FFXIV: The 1 Job at 50 Monday night raiding 8 man FC game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by C-croft

True, but the arguement forever behind is silly and grasping at straws. Sticking to more solid arguments would be best. Or else this thread becomes another one of those.

---

Straws? Read the OP.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Azurus

So I am locked in to being a healer, until such time as someone else gets all ilvl 90 and switches to whitemage, and not being able to help my friend because of lock outs. Ive resorted to making an alt to be able to raid with my friend....in a game that boats a system where you can play any jobs on one character...this is where the system bothers me, I want to play with everyone :/

edit:

Ya your full of it im sorry. your FC has ways to bypass lockouts and a myth cap? Its not just about getting all our jobs in darklight, thats easy we do that already, so woopdiedoo for your FC i guess? The point is you cant play this content with any more then 7 other people currently. And god forbid you want to play through coil from a different point of view. Unless you are lucky and have someone else willing to take over the role you want to give up you are out of luck in your static. Also none of what you said changes the fact that a new player today will not be twintania ready to play with people grinding it now no matter how hard they play. I will concede though the raised myth cap may help this a little bit.

---

Silly coil static requirements. Full iLvl 90 WHM onry. Why bother going into coil as a full ilvl 90 WHM except for the weapon? Why must you always run a static? Why not just run with your FC mates, as an FC. Coil doesn't mean you are forever locked into a static. Take someone from the FC and fill in gaps. Recruit more coil players and ask that they also pickup newer players who just got ready for coil. The argument that coil lockouts and loot locks hurts new players is silly. If you really are concerned about new players, sit out for a week, or start a second group in your FC for a coil run. In your specific case, that will be harder, since you are the only healer, but who is to say you can't recruit a new healer into the FC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Mayin

If you removed lockout then the same players would just be crying in a week that they have all the best gear in the game and they have nothing to do.

---

Honestly, it's getting tiresome seeing people reply with this statement on a new topic EVERY DAY. Shouldn't you be leveling up your crafts or something? Go out to a bar every so often. Hang out with your friends, clean your room, get a good nights sleep. Play any new MMORPG and post about how there are people completing all the content in one week after they speed though it. Plenty of things you can be doing.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

Straws? Read the OP.

---

I did and it says that you don't even want to log in on Mondays anymore for the past few weeks. Everything else is yet anotherrehash of another rehashed topic. I do not think all of your points are invalid and I see the lockout as the annoying timesink it is. It's just the posts saying that new players are perpetually behind. People could have been cutting edge and got most myth gear and no coil gear, and the new player could have come in geared up in coil due to lucky RNG. Your entire post has very valid points. However, new players ability to get coil gear and myth does not leave them perpetually behind is all. Many posts use new players as an argument, but in reality it's is just a grasp to 'win a point' in their favor. New players are not hindered to gear iLvl 90 due to time. It is due to their inability to progress in coil, whether that's gear, skill, or community. All of which can be attained without a lockout of any kind prior to entry into coil.

EDIT: Post lock. Sadface. Yet another ludicrous lockout.

>Someone asks for less restrictions on their ability to play content - esp. so they can help others play that content and so that they can enjoy more of their game time with this particular game.


>Forum erupts into "You rushed!" "Lock outs are good!" "What's stopping people getting everything and quitting the game!" "Content Locust!" cite "You'll get bored and quit the game." as rational to someone who is already bored and ready to quit the game because the game does not let them play it's content at their leisure or for pleasure. 8/8 Static one clear per week cap is 300 - log out be done <- how fun and casual and inclusive does this sound to you?
>Person quits because they're only able to do the content they enjoy for >3 hours each week and unable to assist friends/other players.

>Forum enjoys being blocked from content rather than doing content, does not believe in helping other players outside of established statics, does not believe the game (which encourages having multiple classes) should allow players to progress multiple classes at the same tier of gear at end-game.

Although I hated ground hnm's in ffxi, this was a time sync that kept people who complained about not enough content, content. I don't want to see them return, but they need to give the player base something more to do. I myself do the same thing of log in monday, clear turn 1-4 tell myself I'll log in to farm WP's sometime during the week, and then never do. I'm ready for new content but I'm afraid it's going to be completed in less than a month, then we'll be back to the same thing we are now.

Ok, here's the thing.

The lockouts are a temporary and artificial way to gate progress and extend content.

Yeah, they suck, and I understand why you're frustrated.

However, if the lockouts weren't there, most of you wouldn't even be logging in on Monday's anymore. You'd have gathered all of the gear you wanted and ditched the game until the next patch.

