A Recent Yoshi-P Post that probably needs to be read (Translation)

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Originally Posted by Reverser

Your translation has several innacuracies. You should probably leave messages of this import to be translated by someone else (ie professionals). This is the face of a producer to his players and requires more than a "stab."

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Would you be willing to enlighten us as to where the translations inaccuracies lie, rather than openly criticize an individuals attempt to help others here out?

Not to mention the lack of providing useful commentary on the topic.

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Originally Posted by Reverser

Your translation has several innacuracies. You should probably leave messages of this import to be translated by someone else (ie professionals). This is the face of a producer to his players and requires more than a "stab."

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Oh shut up, he did a free service to give the English side of the forums a look into new information not released to us yet.

It isn't(and shouldn't) be mandatory, but the point still stands: You try to form an effective raid group and make sure everyone understands what's going on when there are about 3 language barriers in place. Until there's an auto-translate function that translates everything I type on the fly correctly(no google-translate nonsense), then it isn't going to be useful when trying to go through the deep content. It also doesn't really promote anything other than the equivalent of grunting to each other in conversation.

That being said as a cultural hodgepodge myself I definitely prefer global servers since communication isn't a problem(save keyboard fonts), but for other people it's an issue.

Reading this thread I can see how some Japanese don't want to play with western players, jesus christ some of you need help. I for one will be staying on the global servers, if indeed square does launch region specific servers.

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Originally Posted by Dhalmel

Reading this thread I can see how some Japanese don't want to play with western players, jesus christ some of you need help. I for one will be staying on the global servers, if indeed square does launch region specific servers.

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I have a feeling the JP will mostly be on their own servers, it always felt like if they had the chance in FFXI, that they would take it. I cant tell you how many "jp only" things ive seen in that game, or the Japanese flat out refusing to play with others.

I personally dont love the idea. It was one feature that made FFXIV stand out and now it will be another option and will split the already small community up even thinner.

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Originally Posted by Rokien

Thats soo stupid, why would anyone want that........ god. Make the player base community smaller GREAT IDEA.... not! Thats why I loved FFXI meet new people all over the world. If youw ant that go play WoW, they better keep their hands off my community!

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Im sorry but this is a great idea. We get all the same speaking people on at the same time during peak hours. I think ff11 suffered because of not doing this.

Also JP are mean. Even in ff11 they would say "JP ONLY" when seeking for a party ... i say see ya.

Cheers on the translation dude!

Also, nice to see him clear up some shaded areas.

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Originally Posted by Reverser

In the meantime, my post is meant to illuminate that this should be taken with a grain of salt until it is officially released and translated by the company who is providing the information.

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Yeah, I'm sure 4gamer and gamewatch will post an english translation soon enough.

(lol)

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Originally Posted by Reverser

Actually I didn't spend 10+ years mastering a language...

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I've got my work cut out for me...

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Originally Posted by Reverser

Actually I didn't spend 10+ years mastering a language to provide a free translation service. I'll keep it to myself in the future. In the meantime, my post is meant to illuminate that this should be taken with a grain of salt until it is officially released and translated by the company who is providing the information.

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Well, I appreciated this very much. Thank you.

As for not being able to afford GM service.. I've reported people swearing and being vulgar in public chat, never got anything but an automated reply back.. and later found out that person i reported never even got so much as another automated message. Also I reported someone blatantly botting and got nothing but an automated message. Are there actual GMs working??

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Originally Posted by Reverser

Actually I didn't spend 10+ years mastering a language to provide a free translation service for nerds on the internet. I'll keep it to myself in the future. In the meantime, my post is meant to illuminate that this should be taken with a grain of salt until it is officially released and translated by the company who is providing the information.

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You were quick to criticize a service another individual took the time to provide. While it wasn't perfect by your standards, it was miles more informative than what little you had to contribute. On top of that you have the gall to retaliate upon a simple request.
While I can't speak for the others, I merely asked if you were willing to do so. A simple no would have sufficed.

I don't see the problem in a simple translation. Not to mention the OP even pointed out that there may be mistakes in his translation, so that "grain of salt" was implied.

