Bards need a buff

No... no we really don't. Don't get me wrong, I would love a buff. But Bards are a multi-use class, and if we get a damage buff, we will be pretty broken.

Lets all be serious here, the main problem is our limit break...change thay and we will be happy... give us a limit break like zeldas light arrow from brawl lol. A ranged final heaven, something to not go, "2 brd in a dungeon, lol limit break!" Other than that as a main brd with multiple t9 clears, I'm not to disappointed overall with the kit. Maybe make mantra 20% for us since we are support class or even a regen song >>.

I don't propose myself to be experienced enough to seriously claim to know what changes, if any, should happen to bards, but:

I'd be really happy - both as a bard and not-bard - if they'd remove the damage penalty on songs. Because then maybe other bards would actually fucking sing them once in a while.

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Originally Posted by XionAvalonArcadia

Lets all be serious here, the main problem is our limit break...change thay and we will be happy... give us a limit break like zeldas light arrow from brawl lol. A ranged final heaven, something to not go, "2 brd in a dungeon, lol limit break!" Other than that as a main brd with multiple t9 clears, I'm not to disappointed overall with the kit. Maybe make mantra 20% for us since we are support class or even a regen song >>.

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If they gave Bard that, it'd be *required* for it to be weaker than Meteor. Otherwise we run into the problem of lolBLM.

Party compositions would just be MNK/DRG/SMN/BRD if Bard's limit was akin to caster on the same strength level. But if it was weaker, then Bard's could have their dungeon limit break and casters would still be cool.

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Originally Posted by Eissels

I don't propose myself to be experienced enough to seriously claim to know what changes, if any, should happen to bards, but:

I'd be really happy - both as a bard and not-bard - if they'd remove the damage penalty on songs. Because then maybe other bards would actually fucking sing them once in a while.

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Foe's Req already does not have a damage penalty. Army's Paeon boosts your own TP regen, allowing more AoE which I feel would be pretty OP'd without the damage penalty. Same with Mage's Ballad since it increases your own regen as well, the uptime would be near unlimited. All in all, I don't feel that I feel that I'm behind in dps (though I am a filthy casual swine, I haven't touched anything beyond T5)

If anything, they should fix how the skill graphics (especially rain of death, misery's end and Wide volley) abruptly disappear if you use another skill during it's animation/graphic.

I would love it they just up Heavy shot or Bloodletter's dmg to 170 potency. That way it just a constant 170 potency after the intial burst and dot appliance instead of 150. Or decreasing the cooldown timer on Raging strike from 120 seconds to 90 seconds with the trait. And most of all, Have repelling shot get rid of heavy!

but if not meh, I still sometime get 2nd or 3rd on a parse according to pple.

90% of the people wanting buffs are bards and 90% of the people saying bards are fine don't play it lol.

Question does anyone run 2 bards in 2nd coil, without a drg?

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Originally Posted by NyssaElf

Question does anyone run 2 bards in 2nd coil, without a drg?

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Ive known groups that did that and have downed T9

Basically one bard is a Peon/Ballad whore, and the other has up Foes 24/7

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Originally Posted by Sen_Terrechant

Ive known groups that did that and have downed T9

Basically one bard is a Peon/Ballad whore, and the other has up Foes 24/7

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Lol poor song whore bard, that's no fun. They didn't have a drg though right?

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Originally Posted by Crazypluto

90% of the people wanting buffs are bards and 90% of the people saying bards are fine don't play it lol.

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100% of those statistics came out of your ass.

BRDs are fine as is. Any adjustments SE sees fit for BRDs are fixes, not buffs.

BRDs are support players first and foremost, hence why I believe our LB is great as is. I'd rather risk a death doing the LB than for the healer to stop healing and possibly die from the LB animation.

BRDs dps is fine as is as well. We are mobile and as such we don't rely on remaining still or flanking the boss as casters and melee do. True, although we do have consistant damage that is lower than the other dps roles, our burst damage makes up for it and a good BRD knows when to save their cooldowns for certain mechanics. Every dps sacrifices something for their specialty, it's just that some people have yet to see what us BRDs have attaibed in exchange for our lower dps.

Bards are meant to be a support class but they really aren't. With a good group, you will almost never sing anything but foe.

Let's start off with facts. There are currently 3 roles in FFXIV:ARR, damage dealers, healers, and tanks. Although a lot of people want to claim that Bards are a support class, it does not fall into that category because it doesn't exist. Bards first and foremost with this game's current design has them under the damage dealer role. Now with that in mind, the fights are most likely designed with the thinking that not every group will have a Bard. This means that the fights can be cleared without Bard songs. Yes the songs are a very powerful utility but I highly doubt its 100% necessary.

So with that stated, why is it so wrong to ask for a small buff that can at least let us be able to compete with the other DD jobs. For example removing the 20% damage reduction from songs would be incredible. Another would be changing Rain of Arrows, putting a debuff that increases range damage taken, but also leaving the high TP cost.

