Did Yoshi P messed up the relics Im trying to understand the meaning of this help me!

Asierid: They are copying almost every other MMORPG why not use something from FFXI? Is that too much to ask since you have influences and elements from every other MMORPG?

Considering this is a vertical progression, theme park MMO; and XI is horizontal and more open world...

Yes, actually.

Everything is relevant in XI. Relics were still used for quite some time due to the virtually nonexistent gear creep, so they had to stay as grindy as usual.

Relics here are pointless "relics" (ha) from 2.0. They serve no purpose now. Why keep it the same and not let any player experience the story? It's not like the relic is some sexy super weapon anymore like it was back in 2.x. This is just a case of pride getting in the way of common sense to me.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Asierid: They are copying almost every other MMORPG why not use something from FFXI? Is that too much to ask since you have influences and elements from every other MMORPG?

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But they are using stuff from FFXI already.

Besides the similar jobs, abilities, items, monsters, etc, Desynthesis is pretty much heavily based on FFXI's crafting.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Asierid: They are copying almost every other MMORPG why not use something from FFXI? Is that too much to ask since you have influences and elements from every other MMORPG?

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Let's be honest here.
From the sound of your posts you don't want them to copy "something" from FFXI.
You want everything form FFXI.

Assirra: I am honest. I'm fully aware FFXI in todays time its not possible. Gamers are more lazy and used to a non grind envoirment. I'm also not interested in FFXI cause i dont want to wait 6 hours for a party and have to fight HNMs pops and camping etc. You could still learn from other good things from FFXI like forcepopping bosses with items on world map? BCNM KSNM etc all these things could work with vertical progression too you know since it just requires having a good amount of pop items to enter a battlefield and get drops =) Since we can have any of that just leave the relic one whats the big deal?

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

You could still learn from other good things from FFXI like forcepopping bosses with items on world map?

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Oh, you mean kinda like treasure maps in FFXIV? ;)

All this FFXI nostalgia is inevitable I guess. People tend to latch on to the familiar and romanticize the past.

The Relic system in FFXI was a brutal grind fest that required LSs to use their membership as slave labour to advance a chosen few. I think that system is best left behind.

I'm eager to find out what SE has in mind for new relics and what leg-up current zeta holders will have in the new quest. I expect it will be a modest advantage.

As someone who got his Zeta post nerf:
I don't care.

Also it's not like they hand it to you. W/o the bonus window announcement due to a lack of people posting, nexus is as grindy and "hard" as it has ever been. Probably the most intense stage of the weapon now, since atma has been nerfed to hell and the books only cost a penny.
Also: I spend 3M gil POST NERF! on the Zeta crafting items alone.

It's an outdated item, most newcomers won't even bother with THAT kind of grind it for a simple projection skin. So it will remain a relatively rare sight. Esp once the new relic hits and is considered "the new hotness".

I don't think today's gamers would have the patience to even grind relics like they were in XI. I know I didn't. =D

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Originally Posted by Warlyx

Gjallarhorn? meh , Daurdabla let the brd put a 3rd song....

Aegis : magic dmg taken -25% at 75.... -50% at 99.

FFXIV ....u can change to DRK for magic mitigation :P

I hope relic this time is done right , because i hated the Novus stage...

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Right, which is why a "professional" bard needed both. The effects stacked. 99 Ghorn was +4 to all songs - the universal instrument. Dharp permitted 3 songs, 4 if maxed out, but with no bonuses. 99 Ghorn let the bard pretty much replace a red mage for party buffs since they could handle all the hastes to magic cap single handedly with /WHM and refresh up to an insane +13 MP/tick and provide supplemental healing. In my old static, we had WHM SCH BRD MNK THF PLD for our Seekers content (occasionally swapping out the SCH or a BLM, or a MNK or THF for something else.) I was the bard, and I used both 99 Ghorn and 90 Dharp for three very VERY potent songs.

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Originally Posted by DawnSolaria

Guess what: I grinded out my Veil of Wiyu Novus in mere THREE days!

Half of objective isnt the only thing they nerfed, I also got all the alexanderite I needed in mere TWO hours thanks to 2000/2000 poetics i saved up. Whats even more awesome is that I dont have to give a bull's feces on what materia i meld onto it.

Does this upset you OP? Does it?

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Had to login just to give this one a thumbs up! lol!

Aside from all the childish and personal attacks in this thread wich is already corny as it is. I stand firm with this opinion and ALOT of my FC and LS members do aswell.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Aside from all the childish and personal attacks in this thread wich is already corny as it is. I stand firm with this opinion and ALOT of my FC and LS members do aswell.

