Dear Square Enix - I want to Craft

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Originally Posted by Katlyna

I'm highly curious what fixes we are going to get in 3.07 and if things will get better enough... been such a mess I'm pretty peeved at this point. Its taken them entirely too long to put in fixes.

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You just know the favors will only last 5 instead of 15 minutes and have the same exact drop rate.

But you guys said you didn't want to spend 11 hours doing it, now you only need 4!

now now .. you know crafting is *still* too powerful, some of the tweaks are to make it even less useful and more frustrating. As long as 1 raider somewhere thinks for just a moment that a crafted piece can be pentamelded with all grade 5 materia to better then the alex normal item, crafting is too strong!

So we'll have 1 minute favours, with a 50% chance (SE RNG of course!) of getting 1 pop from clearing an ephemeral node ...

more realistically: maybe they'll have something that's not akin to pulling teeth. I don't see them revising the system enough to be a good one though, just one that isn't supremely awful. And I don't see them realizing just how bad the path they have gone for crafting in general is. I expect a few more rounds of doubling down on the bad decisions.

I stopped reading stuff when I read "1.5m to cap red scrips last week, 600k this week"

What the hell
It cost me zero to cap it and its even faster since they increased the red scrips gains.

9 or 10x Aurum Regis Planisphere (had a star) worth 44 to 52 a pop. That was it for my week.
Had all materials already because I do gathering, retainer ventures and dragonskin maps (so many mats from those maps).

Of course the rest of the problem is using the red scrip tokens, I'm just hoarding mine until maybe one day Squenix stops being stupid about it and changes the system to something smart and fun instead.
Favors are dumb and completely unfun

Gathering all the materials yourself doesn't make them "free". It cost you time and the amount of gil you could have sold those items for. This is called opportunity cost, and it's very helpful to learn about as a crafter.

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Originally Posted by Shadowsun

I stopped reading stuff when I read "1.5m to cap red scrips last week, 600k this week"
What the hell
It cost me zero to cap it and its even faster since they increased the red scrips gains.n

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Different servers, different prices =-). And week one it was around 1-2million for people on our server to cap. Pretty nuts huh?

We'll see the changes they implement on Tuesday, they will probably unbalance the Favor Node mats and make the prices tank as a consequence. I wonder what new recipes they are releasing, I'm so bored with gathering lately.

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Originally Posted by Jade-Nephrite

We'll see the changes they implement on Tuesday, they will probably unbalance the Favor Node mats and make the prices tank as a consequence. I wonder what new recipes they are releasing, I'm so bored with gathering lately.

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Probably won't be until Thursday along with the scrip reset

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

Probably won't be until Thursday along with the scrip reset

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3.07 Is Monday Night. Favors are a separate entity compared to scrips so there is little chance they would wait till Thursday to update Favors.

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

You just know the favors will only last 5 instead of 15 minutes and have the same exact drop rate.

But you guys said you didn't want to spend 11 hours doing it, now you only need 4!

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I'm half a wizard. Lol 5 minutes will have even worse RNG than before. Get your arthritis pills ready cause it's time to click click click.

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Originally Posted by Hanmerreborn

I'm half a wizard. Lol 5 minutes will have even worse RNG than before. Get your arthritis pills ready cause it's time to click click click.

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I love the new favors. Been click click clicking all morning. Stop whining.

They should drop the gear requirement maybe as well. I have my hands full just getting mats to my crafter friend. In order to help him out, I can't get my gear upgrades very quickly though, so I might be sol when the higher grade mats come out that will require the higher Gath/Perc. Also, even with the reduction to 5min for favors, I still feel like I am not even every able to play my bard with all the materials that need to be gathered. It's just too time consuming either way. I wish they would make the less wanted gear pieces you get with red scripts, blue scripts instead. Working full-time, I want to do my Botany stuff to the fullest, but I also want to play my Bard more too xD

All SE needs to do to fix 80% of the DOL/DOH problems is substantially increase the weekly cap for Red craft/gath scripts to 1K or so. That's enough where we'd more flexibility every week. I.E. get a piece of i180 gear, buy and farm a few stacks of favor AND craft i170 gear to use or sell. Right now its basically buy a i180 piece, farm a couple favors and you're done til reset. For me that's like two days...then waiting for 5 to repeat...NOT fun.

The no DOL armor is the other 20%. Does it suck? Yes, but at least i'm making decent gil on gatherer materia :) SB to 100%, convert, sell, craft another, repeat.

