Are you here because you hate WoW or love FF14

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Originally Posted by Mcg55ss

No one gets just quit or anything like that when they post a constructive criticism and don't post it in a condescending way. Don't come to the forum and say well wow's better than final fantasy, all wow contents better than final fantasy and that you're kind of what you like is a reason gaming sucks blah blah blah expect to have positive interaction. Just like life is all on how you present yourself you present yourself as you want to debate and argue and have a pissing contest somebody's going to step up and challenge, you come on here and try to just talk and have a friendly debate about the back and forth about what the game can improve on what it does right what it does wrong you'll get people that want to participate in that respectfully.

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Literally no one said WoW is better than FFXIV, it's actually all in your head, if anything I have said multiple times that FFXIV does the social aspect better and that WoW does the content aspect better, how is that me saying WoW is better than FF again?

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Literally no one said WoW is better than FFXIV, it's actually all in your head, if anything I have said multiple times that FFXIV does the social aspect better and that WoW does the content aspect better, how is that me saying WoW is better than FF again?

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think people go to bed thinking "oh no the sword in silithus ? aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! how come ?", nah, people go to bed chilling and thinking about what M+ or raid, or anything else they'll do the next day. Your kind might be a majority in FFXIV, it's not in WoW, and thank god for that, because people like you ruin games with your vision of it, that's why WoW's content is far superior to FFXIV's, and that's why I enjoy content in one, and not the other.
Last edited by SophiaDL; Today at 07:37 AM.

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Originally Posted by Mcg55ss

think people go to bed thinking "oh no the sword in silithus ? aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaah! how come ?", nah, people go to bed chilling and thinking about what M+ or raid, or anything else they'll do the next day. Your kind might be a majority in FFXIV, it's not in WoW, and thank god for that, because people like you ruin games with your vision of it, that's why WoW's content is far superior to FFXIV's, and that's why I enjoy content in one, and not the other.
Last edited by SophiaDL; Today at 07:37 AM.

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Exactly what I said, I said the content is superior in WoW, so? Does that mean FFXIV is bad ?

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Originally Posted by Renathras

long quote

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I saw the last sentence you wrote and I'm already over it, not bothering sorry bud

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Originally Posted by RosaliaDLB

And yet criticism is pretty widely viewed as a bad thing on this forum,

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No, it's not.

And this has been pointed out TO YOU SPECIFICALLY so many times, you aren't mistaken, you're lying right now.

YOU, personally (or one of your two alts), has had people reply to you, which you then quoted, so you've seen it. People have told you that criticism of game systems is acceptable (ideally if you aren't being a jerk about it), but attacking other people is not criticism of the game and is unacceptable, and using charged language like "FFXIV is garbage/sucks/etc" is not criticism, either.

You seem not to understand the difference between criticism and insults, so you insult the game and players that like and then get confused when people call you out on it, saying you were only offering criticism. You keep doing this AFTER many people have told you that's not criticism, that's insult. So you have no excuse at this point to feign innocence or ignorance.

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No one, LITERALLY NO ONE, here says that "criticism is a bad thing". Even most of the positive posters here, myself included, frequently offer criticism of the game. You know my most frequent ones of (a) no exploration content in EW (with which you agree), (b) the open world having little direct replay value (with which you agree), and (c) encounter design being based on mitigation and avoidance not healing, and non-healer role Jobs having too much healing and free healing among them to make Healers kind of redundant (with which I suspect you also agree on some level).

Toxic positivity isn't a thing here. Toxic negativity is, though. And you should know this because people have told you the difference over and over. Pretending to not listen doesn't absolve you of that fact.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

Literally no one said WoW is better than FFXIV, it's actually all in your head, if anything I have said multiple times that FFXIV does the social aspect better and that WoW does the content aspect better, how is that me saying WoW is better than FF again?

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I never seen any mention of anyone saying wow is better in this thread. Every time i see wow brought up is former wow players constantly bringing up how the game they left sucked and they hate blizzard and wants everyone to know while also claiming ff14 is paradise and perfect and doesn't need to improve certain aspects.