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I like this post. You don't dance around. It's very direct in conveying that you're not here for discussion, but rather to compel agreement.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Aside from all the childish and personal attacks in this thread wich is already corny as it is. I stand firm with this opinion and ALOT of my FC and LS members do aswell.

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Yeah but I don't, why should Dev listen to your bunch but not me?

Or it could just be the dev white knights all gathered at one place because they enjoy just getting handouts :)

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Or it could just be the dev white knights all gathered at one place because they enjoy just getting handouts :)

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You talk about childish and then use the terms white knights and handouts.

Pot kettle black

have a nice day.

It could also be all the people playing a game that's wrong for them gathered in the same spot.

Ie., your FC and LS.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Or it could just be the dev white knights all gathered at one place because they enjoy just getting handouts :)

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And your argument falls apart the moment you used White Knight. Basically states you don't have a good counter argument and lash out at those who don't side with your views.

Or it could be people who dislike this whole just because you pay for a subscription you are entititled to everything mentality

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Or it could be people who dislike this whole just because you pay for a subscription you are entititled to everything mentality

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Great point! Just because you pay for a subscription does not mean you are entitled to whatever imagined difficulty you want from it. Last I checked, there are many other games out there to choose from. You actually are allowed to play other games to satisfy that itch. I don't think FFXIV will be the jealous type, you are allowed to see other games.

I think that OP is forgetting the fact that FFXI had a level cap of 75 for 4 expansions that's right 4 expansions the level cap was 75 this Kent that the relics in FFXI had well over 10 years of usefulness.

This isn't the case here the level cap jumped from 50 to 60 the OP has forgot this very important fact.


For all we know there will be a quest or a grind sadly gawd I hate grinds I'm forced to go back just to help people clear crap for the first time I want something fun to do to get my best weapon. Wait I got off topic. A quest or sadly a grind gawd I hate grinds....... Dam. To get the zodiacs useful at 60.

This isnt an ffxi relic. Ffxi relics and mythics took YEARS to make. Let that sink in. Those weapons took most people longer to make than ARR has EXISTED.

That is why they were left as the top spot. Zeta in 14 are a pale withered shadow of that type of investment.

Stop comparing zeta to ffxi RMEs. Zeta can be done completely solo in a matter of weeks. Xi RMES (before they were, ironically, nerfed to be easier 5 to 7 years later) required epic amounts of resources, and large group fights to make. Those weapons deserved to be at the top because they took an astounding amount of work to complete.

You insult the XI experience by putting zeta on the same levels as relic/empy/empyream weapons at level 75.

You didn't earn a permanent spot in the sky with this paltry zeta quest. Stop using weapons requiring years of effort to obtain as a justification for the casual zeta to live on forever. Zeta are more like a str magian weapon. Good. Take some time but nothing like an rme.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Yet we got punished for dedicating time and putting money into it.

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You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

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pun·ish·ment
ˈpəniSHmənt/
the infliction or imposition of a penalty as retribution for an offense.

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I'm not sure that having the best available weapon in the game for a portion of time, together with a leg up on the equivalent item in the next expansion, can really be considered a penalty.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Instead of a new chapter it should have just continued to expand.

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If only they were going to do something that would give you an advantage on the 3.x relic if you'd finished the 2.x relic.

As a tank, I'm just waiting for my next relic upgrade. Since i190 is good enough for now I will concentrate my weekly tomes on gear. Imo.

Ibi: It is a punishment it teaches me to not bother with something right away cause i can still get it with putting in half the effort as the guy before. Look at how the relics are nerfed now. Everyone can get them for maybe 60% less time and about 90% less costs on the materia IV and on top of that the nerf on lights and alexandrite drop rates. You are telling me thats not a punishment? Alot of people here are refering stuff to cars and real life scenarios ok lets say me and you working the same job you work 8hours doing something for 1000 USD I work with alongside you but the manager comes in and says Skizz here is 1000USD while Iba has to be here for another 7h to get the 1000USD. That is fair in your book? For exact the same thing?

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Stuff

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Because comparing currency used to live on to an electronically generated pixel in a video game is fair. Right.

It is not a punishment. A punishment would be to have your weapon be of lesser value than those who had completed their weapon later. Your relic weapon is no different than some other guys relic weapon should you choose to slot the same stats. You are no further behind in the game today because some other guy decides to do his relic next week and be done the following few days. He is actually behind you because you have your weapon, and he does not.

Again, for the fifth time, Relic. Weapons. Are. Useless.

Who cares if you have one now. Even if it still took the same amount of time to complete, it would still be useless today. No one would really give a damn if you completed it because it is nothing but a glamour stick now and has no relevance to the content that is out right now. Course, then you'd complain that the "Relic you worked long and hard for deserves to be buffed!". But hey, that's a completely different story.

tl;dr: It's old. Get over it. This thread is stupid.

