we need a sword dps

I think the whole idea of locking classes to a kind of weapon and changing classes via equipping weapons was super short sighted. In the long run that limits what kinds of classic jobs they can use without heavy transformations. Now any new sword-wielding job needs to have some special kind of sword, like DRK's greatswords or samurai's katanas. Would have been better if they sticked with soulstones since the very beginning.

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

What would make it differ from Dragoon then? Other than not Jumping.

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Assuming you're referring to their weapons, the main difference would be that dragoon's weapon is meant for piercing attacks; while the naginata, iirc, is primarily a slashing weapon. Which would fit well with samurai type techniques.

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Originally Posted by Khaoticsuccubus

Assuming you're referring to their weapons, the main difference would be that dragoon's weapon is meant for piercing attacks; while the naginata, iirc, is primarily a slashing weapon. Which would fit well with samurai type techniques.

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Referring mostly to play style and aesthetics. It would share most if not all of the same animations as DRG. Not to mention the fact that DRG was given a Naginata already.

http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/5c0e580aff5/

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

Referring mostly to play style and aesthetics. It would share most if not all of the same animations as DRG. Not to mention the fact that DRG was given a Naginata already.

http://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodest...m/5c0e580aff5/

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Not at all. There are plenty of unique animations they could use for the naginata. While some of Dragoon's animations sweep their spear in a wide arc, the vast majority forcus on frontal piercing stabs.

Also, this wouldn't be the first time they've had to retcon a weapon out of the game for a new class ;P

Paladins used to use "daggers" from time to time before rogue/ninja came out. Which was when they changed their name and replaced them with a new model of an actual sword.

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Originally Posted by Khaoticsuccubus

Not at all. There are plenty of unique animations they could use for the naginata. While some of Dragoon's animations sweep their spear in a wide arc, the vast majority forcus on frontal piercing stabs.

Also, this wouldn't be the first time they've had to retcon a weapon out of the game for a new class ;P

Paladins used to use "daggers" from time to time before rogue/ninja came out. Which was when they changed their name and replaced them with a new model of an actual sword.

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The difference there is its daggers splitting from paladins not swords, this is pulling a polearm from a class that uses polearms to make another class that uses polearms. Is it possible that Samurai will also use polearms? Yes, likely? Not so much, especially because most people associate Samurai with Katanas.

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Originally Posted by Sicno

I think the whole idea of locking classes to a kind of weapon and changing classes via equipping weapons was super short sighted. In the long run that limits what kinds of classic jobs they can use without heavy transformations. Now any new sword-wielding job needs to have some special kind of sword, like DRK's greatswords or samurai's katanas. Would have been better if they sticked with soulstones since the very beginning.

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This isn't particularly a problem with samurai specifically as Katana have always been classed as their own kind of weapon in Final Fantasy games.

But even then I don't think thats really much of an issue. We have multiple classifications of existing weapons that are very similar, blm/WHM weapons and sch/smn books. It's all just back end coding that makes the difference.

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

The difference there is its daggers splitting from paladins not swords, this is pulling a polearm from a class that uses polearms to make another class that uses polearms. Is it possible that Samurai will also use polearms? Yes, likely? Not so much, especially because most people associate Samurai with Katanas.

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Addendum... most people in the West associate Samurai solely with katana. ;P

I'm still betting on our ffxi friend becoming the samurai trainer... and she used a naginata.

There are still many types of polearms and the dragoon style does not befit the use a good portion of them. Lumping all polearm-esque weapons under dragoons piercing style is actually doing them a disservice really.

It's like when rdm comes out and uses a rapier. A rapier is technically a sword but, you can't just say their techniques would be the same as a paladins as they use a completely different style of combat. Slash vs piercing again.

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Originally Posted by Khaoticsuccubus

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While I agree that it is a disservice, chances are due to the past uses of samurai in every ff game using them, it will be Katana based, personally I am hoping they take the tactics route and allow you to draw the spirit out but thats just me. As for RDM its going to be awkward due to the Gladiator description of "Uses all swords" and them then not being able to use rapiers.

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

While I agree that it is a disservice, chances are due to the past uses of samurai in every ff game using them, it will be Katana based, personally I am hoping they take the tactics route and allow you to draw the spirit out but thats just me. As for RDM its going to be awkward due to the Gladiator description of "Uses all swords" and them then not being able to use rapiers.

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To be fair rapiers are more about parrying and stabbing, not slashing like a Paladin. So that style of sword would not suit them.

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Originally Posted by AlphaFox

To be fair rapiers are more about parrying and stabbing, not slashing like a Paladin. So that style of sword would not suit them.

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True, except it doesn't say anything about slashing weapons it just says swords. Though I do agree, seeing paladins with rapiers would be silly.

Feel like I should add, RDM is the one class I am most excited for, though if it is a healer I just quit.

I guess it just depends on where you come from and how you view the RDM. I honestly don't think (and I could be wrong) they were intended to ever tank or solo as I heard in 11, they just happened to be able to much like Ninja and Samurai being reversed in the intended role. For me, a RDM just has access to both classes of magic while being allowed to melee DPS. That is kinda why I have a hard time viewing them as a tank or healer, simply because they were never ment to excel at either. I still want a caster tank and if he gets thrown into a Tank position (or any really) I'll still try it but a DPS is really the only way I can view it. Have his pure melee be weaker than others, his magic weaker than blackmages or summoners but allowing him to weave them together allows his dps to be comparable on the DPS chart while having some side skills of healing or protection (perhaps on cool downs) and maybe even another battle raise like Summoner. When we let him step on the toes of a Healer or tank though it kinda tosses the long running "Jack of all, master of none".

