On a scale of 1 to 5-- Do you feel SE listens to their western players? State why.

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Originally Posted by loreleidiangelo

I think they're listening to feedback, but the NA audience isn't exactly making it easy for them with their multiple topics, click bait titles and "THIS NEEDS IMMEDIATE DEV ATTENTION" histrionics. Also, there are quite a lot of criticisms and suggestions that go contrary to core design concepts and systems in this game, yet people seem to think that if they just shout loudly enough about it the game will go through a massive overhaul.

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Yes see you stated it much more articulately than I did. I appreciate it.

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Originally Posted by panderin

Oh Lord, I am an American and I see what happens on these forums all day everyday and guess what I see a LOT of exactly what I described. Quit acting like it doesn't exist. I am still wanting to get back to the topic at hand. You try to do the same.

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We will when you stop acting like it doesn't exist on the JP culture as well. I actually have gone there, interacted with them, did tons of student exchange programs with a very kind Japanese family. Needless to say it still exists PLENTY over there. Goes both ways. -_- Your OP on the first page comes off as if they have no flaws, and Americans are just plain selfish and not nice. I have met plenty of JP and Americans who are super kind and also who are on the opposite spectrum...it exists everywhere...

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Originally Posted by Iromi

We will when you stop acting like it doesn't exist on the JP culture as well. I actually have gone there, interacted with them, did tons of student exchange programs with a very kind Japanese family. Needless to say it still exists PLENTY over there. Goes both ways. -_- Your OP on the first page comes off as if they have no flaws, and Americans are just plain selfish and not nice. I have met plenty of JP and Americans who are super kind and also who are on the opposite spectrum...it exists everywhere...

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You win, I was banned, the post was removed. Looks like we can move on now :)
I am going with a 2 because it seems like they listen to NA on things that might not be as relevant to the entire community as far as game scope but that is just one opinion.

I hope that is sufficient.

The rating will stay at 1 so long as the non-Feast PvP queues are as long as they are simply because they want to keep grand company restrictions. It's completely unacceptable to have wait times of ~30 minutes on the lower end to questioning if it will pop before you go to bed.

I will also say that the development cycle is stale, but they've yet to do much to address that criticism. They made a very poor attempt with Diadem. Palace of the Dead isn't nearly as bad, but it is still very boring. Both events could have used objectives to focus players' attention in them. And they're still afraid to make systems such as these two sit alongside the "real" progression system. It's no surprise that these events are in the "catch-up" patches. They're really afraid of making relevant horizontal progression systems that can sit alongside the tome / raid dynamic. A fully fleshed out Palace of the Dead with some real difficulty could have been that. But they chose to just make it a boring affair of killing low-challenge mobs with no other objective to get a weapon in a catch-up patch.

I will say 4. Not 5, because there are things that are really needed like the Coldown reset on wipe for high level raids or fix the inventory issue.

But, despite people think about western feedback not reading it, I must say that we deserve it for not being more organized. We cannot open 5000 threads about 1 single thing, calling them everything for ot doing what we want and for being so arrogant than we think we can do better job. So, that's our entire fault.

Also, I must be glad the they didn't hear such things like "don't allow newies to join PF" or the lock button for bonus on Duty finder, or even put a DPS metter and rakiung system to categorized players. I really glad they didn't hear that.

A 5 if we're talking savage raiders: I think they listen a lot to the crème de la crop type players, even though they're absolute minority of the players, especially when it comes to gear progression (and I think this will cause issues to the game when it hits 4 or 5 years old).

I'd say a 3 to the rest of the NA playerbase.

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Originally Posted by Jynx

Once politics and nationalities start coming into play this thread went off the deep end.

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That's probably why people think they don't listen. Every time we all try to talk like a human someone, somewhere has to act up.
Happens all the time. Not only that people always gotta make 4 million threads about the same thing in different wording then a fight breaks out.
Take a look at JP forums, alot of posts in a SINGLE topic, not millions.
Even ones with legit serious feedback, people can't seem to talk civilly and start Keyboard Warrioing so the thread derails and loses all meaning.

