bc6d245b...86b95d1_hq.jpg -
12-27-2017, 08:45 AMInfindox
Had a weird dungeon run the other day. Something happened to the tank irl and they accidentally wiped us all because of it. They said issues irl but they were back and sorry, no big deal. We continued back to the place before we pulled and the healer goes "uh... Aren't you guys gonna wait for protect?"
Other dps: oh sorry thought you'd use Protect right before we pulled
Healer: my what patience.
Then leaves us. I honestly didn't know what to think at the time lol -
12-27-2017, 10:34 AMAosha+ Shadowflare which is an OGCDQuote:
Originally Posted by Enla
On the conversation that was going on earlier around that i260 staff:
I'd say it's all dependent on how you personally view those "Schrödinger's argument" situations, and how willing you personally are to risk it happening. Both sides have their valid points. -
12-27-2017, 02:49 PMLokier
Amidst trying to get my BLM to 70 I encountered horrible group after horrible group in Doma Castle and Castrum Abania... The worst was when a healer joined Castrum Abania in 65-67 gear... Wearing a lvl 60 ilvl 230 weapon... :)
We died on the first pack, we died on the first boss, we died on every pack on the way up the dungeon, we didn't die on the 2nd last boss because there's not really any damage to worry about (unless someone doesn't take their buff.) By the end the tank eventually quit on the end boss when we couldn't even kill it after 6 or 7 tries. No idea what was said in the end before they all seperated, they were all German... Queued for an English run... -
12-27-2017, 03:32 PMIscahI get the same thing all the time - I'm Australian, so on the Japanese server, and I set the duty finder to English only but still end up in lots of parties with three Japanese speakers. Apparently a lot of people just tick all the boxes anyway to get into the dungeon faster.Quote:
Originally Posted by Lokier
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12-27-2017, 04:58 PMVanilleFang
So I ran Rabanastre earlier and well... People didn't really follow mechanics (no surprise) and we wiped twice on Mateus. Like at one point Team A pulled their mob over to Team C (my team) and stuff like that. Blah blah we finally make it passed him with Alliance B bitching at everyone. I get it, you just want to clear. But what do you expect from a 24man raid? They go to shit like 75% of the time.
The best part of the run though was when I had to solo heal Hashmal. It was super fun (no lie, it was), and thank you RDM on my team who helped me keep up with the ressing! You earned my comm! I sometimes actually wish there were more opportunities to solo heal content. -
12-27-2017, 05:08 PMKakiko
Ran Temple of the Fist the other day as healer and with 2 friends; one tank and one DPS. The other DPS was a RDM who could not stay alive. He dies a couple of times and then admits, with a laugh, that he was playing on his xbox at the same time and "kept picking up the wrong controller." He kept dying to SUPER EASILY avoidable stuff, too. On the last boss, during the proximity aoe, he actually ran INTO the boss rather than away from and faceplanted. This time, I just left him there. He was nice, but still joking about how he was telling his girlfriend how he could easily play two games at once.
Ran the Aetherochemical Reactor last night with same friend as tank. Got a healer who let tank die on an early trash pack and then at the two Ascians boss, the healer died within 15 seconds three times in a row, to the point our other dps left and we got a replacement. Fourth time, healer dies again within 15 seconds, new DPS dies, tank and I manage to survive enough to beat them and move on to the last fight, where the healer spends a few minutes arguing with the tank about how the tank wasn't tanking properly. After that, the run was fine. Neither tank nor myself got commed though, which was kind of frustrating. -
12-27-2017, 06:23 PMMinako_Nightsong
Today I got Skalla as my expert roulette which I have run dozens of times before as a white mage. I was horrible. We wiped to the trash pulls twice before the first boss, I died during the first boss, then we wiped again on the trash right after. I don't normally have a problem keeping everyone alive on big pulls but I do stress and struggle even at 320 ilvl.
The tank then typed regen and Medica2 via the translator. I had never considered using such an expensive group spell on just a tank but figured I'd try it. It was a game changer. I felt less stress than usual and could put some dps out too. The rest of the dungeon went smoothly. This tank didn't yell at me but instead just gave me good advice and the dps stuck it out showing a lot of patience. I just thought that was awesome. :) -
12-27-2017, 06:59 PMIlyrianNice of them to give you advice - sounds like a good group dynamic with nice people.Quote:
Originally Posted by Minako_Nightsong
What is slightly alarming is the fact you (and others) can get to ilevel 320 (assuming you have done a few bits of group content to get there) and not know something so basic. I've seen this exact instance a few times before and think it just proves what a bad job the game actually does at acclimating people to healing jobs and could suggest why so few people actually get to and maintain it in end-game content. -
12-27-2017, 07:27 PMAoshaLeveling roulette ignores language selection nowadays, so in there it's not the issue.Quote:
Originally Posted by Iscah
Elsewhere on the other hand... -
12-27-2017, 09:26 PMSpiroglyphThere's nothing more PURE PRINCESS HEALER like than Holying until oom followed by Benediction right after (on yourself, of course, because your HOTs have gotten you aggro and the tank is long dead by now)Quote:
Originally Posted by TheAngelneer
I mean, at least to me this never fails to feel majestic af -
12-27-2017, 09:27 PMBourne_EndeavorFor big pulls on WHM, I recommend...Quote:
Originally Posted by Minako_Nightsong
Swiftcast Holy -> Aero III (Assize) -> Regen
And go from there. Don't be afraid to weave in Holy even if you're still getting comfortable DPSing. I primarily use it so quickly for the Stun. That way if the tank needs extra spot healing, I can either use Assize earlier, Tetra or Cure II. Definitely try to keep Regen up. Another tip, especially if things are on cooldown from an earlier pull, is toss at Cure on the tank at some point during the pull to get a Lily proc for Divine Bension. Try to time this after they do an Overpower/Unleash/Flash. That way it won't effect aggro and gives you just a little more breathing room.
