Suggestion: Close Raid Roulete Loophole (Using low ilevel to force low level raids)

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

I can queue at whatever ilevel I prefer to. I don't see it as an issue in the least. The idea of trying to control what and how people queue for shouldn't be up to those who prefer to run the 60 level raids.

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What you do is not of my concern, right now the alliance was not fulfilling its purpose long before the current event and needs to be fixed.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

What you do is not of my concern, right now the alliance was not fulfilling its purpose long before the current event and needs to be fixed.

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It doesn't need to be fixed. It works just fine. I would run it all the time and the experience awarded was and is excellent. Alliance and Main Story roulette are two roulettes I would do daily without fail when i was leveling. I see absolutely no problem with them at the moment.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

It doesn't need to be fixed. It works just fine. I would run it all the time and the experience awarded was and is excellent. Alliance and Main Story roulette are two roulettes I would do daily without fail when i was leveling. I see absolutely no problem with them at the moment.

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Of course you don't. Just becouse you don't notice it does mean is not there.

Reality is, same as with normal raid, the roulette was created to help people run abandoned content, and giving something extra for anyone that tag along, and right now is not doing that. So, needs to be fixed and here we are giving some ideas.

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Originally Posted by Driavna

Of course, you don't. But if you don't notice a problem that does not mean is not there.

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Well we'll have to agree to disagree. Sorry but SE has better things to do with it's time that to try and cater to the individual preferences of certain players who don't like how other queue for duties.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Well we'll have to agree to disagree. Sorry but SE has better things to do with it's time that to try and cater to the individual preferences of certain players who don't like how other queue for duties.

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Are you even aware that right now this is exactly what you are doing to other players that want to do any of the other alliance raids for the first time?

SE probably should put exp penalties on those with classes capable of running higher level raids that tank their equipment. Any class at above 50/60/70 should be able to at least equip the gear offered by the poetics tomestone vendor for that level.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Well we'll have to agree to disagree. Sorry but SE has better things to do with it's time that to try and cater to the individual preferences of certain players who don't like how other queue for duties.

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You're looking at it the wrong way. You're defending the current system, that actually caters to individual preferences (gaming the ilvl system to only get raids you prefer in a roulette).

SE should fix their roulettes to disallow this. You don't want to get 60 raids on your roulette? Bite the bullet or queue for 50 raids directly. Roulettes are mainly to boost queues for duties, and these practices are making new people clearing 60 raids almost impossible.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

I don't see a problem at all in gearing for a lower ilevel to get the 50 level raids as opposed to the 60's. Seriously stop trying to control how people queue.

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If you only want the lv 50 ones QUE for them and not the roulet. We want VARIATY and not "is it LotA or Tower" roulet. And no i cant que for all 6-9 raids now would that work as id get forced to the 50 ones anyways and not que for them results in not gettin any raid and defeats the purpose of a roulet.

One other way would be they do the PvP thing and make one roulet prefered for a day or two...

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Originally Posted by Sarevok_Thordin

SE probably should put exp penalties on those with classes capable of running higher level raids that tank their equipment. Any class at above 50/60/70 should be able to at least equip the gear offered by the poetics tomestone vendor for that level.

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THIS a 100 times. I know we level fast but ppl need to lear to actually gear up and not cry when they hit tsuko and go "but muh gear was fine so far, i dont need shire!!!111"

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Originally Posted by Sarevok_Thordin

SE probably should put exp penalties on those with classes capable of running higher level raids that tank their equipment. Any class at above 50/60/70 should be able to at least equip the gear offered by the poetics tomestone vendor for that level.

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Perhaps they need to offer a 50 level roulette and a 60 level roulette and adjust the rewards proportionately and not get into the market of trying to penalize users based on how they gear for duties. Plenty of people still run Main Story roulette because the rewards are well worth the time invested even being forced to watch the cutscenes.

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Originally Posted by LaylaTsarra

Perhaps they need to offer a 50 level roulette and a 60 level roulette and adjust the rewards proportionately and not get into the market of trying to fix how people gear for duties.

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Fixing the gearing up was one way to stop people from manipulating ilvl in Alliance Raids.

Of course I wouldn't be opposed to level 50/60 Alliance Raid Roulettes so long indeed rewards are adjusted, people shouldn't be able to get anywhere fast to 80 using the level 50 alliance raids alone.