You wanna be heard? Then stop acting out all the time.

I am assuming 1 = not at all and 5 = very well?

It's tough to really say, I feel that Square listens to the Western pbase as well as minimally necessary to remain competitive. However, it feels to be more of a mask or a facade, in that they will have live letters where they address questions - but then ignore hot topics and focus on the 'easy questions'. Whenever a question is asked that differs from their already set point of view / direction of the game, they give 1-off answers that disregard it completely. I've also seen them give more detailed answers that don't really answer what was asked, but what they wanted to be asked.

So, superficially, I'd give them a 4. However, my real opinion is closer to a 2.

I think the question is flawed. At least a little bit.
They definitely give more feedback to the Japanese community. Partially because it's easier to communicate in your native language.
Secondly, the Western audience is a lot less coherent than the Japanese community.

I routinely read the Japanese forums (I don't post there because my writing is terrible but that's another topic). And there isn't the "Disappointment this" or "atrocity such and such" or "I'm leaving because" threads taking up half of the forums. How can you expect them to sift through all the garbage on our forums and respond? Or even listen?
Further the Japanese players are not near as toxic, they don't stubbornly refuse to play better, and they come up with good ideas and discuss them instead of arguing about what "affliction" SE decided to burden us with on the latest patch.

What do you expect when you have a third of the healer forum getting angry at the fact they have DPS skills? Or that every in-game event is a justifiable game-leaving event?
I wouldn't know how to respond either.

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Originally Posted by FunkyBunch

I think the question is flawed. At least a little bit.
They definitely give more feedback to the Japanese community. Partially because it's easier to communicate in your native language.
Secondly, the Western audience is a lot less coherent than the Japanese community.

I routinely read the Japanese forums (I don't post there because my writing is terrible but that's another topic). And there isn't the "Disappointment this" or "atrocity such and such" or "I'm leaving because" threads taking up half of the forums. How can you expect them to sift through all the garbage on our forums and respond? Or even listen?.

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Why do you think that a thread specifying that someone is disappointed in something is garbage?

Further, why do you think a thread that details the reason for lost business is garbage?

Both of these are incredibly useful information for the developers. To ignore them would be a mistake.

I'd give it a 2/5.

They're too stubborn on too many things, and often when they "listen" to us, they either misinterpret requests (not sure if it's a language barrier issue or what) or try and do something a "new" way that ends up just being more convoluted and annoying than it should have been.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Why do you think that a thread specifying that someone is disappointed in something is garbage?

Further, why do you think a thread that details the reason for lost business is garbage?

Both of these are incredibly useful information for the developers. To ignore them would be a mistake.

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FFXIV has "over 6 million players" need to keep the tinfoil hats on to stop naysayers.

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Originally Posted by Chiramu

FFXIV has "over 6 million players" need to keep the tinfoil hats on to stop naysayers.

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McDonalds has sold over 245 billion burgers, but they still print out surveys to collect feedback from people, and still go out of there way to appease those who are disappointed.

Saying things like "tinfoil hats" and "naysayers" degrades the quality of your argument, by the way.

As an aside, FFXIV has sold over 5 million accounts the last I saw (believable to 6 million now), but has well under 6 million players. The most recent census estimates there are 700,000 characters - where players is even less than that due to one player having multiple characters.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

McDonalds has sold over 245 billion burgers, but they still print out surveys to collect feedback from people, and still go out of there way to appease those who are disappointed.

Saying things like "tinfoil hats" and "naysayers" degrades the quality of your argument, by the way.

As an aside, FFXIV has sold over 5 million accounts the last I saw (believable to 6 million now), but has well under 6 million players. The most recent census estimates there are 700,000 characters - where players is even less than that due to one player having multiple characters.