Bards won't ever be able to reach those high numbers that Monks, Dragoons, Summoners, and Black Mages can reach but that's fine. Remember that those classes are only able to hit those ridiculously high numbers because they are enabled to do so. Whether it be allowing them to ignore certain mechanics and placing that responsibility on someone else, or having the Bard sing Mage's, Paeon, or Foe's to increase their output.

BRDs already compete with other roles. While they operate at a lower sustained DPS level, they remain almost unaffected by mechanics in battles that lead to off time for other DPS. Shortly, they have the most on-target time. For many fights, this can lead to them being highly competitive if not top.

Like any other DPS job, though, there are also fights where BRDs arent particularly good: fighrs where there aren't very many mechanics that force offtime for melee or movement for BLMs. Eve then, BRDs are desired for their songs as a recovery tool.

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Originally Posted by NoctisUmbra

BRDs already compete with other roles. While they operate at a lower sustained DPS level, they remain almost unaffected by mechanics in battles that lead to off time for other DPS. Shortly, they have the most on-target time. For many fights, this can lead to them being highly competitive if not top.

Like any other DPS job, though, there are also fights where BRDs arent particularly good: fighrs where there aren't very many mechanics that force offtime for melee or movement for BLMs. Eve then, BRDs are desired for their songs as a recovery tool.

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That's a lie. There's no fight in the game bard isn't good at.

Bard's dps isn't that much lower and in most cases, it's higher, because the melee aren't that good. It's not uncommon to see bard being near the top in coil 2 runs.

I rarely see exceptional melees that can outclass me. I do see them but they're few and far in between.

Maybe start with that when you use an attack, it will root you in place and when you start moving, it will cancel the action, that will be a very good buff for those who thinks Brd does need a buff....Then we will talk more...

Can be cast while moving, unaffected by direction, and always has 100% up-time damage, less affected by any mechanic out there, cheesy mode with no rotation, off CD, pop, and spam shot, what else would you guys want? Maybe give us, the caster DPS not have our cast interrupted while moving one even the mobs move out if the way itself mid-cast, then we will come to an agreement that either caster DPS should be lower or Brd DPS should be brought up...

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

That's a lie. There's no fight in the game bard isn't good at.

Bard's dps isn't that much lower and in most cases, it's higher, because the melee aren't that good. It's not uncommon to see bard being near the top in coil 2 runs.

I rarely see exceptional melees that can outclass me. I do see them but they're few and far in between.

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I'm not disagreeing here, I know BRD dps can be quite high in content. I was elaborating on just that.

If, however, you are doing top dps as a BRD in basically anything, you're either playing with melee that are severely below you in gear, or just bad, like you suggest.

When I do comparisons, I assume even skill. Content like Turn 8 for example is built for MNK.

So, yes, there exists content where BRD may not be able to hit as high dps values as some other jobs, but unlike other jobs that's rarwlynif ever due to BRD being bad at the fight, but rather a more risky or effective dps job being less obstructed by it.

BRD basically does the same run and gun in any fight, for the most part.

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Originally Posted by LunarEmerald

That's a lie. There's no fight in the game bard isn't good at.

Bard's dps isn't that much lower and in most cases, it's higher, because the melee aren't that good. It's not uncommon to see bard being near the top in coil 2 runs.

I rarely see exceptional melees that can outclass me. I do see them but they're few and far in between.

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Well... I'm terrible at T7, this fight is a nightmare. I use only the threat meter as a reference and I'm always 8th on Melusine. (2nd till the first Renaud though)
Most of the time I am above Melee, but when it comes to mages (both SMN and BLM) I just can't compete with them.

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Originally Posted by Hippo

Stop whining, bards!

Pros
1) 1st DD slot that raid leaders fill
2) cannot be replaced any non-bard DD
3) takes least skill to play
4) takes least skill to play well
5) least expectation to deal any real DD
6) Yoshi P (Wandering Minstrel) 's job in FFXIV
7) highest average DPS - across diff types of fights (dummy type, high movement type, single mob, multi-mob, new raids, farm raids)

Cons
1) lowest Dps in dummy fights (but see pro #5)
2) most boring to play
3) useless LB
4) AF look bad on male character
5) sissy type of job

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Hey! Don't mock the manly high heels!

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Originally Posted by Necato

Well... I'm terrible at T7, this fight is a nightmare. I use only the threat meter as a reference and I'm always 8th on Melusine. (2nd till the first Renaud though)
Most of the time I am above Melee, but when it comes to mages (both SMN and BLM) I just can't compete with them.

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Threat meter is a horrible way of gauging DPS. And if you are the kiter in your group, that would totally explain your low threat on Melusine.

Btw. if you are above the Melee most of the time and your melee are even less able to compete with your mages than you are, then your melees are doing something wrong.

I always laugh when archers complain about their DPS. Have you ran ST? 10/15 dps characters will be bards, obviously the problems aren't bad enough to stop every generic dps player from running directly to the archer class.

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