It's temporary. It sucks, but it's their artificial way of extending the 'content' until they have time to build up a decent amount of real content.

Really? Come on. Working on my last job now, haven't even been to coil yet. How can you say that you can only gear 1 job per patch? I'm working on my sixth relic, all my relic'd jobs are just about geared for coil (barring some dl accessories I've yet to get), yet people continue to say you can only 'gear 1 job'.

Do you not know how to play? Are you just saying this to troll? Or do you really think all your jobs should be allowed to have full i90 gear in a few weeks? Sad either way. Very.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TrystWildkey

Ok, here's the thing.

The lockouts are a temporary and artificial way to gate progress and extend content.

Yeah, they suck, and I understand why you're frustrated.

However, if the lockouts weren't there, most of you wouldn't even be logging in on Monday's anymore. You'd have gathered all of the gear you wanted and ditched the game until the next patch.

It's temporary. It sucks, but it's their artificial way of extending the 'content' until they have time to build up a decent amount of real content.

---

If there was no lockout, I would be logging in still to help people who didn't rush it in the first month.

In the scenario where there is a lockout, I play Monday's and not at all for Tuesday-Sunday.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TrystWildkey

Ok, here's the thing.

The lockouts are a temporary and artificial way to gate progress and extend content.

Yeah, they suck, and I understand why you're frustrated.

However, if the lockouts weren't there, most of you wouldn't even be logging in on Monday's anymore. You'd have gathered all of the gear you wanted and ditched the game until the next patch.

It's temporary. It sucks, but it's their artificial way of extending the 'content' until they have time to build up a decent amount of real content.

---

Not quite so with a gear lockout. But let's be honest, SE is simply not capable of creating a gear-locked loot system that would work with coil such that you can't just spam turn 1 over and over until you get what you want.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

If there was no lockout, I would be logging in still to help people who didn't rush it in the first month.

In the scenario where there is a lockout, I play Monday's and not at all for Tuesday-Sunday.

---

You can still help people, just not in coil right now.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TeaTimeBear

You can still help people, just not in coil right now.

---

B-b-but I don't get a chance to gear my classes out in BiS gear then!!!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TrystWildkey

However, if the lockouts weren't there, most of you wouldn't even be logging in on Monday's anymore. You'd have gathered all of the gear you wanted and ditched the game until the next patch.

---

Or I could be, you know, gearing up other jobs, since we have this whole "armoury system" thing that's supposed to allow us to play multiple jobs on one character and all. Please don't presume to tell me what I would or should do with my time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by permbanned

Not quite so with a gear lockout. But let's be honest, SE is simply not capable of creating a gear-locked loot system that would work with coil such that you can't just spam turn 1 over and over until you get what you want.

---

Who cares if people do?

Does it really break FFXIV if people have a bunch of jobs in Allagan instead of just one?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

I don't even want to log in aside from Monday's anymore. And it's been this way for several weeks.

---

While I agree with everything you said, the sad truth is that SE don't care that people find the game fun four days a week or one day a week, both types of people will pay for a whole month - And that what matters for SE in the end. ( - . - ;

I don't understand the argument that someone wants to help their guild, hence the desire to remove the lockouts, or else they stay behind. It means that if that person don't help then his FC won't ever make it into coil? Or he is the only one who can tank/heal/interrupt? Are the rest of his FC a bunch of unskilled people that can't organize themselves in a secondary FC group? Aren't there enough for two 8-men groups at least? Can't they PuG?

I read the same people who claim that they want being able to go for more coil also saying that wouldn't do other stuffs in game because there's nothing of their interest there (like CT, after getting their own loot). So, in the end they don't want to help anybody but themselves. Even being locked on Coil I still play on a daily basis. I help low lvl FC members with storyline and dungeons, I help other FC members with their relic quests, I run dungeons with them even after I've capped my tomes for the week. There are plenty things to do to help withr FC mates even with lockouts, like advising them with tactics. But, in the end it's all about personal needs. There's nothing to do with helping FC.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Edenholt

I don't understand the argument that someone wants to help their guild, hence the desire to remove the lockouts, or else they stay behind. It means that if that person don't help then his FC won't ever make it into coil? Or he is the only one who can tank/heal/interrupt? Are the rest of his FC a bunch of unskilled people that can't organize themselves in a secondary FC group? Aren't there enough for two 8-men groups at least? Can't they PuG?