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You know what's odd about those numbers? Dont they count before ARR? But they say the game has only been around for 3 years (yeah I know ARR has been around for 3, but they dont say FFXIV:ARR, just FFXIV). I guess 6 million accounts in 3 years sounds better than 6 million accounts in 5-6 years?

I wouldn't know, I'm too afraid to post feedback because I'm afraid of getting banned.

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Originally Posted by WoooBlaaa

I wouldn't know, I'm too afraid to post feedback because I'm afraid of getting banned.

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Hey it happened to me, I don't blame you, I have learned my lesson to trust me. Just try to be as bland as you can with any feedback and if people want you to get specific RUN FOR THEM THAR HILLS!

Wait? They ban you for giving feedback on the forums?

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Why do you think that a thread specifying that someone is disappointed in something is garbage?

Further, why do you think a thread that details the reason for lost business is garbage?

Both of these are incredibly useful information for the developers. To ignore them would be a mistake.

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Point 1-Because it's about everything all of the time, in multiple places with multiple threads. And 95% of the time there's not even a coherent argument about it. It's just whining.

Point 2-Because in every instance I've seen, the player didn't actually quit, they just wanted attention and to flame bait.

Also, It's not useful information if it's things you can't fix.******* This is what people don't seem to understand.
SE is not going to completely re-write the game from the ground up, again because one guy in Cleveland thinks the 1-Tank,1-Healer,2-DPS meta is stupid.

When half of your feedback is from 10-20 grumpy players who are literally unhappy about everything, it's not useful information.
I work in data and customer feedback/quality assurance, I recognize when feedback is about wanting something fixed or is just an unhappy person and their feedback has nothing to do with the product.
Which is the problem I was alluding to. The majority of feedback I have seen is useless feedback, and even when there is legitimate feedback it is lost in the noise with the angry people being angry at "insert new feature/event" here. You can't fix problems for those people no matter how much you want to.

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Originally Posted by KitingGenbu

You know what's odd about those numbers? Dont they count before ARR? But they say the game has only been around for 3 years (yeah I know ARR has been around for 3, but they dont say FFXIV:ARR, just FFXIV). I guess 6 million accounts in 3 years sounds better than 6 million accounts in 5-6 years?

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The census counts based on certain achievements earned so it is gathered only for post ARR content.
Further, you could guestimate how many active players there are by the trophies at least on PS4.
Less than a third of players have finished the ARR MSQ. I'm assuming that probably translates similarly to PC.
Without trophies for Heavensward though, the less than a third of players at end game is inevitably lower.

4/5

They definitely do but they cannot pleased everyone. There's got to be a balance.but the answer is yes we had certain adjustments in game thanks to our requests.

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Originally Posted by Laerune

Wait? They ban you for giving feedback on the forums?

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It depends on how you presented the feedback. If you used offensive terms or attacked a particular employee at SE, it is against ToS and can result in you getting banned.

I'd give them a 2.5/5. Not because I think they cater to the JP population more than NA/EU, but because they try to work these things in so quickly, the end result often goes over like a lead balloon. Examples:

1) We say: We want a mini game with pet battles using minions. They respond with a weak minion based RTS that's bland, meaningless and nearly impossible to play on a controller. It's not like you can evolve your minions or make them stronger when you leave LoV. No real reward or meaningful progress to it = no participation.

2) We say: We want a never-ending dungeon with progressively harder monsters. They respond with Deep Dungeon which gives us precisely what we want, but it's rather copy/paste except for the difficulty. There's no real sense of wonder or awe.

They want us to get excited about these things because it's one more way we can sink our time and skill into something as they work on other things. If they were to truly make LoV meaningful (evolving pets, minions that actually fight with you or can duel against other players, etc) it would punt the game's balance out a window. You think it's bad having to juggle balance for these classes? Add in over 100 minions.

Same with DD. Had they taken the time to really make it part dungeon, part puzzle-solver, part exploration as we'd hoped for, it probably would have taken 6 months to a year or more to program in all those variables. And if they had told us that, we'd have taken our pitchforks and torches to SE's corporate headquarters -- so I don't blame them for not revealing more!

