My take on Samurai as a tank

As a tank it's gonna rely on parry. That much is certain.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

If Samurai did become a tank, it should most definitely be like you said an OT type role like Warrior. Have a defensive stance and an attacking stance in some shape or form.

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why do people say OT like it's such a real thing. many fights both tanks tank equally and PLD has defensive and attack stance too. all tanks SAM or not need to have MT and OT utility in a Full Party.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

As a tank it's gonna rely on parry. That much is certain.

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Didn't SE mention that parry is going to be reworked in 4.0?

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Originally Posted by SendohJin

why do people say OT like it's such a real thing. many fights both tanks tank equally and PLD has defensive and attack stance too. all tanks SAM or not need to have MT and OT utility in a Full Party.

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OT is a real thing. The OT has multiple roles in a fight. Either they need to grab the adds, perform a certain mechanic, or help switch with MT when they have too many stacks. WAR excels in this because they have a lot of utility to deal damage in their offensive stance compared to PLD. It isn't to say a WAR can't MT or a PLD can't OT, they are capable of those roles also, but when you are meeting strict DPS checks, you usually want the one who can bring a little more damage in the OT position. Again it is a each to their own thing. I believe Samurai should be given strong offensive measures similar to WAR.

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Originally Posted by Syhrwyb

Didn't SE mention that parry is going to be reworked in 4.0?

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They said they were looking into changing how parry works by possibly 3.5 or when the expansion hits.

It would be neat if Samurai used parrying to a strong extent. Then again, WAR is suppose to be kind of like that also, but parrying stat building is pointless right now.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

If they are tanks, absolutely on heavy armor. Going to happen anyways since they would likely be thrown into the fending category of gear. If they are a DPS, then having light armor would be fine also. I question if they are DPS that if they would be thrown into Maiming gear with DRG, Striking with MNK, or get a whole new category like they did to NIN. At this point it would be worse to add a whole new gear set.

I am fine with heavy or light looking armor, as long as it helps represent the role well.

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That's perfectly fine. I don't mind Samurai as a Tank or DPS. But some people are really hurt that not all SAMs in FF wear Heavy Armor. This is more or less the same outcry we had back then about tanks running around in bikinis and how it was ruining their "Immersion." Just cuz it's a RPG mechanic of applying numbers from an item for more or less of something doesn't change the fact that on screen, my character is in either little to no clothing and has the defense of the gods. FFX-2 debunks that because that game only had weps and accessories. Before anyone rules it out, It's still a FF game made by SE and still uses the Job "Samurai." Fan service or not tho, actual logic is not meant to be applied to games. We can even look at FFXII, no one in the entire party wears Heavy Armor on screen. Sure they can equip gear and stuff but at the end of the day, they are still running around in plain cloth.

I wonder. Whenever they add a popular class to dps it hurts queue times severely. So if they do add SAM as a dps like Yoshi invisioned then they would have to create popular requested healer and tank jobs to balance it out.

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Originally Posted by Syhrwyb

Didn't SE mention that parry is going to be reworked in 4.0?

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They did. said changes might be put in place by 3.5 and likely to be delayed to 4.0 ergo the new expansion. Probably for Samurai. Who knows what that will mean for the DRK's out in the world.

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Originally Posted by SendohJin

why do people say OT like it's such a real thing. many fights both tanks tank equally and PLD has defensive and attack stance too. all tanks SAM or not need to have MT and OT utility in a Full Party.

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Clearly one Tank is tanking the boss and the other is not. MT = Fighting the Boss OT = Fighting the boss he is not

I am glad you agree all Tanks require utilities under both roles. Because DRK could use a little help. PLD and WAR have great options like shields, heals and dmg up/down utilities but DRK is all about that dere Delirium and skills that increase their attack rate in the form of BW and damage DoTs.

