Dawntrail needs to better, not just more.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

People saying the game is fine are wrong. Recent statements by a Chinese producer of XIV confirm people are logging in but they are logging in for less time overall and doing less activities. His literal job is to analyze the Chinese data and forward it to SE.

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Interesting. Do you have the source for that info? I'd love to read it.

It be cool if they shook things up but that seems pretty unlikely at this point. They have their safe formula and they'll stick to it.

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Originally Posted by Battler-Ushiromiya

There's the operative word, was. If anyone on here was allowed to design the game it would flop in a week. Thank god the devs don't read this trite.

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At the same time, if the game as it is now was released but without the Final Fantasy brand to carry it, the game would also flop in a week.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

Interesting. Do you have the source for that info? I'd love to read it.

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I don't know if there's a readable version, but Arthars covered the video and posted a Translation video on it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iykDHV5_UiE

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Originally Posted by Battler-Ushiromiya

There's nothing wrong with the game, go play 11 if you want bad design choices lmao

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FF14 isn't a perfect flawless game as you claim. You also sound like someone who hasn't played ff11 and declared it bad based off watching a few videos on it because it isn't ff14 so therefore ff11 supposedly bad. People need to stop being defensing and offended defending the game/company just because people criticize the game and point out it's flaws as if there life depended on defending there favorite game.

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Originally Posted by Jojoya

They said a new type of "lifestyle content" was coming, though I'm sure that's not what you're interested in.

A good question is what are you hoping for if they do add something new for combat content. Is there something in particular you've experienced in another MMO that would also work in this game?

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Nothing groundbreaking actually, I'm not expecting the game to reinvent the wheel.

1. Gameplay rework, it's just too stale, ESPECIALLY for healers, and it's been so for multiple expansions at this point. The 2 min meta is also just a lazy way to balance everything, besides the absurd homogenization. They don't need to redo everything from the ground up.

In truth, they did great with the 6.1 pvp rework, and it feels like what the gameplay should be had the devs free reign. SGE is an offensive damage support, DRK is back to hp drain gameplay, DRG has damage based on jumping around (might be unsuitable for pve), MCH has to deal with smart positioning, SCH can spread dots again, etc... Not everything is perfect but so many of the changes people want, or what the jobs used to be, are implemented in PvP.

2. Content variety. Exploratory areas like Bozja, deep dungeon "rework", how they will improve criterion (basically 4-man savage), Rival Wings/Secure pvp maps rework (and deletion of the snow map), anything with gameplay that is not a straight continuation of what is currently existing.

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Originally Posted by Zairava

I don't know if there's a readable version, but Arthars covered the video and posted a Translation video on it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iykDHV5_UiE

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For those who can't/don't want to watch the video, here's a bulleted list. °˖✧◝(⁰▿⁰)◜✧˖°
(Important note: this is based off of Arthars' translation of the video)

•The CH producer first talks about the culture differences between Chinese and Japanese game developers: He compares JP devs to a ramen shop, focusing more on the craftsmanship, having only a few traditional flavors, and cooking/preparing the food in front of the customer, while CH devs see a mechanic they like and/or is popular from another game and just add it. He also says that Yoshi-P is not like that and is more open-minded and willing to look at other games for inspiration. However, because patches are designed like a year in advance, these new additions to the game might not be as fresh.

•Even with them being one patch behind the world release, there are CH players who feel the game is getting stagnant, the 2-min meta is boring, and, while the quality is still good, the game doesn't feel fresh enough anymore.

•Both he and Yoshi-P looked at the log-in data: there is still a healthy amount of players logging in but for less time. This is one of the reasons why Yoshi-P made so much solo able content and/or content with fewer people involved in EW.

•Yoshi-P told him that in 7.0, they will be making more content for both solo-playing and large-scale groups.

•The previous CH server producer (the current producer's boss) supposedly foresaw some of the issues the game currently has but didn't say anything because of the state of 3.0 and its raiding scene. Arthars didn't know how bad HW's raid scene was outside of JP because JP was still pretty active and asked Xenos if it was that bad. Xenos told him HW's NA raid scene was a graveyard. The previous producer also said that if the game could survive 3.0, it would turn out fine, regardless of if it grew stagnant or not.

