Letter to MR Yoshi: Why parses system is destroying the ffxiv world.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

Ergo, ppl that enjoy parses run and are relying on numbers so much should join and play with ppl that think like them. The weekly clear parties are not the place! Weekly clear, 2 chest is self-explanatory: we want our book and our drops! The run need to be smooth, ppl nice and TEAM PLAYERS that’s what most of raiders don’t get :(

---

Raiders kinda have to be team players, though... if anything, the people who lack teamwork are those who either don't learn mechanics OR do less than bare minimum DPS (like a RDM doing 1k DPS on Phantom Train Savage, with their only death being to the DPS Ghost). All 8 players have to contribute in some way, otherwise no one is going to clear the fight (especially if all but one DPS are doing less than 4k).

The other day, a friend pointed out that the DRG and RDM were doing low DPS (the BLM was pretty low, too) and they responded back by calling him "Leviathan trash" and kicked him from the party. The BRD was the highest DPS at 4.4k, for those curious.

I read this first post and I'm already all like 'there's no way this is an actual thread, those examples provided just way too specific in actually supporting the use of a parser instead' for this to not be some kind of parody attempt.

Ladies and gentlemen my idea this morning with this post was absolutely not to create any kind of discussion or such useless drama! The title clearly says: Letter to Mr Yoshi. That was and still is my opinion about the parsing system and I am just naive hoping to catch his attention that is it! I am not honestly interested in feedbacks and I hate arguments in general...
I continue to think that the parsing system is the worst thing ever happened to this game and as I can see by the toxicity of some ppl replying I was right!!! Almost nobody gave a contribution, a suggestion and what I see is just HATE.
I tried to explain with the parses are creating discrimination and an hostile community full of selfish people I really don’t care about my parses but I want to look at your conscience and ask yourself: am I greedy when I play? Is to get a Orange log a priority to me? If the answer are YES maybe I am right...

I didn’t troll because I am a respectable person and an adult, the concept of discrimination I expose it’s real believe it or not..
To you guys, elite players I ask: do you think having a orange log make you better players than others? If you think of your self as 1rs class player and who doesn’t 2nd class or 3rd... THAT IS DISCRIMINATION !

Peace & Love

On the off-chance you actually *are* serious about this, as an orange ranked parser myself, I want to say you're not getting that high up there in the first place by dying because you refused to use emnity reducers/dumps and ripped aggro off the tank in the first place. >_>

Nothing tanks your DPS faster than freaking death.

Shadewalker literally exists just to give tanks the ability to remain in DPS stance longer too. If the tank remains in tank stance throughout, they're never going to need it.

Those two examples in particular are why people are treating this thread as a joke, because parsing raiders have every incentive in the world to actually use such skills correctly in the first place.

Last thing: To show my sincere interests in this community and this game I would like to extend a suggestion...because I think not all but many player agree with me will be nice to keep logs run and weekly clear separated, if you want to parse or consider yourself an elite player write it on your PF and look for ppl like you. Let’s keep logs out of weekly clear so you won’t take all the fun out from who doesn’t care at all and want just play for drops,achievements or whatever please :)
I would like the developers to put a new option to select on PF creation where if you want to parce it’s specified something like that may work :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

Ladies and gentlemen my idea this morning with this post was absolutely not to create any kind of discussion or such useless drama! The title clearly says: Letter to Mr Yoshi. That was and still is my opinion about the parsing system and I am just naive hoping to catch his attention that is it! I am not honestly interested in feedbacks and I hate arguments in general...
I continue to think that the parsing system is the worst thing ever happened to this game and as I can see by the toxicity of some ppl replying I was right!!! Almost nobody gave a contribution, a suggestion and what I see is just HATE.
I tried to explain with the parses are creating discrimination and an hostile community full of selfish people I really don’t care about my parses but I want to look at your conscience and ask yourself: am I greedy when I play? Is to get a Orange log a priority to me? If the answer are YES maybe I am right...