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Originally Posted by Renathras

No, it's not.

And this has been pointed out TO YOU SPECIFICALLY so many times, you aren't mistaken, you're lying right now.

YOU, personally (or one of your two alts), has had people reply to you, which you then quoted, so you've seen it. People have told you that criticism of game systems is acceptable (ideally if you aren't being a jerk about it), but attacking other people is not criticism of the game and is unacceptable, and using charged language like "FFXIV is garbage/sucks/etc" is not criticism, either.

You seem not to understand the difference between criticism and insults, so you insult the game and players that like and then get confused when people call you out on it, saying you were only offering criticism. You keep doing this AFTER many people have told you that's not criticism, that's insult. So you have no excuse at this point to feign innocence or ignorance.

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No one, LITERALLY NO ONE, here says that "criticism is a bad thing". Even most of the positive posters here, myself included, frequently offer criticism of the game. You know my most frequent ones of (a) no exploration content in EW (with which you agree), (b) the open world having little direct replay value (with which you agree), and (c) encounter design being based on mitigation and avoidance not healing, and non-healer role Jobs having too much healing and free healing among them to make Healers kind of redundant (with which I suspect you also agree on some level).

Toxic positivity isn't a thing here. Toxic negativity is, though. And you should know this because people have told you the difference over and over. Pretending to not listen doesn't absolve you of that fact.

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Can you kindly stop screaming ? Maybe use italics instead of screaming ^^

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

I never seen any mention of anyone saying wow is better in this thread. Every time i see wow brought up is former wow players constantly bringing up how the game they left sucked and they hate blizzard and wants everyone to know while also claiming ff14 is paradise and perfect and doesn't need to improve certain aspects.

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They just cant stand being corrected when trying to shill for FF14 with lies, so something that any mature person would just get over with in 2 comments those ex-WoW manchilds drag on over 10 pages constantly trying to tiptoe around them being called out on their lies and digging their heel in the dirt.

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Originally Posted by Shinkuno

They just cant stand being corrected when trying to shill for FF14 with lies, so something that any mature person would just get over with in 2 comments those ex-WoW manchilds drag on over 10 pages constantly trying to tiptoe around them being called out on their lies and digging their heel in the dirt.

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I think ff14 and wow could look at each other and the things both games does right and wrong and use that for both games to improve certain aspects of each game. But apparently by saying that each game could learn from each other means that we think one game is better then the other.

Even when constructive criticism is posted, the goalposts are simply moved. Feedback often isn't posted here to be picked apart by other posters but rather with the hope that it will - by some miracle - be read and handed to the development team. As someone who has posted here consistently for roughly a decade, I think it's fair for me to say this - there's individuals here who will find ways to dismiss even the most politely worded criticism.

I know multiple individuals - myself included - who have backed up their discussion points with quotes from official interviews and in-game sources. That still isn't enough for some, because for such individuals it was never about being constructive - they'd rather that anyone they've developed very strange grudges with simply didn't post at all.

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Originally Posted by Nebelheim

I think ff14 and wow could look at each other and the things both games does right and wrong and use that for both games to improve certain aspects of each game.

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Absolutely. Blizzard could take a look at how invested people are into housing, Square could see how many casuals players still like to at least be a bit challenged by the game. Mythic raiders are a minority, but Mythic+ is really popular cause its basically a difficulty slider for every dungeon.

I'm here because there's no other MMO for me to go to and I found a nice RP group I want to stick with.

When a new MMO comes out with a good holy trinity we'll see if I stick around.

WoW destroyed my class (Shaman) in ways FFXIV destroyed AST. I've no desire to revisit the new Shaman even if I miss my goblin. There are somethings WoW does better (battle content) and there are some things FFXIV does better (story). Both are flawed in ways that people may or may not care as I've outlined before (along with a few other "major" competing MMOs).

Currently I'm holding out for AA2. I have 0 hopes that its going to fix the problems of the first game. Here's to hoping I'm wrong.