•When the current producer first started playing the game, he didn't know things like what a burst window was or about aligning buffs. Arthars says it makes sense because he's a SAM main. Only after ShB and the 2-minute meta was introduced did he realize people were aligning buffs and burst windows.

•He thinks the current discussion about the 2-min meta is interesting and wants to hear suggestions. He does say that he doesn't like 90 or 180 second cooldowns, saying that it would make the game worse. He thinks making the jobs more fun/unique without decency on others would make the game better. Arthars summarizes it as "if you need x amount of damage to clear the fight, it doesn't matter how you get that damage, whether you're doing the 2-minute rotation or not, as long as every individual job is balanced to the point that its uniqueness takes care of their individual DPS.

•The producer thinks job balancing as a whole is a people problem based more on how the community plays/perceives how the game should be played. He says making all (currently) 21 jobs balanced, unique/in-depth, and fun to make everyone happy (who wants all these things for the job(s) they main/play) is impossible. He also points out that XIV's balance compared to other MMO games, bringing up League of Legend's roster as an example.

•He personally felt a difference when playing SAM after Kaiten was removed. He says, as a player, he doesn't really feel the difference with potency changes versus a rotation change. He thinks this is because he thinks he isn't a higher-tier player, so homogenization of the job made it easier for him to understand how to play the game and the job. (He's cleared four Ultimates, by the way)

•Before 4.0, he didn't do any high-tier content. He also says he doesn't think he could have done Alexander Midas or Creator. He thinks 4.0 was when the game reach the point where it was more appealing for most people. He also only started to do high-end content because SAM was added.

•He watches Xenos and agrees with him in that how XIV introduces changes now-a-days is too slow. (For those unaware, Xenos compared the changes between 2.0-4.0 and how massive they were compared to 4.0-6.0. Starting with 2.0, fight mechanics where less difficult but rotations where harder, then 3.0 made things more difficult all around, with 4.0 polishing things up, making fight mechanics slightly harder and rotation slightly easier. Because there was so few changes from 5.0 to 6.0, the game feels stagnant and really needed a change similar to 4.0's change from 3.0, with fun being more emphasized.

•He doesn't think this game is built for min-maxing.

•He doesn't understand some of the videos that complain about XIV only using repeat mechanics (Arthars uses Dynamo and Chariot as examples). He says that the fun of XIV's fights comes from solving the mechanics, so that even for someone who isn't blind progging (which he himself doesn't do), it isn't boring.

•He thinks they should add more Frontlines maps. Going back to his thought that this game isn't for min-maxing, he thinks Frontlines suits XIV's community perfectly because it's suppose to be a more fun and casual then Crystalline Conflict. If it were up to him, he would want to balance PvP more on Frontlines then CC.

•Because he had little-to-no expectation for it, he doesn't think Island Sanctuary was that bad. He doesn't really plan anything on his island and gathers random mats. He thinks the UI is bad though.

•He thinks the dev team need to finish Hrothgar females and not add any more new races, instead using that time to add more facial features and cosmetics. He thinks this will increase Fantasia sales even more.

•He also suggest to Yoshi-P, seeing as so few mogstation glamour pieces are being released due to Yoshi-P wanting to release items as sets, they should instead just release individual, stand-alone items. He also thinks they should spread out mogstation items releases. As it is now, a bunch of items are released after a few months, he thinks something like a few items released once a month would be better.

•He also thinks there should be more regional-exclusive mogstation items. As it is now, other then the items created for the Chinese and Korean servers, the dev team designs mogstation items with global appeal and application in mind.

•He likes the food in the Chinese Eorzea Cafe. He also uses some of the money gained by the cafe on XIV-only Chinese, content creators for things like live events.

•He thinks 4 to 4.5 month for patches is too long and 3 to 3.5 was better. He also thinks we are getting less "fun" content.