Yes they have Reprisal but only when they are MT otherwise getting a parry proc is hard to come by.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

It isn't to say a WAR can't MT or a PLD can't OT, they are capable of those roles also

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that's my point.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

but when you are meeting strict DPS checks, you usually want the one who can bring a little more damage in the OT position. Again it is a each to their own thing. I believe Samurai should be given strong offensive measures similar to WAR.

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or they can do whatever they want with the new tank job and make changes to DRK so that DRK becomes comparable to WAR in those situations.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

They did. said changes might be put in place by 3.5 and likely to be delayed to 4.0 ergo the new expansion. Probably for Samurai. Who knows what that will mean for the DRK's out in the world.

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I still say Parry should reduce the attack to 0 or count as an evade. Same for blocking... Dumb change they did in XI and made it carry over to XIV... -_-;

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Originally Posted by SendohJin

that's my point.

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I know that was your point. I was making my stance clear.

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or they can do whatever they want with the new tank job and make changes to DRK so that DRK becomes comparable to WAR in those situations.

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A DRK who knows what they are doing can easily do comparable damage and perform those functions fine. Very sure they would give Samurai flexibility also. It would make no sense if they did not.

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Originally Posted by FallenArisen0990

I still say Parry should reduce the attack to 0 or count as an evade. Same for blocking... Dumb change they did in XI and made it carry over to XIV... -_-;

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Well right now Parry only does 20% dmg reduction regardless of what your Parry stat is. Coupled that DRK can also increase it's evasion to basically have a priority system of Dodge > Parry. PLD can have a priority system coupled with a Flash's blind of Dodge > Block > Parry and Warrior being handed an auto parry skill.

Meaning DRK has the highest potential of utilizing "dodge-tanking" if Blind works. PLD has the highest probability of mitigation having 3 ways to do it. And WAR has a way to mitigate moderate damage for every attack.

Do note however while magic attacks can be dodged. They cannot be blocked or parried. If DRK could parry magic via an exclusive trait it would be used or preferred in magic heavy fights outside of Dark Mind.

Since Parry does the same reduction regardless though many including myself see it as a garbage stat not worth investing in. Which is why you see many Tank's mostly stacking Crit and Det. Other cases Accuracy and Skill Speed.

The dev team has noticed this and is making changes to Parry but what changes they did not entail.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

I am glad you agree all Tanks require utilities under both roles. Because DRK could use a little help. PLD and WAR have great options like shields, heals and dmg up/down utilities but DRK is all about that dere Delirium and skills that increase their attack rate in the form of BW and damage DoTs.

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You got Dark Arts Dark Dance and Dark Arts Dark Passenger combo for evasion tanking by boosting evasion and Parry by 20% while also inflicting Blind to lower enemy accuracy. Dark Arts Dark Mind is good against magic heavy bosses for the 30% magic vulnerability reduction. There is also the 30% Damage Resistance built into Shadow Wall. Blood Weapon is not available unless you off-tank, and that is primarily for feeding MP for Dark Arts Souleater which is our main damage and main sustain.

I would say that DRK could use getting Sole Survivor buffed outside of PvP, its a 2 min cooldown only useful on trash mobs or adds. What is wrong with us using it to mark a boss for a 10% vulnerability? It is on a 2 min cooldown compared to a Ninja's which is on a 1 min cooldown and needs a positional (which Ninja is going to have anyways for their main damage combo).

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Originally Posted by TankHunter678

I would say that DRK could use getting Sole Survivor buffed outside of PvP, its a 2 min cooldown only useful on trash mobs or adds. What is wrong with us using it to mark a boss for a 10% vulnerability? It is on a 2 min cooldown compared to a Ninja's which is on a 1 min cooldown and needs a positional (which Ninja is going to have anyways for their main damage combo).

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The fear that a DRK and 2 NIN's will have to be required so you can essentially have a 10% damage increase for the whole party every minute for 10 seconds. MT options for DRK though is great as it is. Most concerns generally come to a OT DRK offering less then a PLD or WAR.