I didn’t troll because I am a respectable person and an adult, the concept of discrimination I expose it’s real believe it or not..
To you guys, elite players I ask: do you think having a orange log make you better players than others? If you think of your self as 1rs class player and who doesn’t 2nd class or 3rd... THAT IS DISCRIMINATION !

Peace & Love

---

You came to a forum where players discuss things and thought you were addressing a letter to Yoshida? Man, you're really clueless. The dev team uses parsers, the community makes their openers and rotations based on parser data, this game literally only works because someone parsed the output. You get on your high horse, but you really sound like a clueless child. You don't want parsers in the game? Guess what, they're never going away and when they make a new MMO, there will be another parser and it will continue because players will always want a method to do their best. You're the toxicity that drives people away with your ignorance, I'm sorry that the Boogeyman Raiders told you that you're bad at the game or whatever. But, Yoshida isn't going to commit commercial suicide by preventing people from parsing their runs and you and everyone else who has made this thread 5000 times won't change that in the slightest.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

Last thing: To show my sincere interests in this community and this game I would like to extend a suggestion...because I think not all but many player agree with me will be nice to keep logs run and weekly clear separated, if you want to parse or consider yourself an elite player write it on your PF and look for ppl like you. Let’s keep logs out of weekly clear so you won’t take all the fun out from who doesn’t care at all and want just play for drops,achievements or whatever please :)
I would like the developers to put a new option to select on PF creation where if you want to parce it’s specified something like that may work :)

---

Take your own advice and make your own PF runs instead of telling people what to do with their parties, if you consider yourself a casual player - write on your PF and look for people like yourself so won't take the fun out of the game for those who want to play the game effectively while getting their drops, achievements, etc. See how it works both ways?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

Last thing: To show my sincere interests in this community and this game I would like to extend a suggestion...because I think not all but many player agree with me will be nice to keep logs run and weekly clear separated, if you want to parse or consider yourself an elite player write it on your PF and look for ppl like you. Let’s keep logs out of weekly clear so you won’t take all the fun out from who doesn’t care at all and want just play for drops,achievements or whatever please :)
I would like the developers to put a new option to select on PF creation where if you want to parce it’s specified something like that may work :)

---

As if raiders don't have an interest in the community either...

If you actually think the forums were bad, you should've expected these types of responses when you started off by essentially attacking a tool that you have shown little understanding for. And then shooting down the responses that you chose to reply to. Then labeling raiders as toxic. How about you actually learn about the tools, the jobs you've been complaining about, and in your case, what an elitist actually is.

Word of advise, though: if you are just as hostile and unresistant to actually discussing things like this thread, then yeah...you're going to be labeled as a troll. In much the same vein as past trolls. Don't do it. Don't be the next zexy. Don't be the next enigma. Don't be the next troll that earns infamy.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultima

You came to a forum where players discuss things and thought you were addressing a letter to Yoshida? Man, you're really clueless. The dev team uses parsers, the community makes their openers and rotations based on parser data, this game literally only works because someone parsed the output. You get on your high horse, but you really sound like a clueless child. You don't want parsers in the game? Guess what, they're never going away and when they make a new MMO, there will be another parser and it will continue because players will always want a method to do their best. You're the toxicity that drives people away with your ignorance, I'm sorry that the Boogeyman Raiders told you that you're bad at the game or whatever. But, Yoshida isn't going to commit commercial suicide by preventing people from parsing their runs and you and everyone else who has made this thread 5000 times won't change that in the slightest.



Take your own advice and make your own PF runs instead of telling people what to do with their parties, if you consider yourself a casual player - write on your PF and look for people like yourself so won't take the fun out of the game for those who want to play the game effectively while getting their drops, achievements, etc. See how it works both ways?

---

1 I am not a casual players but I raid every week, I literally wait for Tuesday to play, my goal is too get all my classes to 369/370.

2 As a healer I really don’t care about parses because are irrelevant to me.

3 On my PF I specify always to be good and to have fun together and still I get toxic players.

4 My suggestion was to insert an option like you see can select stuff like loot master or recordable, they should add : “parsed run” so ppl that agree with me can avoid it!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

2 As a healer I really don’t care about parses because are irrelevant to me.

---

This is plain wrong on so many levels.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

1 I am not a casual players but I raid every week, I literally wait for Tuesday to play, my goal is too get all my classes to 369/370.