•He has spies through out the different types and tiers of gameplay that collect player feedback for him. The current consensus he's been getting is that people want to play the game but the patches are too long and don't have enough new things to do. He agrees with this sentiment but points out that the CH server is lucky because they pay per playtime and only have to pay for retainers once vs the rest of the world's monthly sub.

•Supposedly, SE has been trying to hint at him to remove the pay-to-play model on the CH servers and go to a monthly sub model but he thinks the current model is working fine and that as long as he is producer, their pay model will not change.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

Interesting. Do you have the source for that info? I'd love to read it.

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It was live on a Twitch stream and translated by Arthars live as well. The clip is on his YouTube.

I see someone already linked this. Appreciated! But yes the comments indicate not so much that the game is dying as much as it does what many including Zepla have said-- that players are bored..not just a few, not just some, a notable portion.

The producer also says he basically has employees who play the game and submit feedback directly to him that they observe from the playerbase and the most consistent feedback right now is "We want to play the game but there is nothing to do". I wonder if the relic, Job design, two minute meta, island sanctuary etc have anything to do with that? A lot of new content isn't landing well with players and without very engaging job Design to offset that it seems like a recipe for disengagement.

Unless there's a major shift in the core content, we can expect more of the same baseline.

Probably the most hopeful you can be is additional side content that is replayable enough to take people through the downtime each patch.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

an important community of players to consider feedback from.

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Feedback from the same 30 people on the forums isn't important. You aren't important. Play a different game, it's not for you anymore.

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Originally Posted by Battler-Ushiromiya

Feedback from the same 30 people on the forums isn't important. You aren't important. Play a different game, it's not for you anymore.

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People even outside the forums have been providing the same feedback and complaints, and not a small amount either.

People like you are the reason Blizzard did irreparable damage to the playerbase during Shadowlands. Get a grip.

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Originally Posted by Battler-Ushiromiya

Feedback from the same 30 people on the forums isn't important. You aren't important. Play a different game, it's not for you anymore.

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I think it's time to break out the words of Yoshi-P himself,

https://i.imgur.com/htvDPPi.png

Particularly, point number 3 on there. Source: https://www.gdcvault.com/play/1020179/Behind-the-Realm

Ah I always love the doomsday posts. The vocal minority is always, well, so vocal. I truly wish there were as many discontents as the forums and the ole YouTubes would suggest that way when this expac does drop I don't have to wait in a multiple hundred player queue and everyone can happily play the other games that are so much better. Maybe the whole Chris Metzen nostalgia presentation thing will bring all the WoW kiddies back to their corner of the playground.

Just to throw in my two cents and where I stand as a player, I like to just come back every now and then and do whatever's new, maybe start working on an alt job or a glamour or something to fill out the time. Honestly the game could stagnate now and I'd still have tons of content to chew through for years to come, some people play 50 - 100 hour single player rpgs multiple times and are just dandy. I've put about 1.5k hours in according to Steam, and I've beaten EW and gotten 3 jobs to 90. I've only barely scratched the surface, maybe I need to double my time before I start feeling this burnout everyone is getting, but at that point why not do the famously quoted thing of just leaving and coming back when you get that itch? If you try to nolife everything you're going to run out of stuff to do way fast.

But anyway, even if this expansion is just more MSQ and the same formulas and stuff, that'd be cool with me. I like what we have now, and at least at my level of play, I don't really understand what is so different now than, say, in Stormblood. Hell, I mained MCH during Shadowbringers and apparently that class wasn't meta, or something? Either way, I enjoyed it. I'm sincerely cool with just more MSQ, dungeons, raids, and most importantly glamours. Some new beast tribes, mounts, yada yada. Just more content on the pre-established thing would be excellent. I kind of hate the Eureka and Bozja systems even though those seemed to be beloved, felt like a grind within a grind for me personally.

Either way just wanted to throw out my two cents, been a long time lurker but a first time caller but wanted to kind of offer some different views in the echo chamber I've noticed this forum become.

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Originally Posted by EdwinChucklenuts

Ah I always love the doomsday posts. The vocal minority is always, well, so vocal.