---

It means that our FC of 20 people has 4 left over (8+8+4), and they get to pick up group Coil because the other 2 parties can't help or take them.

As I stated in the OP, if your FC isn't a multiple of 8, someone's getting alienated.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

Who cares if people do?

Does it really break FFXIV if people have a bunch of jobs in Allagan instead of just one?

---

No, it definitely doesn't. I'm on your side lol. I'd take any other system over a content lockout, whether it's a gear lockout or no lockout at all. This game is boring as ^#&%.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by C-croft

snip

---

My static IS all FC members already. How am i supposed to run 2 coil groups? So say i find someone else who wants to heal for coil? what if the dps in the group doesnt wanna drop? I just kicked myself out of my coil static. Why is it so wrong to want to run this content with multiple groups of people?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DurtiMonkeyToe

I mean... no... I don't agree with you at all. Your arguing for the short term over the long term. If the Coil didn't have a lock out, then yeah sure.... you would of course play more.... for a week. You would spam T1 over and over and over until you got the pieces you needed. Rinse repeat for T2. T4. Ect. You would do it enough to get yourself and your FC all the gear you wanted and then you would be done, with nothing to do. That is the truth of the matter. Changing the lockout doesn't change the content, it just speeds it up and the more FC members you gear up completely the less they log in anyway. Same results really just more of a cliff than a gradual slope that we have now.

---

How many people have all jobs, including crafting and gathering jobs, to 50? How many people have full darklight and relics on all those jobs? What percentage of the game population has that?

Probably isn't very high. Yet there are no lockouts on leveling and philosophy tome gathering. There isn't a lockout on how many relics you can get a week.

Hmm, that's weird. It's almost like your rationale that everyone would just hardcore grind coils 24/7 and gear out all their jobs in ilvl 90 gear would only apply to a very small percentage of the people playing the game, while less restrictive lockouts would benefit the vast majority of people who just want to be able to do the only progression dungeon more than once a week so they can gear up more than one job in a game that promoted the concept of playing more than one job on one character.

Mog has a valid point of view; however, there is something I completely disagree with... Players finishing their gear runs and still going into the dungeons to help others. Sadly this is not the case (in my opinion and what I've seen not only here but in FFXI as well.) Not saying 100% behave this way, but by far the majority of the playerbase is extremely selfish and will only dedicate time to running dungeons after their chances are done for the week in extreme cases, like irl friends. You'll see what I mean once Crystal Tower comes by unless (unless it proves to be a decent tome farming option, in which case there is always something to get out of it) ... By the end of the week ask the raid how many are running and already got their drop for that week. Hopefully I'll be proven wrong (though something tells me I won't.)

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by DoctorMog

It means that our FC of 20 people has 4 left over (8+8+4), and they get to pick up group Coil because the other 2 parties can't help or take them.

As I stated in the OP, if your FC isn't a multiple of 8, someone's getting alienated.

---

We created a Linkshell and invited nice and helpful people. We always have someone that are whiling to help or to just play together, because it happens sometimes that most of us are busy already or aren't online. We create some nice in-game friendships and possible alliances for progression and pretty much everything. If you don't want to think out the box, then you will still have trouble with almost in games.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Amyas

B-b-but I don't get a chance to play with anyone else at all in this content without screwing over the 7 I have been running it with!!!

---

fixed that for you

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Edenholt

We created a Linkshell and invited nice and helpful people. We always have someone that are whiling to help or to just play together, because it happens sometimes that most of us are busy already or aren't online. We create some nice in-game friendships and possible alliances for progression and pretty much everything. If you don't want to think out the box, then you will still have trouble with almost in games.

---

once all those nice and helpful people are staticed up with the odd men out from your fc you will still be stuck to your own individual cliques...i dont see how that solves the problem. All it does is make the problem on a larger scale. A lot of us dont care about gearr!!!!!!! We want to play with other people without screwing over those we have been running with! sure I can just quit my static and start a new one every once in a while, but i happen to enjoy playing with my group a lot. Why should I have to choose who to run with and not be able to help them all equally?