Unless they throw a total curve ball and give the RDM a stance (with all skills being the same just potency changing or say some change, like with ASTs Dirunal/Nocturnal spells) that changes him from Healer/DPS/Tank but must be decided outside of a dungeon....yet somehow I get an evil smile at the thought of 8 RDMs in a dungeon in different stances xD

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

As for RDM its going to be awkward due to the Gladiator description of "Uses all swords" and them then not being able to use rapiers.

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That is already contradicted by Dark Knight using Greatswords and gladiator not being able to.

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Originally Posted by AlphaFox

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I quite honestly never fully got into 11, but from what I hear they were mainly healers because of Convert. Though honestly and as weird as this sounds, I think the System WoW had for enhancement shamans or something similar to it would fit quite well. As in something along the lines of melee crits or something building charges to give you a free cast spell. Using it for either damage or a heal. Then having some small insta cast spells as dots or what have you, just for the love of god give the more melee attacks than Enhance shams had, seriously 2 melee abilites... smdh

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Originally Posted by Khaoticsuccubus

That is already contradicted by Dark Knight using Greatswords and gladiator not being able to.

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I actually said the same thing when a friend presented that argument. Quite honestly I agree Gladiator's should be able to use Great swords. Though I don't think it would make to much sense since gladiators main goals were to survive, could also make the argument that they should use Tridents and nets. Actually a trident/net based tank would be kind of awesome.

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

I quite honestly never fully got into 11, but from what I hear they were mainly healers because of Convert. Though honestly and as weird as this sounds, I think the System WoW had for enhancement shamans or something similar to it would fit quite well. As in something along the lines of melee crits or something building charges to give you a free cast spell. Using it for either damage or a heal. Then having some small insta cast spells as dots or what have you, just for the love of god give the more melee attacks than Enhance shams had, seriously 2 melee abilites... smdh

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That's kinda how I always pictured rdm being implemented in an mmo. I mean, it would cover all bases.. melee dps, healing, and offensive magic all woven neatly into a normal rotation.

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

I actually said the same thing when a friend presented that argument. Quite honestly I agree Gladiator's should be able to use Great swords. Though I don't think it would make to much sense since gladiators main goals were to survive, could also make the argument that they should use Tridents and nets. Actually a trident/net based tank would be kind of awesome.

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Heh, that would be deviating from the gladiatior tidbit "uses all swords". While a greatsword utilizes a completely different style of combat than a sword or even a rapier... they are all under the title "Sword". Just as while "Polearms" would include the spear and naginata, they both utilize completely different styles of combat.

Though, now ya have gotten me hoping the samurai is a naginata wielding tank lol. ;P

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Originally Posted by Khaoticsuccubus

That's kinda how I always pictured rdm being implemented in an mmo. I mean, it would cover all bases.. melee dps, healing, and offensive magic all woven neatly into a normal rotation.



Heh, that would be deviating from the gladiatior tidbit "uses all swords". While a greatsword utilizes a completely different style of combat than a sword or even a rapier... they are all under the title "Sword". Just as while "Polearms" would include the spear and naginata, they both utilize completely different styles of combat.

Though, now ya have gotten me hoping the samurai is a naginata wielding tank lol. ;P

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I would actually be okay with that, I am not against them using Naginata its just that everyone automatically associates them with Katana, hell I would still play it even if they gave it a Yumi.

I have a few thoughts.

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Originally Posted by Ignis_kline

I have a few thoughts.

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care to share them?


what would happen if they decided to give us 2 different jobs entirely and just rhrew the names out in the rising event to get us all excited then bam, we get jobs we didnt expect like mch lol

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Originally Posted by Gabrielleblanc

I would actually be okay with that, I am not against them using Naginata its just that everyone automatically associates them with Katana, hell I would still play it even if they gave it a Yumi.

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They could always do a split like they did with Arcanist, Although i know they said they regret doing that. But They could have the samurai Trainer teach two differing styles, one that uses a Katana (DPS so the dps players can get a sword) and Naginata (Tank, so the tanks can get another non-sword role). Different skills for the technically different jobs.

Samurai: Katana using DPS class.
Shogun: Naginata using Tank class.

I could see that working, then everybody is happy, and everybody wins. You'll still get the tank players that dont want to use a Naginata, and vice versa, but I feel its the closest to a compromise as we can get.

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Originally Posted by Cinno

They could always do a split like they did with Arcanist, Although i know they said they regret doing that. But They could have the samurai Trainer teach two differing styles, one that uses a Katana (DPS so the dps players can get a sword) and Naginata (Tank, so the tanks can get another non-sword role). Different skills for the technically different jobs.

Samurai: Katana using DPS class.
Shogun: Naginata using Tank class.

I could see that working, then everybody is happy, and everybody wins. You'll still get the tank players that dont want to use a Naginata, and vice versa, but I feel its the closest to a compromise as we can get.

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Can't we just give Naginata to Berserker DPS Job and have that Berserker DPS Job be slightly inspired by Lu Bu from Dynasty Warriors like how Dark knight was slightly inspired by Guts from Berserker Manga?

Maybe? I wouldnt say no to new jobs, hopefully they got the "we need another (insert job/role concept) because 1 is not enough" out of their system, and i really hope they do take alot of these ideas off the forum into consideration when designing these new jobs.

Back on first page where they can see how many want Samurai DPS job.

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Originally Posted by Heliantheae

I've heard rumors about Dancer and they most likely be Dex based and might use TP. And I would love a healer class that uses TP, since I usually end up Goading them anyway.

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A TP using healer better use MP for sprint somehow.

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Originally Posted by Alistaire

A TP using healer better use MP for sprint somehow.

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Could easily combine it into a flow where MP is used for bigger or instant heals while the TP is both attack or sustained healing over time type moves and buffs. Least then when sprinting they aren't totally shut down but they can still perform the basic functions to a degree.