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Originally Posted by JackDaniels

Well, I appreciated this very much. Thank you.

As for not being able to afford GM service.. I've reported people swearing and being vulgar in public chat, never got anything but an automated reply back.. and later found out that person i reported never even got so much as another automated message. Also I reported someone blatantly botting and got nothing but an automated message. Are there actual GMs working??

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Nah, I've reported huge groups of RMT and if they were actually on duty they could of come in and destroyed a whole ring of them. But, since there aren't actually GMs, nothing happened to them.

How can you have GMs when they can't get paid?

"need funds" can have many meanings. Trying to read into what it means, especially in another language, will probably not help anything.

I.E.: a) We need funds or we will go bankrupt., b) We need funds because it is required that the FFXIV business unit not lose money., c) We need funds so that we can post better results at the end of the quarter, ....

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Originally Posted by PrettyPrincess

How can you have GMs when they can't get paid?

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Just have a program that still lets you report things, but all you get out of it is an automated message.. oh wait..

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Originally Posted by Kajika

"need funds" can have many meanings. Trying to read into what it means, especially in another language, will probably not help anything.

I.E.: a) We need funds or we will go bankrupt., b) We need funds because it is required that the FFXIV business unit not lose money., c) We need funds so that we can post better results at the end of the quarter, ....

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It's not a matter of them going bankrupt like I said in another thread. It's a matter of them losing out on their annual growth.

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Originally Posted by DNO

Im sorry but this is a great idea. We get all the same speaking people on at the same time during peak hours. I think ff11 suffered because of not doing this.

Also JP are mean. Even in ff11 they would say "JP ONLY" when seeking for a party ... i say see ya.

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im not the same opinion as you... gobal servers means, that there are plenty players playing the game around the clock, not just only at your "prime time" in your country..

global servers are more crowded than regional servers... and i bet.. if there are going to be german servers or something like that, that they wont be that full like the global servers are now..

these servers will die much faster than any FF global server from today. and people are going to quit much faster because there are not enough people on the regional language server. thats the point.
i dont think at all that this will be a good decision.


especially after a re-release.. i dont think FFXIV will be that successful it could have been at the first release. oh oh.. well i dont think that all these changes are a good decision...

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Additionally, we also have plans to open new servers where the slate is wiped clean.

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does that mean they want to seperate players who are going to start playing with FFXIV at version 2.0. from players who started at the original release? +language servers?

Really BAD decision in my opinion... so that does mean, that we have servers that are half crowded? what do they think? that three times more people will join the game with FFXIV 2.0? omg..
really if this comes i feel like a player of the third class...

Yeah I actually agree that the regional servers thing is kinda silly. to each their own though. I will continue playing on my current server (assuming it will be the same)

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Originally Posted by Reverser

Your translation has several innacuracies. You should probably leave messages of this import to be translated by someone else (ie professionals). This is the face of a producer to his players and requires more than a "stab."

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I am aware of this, and for that I apologize. But on the other hand, I did this quickly and in one setting. I could do better, but eh, edits... too lazy. =P

However, I would like to point out that I did say:

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Originally Posted by Stanislaw

Please keep in mind that is by no means a complete, 100% accurate translation so the information you see here may not be 100% accurate. For the complete details, it is best to wait for an official translation by the community devs, but until then, I think this post and the information contained within will provide some basic facts and information for people to get by.

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Again a reminder: please keep this thread on-topic and civil. I'm afraid it might be derailed again.



Edit:

A earlier poster made a good point.

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Originally Posted by Kajika

"need funds" can have many meanings. Trying to read into what it means, especially in another language, will probably not help anything.

I.E.: a) We need funds or we will go bankrupt., b) We need funds because it is required that the FFXIV business unit not lose money., c) We need funds so that we can post better results at the end of the quarter, ....

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This above is especially true. I wrote it as "need funds" in the translation, but because it's in another language, trying to read into what this statement really means might be difficult.

Personally I think it's a combination of b) and c). SE has tons of other titles they can dip into for funds in they really wanted to, after all.