I feel like the PvP buffs is just a controlled experiment but I dunno.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

Clearly one Tank is tanking the boss and the other is not. MT = Fighting the Boss OT = Fighting the boss he is not

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obviously, but people use the terminology as if jobs themselves should be designed to largely lean towards one or the other and that's wrong. all tanks should be balanced to do both so that phrases like this don't exist "an OT type role like Warrior".

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

Which is why you see many Tank's mostly stacking Crit and Det. Other cases Accuracy and Skill Speed.

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My problem with Skill Speed is that after awhile, you are softcapped. This is my biggest problem with the Stat System. Every content that SE puts out, doesn't feel like I haven't "progressed" at all. It feels like I'm back at square one til you get gear that surpasses your current. The cycle just repeats itself time and time again.

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Originally Posted by SendohJin

obviously, but people use the terminology as if jobs themselves should be designed to largely lean towards one or the other and that's wrong. all tanks should be balanced to do both so that phrases like this don't exist "an OT type role like Warrior".

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It's because Warrior is a dynamic class and can be used effectively in all content whereas PLD/DRK lean one way or the other and have content designed to favor them. PLD excelling at physical mitigation, DRK having magical mitigation options, and Warrior can sit just fine doing both with abilities that could care less what kind of damage it is.

And right now people see PLD/DRK as more suited to the MT role and while WAR can choose to MT it has that OT moniker derived from the stigma it had in 2.0 where everyone wanted to run PLD over Warrior in certain content.

Due to this if we get another tank they would want it to fill a similar role to Warrior which to the community is OT.

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Originally Posted by FallenArisen0990

My problem with Skill Speed is that after awhile, you are softcapped. This is my biggest problem with the Stat System. Every content that SE puts out, doesn't feel like I haven't "progressed" at all. It feels like I'm back at square one til you get gear that surpasses your current. The cycle just repeats itself time and time again.

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As a BLM main I echo your sentiments. When you ilvl sync down it's crap and basically says your gear your stats it's all balanced...controlled...dictated. I can dish out 4 F2's and then 2-3 Flares in the current content. But sync down and it's back to 3 F2 again because even though I do have 350 Pie. Because of the ilvl nerf they impose my Pie is decreased down again. And I find that really irritating. You try to maximize your job and you just can't when they impose restrictions on you. If Fire 2 is dealing about a 1000 damage at 60 with ilvl 150 nerf and then shoots up to over 2000 unrestricted I think there is an issue.

In any other RPG the gear you got was always yours...you earned this and have the stats to prove it. But because it's XIV it's held back for the sake of balance. Elemental resistances and physical resistances are stagnant worthless and unchanging.

I understand why they do it so BLM's like me don't wreck the shit out of their beeline dungeons. However I still don't agree with it. I earned my gear. Let me use it. That's all I can ask.

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Originally Posted by MagiusNecros

Due to this if we get another tank they would want it to fill a similar role to Warrior which to the community is OT.

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I agree. I've pondered it myself for quite a while and I wondered if SE would surprise us with something unexpected as the next new tank... like Puppetmaster o_o With a fresh playstyle and great damage output abilities like War.

i like see pet tank puppet master would interest ideal for this they got mammet design for it too

yeah i think ill stick to the OT-leaning tank, itd probably have the obligatory tank buster cooldowns 2 or 3 but if they fix parry i can see it having alot of quick reactive cooldowns that act like reprisal, so its mitigation is solely on whether its tanking at the time or not. Not so sure on a tanking stance obviously will be damage reduction but i doubt theyll be lazy and do shield oath again, so idk maybe give it increased healing? Damage stance i could see something like greased, increasing damage or sks. would be interesting if lnc was a cross class

I thought Samurai was just a possible tank, before they had decided to give Dark Knight that honor. Meaning when/if we do get Samurai, it's a safe bet it's going to be dps. o.o;

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Originally Posted by CheshirePuss

I thought Samurai was just a possible tank, before they had decided to give Dark Knight that honor. Meaning when/if we do get Samurai, it's a safe bet it's going to be dps. o.o;

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Chances are it will be a DPS. It could easily go the other way. He had a hard time deciding to let DRK or SAM be the next tank but ultimately pick DRK. Logic says he would give SAM the DPS role, but who knows truly how SE thinks over there.