Hope that helps. :) -
12-27-2017, 10:46 PMKacho_NachoIn Penelope's defense, casting Medica II on a single target is not "something so basic." It's incorrect. You use that particular spell for AoE damage.*Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilyrian
Beourne's ... uh... opener(?) is the better way to go. The stun Holy inflicts gives a white mage plenty of time to get extra healing in on the tank.
*However, it also worked. Just goes to show there are different ways to heal on that initial pull. -
12-28-2017, 04:41 AMIlyrianThe intonation from her post was that she didn't see how Medica II/Regen were applicable and/or she wasn't using them in bigger pulls which, as she describes, was needed in that specific case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Kacho_Nacho
Sorry if my post was unclear: it was in no way meant to disparage the player, merely to state how we shouldn't have healers getting to that stage in the game without a basic knowledge of their spells in practical applications. As I said, Penelope's case isn't the first time I seen a WHM struggle on bigger pulls - I had one in Bardam's struggling with Cure 2 spamming and 0 dps - not even a Regen on the tank. I would say that not knowing you can throw 2 HoTs on a tank to alleviate the direct healing and opening you up time to DPS is basic knowledge - or at least should be and if it isn't the game is failing to teach people at the basic level. Again, when and if needed, all situational - not on pull or anything like that. -
12-28-2017, 05:28 AMBahatiYou're not wrong. I'm a WHM main. When you are a baby healer running with baby tanks you may end up pulling the entire mob if you dare stack regen and Medica II. You may also get in trouble with the tank for "overhealing". At some point your playstyle is expected to shift to both regens and heavy DPSing but let's keep in mind that is because our tanks have more access to hate abilities not because our own tools have changed.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ilyrian
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12-28-2017, 05:57 AMbounddreamer
It still catches me off guard sometimes how high level players can be such jerks to the new sprout players.
I made an alt over the weekend on Aether and reached Sastasha on Monday. I'm an endgame raiding tank. When I took my sprout marauder into Sastasha, from the very first pull the dps, RDM in particular, were super aggressive.
You want a Sastasha speed run? Game on.
I think we cleared in 14 minutes. I used Sprint and Overpower quite a bit. The RDM emoted waving at me five or six times as the end boss cutscene started - super annoying, I was going to skip it anyhow, but I just looked /upset at her. Most surprisingly, all three players gave me their comm and only the healer and dragoon were partied, the RDM was a rando.
All I could think, as they filed out and I waited for them to leave so I could go back and get the mapping achievement, was that if that had been my first duty finder tanking experience I would have been dragged along behind that party, would have learned nothing, and would have felt helpless and overwhelmed. I was fortunate I had a solid knowledge base to turn the tables on them. -
12-28-2017, 08:18 AMTempest222
Today was my first time getting kicked from a duty.
I was doing a run of Ala Mhigo and from my prespective everything seemed to be going ok from my end. We had a couple of wipes to trash which weren't my fault. I was neither the tank nor the healer and I was not pulling aggro from the tank or anything like that. I was just doing my AOE's, not being slow, not standing around doing nothing. Then literally right in the last couple of seconds of the second boss the healer died somehow, but since we were done with the boss I didn't rez him since I thought there's a penalty, so I figured it would be better for him to just respawn. So he he did, and then on the next set of trash we again so everyone respawned at the beginning of the dungeon. I was the first up and as I was running back to our previous location I accidentally pulled the enemies because I flat out wasn't paying attention and was looking at the map to see how far back everyone else was. I figured it was no big deal as everyone else was still on their way back anyway and it's not like I had ever had an accidental pull before. But, apparently it was a big deal as I was booted right as I was respawning again at the start.
Or maybe I was booted for another reason, but that's the only thing I can think of that I did "wrong" during the run plus not rezzing the healer after second boss. Neither of those things seemed like issues to me... So yeah, I'm really confused. I was doing fine as far as my part went imo and then all of a sudden dismissed. Unless its possible to disband the group entirely and it just appears that you got dismissed.
And since I have zero clue what I did so wrong that more than one person agreed I needed to be removed, i don’t know how to improve and not do whatever it is again. -
12-28-2017, 09:29 AMOvenmittsWell for starters, it sounds like there was an issue going on with either the tank not holding hate, or the healer zoning out during something important. Depends on how they died and what caused it. If you have the ability to, you should always make an effort to try to rez the healer since they are your life blood my dude. If the team decides to just wipe and restart, he can always just refuse the rez request. No harm, no foul.Quote:
Originally Posted by Tempest222
Since there's so many unanswered variables to this scenario, I think it could be a little of column A and a little of column B but definitely for sure not entirely your fault. I think the kick was just accepted because they are a bunch of buttmunchers. Don't get yourself down. There are jerks out there, but you just do what you can and you try to roll with it.