Okay, how about this.

How about you think that when we get new relic in 3.1, you think of it as Zeta being expanded? Will that make you sleep better through your nights? Because in a way it is... If people with Zeta get "consideration" for easier quest.

I don't think a great many people agree with you Skizzle.

However, your ignoring that the reason you want to get a relic earlier rather than leaving it till its nerfed is because when the nerfs come in the relic is already losing relevance in content. People who got Zeta's during 2.5 had the best weapon you could get for your class in the game right up till HW launched and even then the weapon was relevant till the high 50s.

People who do the weapon today aren't getting the same reward because the item doesn't have the same value anymore. Its value now is solely Glamour. Effectively not having any nerfs means that people would have to put in the same effort today to get less. That is compounded by the fact that many of the activities that were involved in getting a relic previously cant be done with the same level of reliable speed. Light farming is a perfect example. Where you could get instant queues for Garuda HM prior when it had bonus, you know have a 10 min wait most of the time.

Simply put your extra effort paid for you to be able to use your relic when it was a useful weapon. Its pretty basic reasoning.

You really need to accept this as a reality. There is clearly not enough people in the community incline to agree with you to convince SE they were wrong to do the nerfs.

look at all the crap people say here that expansions always reset progress. thats such bs guys. guess most only know wow and its ALWAYS LVL CAP RAISE crap addons. not all mmos did that.

the imo SOLE reason why relic couldnt continue was the LEVEL CAP RAISE. that is the nature of that crap. sadly. it has nothing do with disrespect. but if devs decide to go lazy route and raise max level for BASICLY NO REASON. they could have raised ilvls like now and it would be same endgame wise only without making old content completly faceroll and useless mostly.

so if you want to stop that from happing again say NO to level cap raises on the future of this game and maybe yoschi will get the message. sadly to many played wow and think thats normal while in fact is a lazy excuse for doing a reset which imo was not needed at all since endgame on heavensward is THE SAME AS BEFORE.

^As a Paladin main who had to stick with a single miserable 123123123 combo for about 2 years I'm just sitting here laughing at how you seem to think the level cap raise was unnecessary.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Look at how the relics are nerfed now.

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Look at how the relic are useless now, too :p
You were "rewarded" by having the top weapon for your job for several months (Or really close for the early stage), that's not a punishment.

But, if you want to compare it to real life, I suppose you'd like every one to still pay their PS3 games at full price even now that the console is outdated, because you had to when you bought them on day one years ago ?

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Originally Posted by Windklinge

look at all the crap people say here that expansions always reset progress. thats such bs guys. guess most only know wow and its ALWAYS LVL CAP RAISE crap addons. not all mmos did that.

the imo SOLE reason why relic couldnt continue was the LEVEL CAP RAISE. that is the nature of that crap. sadly. it has nothing do with disrespect. but if devs decide to go lazy route and raise max level for BASICLY NO REASON. they could have raised ilvls like now and it would be same endgame wise only without making old content completly faceroll and useless mostly.

so if you want to stop that from happing again say NO to level cap raises on the future of this game and maybe yoschi will get the message. sadly to many played wow and think thats normal while in fact is a lazy excuse for doing a reset which imo was not needed at all since endgame on heavensward is THE SAME AS BEFORE.

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They wanted to add new skills for us in 3.0, and they chose to give them to us as we progressed in level, kind of like how we earned skills through the entire game so far. I think the way they invalidated content was more due to their copy/ paste implementation of the endgame, where only the most recent content is relevant, making level 50 instances far less useful.

Were the relic quest to be continued, players that are just joining or returning would be required to finish their zeta relics in order to progress with the rest of us, which would be weeks of grinding the relic through various stages of irrelevancy, unlike players like myself that kept the relic current through the phases. This would happen regardless of whether the relic was level 50 i200 or level 60 i200. You'd still be sending players back to grind an old weapon that the developers stated long ago that they planned on wrapping up with the zeta stage and moving on to something new in Heavensward. Is the need to be ahead of a newer player really so strong? They will be grinding the same relic steps as the rest of us, and if you plan on dedicating time to finish the new relic, chances are you'll have it before the average player regardless.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Ibi: It is a punishment it teaches me to not bother with something right away cause i can still get it with putting in half the effort as the guy before.

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Okay, so you're incorrectly using the word punishment to try to make your point. Got it.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Look at how the relics are nerfed now. Everyone can get them for maybe 60% less time and about 90% less costs on the materia IV and on top of that the nerf on lights and alexandrite drop rates. You are telling me thats not a punishment?

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Yes. Let's look at how they're nerfed now. Fully upgraded, they're only i135, and you can get better weapons from leveling dungeons or by getting a small number of Tomestones of Law.