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Originally Posted by Sarevok_Thordin

Fixing the gearing up was one way to stop people from manipulating ilvl in Alliance Raids.

Of course I wouldn't be opposed to level 50/60 Alliance Raid Roulettes so long indeed rewards are adjusted, people shouldn't be able to get anywhere fast to 80 using the level 50 alliance raids alone.

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Currently it s the main story roulette that yields the most xp at level 60 and above, and it is way more faceroll than the level 50 raids. I think people should know better by now than to expect difficulty on leveling content. If you want hard stuff just go run some savage/ultimate.

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Originally Posted by Stanelis

Currently it s the main story roulette that yields the most xp at level 60 and above, and it is way more faceroll than the level 50 raids. I think people should know better by now than to expect difficulty on leveling content. If you want hard stuff just go run some savage/ultimate.

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That incentive was needed for the exponentially longer time required to do that content due thanks to the cutscenes, if they didn't add in such rewards nobody else would do it.

i'm going to admit i've stopped following this a few pages ago but... i'm pretty sure people did the same thing with trial roulette so why is just the alliance roulette aggravating people right now? I'm confused.

I queued into Rabanastre and Ridorana earlier today with absolutely no issues, and the queue times were more than reasonable at around 5-10 mins. So I don't see the problem.

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Originally Posted by Sarevok_Thordin

That incentive was needed for the exponentially longer time required to do that content due thanks to the cutscenes, if they didn't add in such rewards nobody else would do it.

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Technically it is still shorter than your average dun scaith raid, especially if you run castrum.

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Originally Posted by CorbinDallas

I queued into Rabanastre and Ridorana earlier today with absolutely no issues, and the queue times were more than reasonable at around 5-10 mins. So I don't see the problem.

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It's safe to assume some players are working in their upgrades, that alone will keep those raids active. LvL 60 are usually more problematic, even before the event.

Why we just wont ask for synchronising stats for everyone?
If someone will queue up into the dungeon with X minimum ilvl required then he should be synced to that ilvl, giving him extra stats and etc. There should be ilvl max and min sync, someone with overkill ilvl should be synced to max ilvl too.

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Originally Posted by Schan

i'm going to admit i've stopped following this a few pages ago but... i'm pretty sure people did the same thing with trial roulette so why is just the alliance roulette aggravating people right now? I'm confused.

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Thank you for bringing this up, Trial roulete needs to be looked into as well. I can count with 1 hand the amount of times I've gotten Tsukuyomi, Byakko, or Seiryu for the past year. For trial roulete the loophole might not be used as much but definitely something to correct either way, the loophole should not exist.
If you want to queu with low ilevel gear, fine, you can do so, but you'll have to use that ilevel 90 gear to clear Titan or Garuda.

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Originally Posted by Amnmaat

Thank you for bringing this up, Trial roulete needs to be looked into as well. I can count with 1 hand the amount of times I've gotten Tsukuyomi, Byakko, or Seiryu for the past year. For trial roulete the loophole might not be used as much but definitely something to correct either way, the loophole should not exist.
If you want to queu with low ilevel gear, fine, you can do so, but you'll have to use that ilevel 90 gear to clear Titan or Garuda.

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The thing with trials is they're usually one and done and no reason to ever run them a second time. The majority of trials you'll ever do in roulette are the ones related to the MSQ. Not getting the Four Lords (optional side quest btw) doesn't mean anything in the slightest.

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Originally Posted by CorbinDallas

The thing with trials is they're usually one and done and no reason to ever run them a second time. The majority of trials you'll ever do in roulette are the ones related to the MSQ. Not getting the Four Lords (optional side quest btw) doesn't mean anything in the slightest.

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Tsukuyomi and Shinryu aren't the Four lords though. Moreover, as long as they're looking into these loopholes they should seal them, they don't align with the purpose of the roulette.

I can understand why people would want to intentionally ilv drop considering how most content past lv 50 is bound to be more difficult and less rewarding to the person, and especially in the case of 24 raids anything past the first two are far more likelier to end in wipes and abandons, so I can see why people would intentionally do this.