It's just disheartening because the game could be so much more, but they keep putting out these half-baked results based on ideas from all players, and as a result everyone thinks they're not paying attention.

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Originally Posted by FunkyBunch

Point 1-Because it's about everything all of the time, in multiple places with multiple threads. And 95% of the time there's not even a coherent argument about it. It's just whining.

Point 2-Because in every instance I've seen, the player didn't actually quit, they just wanted attention and to flame bait.

Also, It's not useful information if it's things you can't fix.******* This is what people don't seem to understand.
SE is not going to completely re-write the game from the ground up, again because one guy in Cleveland thinks the 1-Tank,1-Healer,2-DPS meta is stupid.

When half of your feedback is from 10-20 grumpy players who are literally unhappy about everything, it's not useful information.
I work in data and customer feedback/quality assurance, I recognize when feedback is about wanting something fixed or is just an unhappy person and their feedback has nothing to do with the product.
Which is the problem I was alluding to. The majority of feedback I have seen is useless feedback, and even when there is legitimate feedback it is lost in the noise with the angry people being angry at "insert new feature/event" here. You can't fix problems for those people no matter how much you want to.

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While I understand your frustrating reading these, I still disagree with the premise that SE should ignore them. They may not be great to hear, they may conflict with each other, they may be incoherent and they may be written in rage. However, there is still useful data that can be collected and interpreted.

For example, they can see things like:

• Likes on a post that either support or oppose a feature or content
• Number of threads that support or oppose a feature or content
• Details regarding why specific people oppose certain content

and so on..

For example, they could see the repeated threads popping up and consistently hitting over 100 pages on healer DPS. There is a huge divide on this issue and it's really an issue in their game design that promotes issue.

For example, they can see people who are consistently posting how they are 'bored with the game' and then read the details on what they think of all the content (i.e. dungeon design, diadem reception, raid participation etc.)

Ultimately, the devs should be reading 'between the lines' and looking past some of the emotional walls lining many of the posts. They should be flexible in their game design to adapt to feedback.

Ignoring a post because it is written poorly is not in the best business interest of the company. It may be something that you and I don't care to read, or become frustrated by reading, but the devs have to think a little differently than you or I.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

SNIP

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I think you're missing the point. I never said that they should ignore every post ever.
I said the community is part of the problem in why we don't get more dev feedback.

Because you can't respond to twenty threads about why "incoherent argument about why PoTD is bad".
However they listened anyway and tweaked it so the boss gives you upgrades. Same with Moonfire event incoming fix.

I'm not saying they ARE ignoring the threads, I'm saying WE WOULD GET MORE FEEDBACK if we posted better.
I have read quite a bit of "I'm not happy with the game because sux k thx bai". I don't have time to read every post, and the Devs don't either.
It's about allocation of resources, how much time do you spend allocating to 1/8th-1/4 of your player base when half the complaining posts are from the same 20 unhappy people who are disappointed all the time about everything?

I just am stating, as an observer who happens to do this for a living, if we get attention it's because we're lucky and SE is doing a good job filtering through all the crap.

I don't disagree with you that there's good information, I disagree that ALL information is good information.

I'd give SE and Yoshi-P good marks for listening, they have repeatedly demonstrated that they do listen, despite the impatience of people raging that they do not responed immediately.

Coincidentally, today I ran across an interview with Yoshida-san where he talks very specifically about player feedback. The interview was published by PC PowerPlay on July 20, 2016. So it is right on the mark and as up to date as we can get.

Here's the link;
Interview: Final Fantasy XIV's Naoki Yoshida

And here are a few quotes to chew on;

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PCPP: How much does player feedback help to shape the updated content for the game?