The only reason I think I'd choose a NA server is if it was actually IN NA. Besides that I prefer to be in a server that's multicultural. Its just a lot more fun that way.

International mixed servers is what made FFXI unique in it's own way. In my opinion it is a defining feature of the way in which SE runs its MMO servers (with regards to FF anyhow). Giving people the option to not associate with people of differing cultures is a step in the wrong direction. The language barriers caused by international servers are not a big deal, we always managed to get by in FFXI just fine. So you can't have a full conversation about the origin of the universe, it's not the end of the world. If SE lets people regress into their cultural groupings (taking the easier road or the path of least resistance) it will be for the worse for all servers.

Also the Japanese community isn't "mean" or "racist" or any of that nonsense. Some people are mean and racist in any community NA or JP or EU, sucks to those people I'm not structuring what I do or don't do around their dumb-ass view of the world. In any event if you don't really want to play with those people because of the language issue you don't need to... they're in a drastically different time zone that means you basically don't see them anyhow a lot of the time.

Being on international servers can only be to everyone's benefit. It means the markets are getting a constant inflow and outflow of goods at all hours of the day. It means the server does not experience serious dead times because the gap is bridged by people from different time zones. Both of those things seem like a bonus to me.

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Originally Posted by Adol

"Therefore, we will let our customers decide at the point where 1.20 is released - or perhaps even when 1.21 or 1.22 is released, it doesn't matter"

...what. He isn't saying we can say when 1.20 is released, is he? Maybe I'm reading this wrong.

Thanks for the TL.

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i think he is saying he fully expects some ppl to leave when billing happens. but he expects them to come back in 1.21 or 1.22 when they hear what is happening

Language specific servers just sounds like a bad idea in the current state unless the games gets 3-4 million subs, some of the language specific servers will probably have population problems.

This is the biggest thing that worrys me now. If the JPs all go to JP servers, the multi-regional servers are screwed. If the we have to choose NA region because of that, we could see the Aion effect where the whole NA population just drops out. Aion is still the 2nd largest mmo on earth... but you would not know that if you just logged into a NA/EU server and did no research.

I think Yoshida might be making a mistake adding in region specific servers... a big one. A lot more negatives then positives in the end. In region specific you have lower populations throughout the day, worse economy, and the risk of the server becoming a ghost town a lot easier. And all you get possibly get is a slight reduction in lag, at least for me that is not worth it at all.

Greetings!

This thread certainly began as one person's attempt to provide some information before it was available elsewhere. However, it seems to have gotten a bit off topic, with the discussions about racism and the languages people "should" speak. While language specific servers can be discussed within the context of the original post, extrapolating the discussion to include racism or what the official language should be will be considered off topic or inflammatory, both of which are considered violations. So please be careful in the discussion.

I cleaned up a number of the posts in question. Please keep the discussion on topic so that this thread does not need to be locked.

SGM Enkrateia

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Originally Posted by Rokien

Thats soo stupid, why would anyone want that........ god. Make the player base community smaller GREAT IDEA.... not! Thats why I loved FFXI meet new people all over the world. If youw ant that go play WoW, they better keep their hands off my community!

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Because both Europe and Japan have been asking for it.. !!

I don't want to feel forced to stay up til 4 in the morning to compete with the best in my LS just because the majority are from the US.

I hope they mean regional servers and not language based, I don't wana play with US for the reason I mentioned above. (nothing against Americans of course)

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Originally Posted by Enkrateia

Greetings!

This thread certainly began as one person's attempt to provide some information before it was available elsewhere. However, it seems to have gotten a bit off topic, with the discussions about racism and the languages people "should" speak. While language specific servers can be discussed within the context of the original post, extrapolating the discussion to include racism or what the official language should be will be considered off topic or inflammatory, both of which are considered violations. So please be careful in the discussion.

I cleaned up a number of the posts in question. Please keep the discussion on topic so that this thread does not need to be locked.

SGM Enkrateia

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For a moment I panicked thinking the thread and my work contained within had been deleted and the information that I posted here had gone to waste because of the derailing that had been going on. Much thanks for this.