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Why do people assume the "silent majority" is perfectly happy when they are in fact, just silent.
The "vocal minority" of the "this is fine" group claim the high ground with the support of countless accounts that surely agree with them. Being outnumbered by vocal people with other opinions means nothing.

The forum being an echo chamber is a problem because it's the only thing the feedback we give do here : echoes into nothing.

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Originally Posted by Mimilu

For those who can't/don't want to watch the video, here's a bulleted list. °˖✧◝(⁰▿⁰)◜✧˖°
(Important note: this is based off of Arthars' translation of the video)

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Some of this makes me go, yikes, and some of it I agree with.

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•He thinks they should add more Frontlines maps. Going back to his thought that this game isn't for min-maxing, he thinks Frontlines suits XIV's community perfectly because it's suppose to be a more fun and casual then Crystalline Conflict. If it were up to him, he would want to balance PvP more on Frontlines then CC.

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Yeah I'm honestly sick of CC and a lot of PvP abilities really show they were not balanced for frontline *cough* Astro bomb.

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•Because he had little-to-no expectation for it, he doesn't think Island Sanctuary was that bad. He doesn't really plan anything on his island and gathers random mats. He thinks the UI is bad though.

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Yeah well so did I. At some point any expectations I had for IS faded away, I knew it wasn't going to be what most were hoping for (instanced housing). I enjoyed it at first and actually had a good time, now I find it to be a drag and the very idea that they're thinking of doing this again makes me go "please don't". I enjoyed most of the glamours, until this latest patch where we got the furball costume and Target employee.

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•He thinks the dev team need to finish Hrothgar females and not add any more new races, instead using that time to add more facial features and cosmetics. He thinks this will increase Fantasia sales even more.

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Agree that female hrothgar should be finished before we even consider any new races. Also agree that we should just have more options for pre-existing races instead. Still dislike how midlanders get 6-7 face options and the rest are stuck with four. Dislike the reasoning given but hey they work in a business so what's new.

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•He also suggest to Yoshi-P, seeing as so few mogstation glamour pieces are being released due to Yoshi-P wanting to release items as sets, they should instead just release individual, stand-alone items. He also thinks they should spread out mogstation items releases. As it is now, a bunch of items are released after a few months, he thinks something like a few items released once a month would be better.

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Point blank, do not like this. I already feel we get too much on the cash shop, we do not need more even if it is "technically" the same amount just in staggered, smaller releases. It'll only serve to make them charge more.

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•He also thinks there should be more regional-exclusive mogstation items. As it is now, other then the items created for the Chinese and Korean servers, the dev team designs mogstation items with global appeal and application in mind.

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Dislike the previous, hate this. Regional exclusive stuff in a game that allows cross-region play is asinine. I know this isn't unheard of but that does not mean I have to think it's a good idea just because other companies do it already. Also, if they're only going for "global" appeal, why do we get cultural specific stuff on the store? Those might appeal more to people who hail from that culture.

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•He has spies through out the different types and tiers of gameplay that collect player feedback for him. The current consensus he's been getting is that people want to play the game but the patches are too long and don't have enough new things to do. He agrees with this sentiment but points out that the CH server is lucky because they pay per playtime and only have to pay for retainers once vs the rest of the world's monthly sub.

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I, hmm. Interesting method of collecting feedback. Honestly no comment on subscription payments or anything.

I'm not going all doomer here but really it is looking that to most the game isn't really "dying" as people say, it's "stagnating" which could lead to a gradual death so in a sense they aren't entirely wrong. Sure, numbers are up but if player retention is decreasing is that not also a problem? I think it's kind of disappointing we didn't even get a trial series this expansion. All the trials were MSQ. I know ARR was pretty much the same but still, disappointing. Also, it's kind of interesting to note that I feel like I'm still seeing more people talking about the main 6.0 story rather than much of anything about what's been going on the patches. The void storyline was kinda meh, but I guess after facing something that threatened all of creation whatever else after that would naturally pale in comparison.