I do not want the Samurai to be a tank. We have zero sword DPS classes. I want the Samurai to be a DPS class.

I would have been okay with samurai being a tank before we got dark knight. While the style and skills are different between warrior and dark knight, having a third 2-handed tank is just silly at this point. I'd like to see a new tank that is thematically and visually different.

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Originally Posted by Reignald

I would have been okay with samurai being a tank before we got dark knight. While the style and skills are different between warrior and dark knight, having a third 2-handed tank is just silly at this point. I'd like to see a new tank that is thematically and visually different.

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There really aren't a whole lot of options left that wouldn't be overlapping at this point. I guess they could try to utilize a force/magic shield type of character where the weapon/source of power is a magic infused orb and gauntlet. Think Thanos and the Infinity Gauntlet. It'd essentially be like an Archon from Starcraft, Master Chief from Halo, etc. The mechanics would be unusual in this case though, as they'd have to develop a shield gauge to measure (not just the blind way it works now with jobs like WAR, AST, and SCH) and low actual HP. I suppose they could just set it as a generic buff, like current tank stances, but that sadly removes a lot of the unique functions. Although, coupling that with unusual stat focus like MND for the shielding strength would be a little too out there too, especially when you consider role competition for the same drops.

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Originally Posted by FallenArisen0990

But some people are really hurt that not all SAMs in FF wear Heavy Armor.

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Or it could be people bothered that you're being disingenuous at best. You don't get to sweep the RPG mechanics of past FF games and this one when it comes to equipment types to the side just because they don't fit your narrative. You're only viable argument for samurai in past FF games not wearing their usual heavy armor is a game where there was no armor equipment itemization or classification and thus only the visual look of the job could matter, and even then their design is a questionable, being not solely light robes/clothe, but not entirely heavy armor, but a mixture of both. It doesn't change the fact that Samurai in every FF game wore some kind of heavy armor, from a visual and game mechanic standpoint. No job looked like it's FF equivalent in FF12 on top of the fact the samurai in the game isn't even technically called a samurai going back to what I've said before in that jobs in FF games that don't generally have the iconic samurai armor are deliberately not called Samurai. And even most of those that aren't called samurai and don't have an armored appearance still equip heavy armor from a gameplay perspective (Swordmaster from Bravely etc.)

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Originally Posted by Velhart

Chances are it will be a DPS. It could easily go the other way. He had a hard time deciding to let DRK or SAM be the next tank but ultimately pick DRK. Logic says he would give SAM the DPS role, but who knows truly how SE thinks over there.

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Logic stands that SAM would still be kept as a tank option since it wasn't used as a DPS option in the same expansion where they chose DRK as the tank. I don't know what kind of logic this is: "We have two jobs that would be perfect for the next tank, we picked one of them for this expansion, so let's turn the other one into a DPS for the next expansion." That makes zero sense logically.

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Originally Posted by Shippuu

If you can't seem to think of how vastly different a Samurai could be then that's on your lack of imagination.

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I can think of a few ways:

1) Lose the dumb armored look by making it tank in monk-level STR armor while giving it half the buffs it needs to tank as passives and the other half as something they'd have to juggle in their rotation along with a threat rotation.
2) Give it means to have some other stat increase how much damage is reduced by Parry.
3) If it's going to counterattack, set it to a cooldown that would also parry all attacks (spells and melee, including AoE), increase it's Parry amount by some bonkers number and have that as their panic button.
4) A spell reflect with a cooldown along the lines of Sheltron.
5) Have them use the Iaido style with most of the attacks using just the katana and have attack combos end with dual-wielding.
6) Lastly, make the overall goal of Samurai as a tank being a "high risk, high reward" tank instead of just another tin can with a fresh coat of paint.