I would like to stress Enkrateia's point and ask fellow players to keep this thread in-topic and civil. Getting this thread locked is the last thing we want lest we curb the flow of information that should be seen by other players.

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Originally Posted by Enkrateia

Greetings!

This thread certainly began as one person's attempt to provide some information before it was available elsewhere. However, it seems to have gotten a bit off topic, with the discussions about racism and the languages people "should" speak. While language specific servers can be discussed within the context of the original post, extrapolating the discussion to include racism or what the official language should be will be considered off topic or inflammatory, both of which are considered violations. So please be careful in the discussion.

I cleaned up a number of the posts in question. Please keep the discussion on topic so that this thread does not need to be locked.

SGM Enkrateia

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Racism aside, the dev team through Yoshi-P opened that can of worms by attempting to put language/region specific servers on the table. While some issues come up organically by themselves sometimes it's better not to kick the sleeping tiger.

To use an example of not bringing issues to light unecessarily... It's like the American debt ceiling "crisis"... If they had just quietly dealt with it as they have done for the last several times the issue came up without saying a word about it nobody would have said a thing and life would continue none the wiser. However, they chose to turn it into a shit-show of the highest order, and now it's an issue front and center for the entire world to complain about and doom and gloom over whereas before it was maybe a background grievance (at most) that few people just grumbled about (if they turned their mind to it at all) and then got on with their day.

SE should have just kept their mouth shut and left the way they organize their servers status quo. While a small fringe group would invariably continue to gripe about it, those people would continue to play the game anyhow as they did in FFXI and the world would go on with most people never turning their mind to the issue at all. Now... it's an issue. gg.

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Originally Posted by AngryNixon

Racism aside, the dev team through Yoshi-P opened that can of worms by attempting to put language/region specific servers on the table. While some issues come up organically by themselves sometimes it's better not to kick the sleeping tiger.

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Thats like saying "It's his fault I'm racist, he put the thought in my head!"

Don't talk rubbish.

More importantly If I was Japanese and given the option to play on a JP only server I would jump at the chance, its common sense to choose the server with the population you have most in common with.

Racism doesn't even come in to it.

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Originally Posted by Jinko

Thats like saying "It's his fault I'm racist, he put the thought in my head!"

Don't talk rubbish.

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I said racism aside... I was talking about making an issue of language specific servers. In any event that discussion (rabid argument) will inevitably come with at least some racism or veiled racism... to be expected and ignored.

Tangent sorry: As an aside with regards to your quote if I had been talking about the racism it would be more like "He brought up an issue surrounding international servers. I'm going to take that opportunity to inject my racist opinion on the matter because the issue's been raised and that opens the door for my nonsense spin on it." The racist isn't looking to be excused for his racism by saying someone else put the thought in his/her head.

On your expanded post edit: Again, racism aside, I made some post about it earlier... you're perfectly right, people may gravitate to region specific servers were they available for whatever reason, that's part of the problem.

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Originally Posted by Rizon

I have never played WoW so I don't know what all the hubbub is about....bub. I can only judge by what I have seen in FFXI. Right now the game is starting to go beyond passable and should reach excellence in a year. If that is what it means to be a WoW clone then I am all for it.

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Your a good man.
and let me tell you all the hubbub is about nothing. People love to hate on popular things. People are also mad that wow 100% crushed ff11 in every way. So people hate.

I never played wow and i played ff11 for 6 years but i can tell you Some if not MOST of the ideas from WoW would have made me a much happier ff11 player. I just wish some player whould understand that... But who cares Yoshi understands it and thats why i am very happy he is in charge and not that other guy

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Originally Posted by Anapingofness

Holy crap...
er...well...

Thanks for the translation man!

However, as much as I don't want to jump on the "omfg it's a WoW Clone!" bandwagon... err... well it is...

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Both games are in the same genre. They are going to be similar in form. Is a Camaro considered a Mustang clone? No, but they both have four wheels, a steering wheel, a body, and an engine. Stretching this bad analogy a bit further, they are both sports cars, but they feel and look different from one another. Will FFXIV have PVP, a dungeon finder, and raid content? Yes, but it may look and feel different than WoW's version of those systems. It's irrational to be so repulsed by FFXIV adding features that were considered successful in WoW and other games. Yoshi and team aren't developing this game in a bubble. They look outside of their personal experience to what other companies have done and what has worked and what hasn't.