This is a difficult question to answer as the amount of feedback we incorporate into the game is in no way fixed. However, one particular thing is how we are constantly striving to make the user interface more comfortable and intuitive, so this is one area where feedback is very highly valued and quite a considerable amount of feedback is addressed in each new patch. When we make new content we always make sure to study all the previous feedback we have on things like player responses to the reward balancing on previous content or any proposals for tweaking that players think needs doing, even if the new content in question is completely different to past areas. However, whether individual feedback points are addressed and implemented or not is something we consider very carefully. This is because of the slightly different perspective that the development team has. We tend to be quite strict about what systems go in, as we have to maintain the world of Eorzea going into the future, while many players feedback tends to only consider what would be good in the short term.

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and...

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PCPP: What’s the process for picking which player feedback items are prioritised over others?

We don’t just look at the feedback we get on the forums but have a dedicated FFXIV community team who also check message boards like Reddit etc. and collate together the voice of the players, then analyse what they are saying and pass on a report to the development team and myself. This team has dedicated regional staff in many locations such as Japan, North America, the U.K, and we also collect feedback from South Korea and China via our operating partner companies in there.

All the feedback is listed up every day and urgent issues will be looked at by the development team when they get together the next morning for their regular meeting. Outside of that framework we also hold a separate discussion based around player feedback every Thursday when the development leads get together for the operations meeting. This is when each individual section makes the decisions as to how the feedback will be addressed and the priorities for what gets seen to first will be set down by myself.

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There is more in the interview, so take a look. One thing is clear to me though, all the assumptions that people make about community managers and feedback, or not listening to one community or another are thoroughly de-bunked.

Kosmos, I gather thing is part of their justificarion behind time and content gates as well as using fate farming and hunts over and over. There comes a point when one has to ask: When is "taking the long view" too long? Is burnout from running content the expected norm?

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Originally Posted by Kallera

Kosmos there comes a point when one has to ask: When is "taking the long view" too long?

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I think that depends on context. If you are talking about the suggestions that players make to satisfy their specific desire and/or issue, then I think you always have to take the long view because as developers they have to consider the knock on effects on other content/systems with ay change made. That appeared to be the context that Yoshida was using.

In more general terms, I think they have to balance the long view vs the more short term view. If things are not working, if there are problems then they must be fixed, but knee jerk reaction to fix something needs to be balanced by a more measured reaction to ensure that nothing is done that breaks other things. When I think about the many millions of lines of code that make up FFXIV I shudder at the thought of the integration and regression testing that must be done when making core changes or introducing new systems into the game. That requires a long term view.

I do agree though, that they should have short term objectives and goals and be a bit more responsive to issues. Even so, I know that they always have to consider the long view for the reasons outlined.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

It depends on how you presented the feedback. If you used offensive terms or attacked a particular employee at SE, it is against ToS and can result in you getting banned.

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You also need to be really careful with discussing things with others on here. People are so quick to report you just because they dislike what you said.
Happened to my friend once and he didn't say a single insult. I've read why he was banned. It's hard to convey text at times but if you're that offended then
maybe people need to stay away from the forums, people have opinions! A shocker I know.

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Originally Posted by FunkyBunch

I think you're missing the point. I never said that they should ignore every post ever.
I said the community is part of the problem in why we don't get more dev feedback.


Because you can't respond to twenty threads about why "incoherent argument about why PoTD is bad".
However they listened anyway and tweaked it so the boss gives you upgrades. Same with Moonfire event incoming fix.

I'm not saying they ARE ignoring the threads, I'm saying WE WOULD GET MORE FEEDBACK if we posted better.
I have read quite a bit of "I'm not happy with the game because sux k thx bai". I don't have time to read every post, and the Devs don't either.
It's about allocation of resources, how much time do you spend allocating to 1/8th-1/4 of your player base when half the complaining posts are from the same 20 unhappy people who are disappointed all the time about everything?

I just am stating, as an observer who happens to do this for a living, if we get attention it's because we're lucky and SE is doing a good job filtering through all the crap.

I don't disagree with you that there's good information, I disagree that ALL information is good information.

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Huh? No you said that they are garbage posts, and they are not garbage posts. I provided reasoning explaining why they are valuable.