The CT loot lockout system would be so unbelievably perfect for coil its not even funny. Especially considering 1-4 is easily puggable now (my kills for 1-4 all had at least 3 people my group pugged). You can already see a very different type of culture forming for twintania (at least on Coeurl). People are making LSs specifically for pugging turn 5 since it is content that a lot of people can easily pug any time. My FC is suffering the same issue. If your static is missing a person for a night, you can't get a sub from your other static and if you run without someone they end up getting locked out. So much unnecessary drama caused by the coil dungeon lockout.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BloodPact

Mog has a valid point of view; however, there is something I completely disagree with... Players finishing their gear runs and still going into the dungeons to help others. Sadly this is not the case (in my opinion and what I've seen not only here but in FFXI as well.) Not saying 100% behave this way, but by far the majority of the playerbase is extremely selfish and will only dedicate time to running dungeons after their chances are done for the week in extreme cases, like irl friends. You'll see what I mean once Crystal Tower comes by unless (unless it proves to be a decent tome farming option, in which case there is always something to get out of it) ... By the end of the week ask the raid how many are running and already got their drop for that week. Hopefully I'll be proven wrong (though something tells me I won't.)

---

I've observed the opposite on my server. PUG titan groups are nearly all relic players that are just there to help because they're bored and there's nothing to do. I know I've capped myth tomes on titan pugs alone a couple weeks but even spamming titan gets boring after the 100th time.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by BloodPact

Sadly this is not the case (in my opinion and what I've seen not only here but in FFXI as well.) Not saying 100% behave this way, but by far the majority of the playerbase is extremely selfish and will only dedicate time to running dungeons after their chances are done for the week in extreme cases, like irl friends.

---

There are plenty of people who are like this, for sure. However, there are probably just as many who are the opposite. I honestly, would happily run coil a couple nights a week (1-4 is only about an hour of time after all) just to help my FCmates gear up. Its also in my self interest to do so since they are the people im doing twintania with as well.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by zdub303

There are plenty of people who are like this, for sure. However, there are probably just as many who are the opposite. I honestly, would happily run coil a couple nights a week (1-4 is only about an hour of time after all) just to help my FCmates gear up. Its also in my self interest to do so since they are the people im doing twintania with as well.

---

I would love nothing more than to be able to run coil with my static, help our other static if they have a missing person one week, and form another group for my friend and gf once they are caught up. Sadly I can not do this and it is looking like im either going to have to torture myself with an alt or quit the static im already in....whoopie choices!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Azurus

I would love nothing more than to be able to run coil with my static, help our other static if they have a missing person one week, and form another group for my friend and gf once they are caught up. Sadly I can not do this and it is looking like im either going to have to torture myself with an alt or quit the static im already in....whoopie choices!

---

You'll end up leveling another character just to do coil with them.
Because screw 1 character all jobs. Its about 9 characters 9 jobs!

FFXIV... Why you so backwards....

People log in for days other than Monday? I never knew.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by permbanned

Honestly, it's getting tiresome seeing people reply with this statement on a new topic EVERY DAY. Shouldn't you be leveling up your crafts or something? Go out to a bar every so often. Hang out with your friends, clean your room, get a good nights sleep. Play any new MMORPG and post about how there are people completing all the content in one week after they speed though it. Plenty of things you can be doing.

---

Yessir check my crafts. Im well on my way to being a chef master : D NOM NOM NOM

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TeaTimeBear

I really don't get you. You say nothing positive here when it concerns the game and typically have nothing more but spite to contribute typically. I think the usual thing most people do is refrain from being around something they don't enjoy. But here you are again with more pessimist bring down the house angst posts. I can't help but think of a video I watched when I see users like yourself. It was an AGVN vid, and towards the end of it he's complaining about why someone would bother replaying this (expletive) game on a higher difficulty and that you'd have to be some kinda idiot to do that. Then he turns away from the camera and resumes playing as the vid ends. Are you a masochist?? Really I wanna know because you're not happy and it shows. Yet here you are.

---

I'm here because i can cloth my reindeer c@ in various outfits.

Reason enough for you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Youmu

People log in for days other than Monday? I never knew.

---

Haha , Monday is day of Advenrures ( Coil+Myth) , Tue - Sun usually login ----> a hour fate ---> a hour botanist ----> log out , like that ; ;
But...... fingers crossed , maybe something will change , i waiting 2.1 :D

Why do people say that you have to have all classes and crafts maxed to 50 before you have an "excuse" to complain?

You do realize this is a game that is for fun... and not everyone finds all classes "fun", right?

This isn't a job, it's entertainment... and as far as "rushing".. my problem with the lockout is that it causes me issues, because it tries to force me to advance based on the game 1 week schedule, not on my own terms. That is the opposite of casual.

I DO have other commitments, work, and vacation- and I really don't appreciate losing chances that I can never get back and will always be behind. It's also crap for people that are deployed or work overseas or have jobs that take them away from home for a week or more at a time.

