Why do Vanity items / Player housing / Pets exist?

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Originally Posted by BlazeChronic

Thanks for proving my point. And to answer your question, because the developers efforts would be better spent fixing the myriad of issues that affect the entire playerbase rather than catering to your selfish narcissism.

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HOW exactly did she prove your point? Because she plays the game the way SHE WANTS to play it? The game is designed to be whatever WE want it to be. To go and do what WE want. It's her money she spends each month to play it, it's her right to have nice things or make a house if she wants. The same as it's mine to do with with my monthly subscription, or you or anyone elses.

If you want to play a game where all you do is wander and fight monsters, go pick up a damn hack n' slash and play that. The developers put things in this game for everyone to do in any way they choose. If I want to spend my day just fishing by a waterfall, well...that's what I'm damn well going to do.

I honestly thought the original post was a troll attempt.

FFXIV is a "Theme Park MMO." If you've ever been to a theme park, you would know you aren't interested in everything it has to offer, but there's probably something that interests you a great deal. I believe this what they are going for.

If you were expecting an ARPG out of FFXIV, that is not part of this game's design. It is laser focused on nothing.

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Originally Posted by Cigaran

A Sandbox game, by design, is a game where the player is free to explore the world, create their own content, and impact the world around them. There is little to no set goals other than what the player makes for themselves. The content they create can be shared with the other players of the game and the impact they make on the world is felt and shared by all. The content creation, and ability to share it, are pretty much the defining feature of a Sandbox MMO.

There has only been a handful of truly Sandbox games. Ultima Online, Star Wars Galaxies (pre NGE era), The Repopulation, and to an extent EVE are most common examples.

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Correct. That is what this game does and will do even more in the future. That's what makes this game awesome. I will play this game for years because it is Sandbox.

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Originally Posted by Jess_Spark

Correct. That is what this game does and will do even more in the future. That's what makes this game awesome. I will play this game for years because it is Sandbox.

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It's not a sandbox, just having most content as instanced disqualifies ARR as sandbox, this game has a long way before it can be called a "sandpark", so it's really far from being a sandbox, housing is a minor detail.

Wow. Well isn't this just the heated topic of the day.

I don't know OP, I rather like it when Kidragora follows me around while I do botany. It used to be so lonely... The only company I used to have were those Efts... and for some reason... they just kept trying to kill me...

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Originally Posted by Tupsi

Yoshi himself: Casual gamers. Look at FB or Mobile games and how they try to bleed players dry, because companies know the casual playerbase live for things like this.

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Except that this is a p2p mmo, so your point is nonexistent. Nobody is being bled dry here by this optional content.

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Originally Posted by BlazeChronic

I see that only three people in this thread really 'get it'.

EDIT: and what 'IT' is, that you all seem to be missing.... The op isn't saying take all of those things out, not at all. He is saying the resources, at this point and time, would be better spent elsewhere. The thing is, you guys will defend your vanity items tooth and nail, yet you will go into another thread, and say the responsiveness is killing the game, and that they need more instance servers, blah blah blah.

The OP is absolutely right. At this current time, the resources need to be focused elsewhere. Disagreeing is pure hypocrisy.

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No, the OP and you are absolutely wrong. You have no idea what their resource allocation is like. They could easily work on both vanity content and fixing bugs. Please, stop trying to dictate to Square Enix what they should do. You have absolutely no idea what their development process is like.

You are in the overwhelming minority here.

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Originally Posted by Bufkus

Except that this is a p2p mmo, so your point is nonexistent. Nobody is being bled dry here by this optional content.

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Except you have people who look for games that cater to their likes - lots of people join MMOs based on their housing system or if they have a viable pet system/vanity pet system.

My question is, why is catering to casual players a BAD thing if it extends the game's lifespan? The people who leave the game are the ones who get burned out on it by sitting and grinding out the content in a week and then lose interest, only to resub when the new raids or whatever come out...And then leave again. By adding fun content like vanity items, pets, and housing (and minigames!) it allows for different methods of play and different things to strive for and DO. This means a more diverse playerbase and longevity in the long run, especially for crafters who right now are primarily only able to sell to other crafters.

I hate the mindset of casual = bad. Some of us have lives. Some of us like to have other things to do in games than fight mobs all day. I like to have my characters look pretty, have pets to follow me around and have a cute house to show off my things and sense of style. =D

Social aspects are fun for people. Having a FC house with me and my buds and decking that sucker out sounds like fun to all of us.

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Originally Posted by Malkavianqueen

My question is, why is catering to casual players a BAD thing if it extends the game's lifespan?