Maybe my experience with Shadowbringers is naturally colored by the fact that I started with that expansion so therefore I "technically" had more to do seeing as I had yet to level all my jobs and do most of the old content. Since I've leveled all of them to cap both then and now, any subsequent leveling is almost nothing. I don't particularly feel driven to do savage or many extremes, so yeah I don't have as much to do as people who do raid. But, still, even after having leveled all my jobs in ShB and caught up with all the older content, I still felt I had plenty that I wanted to do. Now I just, don't particularly feel like doing much, just try to shake up my gameplay by trying to play jobs I've wanted to but haven't really for one reason or another.

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Originally Posted by Calysto

Why do people assume the "silent majority" is perfectly happy when they are in fact, just silent.
The "vocal minority" of the "this is fine" group claim the high ground with the support of countless accounts that surely agree with them. Being outnumbered by vocal people with other opinions means nothing.

The forum being an echo chamber is a problem because it's the only thing the feedback we give do here : echoes into nothing.

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I don't see the echo chamber anywhere honestly. We have people arguing the same points, feeling that the game is fine as is, vs people who don't like how some of it is changed.

The vitriolic "This is fine" group are what I feel toxic casual players. They're the ones constantly implying that people who like hardcore stuff or who like to grind and spend sometime in the game are unbathed animals who need to touch grass. Not all casual players argue this way, but there definetly a "vocal minority" who do.

to be brutally honest here i don't think yoshi want the older player to stay what so ever. he be happy to make this in to a solo game and call it a day. he don't want to make the half finished or bugged or not that great systems better. this will make the team really work and they don have to now. people pay for what there now and will defend it to death as well. why work more? the reason he can do it is that there was no good new MMO in over 10 years now. like where you go to? WOW?

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Originally Posted by Battler-Ushiromiya

Feedback from the same 30 people on the forums isn't important. You aren't important. Play a different game, it's not for you anymore.

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Coming from you, that pretty hilarious.

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Originally Posted by samsaraSaber

to be brutally honest here i don't think yoshi want the older player to stay what so ever. he be happy to make this in to a solo game and call it a day. he don't want to make the half finished or bugged or not that great systems better. this will make the team really work and they don have to now. people pay for what there now and will defend it to death as well. why work more? the reason he can do it is that there was no good new MMO in over 10 years now. like where you go to? WOW?

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Back to GW1. Servers are busy, people are friendly and it seems lots of people are returning and desperately trying to clear their inventories so the economy's popping!

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Originally Posted by samsaraSaber

to be brutally honest here i don't think yoshi want the older player to stay what so ever. he be happy to make this in to a solo game and call it a day. he don't want to make the half finished or bugged or not that great systems better. this will make the team really work and they don have to now. people pay for what there now and will defend it to death as well. why work more? the reason he can do it is that there was no good new MMO in over 10 years now. like where you go to? WOW?

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WoW is doing pretty good lately though. Dragonflight has been well received and they have the whole season of discovery coming up with the classic servers here soon.

Carbot summed it up well with this animation, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INc1M9acshI

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

Coming from you, that pretty hilarious.

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See you in dawntrail doomposter, the formula will not change and you will play it anyway.

I don't see Dawntrail being any different in any meaningful way.

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Originally Posted by Ardeth

I don't see Dawntrail being any different in any meaningful way.

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I don't see that as a bad thing personally. Just look at how SE changes it up with the mainline Final Fantasy games, and the mixed reactions that they all receive because of it. Even small changes in FFXIV get huge community reactions, imagine if they made truly massive changes. There would be riots.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

I don't see that as a bad thing personally. Just look at how SE changes it up with the mainline Final Fantasy games, and the mixed reactions that they all receive because of it. Even small changes in FFXIV get huge community reactions, imagine if they made truly massive changes. There would be riots.

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I don't think anyone is asking for truly massive changes, more so people are asking for small to medium changes just to shake things up. Not a full rework of the formula, but some extra spice.

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Originally Posted by Battler-Ushiromiya

See you in dawntrail doomposter, the formula will not change and you will play it anyway.

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Well, yeah... We still do like the game, after all. If somebody didn't care for the game anymore, they likely wouldn't be here talking at all. You're yelling at clouds, here.