Have to remember it's not about just imagination. It's about practicality in understanding what SE can do with the systems it has in place as well.

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Again, this thread is about Samurai as a tank so your yammering about SAM dps overlapping with Ninja is pretty moot.

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This just seems to me like an excuse for not knowing. Sure, you could put it in that stereotypical heavy armor or have it in something lighter, have it just using a katana or have it dual-wield and give it a saboteur style of attacks with a series of small debuffing strikes followed by one massive hit. In the end though, no matter how much you dress it up, it's still just another fast Japanese-themed job darting around with curved blades.

Oh right, and devs mentioned Samurai will likely be DPS. The end.

No to tank Sam.

Have nothing against tanks, just sam can't be one.

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Originally Posted by Welsper59

There really aren't a whole lot of options left that wouldn't be overlapping at this point.

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Personally I'd love to see beastmaster as a tank. Not sure about the logistics of it but having the beast and the beastmaster having linked hp etc would be different and interesting enough for me, although I could see some people just writing it off as a summoner tank. But they need to do a lot of work with pet AI and such before something like that would be good enough as well.

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Originally Posted by Kazrah

1) Lose the dumb armored look by making it tank in monk-level STR armor while giving it half the buffs it needs to tank as passives and the other half as something they'd have to juggle in their rotation along with a threat rotation.
2) Give it means to have some other stat increase how much damage is reduced by Parry.
3) If it's going to counterattack, set it to a cooldown that would also parry all attacks (spells and melee, including AoE), increase it's Parry amount by some bonkers number and have that as their panic button.
4) A spell reflect with a cooldown along the lines of Sheltron.
5) Have them use the Iaido style with most of the attacks using just the katana and have attack combos end with dual-wielding.
6) Lastly, make the overall goal of Samurai as a tank being a "high risk, high reward" tank instead of just another tin can with a fresh coat of paint.

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Before i dive into this list, I want to point out what you said after it:

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Have to remember it's not about just imagination. It's about practicality in understanding what SE can do with the systems it has in place as well.

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You're exactly right, which is why your #1 is absolutely pointless.
1) You're either giving it an entirely new set that isn't shared by any other job, or you're making it share gear with a DPS job. While there's some benefits to the latter, it has some major downsides. Firstly, adding more unique types of armor is bad for the already polluted loot pools so that shouldn't be broached at all. And having a single tank share gear with a dps while the other tanks all share their own kind of gear is problematic. While it makes it easier for a DPS player to break into the tank role, it alienates the existing tank players and provides a problem with them having to select which tanks they want to gear, instead of being able to gear them all at once because of their shared gear.
SE's decision to have tanks and healers share gear is not only one of convenience for developing armor, but also for convenience for these roles. With healers and tanks often always in demand it works as a better incentive to allow them to gear multiple jobs in the same role simultaneaously. This is why adding a new tank that breaks this mold is less ideal. Also, having tanks competing with dps for gear on loot rolls is also another somewhat problematic idea and should generally be avoided.

2) This is fine and something I've talked about before with potential things like a tank stance that allows the tank to parry 100% of all attacks (Resulting in a 20% damage mitigation) and then applying the actual parry stat to something like an "over-parry" which would act like a normal parry mitigation-wise on top of the tank stance parry. i.e. they proc an over-parry and they take 40% less damage from the attack (20% from stance parry + 20% from over-parry). This keeps parry as a stat relatively the same.

3) This is fine too.

4) I've had similar ideas for this as well. Active parry/counters that would work on attacks/magical attacks.

5) This is fine too, I've advocated for dual wielding Samurai myself, and my ideal Tank Samurai would be dual wield in tank stance, and single wield/iaido for offensive stance. Unrealistic though because of animation reasons alone.

6) It can still be a high risk, high reward styled tank while wearing fending armor like the other tanks.

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Oh right, and devs mentioned Samurai will likely be DPS. The end.