Not to say it's right, it is a loophole but when you make harder content or stuff that's more mechnically intense, people are going to try to turn to other solutions to avoid drama, wasted time, dealing with difficult situations. The times I been in Dun Scaith in 4.0+ or Mhach and the wipes and possible abandons have been more than in HW, though that is anecdotal evidence.

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Originally Posted by Amnmaat

Tsukuyomi and Shinryu aren't the Four lords though. Moreover, as long as they're looking into these loopholes they should seal them, they don't align with the purpose of the roulette.

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You're right, but they still won't pop up as much as other MSQ related trials, because shock horror there are more players below level 70 than at level cap. It has always been this way.

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Originally Posted by Seraphor

That said, I didn't get Dun Scaith a whole lot, but I'd say 1/4 of all my Alliance raids were either Void Ark or Wiping City, until a couple months ago, and now this last month it's dropped to never.

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Yeah if I do get one of the Mhach series, it's almost always Void Ark
I think I've gotten Weeping city once, maybe twice
Those runs did take longer, and holy heck my first Dun Scaith run was AWFUL, but I love those raids and enjoy them a lot more than running Syrcus Tower for the 800th time even if it is easier

To the topic, I actually didn't realize that taking gear off to get lower level raids was a thing lol ... I just assumed it was because more people were at lower levels, and/or there were just less people who even had the 60 raids unlocked. It sucks but I've just kind of accepted it at this point :P Can't say I'd mind more variety, though, however they could go about making that happen

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Originally Posted by Avidria

Yeah if I do get one of the Mhach series, it's almost always Void Ark
I think I've gotten Weeping city once, maybe twice
Those runs did take longer, and holy heck my first Dun Scaith run was AWFUL, but I love those raids and enjoy them a lot more than running Syrcus Tower for the 800th time even if it is easier

To the topic, I actually didn't realize that taking gear off to get lower level raids was a thing lol ... I just assumed it was because more people were at lower levels, and/or there were just less people who even had the 60 raids unlocked. It sucks but I've just kind of accepted it at this point :P Can't say I'd mind more variety, though, however they could go about making that happen

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I remember when there was a problem with pulling bosses early which got resolved because someone asked for it to be fixed. A lot of people were against it but now you get teleported into the boss fight. The community will resist everything, but game design requires an understanding of what's fair to everyone and they saw that then and I expect for them to see it now as well.

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Originally Posted by CorbinDallas

You're right, but they still won't pop up as much as other MSQ related trials, because shock horror there are more players below level 70 than at level cap. It has always been this way.

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I'm talking about the loophole, it should be closed; but Alliance raid roulette should take priority in this regard.

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Originally Posted by Amnmaat

I remember when there was a problem with pulling bosses early which got resolved because of a community suggestion where a few people asked for something to be done. A lot of people were against it but now you get teleported into the boss fight. The community will resist everything, but game design requires and understanding of what's fair to everyone and they saw that then and I expect for them to see it now as well.


I'm talking about the loophole, it should be closed; but Alliance raid roulette should take priority in this regard.

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Why is this a problem?

I doubt nearly enough people are doing this to affect things negatively. Your queue is slow because there are far more players doing this roulette that are under 69 and under 59 than those at 60 or 70. Remember it's not level capped people doing alliance roulette, it's mostly players who want exp, and level 70 raids can't be done on alt jobs that need exp.

In my experience mentor roulette tends to be the one that feeds Ivalice raids.

I have no more interest in doing the L60 and L70 raids owing to the bad groups I have experienced. Went with an FC friend recently, got a L70 Alliance raid - we blacklisted 5 of the 6 other players in our group afterwards because they were THAT bad. The shiny mentor crowns should have given us a clue as to what we were in for. Multiple wipes because they couldn't do basic mechanics. Failed dps checks because they couldn't punch their way out of a wet paper bag. 19 other people suffering repeating content again and again because of these players.

This was not an isolated incident.

I only Q for L50 raids now. The ShB Trust system sounds heavenly... ;)

I really don't see the issue, I still get tomes and exp regardless of what raid I do. If you wanna do the current tier ones, just queue for them like normal. It's not like you can override the iLv sync cap anyways.

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Originally Posted by kidalutz

This happens because theres people queuing for the first three for mog tomes. not as many people are unequiping as you think.

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Exactly.