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Originally Posted by Shinkuno

Absolutely. Blizzard could take a look at how invested people are into housing, Square could see how many casuals players still like to at least be a bit challenged by the game. Mythic raiders are a minority, but Mythic+ is really popular cause its basically a difficulty slider for every dungeon.

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I think ff14 does good with the social aspect of mmos but not when it comes to dungeon/trial/raid/job design. And wow does good at raid/dungeon/trial type stuff but not good at the social side.

You know it’s a topic of ranting contention that stormy is fighting with all their Alts to keep beyond post limits and shinkuno just being shinkuno for better or worse. Now we are just missing an awesomejr alt unless they have one :P then the stars have aligned once more :P

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Originally Posted by CStrife912

You know it’s a topic of ranting contention that stormy is fighting with all their Alts to keep beyond post limits and shinkuno just being shinkuno for better or worse. Now we are just missing an awesomejr alt unless they have one :P then the stars have aligned once more :P

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And what did you offer to the topic?

Yeah thought so

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

Exactly. Why are they just complaining about WoW ? Every time someone criticizes FF14, they complain about WoW ? Doesn't make sense when you think about it. What if someone complains about blue cheese, are you going to say "actually bitter melon tastes really bad" ? Who asked ?

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NO ONE is bringing up WoW except the people complaining about FFXIV.

The people who like FFXIV are telling you why it's good. It's when YOU bring up WoW that it enters the conversation.

You can't accuse other people of doing a thing they aren't - I mean, you physically CAN do so, but it makes you wrong to do so.

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Originally Posted by Mcg55ss

No one gets just quit or anything like that when they post a constructive criticism and don't post it in a condescending way. Don't come to the forum and say well wow's better than final fantasy, all wow contents better than final fantasy and that you're kind of what you like is a reason gaming sucks blah blah blah expect to have positive interaction. Just like life is all on how you present yourself you present yourself as you want to debate and argue and have a pissing contest somebody's going to step up and challenge, you come on here and try to just talk and have a friendly debate about the back and forth about what the game can improve on what it does right what it does wrong you'll get people that want to participate in that respectfully.

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This.

You're talking up WoW in another game's forum. Then you complain when the people who play and enjoy said other game don't agree with you.

That's not "criticism" that is being viewed negatively. It's a combination of insults and propagandizing/advertising another game on your party. Same for the people that do this with GW2 and ESO and so on. If you play and enjoy other games, we're all totally happy for you. That doesn't mean you being negative ALL THE TIME here is going to be well received.

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EDIT:

Like for my part, legitimately, I think the only time I even mention WoW is once someone else has brought it up. And then it's less harping on WoW and more comparing and contrasting things, like healer class/Job kits and so on.

Yeah, some people dislike WoW. Doesn't change the fact they GENUINELY like FFXIV, and it doesn't change the fact that you're bringing up WoW more than anyone else. Maybe the reason you see so many people harping on WoW is because YOU keep bringing it up in a forum for a completely different videogame? Ever consider that?

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Originally Posted by Renathras

NO ONE is bringing up WoW except the people complaining about FFXIV.

The people who like FFXIV are telling you why it's good. It's when YOU bring up WoW that it enters the conversation.

You can't accuse other people of doing a thing they aren't - I mean, you physically CAN do so, but it makes you wrong to do so.



This.

You're talking up WoW in another game's forum. Then you complain when the people who play and enjoy said other game don't agree with you.

That's not "criticism" that is being viewed negatively. It's a combination of insults and propagandizing/advertising another game on your party. Same for the people that do this with GW2 and ESO and so on. If you play and enjoy other games, we're all totally happy for you. That doesn't mean you being negative ALL THE TIME here is going to be well received.

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oh my god my dude, how do you keep lying so much, anytime something is brought up agaisnt FFXIV, people always respond "but wow does this" "but wow does that" just stop it lmao

not only do you just write walls of text, but you also just lie so blatantly, it's just blah, and you make me want to never respond to you again, guess I should re-take my stance on that, maybe it actually isnt worth responding to you after all

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

I think it's exactly this kind of thing you're describing that has actually created many of the 'trolls' on these boards.