2 As a healer I really don’t care about parses because are irrelevant to me.

3 On my PF I specify always to be good and to have fun together and still I get toxic players.

4 My suggestion was to insert an option like you see can select stuff like loot master or recordable, they should add : “parsed run” so ppl that agree with me can avoid it!

---

1. You are casual because you made this thread.

2. Then you're not a good healer.

3. Because you're toxic.

4. That'd require official parser support.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

2 As a healer I really don’t care about parses because are irrelevant to me.

---

Even if you don't care about healer DPS, you do know that parsing your healing output is a thing too, right? And it's par for the course for optimizing your play.

Just in case you aren't aware, there's an option to hide all your logs, if that's what's bothering you so much.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by KaivaC

As if raiders don't have an interest in the community either...

If you actually think the forums were bad, you should've expected these types of responses when you started off by essentially attacking a tool that you have shown little understanding for. And then shooting down the responses that you chose to reply to. Then labeling raiders as toxic. How about you actually learn about the tools, the jobs you've been complaining about, and in your case, what an elitist actually is.

Word of advise, though: if you are just as hostile and unresistant to actually discussing things like this thread, then yeah...you're going to be labeled as a troll. In much the same vein as past trolls. Don't do it. Don't be the next zexy. Don't be the next enigma. Don't be the next troll that earns infamy.

---

OMG I attacked a TOOL not anyone else!
Being called troll offends me because was not my I would never.. and I can’t really answer to everybody come on, surely I won’t answer if someone is rude. I am a raider myself and I didn’t call raiders toxic OMG but only player that are greedy,selfish and rude in PF

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ameela

Even if you don't care about healer DPS, you do know that parsing your healing output is a thing too, right? And it's par for the course for optimizing your play.

---

I don’t mind about my parses,are good and I just use it to improve myself but ppl discriminate and classify players by their logs! I see some orange logs healer with statics that barely heal because there is no need thanks to their sinergy and their discord but me I am on Pf and I find so many noobs. I don’t discriminate them or get upset as far as they learn from their mistakes, don’t mind to try 10 times if I have too. But if you greed for dmg and dint dodge or don’t follow mechs because you expect me to heal I get pissed off. Easy heal with a perfect party with super player with 6k DPS but the good healer you see it in difficult situations when the party struggle and you save 12 ppl from dead! Sometimes I have to Rez 4/5 times manually and I still deal dmg so I do pretty well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultima

1. You are casual because you made this thread.

2. Then you're not a good healer.

3. Because you're toxic.

4. That'd require official parser support.

---

I am not toxic at all I am a really nice fella dear..

I don’t care about my dmg because I keep everybody alive and I save ppl from their mistakes! With the perfect group there is no need of heal every second but with ppl in Pf you deal with mistakes so I don’t mind about my dmg. My uptime is pretty high and my dots always on so I don’t cry over green,blue or whatever logs :)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ameela

Even if you don't care about healer DPS, you do know that parsing your healing output is a thing too, right? And it's par for the course for optimizing your play.

---

I heal when required and I attack all the rest of the time! Every run is different and as SCH I aim to mitigate but if the other healer is noob, lazy or greedy I have to manually heal all the fight so BB dmg and that’s no drama...

Still I didn’t want to discuss just give a helpful suggestion for the well-being of the community that’s it. My post was directed to the developers.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

OMG I attacked a TOOL not anyone else!
Being called troll offends me because was not my I would never.. and I can’t really answer to everybody come on, surely I won’t answer if someone is rude. I am a raider myself and I didn’t call raiders toxic OMG but only player that are greedy,selfish and rude in PF

---

When you were going off about a page ago about toxicity and some of the people you were responding to...you didn't put two and two together and realize that most of the folks you responded to were raiders? Or that these "greedy" players that you are tired of are technically raiders themselves?