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Originally Posted by Mayhemmer

Well, yeah... We still do like the game, after all. If somebody didn't care for the game anymore, they likely wouldn't be here talking at all. You're yelling at clouds, here.

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Pretty much, the people who offer feedback even when it's not positive are usually the most invested players... Seems like stating how you would want the game to be changed seems like an attack because you're not calling the game perfect.

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Originally Posted by OgruMogru

Back to GW1. Servers are busy, people are friendly and it seems lots of people are returning and desperately trying to clear their inventories so the economy's popping!

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but gw1 is not really an mmo. a great game but not an mmo.

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Originally Posted by Rolder50

WoW is doing pretty good lately though. Dragonflight has been well received and they have the whole season of discovery coming up with the classic servers here soon.

Carbot summed it up well with this animation, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INc1M9acshI

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from what i get it was the EW of WOW. it was received well but fall fast . as the story is a really bad filler and not much new to do.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

I don't see that as a bad thing personally. Just look at how SE changes it up with the mainline Final Fantasy games, and the mixed reactions that they all receive because of it. Even small changes in FFXIV get huge community reactions, imagine if they made truly massive changes. There would be riots.

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change for change is stupid. you need to know what you do and why. its clear this dev team is not interested in doing no change what so ever. why? then they need to do more work.

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Originally Posted by Rolder50

I don't think anyone is asking for truly massive changes, more so people are asking for small to medium changes just to shake things up. Not a full rework of the formula, but some extra spice.

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to be honest there need to be way more interesting gearing up system that make more content relevant as well. this lame tome grined we have now need to go. it can be finished in 1 or 2 days. then what?
we want them to stop add half asses not finished BS to the game and finish old system. when did the GS got new rewards? what the point of the fashion report any more? Adventurer Squadrons???? why are they in the game at all. i can go on and on on systems they just forget.

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Originally Posted by Ardeth

I don't see Dawntrail being any different in any meaningful way.

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Isn't this kind of thing something that is fully perceivable from the last Fanfest? I always had the impression the the 1st and 2nd ones were more for theme, story purposes and the planned content rather than more technical things that can impact the actual gameplay.

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

I think it is just because the trailer has nothing much exciting in it. It's a holiday that resembles Island Sanctuary, something many of us associate with being boring and spending 2 minutes a day or week doing.

The detail provided beyond the trailer is a lot more exciting, such as dark mountains, barren lands and technology. That sort of stuff would actually have made the trailer better but for some reason they just want to show pineapples, grapefruits and burgers.

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Not dismissing the rest of your post, I just wanted to comment on this part in particular.

Speaking only for myself, it doesn't do anything to show how cool the land and new region looks, if they're not going to make the field areas engaging. As they have been for years, they're nothing but background eye candy for the MSQ, that you will walk through once then only on rare occasions when doing hunt trains or the countless unrewarding optional quests (both which you will do flying so even more passively than during the MSQ).
And to make it worse they showcase another desert area. We already had 3. I don't care if the other 3 weren't meso american. The screenshot they showed didn't even look THAT dissimilar to a place that could have been in Thanalan.

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Originally Posted by ReynTime

Not dismissing the rest of your post, I just wanted to comment on this part in particular.

Speaking only for myself, it doesn't do anything to show how cool the land and new region looks, if they're not going to make the field areas engaging. As they have been for years, they're nothing but background eye candy for the MSQ, that you will walk through once then only on rare occasions when doing hunt trains or the countless unrewarding optional quests (both which you will do flying so even more passively than during the MSQ).
And to make it worse they showcase another desert area. We already had 3. I don't care if the other 3 weren't meso american. The screenshot they showed didn't even look THAT dissimilar to a place that could have been in Thanalan.

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ye such a good looking land and new region looks. well teleport to limsa to afk till the next expansion.

It's amazing that we have official statements that players are

-logging in less
-doing less activities
-can't find things to do

but it's still "go play another game, the game is fine, it's just not for you, there's a silent majority that loves the game".