Funny thing about Camaros and Mustangs: They both have similar designs and similar specs, which in essence you could consider a clone, so while they may "feel and look different", you can't necessarily look past the obvious.

This is the problem with WoW clones - People are tired of them. WoW in itself is a mismash of MMOs before it, but games after it are clearly copying it, e.g Rift was a very blatant WoW clone. People want something new and different, which is why they're ready to murder children if you merely mention SQUARE ENIX's last successful MMORPG, FFXI.

Using successful MMO mechanics does not a WoW clone make.

That's like saying WoW is a clone of it's predecessors because it uses an EXP system, or damage indicators, or special skills.

thx man this was totaly helpfull but i made my mind up already you gota pay to play in real life and on ff lol im gona be playing after 1.20 i like yoshi's changes so far cant wait to see what else we get in the coming years (yes i believe this game will survive)

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

Funny thing about Camaros and Mustangs: They both have similar designs and similar specs, which in essence you could consider a clone, so while they may "feel and look different", you can't necessarily look past the obvious.

This is the problem with WoW clones - People are tired of them. WoW in itself is a mismash of MMOs before it, but games after it are clearly copying it, e.g Rift was a very blatant WoW clone. People want something new and different, which is why they're ready to murder children if you merely mention SQUARE ENIX's last successful MMORPG, FFXI.

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Yeah, it wasn't the best analogy (I know nothing about cars), but I think it made the point well enough. If you asked a Mustang enthusiast if his car was a "clone" of a Camaro I think he'd laugh at you because it just isn't true.

I get that, but I don't think the inclusion of PVP, a dungeon finder, and raid content are what defines a game as a WoW clone. In the end, XIV will be a much different experience from WoW. People just "hate" WoW so much that they can't see beyond that.

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Originally Posted by LilaAquillina

Yes, this game will be a WoW clone. They tried to be 'unique' -- anyone remember the hype here? They were taking down the 'holy trinity'! Seamless world! no levels! Fully customizable classes!

Now they're going to copy the market leader. It makes good business sense. It's going to be a WoW clone, albeit a shinier, cleaner WoW clone. Split hairs any which way you want to, but it is what it is.

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Oh yeah gee. I forgot that WoW invented the holy trinity. It is the only game to ever have a tank, DPS, and a healer. Good call, very good call.

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Originally Posted by Jennestia

Funny thing about Camaros and Mustangs: They both have similar designs and similar specs, which in essence you could consider a clone, so while they may "feel and look different", you can't necessarily look past the obvious.

This is the problem with WoW clones - People are tired of them. WoW in itself is a mismash of MMOs before it, but games after it are clearly copying it, e.g Rift was a very blatant WoW clone. People want something new and different, which is why they're ready to murder children if you merely mention SQUARE ENIX's last successful MMORPG, FFXI.

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You are right m'lady. People *are* tired of WoW clones- which is why players don't want FFXIV to turn into another WoW Clone. Why play a clone when you can play the real thing?

Besides, fact of the matter is that regardless of your personal feelings toward WoW it is the MMO leader. However, what most people don't realize is that FFXI brought MMO's into mainstream in much the same way that FF7 revolutionized JRPG games.

However, where Blizzard succeeds is that it looked at other games before it, including FFXI I'm willing to bet, and took things from them. Then they made them better. They retained the Warcraft feel by using the lore of their previous games so that fans of the previous games could feel connected to the world. SE on the other hand decides to first be a special snowflake in the worst ways possible then when that failed decide to copy WoW because that has worked so well for the other clones, right?

FFXI should have been their template. They should have first taken things that made that game stand out and made them better, such as the party system. Yeah, you made friends in FFXI because you actually met people. Sure, Content Finder is a step up to the LFG system so why not make it across a single server and make parties that way? That was the community isn't destroyed.

Why not expound on the idea of mog houses?