In the beginning, many new users come here and post legitimate heartfelt criticism that they've spent a long time thinking about; They end up getting rebuked and torn to shreds by people who will defend this game at any cost, even if it means engaging in some of the most blatantly disingenuous argumentation tactics imaginable. Of course it's natural to walk away from an interaction like that feeling frustrated. Most people will just keep walking, and not come back to these forums; But there are others that have trouble letting it go, and end up going on a villain arc.

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Pretty much this, "you reap what you sow" really fits this forum imo

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Originally Posted by Theodric

Even when constructive criticism is posted, the goalposts are simply moved. Feedback often isn't posted here to be picked apart by other posters but rather with the hope that it will - by some miracle - be read and handed to the development team. As someone who has posted here consistently for roughly a decade, I think it's fair for me to say this - there's individuals here who will find ways to dismiss even the most politely worded criticism.

I know multiple individuals - myself included - who have backed up their discussion points with quotes from official interviews and in-game sources. That still isn't enough for some, because for such individuals it was never about being constructive - they'd rather that anyone they've developed very strange grudges with simply didn't post at all.

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I think it's exactly this kind of thing you're describing that has actually created many of the 'trolls' on these boards.

In the beginning, many new users come here and post legitimate heartfelt criticism that they've spent a long time thinking about; They end up getting rebuked and torn to shreds by people who will defend this game at any cost, even if it means engaging in some of the most blatantly disingenuous argumentation tactics imaginable. Of course it's natural to walk away from an interaction like that feeling frustrated. Most people will just keep walking, and not come back to these forums; But there are others that have trouble letting it go, and end up going on a villain arc.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

oh my god my dude, how do you keep lying so much, anytime something is brought up agaisnt FFXIV, people always respond "but wow does this" "but wow does that" just stop it lmao

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You would know about lying.

Show me where you've been negative to FFXIV and I've responded with "but wow does this".

You said "always", which means that I must have done it. Find ONE post where you were negative to FFXIV and {I}, me specifically, brought up "but wow does this" to bash WoW.

Find one. I dare you.

Oh, right, there isn't one, much less ALL of them.

STOP LYING.

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Originally Posted by Renathras

You would know about lying.

Show me where you've been negative to FFXIV and I've responded with "but wow does this".

You said "always", which means that I must have done it. Find ONE post where you were negative to FFXIV and {I}, me specifically, brought up "but wow does this" to bash WoW.

Find one. I dare you.

Oh, right, there isn't one, much less ALL of them.

STOP LYING.

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I aint even talking about you my guy I'm talking in general, there's multiple people that use "wow does x" as a rebuttal to criticism agaisnt FFXIV, just stop

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

I aint even talking about you my guy I'm talking in general, there's multiple people that use "wow does x" as a rebuttal to criticism agaisnt FFXIV, just stop

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Just say I'm glad AlexiaD is back. I like this one :)

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

I think it's exactly this kind of thing you're describing that has actually created many of the 'trolls' on these boards.

In the beginning, many new users come here and post legitimate heartfelt criticism that they've spent a long time thinking about; They end up getting rebuked and torn to shreds by people who will defend this game at any cost, even if it means engaging in some of the most blatantly disingenuous argumentation tactics imaginable. Of course it's natural to walk away from an interaction like that feeling frustrated. Most people will just keep walking, and not come back to these forums; But there are others that have trouble letting it go, and end up going on a villain arc.

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I dunno… there is an element of truth to it sure. I myself feel like the negative trolls of the Internet have over the years caused me to be far more sceptical and less inclined to take every post as equally valid (So... yaya?) but I just do not see the 'toxic praise' being as prevalent as people say here. People disagree with criticism sure and personal bias will always play apart in forming opinions, but the outright ‘Yoshi-P/Capitalist SE worship’ behaviour seems minimal at best, on this forum at least.