They never listen. Don't know why we waste our breath posting. When its about something game breaking they don't care. Message about a minion or a spelling mistake and you get a reply. I'm leaving this game. Wanna ignore me after weeks and weeks of reporting problems. Fine. But I'm not paying for the game anymore. Its not worth its fee with crafting in such a mess.

I wouldn't they they don't listen, they just a bit slow.

And I fully agree with the OP. I would like to start crafting proper lvl60 2 stars gear BUT the colossal amount gathering and limited is stopping me. I don't remember being like this when we started with artisan gear at all. You only needed to do ixali quest to get the key mat but no wait for weeks and weeks to craft a piece.

And at the same time I cannot gear my character with red scrip gear cause if I want to craft the ilvl170 one I will have to use the red scrips envelopes so I either do one or the other. It just doesn't feel right.

The solution imo will be:

Mats that you need for top gear need to be totally separated from red scrips. Get them from somewhere else.

I nearly got all my 180 set for BSM from red scrips. But I cannot make or start selling anything because it's a right hustle getting the mats for everything else. I feel the whole thing a bit broken.

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Originally Posted by Mature

I feel the whole thing a bit broken.

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It basically is, especially in regard to the DoW/M gear. While some of the other materials have been selling on my server, none of the spring water (or whatever it's called) necessary for the Grade 2 Dissolvents is being sold, which is yet another limit on the gear actually being produced. No one without ALC at 2-star level themselves or a geared ALC friend will have any means to make the gear. It's made worse when you consider that most folks will be spending scrips to gear at least three classes, which means we're still some time before a steady supply of materials makes its way into the economy. (Most serious crafters will gear more than three classes, too).

The whole system is a mess.

I want to craft too. I want to gear up all the crafting jobs. even if I can only master 3 which im ok with. however crafting 1 item a week getting the hq mats or maybe 3 a week if I stick to the nq is rubbish. I might be ok with this if they took out the token requirement when trading for purified coke or odourless animal fat. I don't want to choose between crafted items and traded items I want to do both.dow/m have esoteric items alexander items and savage to gear up with. they can do all three in a week. whereas we can either craft 1-3 pieces in a week no retry if you don't get desired result(in alex you just pass on items you don't want) OR get I piece of tome gear (extreme example but mh tools take 3 weeks to get) so I cant get crafted gear. the itms I need sell on ah for around 600k each meaning itll take 9 million gil to even go that route. I don't have 9 millon gil. itd take me a week to make that which I could be using to cap tomes ect. im giving up on crafting. im gonna stick to gathering. sell favour items for ridiculous amounts(instead of gearing up my miner) and maybe come back to crafting if they fix it. but after all the complaints about it so far cant see it happening :(

I feel sometimes that they did this in purpose so they make crafting more relevant in the long run. Cause kinda they must of known how long as how many pieces can be done a week.

Tbh I would of been ok if all gear was shared between classes a bit like artisan

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Originally Posted by Mature

I feel sometimes that they did this in purpose so they make crafting more relevant in the long run. Cause kinda they must of known how long as how many pieces can be done a week.

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I don't really see how crafting's going to be relevant in the long term if we don't have any relevant recipes to make, though. At this point, we're probably going to be waiting until 3.2 (which probably won't be for another 4 to 5 months) before there's any hope of having relevant stuff, unless they come out of left field and give is i190 crafted gear in 3.1 and heavily increase the availability of materials for 2-star crafts.

OP's issues were the exact same issues I had on the release of the Red Scrips system and while it was implemented poorly and took far too long to tweak the recent change to Favors was a breath of fresh air and has had a HUGE impact on my own crafting progression. Where my previous average was anywhere from 1-3 items per Favor (Let's be honest, usually 2) my new average is at least 3, usually 4 per Favor.

Immediately following the change to Favors I crafted 3 OHs and all 8 MHs that week. I spent 7 hours Saturday gathering 330 items to craft my last 5 MHs (Yes I bought some, I was tired, cut me some slack) and I didn't even mind since I KNEW it would have taken me 4x as long previously.

I'm disappointed that I still have to do the thing I hate (Gathering) to do the thing I love (Crafting) but I'm hopeful that it will no longer feel like a full time job and I can see some progression each week.

What I dont understand is why people focus on making the MHs when the OHs provide a far greater stats upgrade..and require less materials.