Why not make gardening even better? Crafts are now actual classes. Why doesn't the guys who level Botany have their own garden/greenhouse/etc? Why do NPC's sell produce like apples and rice- why don't the players grow those? Culinary peeps then can buy from players and suddenly you have a purpose to Botany that directly effects the player base. It also makes it more interesting than simply going out and /harvesting things all the time.

Why not retain the little cut scenes FFXI had when activating quests but actually tell you where to go, unlike in FFXI?

Better yet, why not finally allow us to see food stats? People have been asking for that for years in FFXI.

Oh- also, they did add chocobo breeding in FFXI but it was pretty lame. Why not make that a craft or a subcraft. Why not have players breed chocobos and sell them from player to player. Suddenly you have an economy, a purpose other than growing your own chicken.

I mean, Uldah should have a casino and chocobo racing where the breeders actually matter.

That's just the tip of the iceberg! I haven't even said anything about the races yet!

What does SE do instead? They decide to copy WoW in the worst way possible. This game barely had any of the FF flavor and reading what Yoshida-san had to say just stripped any FF taste/feel it had or was going to get.

So I dunno Jenn, maybe SE will see the error of their ways with this? I highly doubt it. Regardless of how people feel about FFXI at least the players weren't embarrassed to say they played the game. In my opinion FFXI was a far better game with all of its faults and I say this having played WoW for several years.

But I'm glad you said that people are tired of WoW clones.

so who in this thread is for non global servers? no one, heh? ;)

yoshida think of it ;D

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Originally Posted by Aion

basically on 1.20,when the bill goes live ,we will get better player(party?) search and search item in wards?

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nope because 10 people will be playing.

This is a great post by Yoshi. I must admit, he is probably one of the best producers when it comes to explaining what he is doing, where the game is going, and everything else. In fact, even the western devs currently making the hyped mmos could learn a lot from how Yoshi is handling the additions / evolution of this game and more importantly relaying that information to customers.

With that said this gives me confirmation on a lot of issues I hoped would be dealt with. I think it's interesting that he stated almost the exact things I had stated in other threads : A way to efficiently use the economy, and a way to efficiently connect you with other players wanting to do the same thing is critical to an MMO in this day and age. And the fact that he has committed to these revisions before 1.20 comes out, is enough to secure at least a 1 month sub from me.

I just hope they can have a marketing blitz big enough to get peoples attention to play the game again, once it is worth playing.

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Originally Posted by Alerith

Using successful MMO mechanics does not a WoW clone make.

That's like saying WoW is a clone of it's predecessors because it uses an EXP system, or damage indicators, or special skills.

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Also this. People complaining about this becoming a "wow clone" are just silly. If making the ui more moddable, and making connecting with other players easier makes the game a "wow clone" then I guess every MMO to come out in the future will be a "wow clone."

Take a good hard look at the game. There is almost no parallels to WoW as it is right now. Implementing things like player finders or auction houses doesn't make it a WoW or FFXI clone. If it did, then the reliance on shouting in ul'dah to find groups would make this an EQ clone, and we all know people were tired of that game a decade ago.

This game is its own. Just as a reference, go play the free trial of wow, then come back to FFXIV. If you honestly think that XIV couldn't use some of the things existing in WoW, such as the responsive combat, useful and clean ui, and fluid economy, then I don't know what to say. At the end of the day, even if XIV was as smooth as wow gameplay wise, it would never be a WoW clone. It is simply too different from the ground up.

"Re: WoW Clone?!?!!?"

When RIFT was in beta, I went to telarapedia's article on "stats" and could map them 1-to-1 to WoW stats. I then went to Telarapedia's articles on combat mechanics and side-by-side compared them to wowwiki's articles on the same mechanics. I then went to Telarapedia's ability lists and looked for abilities that didn't show up in WoW.

...Aside from the fact that I haven't been able to find a complete wiki for XIV to do this test, I don't think that I could make the case for it being a WoW-clone, mechanically, even if the UI ends up looking exactly the same.

If 2.0 is going to make it a WoW-clone, that would imply that right now, it's a WoW-clone with bad UI. I don't see anyone making that case.