2/5
alot of the devs posts and updated on the lodestone stating 'after feedback/suggestion' or such like its 9/10 stuff JP have requested not EU/US

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Originally Posted by Kosmos992k

There is more in the interview, so take a look. One thing is clear to me though, all the assumptions that people make about community managers and feedback, or not listening to one community or another are thoroughly de-bunked.

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From reading that it seems as if they look at player feedback as an afterthought. They seem to listen, but this shows more of their "playing it safe" implementation, so if they do end up "listening", the communities desires aren't resonating with them. There is also is no real telling how well our community leaders really do here because you can see very well from the history of these forums that the community leaders kinda cherry pick comments or unimportant things that most people are not concerned with.

I'd say this doesn't really debunk anyone's concerns.

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Originally Posted by KokonoeAiyoko

From reading that it seems as if they look at player feedback as an afterthought. They seem to listen, but this shows more of their "playing it safe" implementation, so if they do end up "listening", the communities desires aren't resonating with them. There is also is no real telling how well our community leaders really do here because you can see very well from the history of these forums that the community leaders kinda cherry pick comments or unimportant things that most people are not concerned with.

I'd say this doesn't really debunk anyone's concerns.

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I think that depends on how significant you feel that fan feedback should be.Theinterview outlines that they already have a gameplan for the rest of 3.x and the expansion, those things won't change on the basis of the short term concerns that are predominant in player feedback. However, it's plainly obvious that they see player and fan feedback and communication as a priority. The very fact that they have weekly meetings and staff who actively gather player feedback shows that not only are they listening but they are seeking out the feedback beyond their own foruums. What more do you want? Sometimes when you ask the supreme being for something, the answer is 'No'. But that doesn't mean your request went unheard or had no impact, it may be that the change cannot be made short term, but in some future patch the suggestion/requestmade has an impact on some new feature or content.

Honestly, people need to understand that the develoeprs cannot put up neon signs saying "This change was the result of post #348876 made by 'Hugh Jengine' of the Groundswell server". Nor can the devs work in changes in exactly the way requested or the time frame an individual desires. that doesn't mean the feedback is not heard.

I would give them a 3.

While I know they listen to us but just don't act often because our requests can be a little selfish or crazy, I cannot help but feel that our Japanese brethren get a higher priority.

Please don't shoot me, its just how I view the situation.

I would rather they listen to JP more their more coherent in their forums structure compare to western were all over the place with ours with tidbits of useful feedback here and there IMO of course a 2 I say /shrug.

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Originally Posted by KokonoeAiyoko

From reading that it seems as if they look at player feedback as an afterthought. They seem to listen, but this shows more of their "playing it safe" implementation, so if they do end up "listening", the communities desires aren't resonating with them. There is also is no real telling how well our community leaders really do here because you can see very well from the history of these forums that the community leaders kinda cherry pick comments or unimportant things that most people are not concerned with.

I'd say this doesn't really debunk anyone's concerns.

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Doesn't sound different from any other company. Keep in mind what these guys tell the community is basically what their NDA's allow, and since they're trying to keep a professional image, on top of going through MOUNDS of feedback per day, they're bound to come across as detached to an extent.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Huh? No you said that they are garbage posts, and they are not garbage posts. I provided reasoning explaining why they are valuable.

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I never said they were ALL garbage. I said there was TOO MUCH garbage.
Most of them are not valuable. You can pretend that every grumpy person has information that is useful to you, but that doesn't make it true.

For example:
14 out of 20 threads on the front page of the Dungeons Page are all PoTD complaints. And there were really only 3 unique ones which should have really been contained to one thread. 11 of those threads I would consider garbage as it's just repeated noise already discussed elsewhere.

I rate them at about a 3/5

Not too bad but a lot of room for improvement, we have some awfully good ideas that go largely unnoticed, and left totally void from any dev or CM input.

Which is why I think here we tend to repeat and make thread after thread about the same thing, we don't get any answers!