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Originally Posted by AnimaS

Understand what SE did? I've mentioned it several times but fundamentally they took ALL that collected time gearing, regearing, turning in for master books AND RESET IT so they didn't have to develop any recipes (which is why you have 20 people selling the same gear now, since there is virtually no way to profit on this stuff anymore.) They took *all* gather/craft progression and RESET

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Of course they reset it. New expansion= more levels and gear to grind out. You didn't expect your ARR gear and stats to be OP in a new expansion did you? How boring would that be? You have a head start on noobs and people that didn't level/gear crafting or gathering but you need to essentially start from scratch. Just like battle gear. Yeah it's good for a bit but sooner or later you have to say bye bye to that dreadwyrm gear you fought so hard to get and replace it with a green lol

The reset was fine... its the broken economy and lack of any functional use of the current crafting and gathering gear. Its just terrible. Things could be corrected economically with another crafting patch which provides interesting adventuring, glamour and other items which are fun, have worth and require the current red scrip gear. But leaving us in this state for three months or more is insulting.

After blowing up both of my 2 attempts at 2* DoL offhands because of horrible Hasty runs + Reclaim failures, I can confidently say that I'm done with this Kafka sideshow until such time as when it's fixed.

I was 6/8 Lucis and wearing full self-crafted Artisan pre-3.0. May not have been one of the handful of elites on my server, but I was in the upper tier. I don't care about making gil, I just care about self-sufficiency, helping friends with requests, and being able to experiment with challenging crafting propositions.

The system was billed on making crafting more casual, but it's done the opposite--it's widened the gap between casuals and hardcores. Casual omnicrafters like myself are getting discouraged, while the Scrips are doing little to nothing to hamper the hardcore omnis who have the gil to buy out DoL mules for Favor mats. Casual omnis act as brake pedals on the prices of things because we're doing it more for the love of the craft than looking seriously at margins. How are nearly empty markets without competition healthy for the game's economy?

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Originally Posted by Lobotomite

The system was billed on making crafting more casual, but it's done the opposite--it's widened the gap between casuals and hardcores. Casual omnicrafters like myself are getting discouraged, while the Scrips are doing little to nothing to hamper the hardcore omnis who have the gil to buy out DoL mules for Favor mats. Casual omnis act as brake pedals on the prices of things because we're doing it more for the love of the craft than looking seriously at margins. How are nearly empty markets without competition healthy for the game's economy?

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I concur with you 100%. It just sucks. All I can tell my casual linkshell members is to level their DoH to 60, and either sell favors, or use them. They have to gather them all to have any chance to function.

Dear Katlyna & fellow crafters, do some of you still remember the glorious days when we grind (crafting grind) Builder title and then crafted HQ 2 star 40 durab items with only the original lvl 50 class quest mainhands?
How about the Patch 2.2 grind (crafting grind) we did to obtain Artisan mainhands? Then we took on the crafting of 3 star i90 battle gear with only a single Artisan mainhand, one i90 set after another, and raiders come to seek us for those i90 one after another?
After that, we took on those 3.5 star HQ turn-in items for Master Recipe II with a single Supra Tool that was only 10 Craftsmanship & 5 Control higher than the Artisan mainhand while we were still using i55 Militia offhands. Do you remember that grind (crafting grind)?
(this post too long, have to break into 2)

Then we crafted our own 3 star Artisan offhands, and took on freaking 4 star challenges while we were still wearing our old school i55 AF gear... haha! And then once again, raiders come seek us one after another for 4 star i110 gear for their powers and glamor.

Damn, those were glorious days that we can only look back right now...

Right now, we grind hard (mostly gathering grind) each week for some i170 / i180, and not sure exactly why we're doing it... feeling so lonely making Deep-fried Okeanis Collectables (without the glorious HQ hand-gesture) with 2 macro buttons, then dumping into NPCs... nobody come contact us for anything except Thavnarian Bustier or Hive Barding! LOL! So many skilled hands now idle at Idleshire... wasted talents.

I hated the Lucis grind, but zomg getting to make gear for adventures and raiders and having a line of people every day I logged in was awesome. Our FC market board was super busy with people having fun, making things, trading stuff etc. And the economy was just hopping. Tons of other people asking questions, making gear, making money. I really miss when crafting was like that!

PS Camie: After posting you can edit your post to any length!