Get with it. I play games on my schedule, not the game company's schedule. I pay a subscription so the game is there for me- not so I can be there for the game.

-and who cares if some people would burn through and call for more content? That is happening now. It will always happen.

mog, couldn't agree more :s

at this point i'm just hoping there's new things coming in 2.1 that haven't been talked about yet

some form of character progression outside of coil

doesn't have to be gear, ffxi has merits EQ has AAs

it wouldn't even have to be exp related.. but something to do with friends that would actually have a chance at progressing our characters, outside of that one hour a week in coil

as is, we're looking at side/downgrades from ct/x primals.. I'll gladly do them anyways, but they come with the same problem attached to coil... once a week :\

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Risae

Of course, once the games goes out of beta.

---

So much win.

The way the game is set up now is legit. I90 is te absolute highest tier gear, and there will soon be 1x95 wpn, 2x 90 wpns, 2x80 wpns, and two sets of i90 gear (3acc) and an ILvl 80 gear. Yes, you do have to pick a "main" Job, and have to complete your 90 set on that before moving on to another. But there are other options to gear alts.

Not everyone has a static that grids T1-4 everymonday and caps all tomes after on Monday. That's a small fraction. Even fewer are willing to grind through the story multiple times. Most of us take all week to do this, and still ony finish T1-2.

You call yourselves "hardcore" and then cry about te consequences of it.

Also, for all we know there could be more crafted recipes being added for 80 gear or even why the treasure hunts give.

You should not be able to simultaneously advance every class quickly, it should be one at a time or more than one at a slower pace. It just make sense.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Youmu

People log in for days other than Monday? I never knew.

---

Was under the impression A Realm Reborn, like its enjoyable content, was locked out beyond Mondays. Huh, learn something new every day.

Granted, I'm paying $10 a month to play a game only several days a month, so what the hell do I know about anything.

Don't bother, OP, you're just going to get pilloried by white knights. And yes, you are 100% correct. The game encourages you to roll classes on one character then punishes you for doing so.

There is zero reason to level more than a few jobs of the same role (plus subs) on one character, it is much more efficient to just make alts for different class roles that get you more tombs per week.

Leveling in this game is super easy even if you don't rush who doesn't have at least one level 50 at this point?

The lockout system mirrors pretty much any modern mmo that is out today. Have you played anything else besides FF MMOs OP? Part of the reason there seems like not much to do is because there is only 1 raid out. Other established MMOs have a lot more raids accessible letting you do more then 1 zone. That is because they have been out a long time ARR is still just 4 months old. Your main progression group probably won't be focusing on the older stuff that is when you can go back and help your slower, casual, less progressed friends do older content.

I find the lockout system to be just fine. The game lets you have unlimited gear 2 tiers or below, darklight 70/ AK 60 /WP 55 gear. I had all my jobs at 50 when the game came out except arc. You can do pretty much everything in the game except turn 5 in coil with level 70 gear. In 2 weeks after launch I had every drop from AK and 4 jobs geared in full darklight because it has no lockout. Now I have all darklight and all the reilcs just from naturally capping myth. I have my PLD in full ilvl 90, in addition I got a handful of other 90 drops from coil that went to greed rolls because people didn't need on mains. I am also at the point where I can spend myth on a 2nd job. Seems like I have a lot of gear at this point. All my jobs are definitely playable, I can speed run WP on my mostly 70 geared bard, or heal it on my whm.

I don't think we need to go back to the FFXI style of drops where there are no lockouts and 1% drop rates. That was just horrible. In 1.0 FFXIV people still had their static groups to spam AV and CC for darklight and would almost never take anyone else that wasn't in their set group.

If you want to play more OP you should level an alt. You will be logging in more trying to get that alt leveled. You say you played in 1.0 and had everything leveled so its not like you leveled much at all in 2.0. A Legacy sub gives you 8 character slots per server. You might as well use those slots. You need to get over the fact that you can play every job one character. Because the truth is if you want to have top tier gear on multiple jobs and do more then one coil a week then its time to level an alt. With these alts you can join your friends coil runs since they have separate lockouts.

Bottom line is you want to play more do more coils per week, then level alts.

The story is a joke, lol at pretending as if it doesn't take more than 10 hours or so of extra time to complete it. Once you get into the 30s the story is paltry xp and if you've already done it you can skip all the dialogue.

The time it takes to level a second character to 50 is marginal compared to the amount of time the characters will spend at 50 with double the rewards (i.e. twice as many lockouts per week, double the cap on tomes, etc.)