If what I said truly offends you, then I would suggest not responding in the way that you have - plenty of us have pointed out some holes in your posts. Not saying that you absolutely have to agree with them, but I do believe that you need to learn some more about the parsers, DPS'ing, and other jobs in general. It doesn't look like you have any logs for Deltascape, which tells me that you're a fairly newish raider in FFXIV. Some advice for you: be more receptive to reading what folks are trying to say, rather than waiting for a reason to respond. If you still disagree, make sure you have learned about a topic first before making a disagreement. A lot of folks here actually do enjoy having a discussion - it's when something is brought up that reeks of a lack of full knowledge that creates situations like this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

I am not toxic at all I am a really nice fella dear..

I don’t care about my dmg because I keep everybody alive and I save ppl from their mistakes! With the perfect group there is no need of heal every second but with ppl in Pf you deal with mistakes so I don’t mind about my dmg. My uptime is pretty high and my dots always on so I don’t cry over green,blue or whatever logs :)

---

Toxicity is subjective, I wouldn't want you in my groups because you seem like you cause trouble and wear a fake personality.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

I heal when required and I attack all the rest of the time! Every run is different and as SCH I aim to mitigate but if the other healer is noob, lazy or greedy I have to manually heal all the fight so BB dmg and that’s no drama...

Still I didn’t want to discuss just give a helpful suggestion for the well-being of the community that’s it. My post was directed to the developers.

---

Classic example right here, you went to a forum not to -DISCUSS- an idea, but instead your ego is so big, you think your suggestion is this amazing gift that nobody has ever thought of or tried before and that the developers will swoop in and read? You're self-centered and selfish, like the people you came here to disparage.

So because people enjoy being optimal that’s bad how? If they aren’t harassing you about it who cares if they want to play optimal. Just because the OP isn’t having fun clearly no one else can be either. Sounds like a pitty party to me.:rolleyes:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultima

Toxicity is subjective, I wouldn't want you in my groups because you seem like you cause trouble and wear a fake personality.



Classic example right here, you went to a forum not to -DISCUSS- an idea, but instead your ego is so big, you think your suggestion is this amazing gift that nobody has ever thought of or tried before and that the developers will swoop in and read? You're self-centered and selfish, like the people you came here to disparage.

---

I represent a group of people, a minority if you like cos I am sure other feel like me. I care that’s all and it’s not a crime to want make things better and fair. I say it again: I didn’t know how the forum works! Mine was a suggestion to developers that’s all

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

I represent a group of people, a minority if you like cos I am sure other feel like me. I care that’s all and it’s not a crime to want make things better and fair. I say it again: I didn’t know how the forum works! Mine was a suggestion to developers that’s all

---

Who chose you to represent them? I love this argument because anyone can say they represent a group and then call it a minority and then demand it be represented. You're sure there are others like you, so you're going to represent them and then suggest a solution that -doesn't- work. You don't know how any forum works apparently.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MaloraYuki

So because people enjoy being optimal that’s bad how? If they aren’t harassing you about it who cares if they want to play optimal. Just because the OP isn’t having fun clearly no one else can be either. Sounds like a putty party to me.:rolleyes:

---

You can be optimal without dmg others with your behaviour, that’s selfish dear.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

I represent a group of people, a minority if you like cos I am sure other feel like me. I care that’s all and it’s not a crime to want make things better and fair. I say it again: I didn’t know how the forum works! Mine was a suggestion to developers that’s all

---

So because you are a lazy healer and think you are doing good everyone else should follow. Got it. Git gud stop complaining your groups actually make you DO YOUR JOB. You have dps skills for a reason even if you throw up a dot it’s better than nothing and standing there letting your party carry you. Most dungeons don’t require heavy healing, overhealing is a waste of mp and time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

You can be optimal without dmg others with your behaviour, that’s selfish dear.

---

How is using a parser for personal numbers damaging. Sounds like you have some issues friend.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultima

Who chose you to represent them? I love this argument because anyone can say they represent a group and then call it a minority and then demand it be represented. You're sure there are others like you, so you're going to represent them and then suggest a solution that -doesn't- work. You don't know how any forum works apparently.