Even then, if a troll is being a troll/acting like a horrible person to others just because they want ‘revenge’ then its still not a valid excuse. Again, just because a troll happens to be on your side of a debate that does not mean one should condone their behaviour. Its not a ‘Get out of Jail’ free card.

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Originally Posted by Luluna

Never played WOW I am from FFXI and came here from there...WOW just never appealed to me.

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That was me too, but many many years in between when I dropped FFXI and then FFXIV. I played 11 for roughly 3 years when it first released in the US, and I had to drop the game because of school. (The game did not respect your time at all back in the day.) My brothers picked up WoW and played it for years, but I never bothered with the game because I was too scared to get sucked into a other MMO. Its why I really enjoy FFXIV's content design a lot.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

I think it's exactly this kind of thing you're describing that has actually created many of the 'trolls' on these boards.

In the beginning, many new users come here and post legitimate heartfelt criticism that they've spent a long time thinking about; They end up getting rebuked and torn to shreds by people who will defend this game at any cost, even if it means engaging in some of the most blatantly disingenuous argumentation tactics imaginable. Of course it's natural to walk away from an interaction like that feeling frustrated. Most people will just keep walking, and not come back to these forums; But there are others that have trouble letting it go, and end up going on a villain arc.

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Yeah, there's also the very strange attempts to police what aspects of the game anyone is supposed to like or dislike. Particularly towards certain characters in the story or any content that requires a bit more thought and planning than yet another round of crystal tower in a daily roulette. Thankfully it isn't all bad since I've met some pretty cool individuals over the years simply by posting here who I otherwise never would have encountered in-game due to playing on a completely different server/datacentre.

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

I aint even talking about you my guy I'm talking in general, there's multiple people that use "wow does x" as a rebuttal to criticism agaisnt FFXIV, just stop

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You can't say "always...in general".

It's either ALWAYS or it's not always.

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Also: Which of these posts was a "wall of text", eh?

You're so bad faith it's terrible.

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EDIT:

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

I dunno… there is an element of truth to it sure. I myself feel like the negative trolls of the Internet have over the years caused me to be far more sceptical and less inclined to take every post as equally valid (So... yaya?) but I just do not see the 'toxic praise' being as prevalent as people say here. People disagree with criticism sure and personal bias will always play apart in forming opinions, but the outright ‘Yoshi-P/Capitalist SE worship’ behaviour seems minimal at best, on this forum at least.

Even then, if a troll is being a troll/acting like a horrible person to others just because they want ‘revenge’ then its still not a valid excuse. Again, just because a troll happens to be on your side of a debate that does not mean one should condone their behaviour. Its not a ‘Get out of Jail’ free card.

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ALLLLLLL of this, yes.

Honestly, who here and what posts have been "Yoshi-P/Capitalist SE worship"?

I think the people wanting to be negative love waving that caricature around because they think it justifies their being nasty to people, but who is doing it? No one, that's who. It's just not happening in any of these discussions.

People defending a game THAT THEY LIKE by pointing out its good aspects or presenting arguments against criticism are not "worshiping" it.

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EDIT2:

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Originally Posted by AlexiaD

https://somnomed.com/au/wp-content/u...k-1024x680.jpg

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Not that you care...but you aren't helping your case with that kind of nonsense.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

It's true that there are actually very few individual users like this.

I think the problem is that those 2-3 users that are like that tend to post in almost every single thread, which makes the behavior feel omnipresent, even if its sources are in reality few.



I agree, it's aberrant behavior, particularly when it comes to those who are willing to go to the lengths to operate multiple accounts and ban-evade.

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Who's doing it, though?

I genuinely don't think I've seen any Yoshi P worship around here for quite some time.

I see a lot of people ACCUSED of Yoshi P worship, but those are people who are just explaining what they like about the game, offering counters to the...CHARITABLY "critiques" (more insults and spite, but let's pretend)...and who even offer their own critiques.

Who are these 2-3?