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Back to this again. One, only Yoshi P said anything about SAM potentially being a DPS. He's also not the end-all, be-all to what happens to this game. Look back a few pages to see what he really said as to why he considers SAM for the DPS role. He has never had an interview where he talked about SAM as a DPS where he also didn't mention it as a potential Tank either.

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Originally Posted by Beetle

No to tank Sam.
Have nothing against tanks, just sam can't be one.

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SAM most certainly can be a tank. And very likely will be one.

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Originally Posted by Reignald

Personally I'd love to see beastmaster as a tank. Not sure about the logistics of it but having the beast and the beastmaster having linked hp etc would be different and interesting enough for me, although I could see some people just writing it off as a summoner tank. But they need to do a lot of work with pet AI and such before something like that would be good enough as well.

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I feel like everyone who mentions BST for a tank never actually thinks about the full rammifications of such a job. Not even touching how much additional work would need to be done just to have a pet AI that isn't total garbage that makes the job being added pretty much an impossibility.

If the BST and his pet have linked health, then what happens if they're both standing in front of an enemy and eat cleaves? Do both targets get hit thus the tank takes double damage? On top of that, the tank is now potentially 2 targets to heal instead of one? Why would healers want to bring a tank that requires additional healing? If the pet doesn't take damage from cleaves/attacks/mechanics then that opens it up to plenty of exploits. Does the pet tank? Or is it just an accessory to the actual tank? Microing pet actions while tanking sounds like something a lot of tank players and potential tank players would find problematic and get in the way of them using appropriate cooldowns or handling mechanics. We have enough problems with people playing the tanks we have poorly like DRK, adding a much more complex tank to that mix isn't the best idea from a business standpoint.

Not to mention BST isn't anywhere close to being as popular or requested as other options. It'd just be a bad business move all around. It doesn't mean it's impossible, and it could be done. But it's just highly, highly unlikely.

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Originally Posted by Shippuu

I feel like everyone who mentions BST for a tank never actually thinks about the full rammifications of such a job.

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For argument's sake let's just pretend they did implement beastmaster as a tank, bear with me. In all likelihood, the pet would just be there as a way to supplement it's DPS. Remember, pets in this game only function as a glorified DoT. As far as AI, they would have to make it like hunter pets in WoW where it automatically goes behind the enemy it's fighting. If anything, the pet might also be included in it's cooldowns, think Fight or Flight style, "beastmaster and pet gain X% damage for Y seconds" or "beastmaster and pet take X% reduced damage for Y seconds." So a tank with a pet might not have a move like scourge/goring blade/fracture and have the pet function as the DoT or apply it.

Shippuu, just out of curiosity, do you know at what stage of development they changed from having Samurai be the Heavensward tank to Dark Knight being the tank? If it was early enough in the development cycle, before actually working on in game assets for the job, it could be possible that when they made the switch they just gave Samurais skill set to Dark Knight.

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Originally Posted by Velhart

Chances are it will be a DPS. It could easily go the other way. He had a hard time deciding to let DRK or SAM be the next tank but ultimately pick DRK. Logic says he would give SAM the DPS role, but who knows truly how SE thinks over there.

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We had all three roles witgh HW. So why would DRK make SAM more likely DPS?

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Originally Posted by Shippuu

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Look, Im glad you think SAM should be a tank but it's not going to be. Yoshi-P is hell bend on making it a DPS. They are gonna make it use the same gear as DRG because NIN shares MNK gear pre-2.4. We already establish SAMs don't always wear Heavy Armor. /end rant.

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Originally Posted by Cakekizyy

We had all three roles witgh HW. So why would DRK make SAM more likely DPS?

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Because the debate Yoshi-P mentioned was not just 2 possible tanks. He also debated if both DRK or SAM should be DPS instead of tank. Has also mentioned he could not decide if SAM should be DPS or tank. So there were more factors than which should tank.

Thanks for info.

Ultimately Yoshi said he didnt want the queue for players to increase like ninja did. Everyone knew that when ninja was released the queue times went through the roof. So I think if Samurai is a dps. Then the healer and tank jobs for 4.0 must be equally or more desireable than SAM

He couldn't decide between DPS or Tank for Samurai. Clearly the only clear avenue is OT where it can be both.