---

If you read all post few ppl are agreeing so I am representing them. Did someone choose MLK or Ghandi to represent their ppl. If you have ideas you express them and forever fight for them!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

If you read all post few ppl are agreeing so I am representing them. Did someone choose MLK or Ghandi to represent their ppl. If you have ideas you express them and forever fight for them!

---

I can't believe I bothered replying to another troll posting garbage. Lesson learnt.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

If you read all post few ppl are agreeing so I am representing them. Did someone choose MLK or Ghandi to represent their ppl. If you have ideas you express them and forever fight for them!

---

Yes because comparing yourself to MLK and Ghandi makes sense. You don’t represent anyone you are just another person complaining and trolling the forums like everyone else.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rockette

I can't believe I bothered replying to another troll posting garbage. Lesson learnt.

---

Don't ya know, Rockette? You gotta fight for your right to party! Do it for the culture!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

Last thing: To show my sincere interests in this community and this game I would like to extend a suggestion...because I think not all but many player agree with me will be nice to keep logs run and weekly clear separated, if you want to parse or consider yourself an elite player write it on your PF and look for ppl like you. Let’s keep logs out of weekly clear so you won’t take all the fun out from who doesn’t care at all and want just play for drops,achievements or whatever please :)
I would like the developers to put a new option to select on PF creation where if you want to parce it’s specified something like that may work :)

---

but parsing is against TOS. LOL, you're asking SE to break their own rules.

It depends on the content. If you're doing dungeon trash pulls, I don't care if my SCH is routinely out dpsing both dps (happens a lot), or that no one is managing their aggro or hitting aoe abilities.

But if you're in EX trials and Savage Raids, the mindset is different and different things are expected.

Many use parsers to figure out why they wiped at <5%. What they can do to be better players because there's nothing native in this game that does that (SSS is garbage).

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Deceptus

It depends on the content. If you're doing dungeon trash pulls, I don't care if my SCH is routinely out dpsing both dps (happens a lot), or that no one is managing their aggro or hitting aoe abilities.

But if you're in EX trials and Savage Raids, the mindset is different and different things are expected.

Many use parsers to figure out why they wiped at <5%. What they can do to be better players because there's nothing native in this game that does that (SSS is garbage).

---

How can we expect people to suddenly be good in EX Trials or Savage Raids if they can't even figure out how to play in babby content like "Expert" Roulette? This game is sickeningly easy to play at a competent level. The fact our only tool for improvement and the source of all data that teaches us how to play and do effective damage is the Parser is just contributing to a lazy and lackluster community where the majority of the playerbase can't even comprehend the basic math that goes into choosing whether to use a single-target combo or an AoE combo. Or even to use skills like Heavy Thrust, because nobody reads their skills.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by JohnSeal

I represent a group of people, a minority if you like cos I am sure other feel like me. I care that’s all and it’s not a crime to want make things better and fair. I say it again: I didn’t know how the forum works! Mine was a suggestion to developers that’s all

---

You represent yourself, and nobody else. If anybody comes to add their voice to yours, then they are also representing themselves, and not entrusting that representation to you.

Parsing does in fact help in that most players (not all mind you) want to use it as a way to improve, because next time you do the same encounter you want to beat your previous parse. That is at least how i look at it.
With this said however i do feel like a large portion of the community puts too much into fflogs for all things

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultima

How can we expect people to suddenly be good in EX Trials or Savage Raids if they can't even figure out how to play in babby content like "Expert" Roulette?

---

People really overrate the few times when people underperform in expert. Most of the time slow performance there is a tank that doesn't pull wall to wall because they are learning the instance or aren't confident. No, your sch does not outdamage people consistently, otherwise every run would take 25 minutes.

And parsers...eh. The only reason they are needed at all now is because SE puts an arbitrary time limit on all fights with hard enrage. The biggest reason people can't clear that is the stat penalty from dying too much. Historically in HW there was a need because SE designed classes to do a lot of damage through hidden means like DoTs, requiring all jobs to keep 2 or more of them up. In SB though the rotations in general are simplified enough to be able to eyeball them, for most jobs.