On the other hand, I see 5-10 (though at least some of those are alts) that are perma-FFXIV haters, who frequently engage in spats with other players/posters, start bait threads, attack and insult other posters, attack and insult the devs, and attack and insult (not critique) the game. I've even pointed out before, if one is attacking other posters, they aren't offering critique on the game itself, yet those people continue to do it.

So who are the 2-3 Yoshi P worshipers here? Can you point out some of their posts? If they're so prevalent, they must be all over, right?

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Originally Posted by Renathras

You can't say "always...in general".

It's either ALWAYS or it's not always.

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Also: Which of these posts was a "wall of text", eh?

You're so bad faith it's terrible.

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https://somnomed.com/au/wp-content/u...k-1024x680.jpg

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Originally Posted by Shinkuno

And what did you offer to the topic?

Yeah thought so

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Damn that's some edge right there...could use that to edge me some fine cutlery to use for this lovely steak dinner I'm making. I already offered topic discussion earlier....your not doing anything really productive at this point rather then beating down your own beliefs and opinions on people whether they are right or wrong so you don't really offer much to the discussion either after your initial spat.

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Originally Posted by CStrife912

Damn that's some edge right there...could use that to edge me some fine cutlery to use for this lovely steak dinner I'm making. I already offered topic discussion earlier....your not doing anything really productive at this point rather then beating down your own beliefs and opinions on people whether they are right or wrong so you don't really offer much to the discussion either after your initial spat.

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How much is there really to offer such a topic to begin with?

The concept that people are throwing money at XIV solely because they think they are spiting WoW in some way is ludicrous. If there was someone who was only here for that reason, and not because they actually like anything about XIV, they need help.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

People disagree with criticism sure and personal bias will always play apart in forming opinions, but the outright ‘Yoshi-P/Capitalist SE worship’ behaviour seems minimal at best, on this forum at least.

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It's true that there are actually very few individual users like this.

I think the problem is that those 2-3 users that are like that tend to post in almost every single thread, which makes the behavior feel omnipresent, even if its sources are in reality few.

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Originally Posted by Hurlstone

Even then, if a troll is being a troll/acting like a horrible person to others just because they want ‘revenge’ then its still not a valid excuse. Again, just because a troll happens to be on your side of a debate that does not mean one should condone their behaviour. Its not a ‘Get out of Jail’ free card.

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I agree, it's aberrant behavior, particularly when it comes to those who are willing to go to the lengths to operate multiple accounts and ban-evade.

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

How much is there really to offer such a topic to begin with?

The concept that people are throwing money at XIV solely because they think they are spiting WoW in some way is ludicrous. If there was someone who was only here for that reason, and not because they actually like anything about XIV, they need help.

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Same with how sunken cost fallacy in my eyes is so stupid...products change and evolve for better or worse...they may never be the same thing you started at and if this is 10 years or even 2 years...they're not obligated to cater to your specific wants and needs there are 1000s of players with differing opinion....but I spent ma money here for so long I don't want to leave it behind because I invested so much time and money into it....how many people do that with FIFA games or a new CoD year in year out...eventually Fornite will die (maybe like 10 more years at this rate) I wont imagine people will be screaming sunk cost fallacy issues there....you can detach and move on...heck I let my sub run because the amount 'TO ME' is a nothing burger...I spent more on this steak then a month sub....I know not everyone is in that boat but the game catering and doing things for a playerbase that isn't exclusively my wants isn't a big deal...do I want to play more? Sure...but I am ok with taking longer breaks and coming back when it puts out stuff.

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Originally Posted by CStrife912

Same with how sunken cost fallacy in my eyes is so stupid...products change and evolve for better or worse...they may never be the same thing you started at and if this is 10 years or even 2 years...they're not obligated to cater to your specific wants and needs there are 1000s of players with differing opinion....but I spent ma money here for so long I don't want to leave it behind because I invested so much time and money into it....how many people do that with FIFA games or a new CoD year in year out...eventually Fornite will die (maybe like 10 more years at this rate) I wont imagine people will be screaming sunk cost fallacy issues there....you can detach and move on...heck I let my sub run because the amount 'TO ME' is a nothing burger...I spent more on this steak then a month sub....I know not everyone is in that boat but the game catering and doing things for a playerbase that isn't exclusively my wants isn't a big deal...do I want to play more? Sure...but I am ok with taking longer breaks and coming back when it puts out stuff.