Staff have confirmed what critics are saying, not what defenders are saying. And devs not immediately responding to the criticism (which is impossible and unreasonable) by implementing changes isn't confirmation that they are unaware or don't care either. When 7.0 doubles down on exploratory zones and relic quests (and more) I have a feeling the defenders will be singing a very different tune. That's because for game defenders, the game is "for them" no matter what the current content is. It's a bunch of pointless and circular non discussion.

Umm, is ok if Mao chimes in here? Mao likes game VERY VERY much but Mao thinkings is lots room for improvements. Dye system, Glam system, Character design, Storage system, Housing System, Dungeons (Mao thinkings Variant dungeons is pretty darn good start), PVP, Exploration, all could use much upgrades and improvements. Some already known to be comings with next expansion. Mao thinkings much more is needed though. Is not good for SE to sit on laurels for too long. Can never be sure when next big competitor shows up these days because lots new games showings up out of blue from Indy Companies. SE needs keep pushing. Yoshi needs channel himself from backs when hims was trying save FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by Turtledeluxe

It's amazing that we have official statements that players are

-logging in less
-doing less activities
-can't find things to do

but it's still "go play another game, the game is fine, it's just not for you, there's a silent majority that loves the game".

Staff have confirmed what critics are saying, not what defenders are saying. And devs not immediately responding to the criticism (which is impossible and unreasonable) by implementing changes isn't confirmation that they are unaware or don't care either. When 7.0 doubles down on exploratory zones and relic quests (and more) I have a feeling the defenders will be singing a very different tune. That's because for game defenders, the game is "for them" no matter what the current content is. It's a bunch of pointless and circular non discussion.

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thing is there a silent majority that got the mentality of "suck it up as i did". like you think people like do low level content in roulettes? no but they willing to take it for the imaginary new players. they are the reason SE and yoshi can never improve thing bit degrade them slowly. from what we can get yoshi hate the older players/ non RP end game players and want them to go from the game so he then can make it in to the solo game he so want ff14 to be now. he did openly say he want to bring in the SOLO players the dont want to play an mmo. not to bring in more MMO players. as for the defender of yoshi, they will defend any thing he do. to them he is god. if you privately push this people they will admit they have so much parts of the game they hate but is ok just suck it up.

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Originally Posted by Eraden

Umm, is ok if Mao chimes in here? Mao likes game VERY VERY much but Mao thinkings is lots room for improvements. Dye system, Glam system, Character design, Storage system, Housing System, Dungeons (Mao thinkings Variant dungeons is pretty darn good start), PVP, Exploration, all could use much upgrades and improvements. Some already known to be comings with next expansion. Mao thinkings much more is needed though. Is not good for SE to sit on laurels for too long. Can never be sure when next big competitor shows up these days because lots new games showings up out of blue from Indy Companies. SE needs keep pushing. Yoshi needs channel himself from backs when hims was trying save FFXIV.

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you are correct, but the only thing we know is a better Dye system. not by much as well. all the rest be as now i bet.

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Originally Posted by SargeTheSeagull

The last few weeks i've been trying to pin down exactly why i'm not as hyped for DT as I was for previous expansions. I think i've figured out why. DT doesn't look like it's going to improve upon anything (graphics update aside), just be more of what we have. Now i'm not saying that's bad, 14 is a pretty solid game and the graphics update is going to be massive, but let's be honest, EW has shown a few of the game's cracks.
You know what would really get my blood pumping? Yoshi P getting on stage at JP Fanfest and talking the whole time about improving 14's core. Stuff like gearing overhauls, healers getting more fun, FATE reworks, extreme 24 man raids, faster leveling, item level sync in certain duty finder stuff, glamour being non-job locked, sidequests giving tomestones at max level, customizable job animations, big job changes, duty roulette changes, UI improvements, portrait system fixes, or even letting you craft using materials in your retainers' inventories. Things that make FF14 better, not just more.