When the difficulty is different, parsing is a lot less use. It's kind of pointless in potd/hoh challenge floor, for example.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RiyahArp

People really overrate the few times when people underperform in expert. Most of the time slow performance there is a tank that doesn't pull wall to wall because they are learning the instance or aren't confident. No, your sch does not outdamage people consistently, otherwise every run would take 25 minutes.

And parsers...eh. The only reason they are needed at all now is because SE puts an arbitrary time limit on all fights with hard enrage. The biggest reason people can't clear that is the stat penalty from dying too much. Historically in HW there was a need because SE designed classes to do a lot of damage through hidden means like DoTs, requiring all jobs to keep 2 or more of them up. In SB though the rotations in general are simplified enough to be able to eyeball them, for most jobs.

When the difficulty is different, parsing is a lot less use. It's kind of pointless in potd/hoh challenge floor, for example.

---

Parsers helped create the rotations that we use to clear all content, that includes PotD/HoH challenge floors. You're not clearing PotD/HoH challenge floors by spamming Impulse Drive much to the chagrin of some DRG players I've met.

SO. Here we go.

People being discrimatory will happen. With or without parser.
People are being arses, not because of the parse, but because they are arses.

With that out of the way.

Parse are actually a fantastic way to improve yourself. With the rights analytics tools (a certain site, for example) you could analyse what cooldown you miss, or if you really were on point on you dot uptime or whatever.
The fight recording is also a step into the right direction.

Also, get off your high horse, nobody even remotely gives a real damn when you don't perform optimally in normal trials. Most don't even have their parser open.

Once again, people are being arses, because they are. Not because the TOOL actively tells them to shit on you.

Another anti-parsing crusader. Lovely.
Tell me more about how a tool designed to help you better yourself is killing the game. Can you get over yourself? First of all, higher levels of content can have some pretty harsh DPS checks, at least compared to the more casual content. Those tools allow you to practice your job more intricately and make sure you're pulling your own weight. If you're the sort of person that would rather jump into something and hold 7 other people back because 'lol I just wanna push buttons', you're probably not the sort of person I'd want to play with either.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Ultima

How can we expect people to suddenly be good in EX Trials or Savage Raids if they can't even figure out how to play in babby content like "Expert" Roulette? This game is sickeningly easy to play at a competent level. The fact our only tool for improvement and the source of all data that teaches us how to play and do effective damage is the Parser is just contributing to a lazy and lackluster community where the majority of the playerbase can't even comprehend the basic math that goes into choosing whether to use a single-target combo or an AoE combo. Or even to use skills like Heavy Thrust, because nobody reads their skills.

---

It's not uncommon for people to not try their very hardest in trivial content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Maero

Parsing does in fact help in that most players (not all mind you) want to use it as a way to improve, because next time you do the same encounter you want to beat your previous parse. That is at least how i look at it.
With this said however i do feel like a large portion of the community puts too much into fflogs for all things

---

This is basically how I feel. I am all for tools to help players improve, but I am totally against tools that allow players to measure each other's dicks, or make the optimal composition the ONLY composition. Improvisation and adaptability are also indicative of a high skill level, and numbers cannot tell the whole story. I find in-game parsers to be a bit of a paradoxical conundrum: both a problem and a solution.

As a console player, I want to improve, but I have to ask my friends on PC to parse me. That's all I want to know -- did I do better this time than last?

And I'll be honest -- the game does an abysmal job at teaching you how to use your job to the fullest, in terms of how to form a rotation beyond the basic 1-2-3.

Even something as simple as generating aggro -- you know what the quest is to learn how to do that? I had to go out into the streets of Ul'dah and shout at marauders with the /say command. That could've been a prime opportunity to learn how to use your actual aggo-generating skill, but instead we yell at the city-folk.

Take Machinist for example. I want so much to love this job. I really do. But at the moment, it's foundation is "cram everything into one little window". And it's just so clunky. Not nearly as well-thought-out as, say, Samurai or Dragoon, who have reasons behind building up their rotation in a certain way. I hope that for the next expansion, all classes and their skills are thought out this well and fully.