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I've learned some *very* expensive Sunken Cost fallacy lessons with Aion. I spent SO much money on their p2w events, only for them to destroy the world - removing half of the zones and changing gameplay systems so dramatically, the likes of which I've never experienced before. It was hard to walk away from that much time and money, but I had to have more respect for my time and money.

Succumbing to sunken cost/time fallacy is not a voluntary action. Gaming companies know this, which is why so many of them design their stuff to exploit it. The same goes for FOMO. The average person won't even realize they're falling prey, let alone have the ability to do an about face. It normally takes an extremely significant change in whatever it is they've taken the bait on for them to realize they've been had and walk away.

It's even more difficult for people who've grown accustomed to not having much money. When you're poor, you know you have to make every penny count. It can make walking away from something like FFXIV a lot more challenging than it ought to be, particularly if you've played it for years.

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Originally Posted by Renathras

Who's doing it, though?

I genuinely don't think I've seen any Yoshi P worship around here for quite some time.

I see a lot of people ACCUSED of Yoshi P worship, but those are people who are just explaining what they like about the game, offering counters to the...CHARITABLY "critiques" (more insults and spite, but let's pretend)...and who even offer their own critiques.

Who are these 2-3?

On the other hand, I see 5-10 (though at least some of those are alts) that are perma-FFXIV haters, who frequently engage in spats with other players/posters, start bait threads, attack and insult other posters, attack and insult the devs, and attack and insult (not critique) the game. I've even pointed out before, if one is attacking other posters, they aren't offering critique on the game itself, yet those people continue to do it.

So who are the 2-3 Yoshi P worshipers here? Can you point out some of their posts? If they're so prevalent, they must be all over, right?

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I'm not even going to bother humoring you, because I've seen precisely how you operate in other threads. (It's also likely against the forum ToS anyway). It really brings us back to one of the statements in my previous post:

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

even if it means engaging in some of the most blatantly disingenuous argumentation tactics imaginable.

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You should run along and go back to arguing the semantics of everyday colloquialisms, or perhaps return to arguing past people in the Healer DPS thread without actually bothering to read and understand any of the content of their posts.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Renathras

Who's doing it, though?

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you ?

/10char

I played WoW until I realized they were not earning my money, when I realized that, I left. I dont hate it, dont love it, but they lost my business. something I highly recommend anyone evaluate for any game they play. if you are not having fun, if they are not earning the money you give them, for the love of the gods, stop giving it to them.

there were things I enjoyed in WoW but the leadership, be it devs or otherwise, could care less and went their own direction. THATS FINE! its their game, they can do what they want with it. same with 14, there are things I am not overly happy about, but I can still live with the direction. when 14 stops earning my money, I will leave here too.

until that time.. I used to play WoW, I no longer do. period, I leave love or hate up to the OP, they seem to have a handle on those...

FFXI TO WOW TO FFXI TO D&D TO FFXI TO FFXIV my hubby and just aren't dawn to there systems. We recently got eso which is taking most of our time, but once we finish all the story I could see us coming back hear I can't grind out end game in 2 mmos

That RMT mindset really poisons people’s brains about these persistent progression type games…

Wow, this thread exploded while I was at work....

.......Aaaaand a good third or so of it is just Shinkuno and VelKallor going at it again. You two really just can't quit each other, can you?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by FenyxRising

Are you here because you hate WoW or love FF14

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Both.

....10char

I'm the weird one that enjoys both. They both have their positives and negatives. Though both games are taking a back seat to Baldur's Gate 3, Armored Core 6 and soon Starfield.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by angienessyo

I'm the weird one that enjoys both. They both have their positives and negatives. Though both games are taking a back seat to Baldur's Gate 3, Armored Core 6 and soon Starfield.

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Yes, BG3 is where its at. I'll probably try starfield too.