IMO, the Lucis grind was the best part of 2.x crafting progression. It was almost a pure timesink and (unlike Supra) could be done cheaply by casuals. The quality requirement was high enough to be reasonably challenging, and it forced you to learn how to properly juggle Manipulation and track your remaining CP on the fly so that you had enough left over to ensure that you could both hit Byregot and finish the craft. Bad run of Hasties got you down? You could just finish the craft and turn in the SQ for your token mats back minus the crystals and common mat.

And once you were done, there was a clear stat boost over Supra which simplified 4* crafting, and you got a giant tool that you could dye any color you wanted. What wasn't to love?

I liked the Lucis stage as well, to be honest. Supra wasn't enough of an upgrade at the time to feel worth the effort, and while Lucis didn't really benefit you in a direct way, it had nice perks (easier 4-stars and the unique appearance/dyes).

The only reason I didn't like the Lucis much was because was because I did all 8... but I concur the design wasn't bad since cost was low and casuals could attempt them. When I say I hated the Lucis grind I literally mean I hated making all 8 that was just silly of me.

the only part I hate about the Lucis grind was
all.
of.
those.
moonstones.

I was one of the people who turned in militia chokers for grand company seals to get my moonstones because I didn't feel like playing the map gamble game or waiting for ixali dailies. I did, however, get all of my Lucis tools about 3 weeks after it was released ;)
Those were good times ...

Those moonstones.... zomg so many leather hats made and handed in!!!

Yep moonstones were my issue too. The amount of seals I had to get on a daily basis was mental.

Other thing I had in mind to help craft 2 star lvl60 more accessible is to , instead of weekly red scrip reset make it daily a bit like ixali tribes for ehcanti (artisan gear) and make the mb more active.

Just a thought.

I dont mind red scrips honestly, the gating doesnt bother me since theres alot of people selling their tokens for gil. What kills me is favors, they are really really just not fun. I shouldnt have to hit nodes for 2 hours to craft 1 chest piece and youre not even doing anything special, just hitting nodes that have worthless materials in them ad nauseua.

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Originally Posted by Pentt

I dont mind red scrips honestly, the gating doesnt bother me since theres alot of people selling their tokens for gil. What kills me is favors, they are really really just not fun. I shouldnt have to hit nodes for 2 hours to craft 1 chest piece and youre not even doing anything special, just hitting nodes that have worthless materials in them ad nauseua.

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This favor thing is far worse than when we were grinding desyn for Mastercraft for Supra... Back then, we were already unhappy about relying RNG for it. Right now, not only it's RNG, but it's actually GATHERING as well... My wrist hurts from constantly clicking the nodes for hours, really... :mad:

Some of us have given up on favors, and just plain waiting until the price of favor mat drops on MB, then massively buy. What this means is, many crafters are gonna be taking "breaks" from the game, and just maxing out red scrips per week to keep up. And what that means is, many crafters are not actually playing the crafting game - maxing red scrips has very little to do with crafting... it's just macro crafting and gathering.

The game is kind of entering a recession at the moment until something is changed...

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Originally Posted by Caimie_Tsukino

And what that means is, many crafters are not actually playing the crafting game - maxing red scrips has very little to do with crafting... it's just macro crafting and gathering.

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I craft less now than I ever have. I cap scrips every week (which takes maybe 30 minutes since I don't gather the mats personally), and then I occasionally put some items up on the MB (all of which are ARR things, as the margins are so much better for them on my server, even if they sell more slowly).

It's really sad. I miss crafting progression and feeling like the end result of the progression mattered. I'm not actually gaining anything by progressing now. Just gear that I can't really use to make anything I couldn't before (at least, not anything that will actually serve a real purpose).

I would like to share something really tiny about my situation about crafting with red scrips.

Today I'm gonna finish work in about 3 hours. I'm gonna get home turn the game on check my sales and I'm gonna carry on gathering the likes of aurum ore sun mica etc. saved them until Thursday so I can craft 2 star stuff.

I find this really depressing that I have to wait to craft. We shouldn't be waiting to craft something we should be on a roll crafting all day long.I cannot go and buy the mats from MB because the price is astronomically high or there's hardly any for sale.

THIS needs fixing. When Artisan gear came in, ehcanti stuff was a bit more flexible to get.You get some per day then off to MB to buy them.The price for them was reasonable as there was a flow on quantities to sell everyday. In red scrip case there's none. You craft, spend your tokens and basically you stuck for a week. this should not be the case.

Gathering for a week to craft for a day don't seem right

Nope it does not. Its absolute utter garbage if you ask me =-/