We know we're going to the new world. We know we're trying to find the city of gold. We know we're getting six zones, a town, a city, new fates and sidequests and raids. Can you tell us instead what is going to be new and exciting about them aside from visuals? Can the FATEs in a zone trigger a critical engagement or notorious monster? Do you get a zone themed glam set for doing every sidequest in a zone? Things like that would be dozens of times more exciting than spending an hour on stage rehashing things we already know.

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Yeah, I know what you mean. This game desperately needs something to spice it up and make it interesting again.

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Originally Posted by Mayhemmer

Well, yeah... We still do like the game, after all. If somebody didn't care for the game anymore, they likely wouldn't be here talking at all. You're yelling at clouds, here.

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I mean, I've already stated my claim in my thread. If I don't see promise in the healers getting fixed by the media tour, I'm out. The forum gremlin can think I'm here to stay all they want, but if things go as they say, they'll have better luck getting a response from the dead of space than from me come 7.0, cause I'll be playing better games.

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Originally Posted by ty_taurus

I mean, I've already stated my claim in my thread. If I don't see promise in the healers getting fixed by the media tour, I'm out. The forum gremlin can think I'm here to stay all they want, but if things go as they say, they'll have better luck getting a response from the dead of space than from me come 7.0, cause I'll be playing better games.

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That's fair. Unless they somehow drop the ball to some horrifically monumental degree in the media tour stuff, I'll still be around for launch Dawntrail. I enjoy the game on a day-to-day basis enough to want to wait until then to gauge where things stand for me.

The gremlin can still angerly shake their fist at clouds before and after that though, I guess. Not like we'll be here specifically to see it either way.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

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It depends. If you've played for 10 years and it's the same stuff as usual, you might think differently. As the game is now as it has been, I don't need to play the game when it's current. For example, when DT comes out. Everything that is now timegated behind tome caps and weekly lockouts will be gone. Granted, it won't be endgame gear or good gear, but it will be substantially easier to obtain. So if I gave a crap about my time, I would wait until the expansion after DT came out so I could reep the rewards with minimal effort. And that's just one flaw in the system. I think things like the time gating need to taper off better, but it's how SE has always done things. So right now, while there is absolutely nothing of consequence to do and people are unsubscribing left and right, it still takes the same exact amount of time to gear up as it did when the tier came out. It's stuff like that where I want change. We have more than half a year of waiting for new content. There is not going to be another raid tier this expansion, and it's still gated to waste your time. It's crap like that, and it's why I said the above. I don't see anything changing, and after 10+ years, I think it’s time to hang my hat. Because playing at the start of an expansion sucks. The queues are too long, and you get gated on your progression again and again. Look, all I'm saying is some change isn't bad. Even if it's little.

But I don't see any changes. The same old same old. And if you like that great, but again, it's getting stale. We can only ride Wrath of the Lich King tomes of Justice/Valor for so long. All I'm saying.

And that's not even scratching how garbage level sync is. How fun it is to completely lose 90% of your kit so Jimmy can get his Copperbell mines done. While the other two dps don't have aoe and Jimmy is pulling one at a time. It's great. You know what 90% of new players want once they see you can do it? The fights unsynced. Which kills the whole point. Blast through Garuda for me. It's bad enough synced that she dies in a few minutes, but Jimmy's gotta go fast nuke her in 4 seconds.

Or how absolutely barren the open world is. Outside of hunts and time gated shared fate rewards, what is there to do?

It's easy to come up with things that never change and bother newer and even older players.

And here I am, a casual player complaining about a gear treadmill. That I will give up on 4 weeks in and unsubscribe. An open world SE will treat with apathy and a level sync system that two lf its competitors have solved years ago. Hell, they(Wow) stole GW2 flight, and now we have two games with better mounts than us.

What are our saviors exploratory zones(which I hate, btw)?

I'm not going to leave just yet, but this constant need by fanboys and white knights to shun change needs to stop. I mean, we still have the majority of ARR unvoiced. New players get a treat of inconsistent, terrible, fake British accent voice acting. This game still has one of the worst barriers to entry in current mmos outside of 11. Change something for the love of all you hold dear.

I had this same mindset during shb about endwalker and got heavily dissapointed. I recommend you get prepared for the same.