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Originally Posted by Khalithar

For argument's sake let's just pretend they did implement beastmaster as a tank, bear with me. In all likelihood, the pet would just be there as a way to supplement it's DPS. Remember, pets in this game only function as a glorified DoT. As far as AI, they would have to make it like hunter pets in WoW where it automatically goes behind the enemy it's fighting. If anything, the pet might also be included in it's cooldowns, think Fight or Flight style, "beastmaster and pet gain X% damage for Y seconds" or "beastmaster and pet take X% reduced damage for Y seconds." So a tank with a pet might not have a move like scourge/goring blade/fracture and have the pet function as the DoT or apply it.

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The problems here, are once again it's a tank that is technically 2 targets to heal. It's already unwieldly trying to heal SMN and MCH pets as they don't show on the party bar for anyone except the owner. Secondly, if the pet is automatically behind the target, then it's going to get hit with all the mechanics that melee DPS normally have to dodge, meaning the tank player has to not only deal with his own tank mechanics, but also micro his pet to dodge all the melee mechanics as well.

These can be solved by things like, all their pets are ranged and thus no real different from turrets/garuda egis. Or that their pets are very very expendable, and they're basically brought out just to die shortly afterwards. With a low cooldown like MCH have with their turrets it's possible, but in the end is this fun at all? To constantly be expending pets and resummoning them over and over? All so that your character deals less damage than other tanks because some of your DPS is dragged to your pet.

It could work sure but it comes with a laundry list of issues that have to be solved.

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Originally Posted by ArikDimas

Shippuu, just out of curiosity, do you know at what stage of development they changed from having Samurai be the Heavensward tank to Dark Knight being the tank? If it was early enough in the development cycle, before actually working on in game assets for the job, it could be possible that when they made the switch they just gave Samurais skill set to Dark Knight.

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They've not said much about the timeframe of ultimately when it was decided that DRK would be the tank over SAM for Heavensward and so we have no information on if they had developed abilities or animations for SAM that they repurposed for DRK. Animations are less likely as they are likely created later in the development process of a job, but certainly some of the DRK skills could have originally been meant for SAM.

It doesn't really change much though if they did, it just means they have to develop new abilities like they would if they go with a tank that isn't SAM. A new tank can still have parry mechanics even if DRK and WAR have parry mechanics, just like a new tank can have flat damage reduction cooldowns just like the other tanks have.

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Originally Posted by FallenArisen0990

Look, Im glad you think SAM should be a tank but it's not going to be. Yoshi-P is hell bend on making it a DPS. They are gonna make it use the same gear as DRG because NIN shares MNK gear pre-2.4. We already establish SAMs don't always wear Heavy Armor. /end rant.

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The only things we've established is how deliberately obtuse you are and how wrong you are about pretty much everything you've said here.

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Originally Posted by Derio

Ultimately Yoshi said he didnt want the queue for players to increase like ninja did. Everyone knew that when ninja was released the queue times went through the roof. So I think if Samurai is a dps. Then the healer and tank jobs for 4.0 must be equally or more desireable than SAM

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Here is a better idea!

Make SAM a Tank Job and Red Mage the Healer Job

Then release Gunblade Job as the DPS Job for 4.0

That way Tank players get their SAM counter/parry/what ever tank

Healers finally get a Healer Job that doesn't require them to stop healing just to DPS with Red Mage Healing Mechanic allow them to cause damage to all nearby enemies to their Healed ally in Black magic stance and White Magic Stance gives them a 50% chance to dualcast their Healing Skill. Thus Red Mage introduce a new mechanic of a Berserker/Burst Healer which can heal and cause damage to enemies at the same time.

and DPS get the greatly desired Gunblade Job people been praying for years which can fit into Ala Mhigo as the place has been Garleanized with garlean technology due to being turned into a Garlean Fortress City.