People who get them now are putting all this effort in for just a piece of glamour equipment, where your efforts got you one of the best weapons in the game.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Alot of people here are refering stuff to cars and real life scenarios ok lets say me and you working the same job you work 8hours doing something for 1000 USD I work with alongside you but the manager comes in and says Skizz here is 1000USD while Iba has to be here for another 7h to get the 1000USD. That is fair in your book? For exact the same thing?

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This is not a good analogy. The $1000 you got for your hypothetical 8 hours is the same as the $1000 I'd get for my hypothetical 7 hours. Acquiring a Zeta in 3.0 is not equivalent to acquiring a Zeta in 2.5.

Let me give you a better analogy.

When the PS3 was first released in North America, in 2006, it cost $499. Currently, Google tells me I could buy one for $220-$250.

Does that mean that the people who bought it at its original price were "punished" for buying it when it first launched? Do you think that when the PS4 released all those people went "But the PS3 eventually got cheaper, so there's no way I'm buying a PS4 at its release price when it'll just be cheaper some day"?

Of course not. They got to play PS3 games when the console was the newest and shiniest one on the market, much like you got to use your Zeta when it was the strongest and shiniest weapon in the game.

Do you think that the people who are buying a PS3 now should have to pay the same price as the people who bought it at launch, so as not to "punish" the people who bought it at that price?

Of course not. There are newer consoles out now, so while they can still play all the same games as the people who bought it at launch (in the same way as people getting a Zeta now can still wield it or glamour it the same way as the people who got it when it was new), they're getting something that's not the current best available console (the same way as people getting a Zeta now could get a better weapon elsewhere).

In fact, let's adapt your analogy:

I do a week of work for a guy in 2006, and he says instead of paying me cash, he'll give me a new PS3. Knowing that he did that for me, if he makes you the same offer in 2015 (a week of work for a PS3), do you take him up on his offer?

I suspect you wouldn't.

What if, instead of a week, it's two days of work for a PS3? More likely.

What if, instead of a PS3 for a week, it's a PS4 for a week? Again, more likely.

Ibi: Thats when we use real life references wich we both know is complete bs. If we just focus on the game itself. There is really no point in making everything outdated at all.

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

Ibi: Thats when we use real life references wich we both know is complete bs.

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Weren't you the one that brought real life references" into this in your previous post, in an attempt to justify your position? Or is it only complete BS when it doesn't back up your point?

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Originally Posted by SkizzleofRagnarok

If we just focus on the game itself. There is really no point in making everything outdated at all.

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There is, but you've demonstrated pretty clearly at that you have no interest in dealing with facts or reality in any of your conversations.

I guess im kinda confused by this thread. Are people mad that they took the time on the old relic quest and now there is new gear involved?

Even if you did get an advantage... they would only hand out something that might cut off a 10th of the time to get something. Which is pretty immaterial considering that people pay to play this game because its a time sink.

I guess I don't understand why people are so angry at having to do a new quest for relic. It only makes sense considering the increase of new players because of the added content. The game has to please players new and old alike so putting a new player base at a distinct disadvantage would be commercially stupid.

/shrug its not gonna matter anyway... your gonna be one of the first in line to get a new relic no matter if you get some kind of advantage or not.

By Skizzles logic, he shouldn't have any relics as the i80 step was nerfed hugely from 1.22c to 2.0. It took the top raid groups in the game almost 4 months to complete the final stage to get the relic which became the i80 version in 2.0. It also required near flawless execution in all of the top tier trials and dungeons, on top of the ridiculously expensive and grindy aspects.

Skizzle just keeps making complaint threads about there being nothing to do without even clearing Bismarck EX or Alex Normal. Probably better just to ignore him now.

Not for one side or the other here but I think what SKIZZLE is getting at here is if the weapon is irrelevant now then they(newer players) "don't NEED" it right??? So why should everyone get to have it without putting the work in to achieve it. Not trying to speak for them but this is how I read it and somewhat agree. Just can't wait to see what they have us doing in 3.1...I am sure it will be expensive and I am sure it will take a ton of time...good bye doing other stuff for a while...LOL

Now that's not fair, NFaelivrin.

This thread is clearly a complaint that there WILL be something to do.

Like the thread says Did Yoshi P messed up the relics Im trying to understand the meaning of this help me!. We're trying to explain but all I hear is..

http://cdn2.content.compendiumblog.c...p_it_short.gif

Look, we can talk about this till the end of the world. They're not gonna change it. IT IS THE WAY IT IS. Don't like it? Too bad. Go play other game then or hope that they listen to you for new relic quest. (but looks like majority playerbase doesn't care so most likely SE won't listen.)

http://i.imgur.com/9zlOhAA.gif