Most times we never even hear a reply or statement (good or bad) we are left hanging unsure if it is even recognized or noted, whereas I think the jp don't have to wait a year+ for a comment or statement.

They don't have to repeat and keep asking because their ideas get feedback.

A heck of a lot more communication would go a longggg way in here. ^^


Mind you I would rate most mmo about the same, wow is horrible for ignoring their player base and being cocky and arrogant and unprofessional, they hide on loltwitter, rift team is a tad better then ffxiv imo etc... none are really good at it ..meh

("listening" does not have to = complying to what we ask!!! I simply mean "hearing" us, communicating that they even have read ideas or give a crap lol...giving ideas any chance in hell to possibly happen one day, heck even to hear "no never is better then silence/ignoring.)

I will give a 2/5. They listen but the only time they mainly listen is when the topic is about glamour or new emotes. The amount of times i see them reply to these topics is quite saddening too be honest. People make other types of topics which people have long discussions on but nothing from the devs or community team is said. When a new glamour thread is made after 2 pages community team reply... I have given up.

During beta and early days of ARR there was so much communication between the community and the team but now its just terrible in my opinion. I would be glad that they say they have no current plans for something right now but give feedback to the dev team so it actually seems like they have looked at it. Staying silent doesn't help at all.

I might be wrong but their job is to communicate with the community and pass on feedback and so far in my opinion it has gone downhill. People have given their issues with raiding for example and how it could be improved but nothing has happened with it. If people don't get some form of reply from devs or community team people just give up and not bother talking about it because it seems like they don't listen and the thread dies.

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Originally Posted by FunkyBunch

I never said they were ALL garbage. I said there was TOO MUCH garbage. Most of them are not valuable. You can pretend that every grumpy person has information that is useful to you, but that doesn't make it true.

For example:
14 out of 20 threads on the front page of the Dungeons Page are all PoTD complaints. And there were really only 3 unique ones which should have really been contained to one thread. 11 of those threads I would consider garbage as it's just repeated noise already discussed elsewhere.

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Firstly, you provided examples and said they were garbage. This implies posts similar to your examples are garbage. I countered that point and provided reasoning why it is useful.

Second, your example here shows how you're again throwing out valuable data. If 14/20 of the threads on the front page are complaints about PoTD, then clearly there is something wrong with PoTD. You go on to say how there is repeated noise, but repeated complaints mean that the complaint is felt by more than just a single person - again valuable information. While it may not be useful to you to read the same complaint over and over, it is important for a dev.

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Originally Posted by Kaurie

Firstly, you provided examples and said they were garbage. This implies posts similar to your examples are garbage. I countered that point and provided reasoning why it is useful.

Second, your example here shows how you're again throwing out valuable data. If 14/20 of the threads on the front page are complaints about PoTD, then clearly there is something wrong with PoTD. You go on to say how there is repeated noise, but repeated complaints mean that the complaint is felt by more than just a single person - again valuable information. While it may not be useful to you to read the same complaint over and over, it is important for a dev.

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Sigh, I'm talking about how to most effectively communicate. Rewriting the same argument, less coherently and spamming the front page of the forum with the same complaint (especially when 12 of the OPs had already commented in the other threads) when you can accomplish the exact same thing AND cut down on dev reviewing time so they have more time to actually respond is "garbage".

If I made 100 threads about how I want contact lenses to be available doesn't make my idea more likely to be listened to, all I've done is create an unconscious bias against my idea. Thread count is nearly useless information.
Thread count with different originating poster information is no more valuable than response count in a single thread with different response authors.
However, by spreading out the topics unnecessarily you limit the ability of the playerbase to respond, read, "like", and focus feedback on posts which dilutes the data and makes the correlation of data more difficult. It also increases the chance that a good post will be missed by both the community and the developers. Which is why I called them "garbage".
Basically you're robbing yourself of the opportunity to give the DEVS the most appropriate and accurate feedback.