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It doesn't, casuals may be the larger market, but they're usually the ones to quit first because something "new and shiny" comes along and they move there. MMOs are meant for longevity which means shit should take a lot longer than it does now, but because devs are just aiming for a quick buck they kill any long term goals that hardcore players/"dedicated" players play for.

Edit: And this game has no identity, so much crap tossed in taken from other games makes it feel hollow and without improving these systems to give it great depth will drive people away. A theme park style does not work for this game.

Perhaps I should have mentioned I love vanity.

I just felt like being blunt and state that most stuff being worked on for MMOs are disliked by enough that it could seem like a total waste of resources. Story though is that one thing that people either like, or don't talk about.

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Originally Posted by Caselia

casuals may be the larger market, but they're usually the ones to quit first because something "new and shiny" comes along

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I get what you're saying, but that's a pretty big generalization. To me, hardcore does not necessarily = dedicated. How many 'hardcore' guilds from this game do the same sort of mmo hopping as 'casual' players? How many already left or are going to leave?

I agree that the game should be harder to extend its lifespan...for those that choose to play that way. I sometimes wish that they had servers with difficulty levels or slower progression rates but I understand why that would be difficult.

I'm just saying from MY experience there is a large group of people who play games for other things than raiding/grinding mobs and that we shouldn't be excluded. For me, most of my crafting professions are higher than my battle ones. And that's why they're adding these vanity/fluff items. To diversify the playerbase and make money.

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Originally Posted by Jackl3

I'd like some insight as to who thought that we all "wet" ourselves in excitement over "cute" pets, mounts, and sunshades.

Stop wasting dev resources in "Player Housing" - Why should I care about a housing area that's just a deliberate attempt at adding more padding to time-consumption. That will have little to no effect to me. Seriously, they fleeced people already by saying "earn an Ahrman pet (that does nothing)" for 90days upfront. - Yeah you can wait but many people paid all upfront.

Why do people ride this horse? - I'd rather they invested this time into creating dark/complex looking Armour weapons.

MMO gamers gone soft? - Is this the norm for Japanese games to include full on vanity, or housing?. What is going on.

Please someone explain the reasoning behind all of this, and why it has started to become a big thing in all MMORPGs?

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I don't think you understand the MMORPG genre if you're questioning these things. It hasn't "started" being a big thing in MMOs, it's always been a prevailing concept since the beginning, particularly the days of "advanced" MMORPGs (i.e. EQ). MMORPGs are immersion based games, they're originally designed for the role-player. It was NEVER a genre for the generic gamer until WoW (specifically around TBC expansion), be it because of tech limitations (computers weren't exactly popular/common gaming mediums) or media popularity.

Questioning these features is like going into an FPS game and questioning why you shoot things or why you have to be in first-person. The genre has deep-seated roots or traditions that exist regardless of whatever next-gen perspectives people might have about it.

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Originally Posted by Caselia

A theme park style does not work for this game.

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You mean it doesn't work for you. The game seems to be pretty successful thus far, and many of these "theme park" ideas were used as a main marketing point to boast sales & gain players.

- Non-combat pets
- Barbershop
- Player Housing
- Golden Saucer mini-games
- A vanity style "dressing room"

All these items were main points of focus during the marketing campaign to hype up this game, and all items are considered to be of a "theme park" style of game play. And the population continues to increase each day largely in anticipation for these things.

So how about we let the developers decide what works for this game. They seem to be doing a well enough job so far.

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Originally Posted by shadowrell_d-_-b

says remove crafting and gathering
is currently lvling a 20 botanist????

are you just being sarcastic or are you serious? -_-

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That post was full of sarcasm. I was poking fun at her. :|

because farmville. and leveling your chocobo is endgame.

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Originally Posted by BlazeChronic

I see that only three people in this thread really 'get it'.

EDIT: and what 'IT' is, that you all seem to be missing.... The op isn't saying take all of those things out, not at all. He is saying the resources, at this point and time, would be better spent elsewhere. The thing is, you guys will defend your vanity items tooth and nail, yet you will go into another thread, and say the responsiveness is killing the game, and that they need more instance servers, blah blah blah.

The OP is absolutely right. At this current time, the resources need to be focused elsewhere. Disagreeing is pure hypocrisy.

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If you think the same guys designing vanity items and housing are the same guys working on responsiveness, you are just wrong. You can't refocus those resources because laying off the art designers to hire more coders or network analysts would absolutely tear the heart and identity right out of this game.

Unlike Action RPGs, which are all about combat and action, and about doing combat and action at an increasingly grander scale as you progress, MMOs are primarily about existing and living in a virtual world.

Player housing and vanity stuff contributes to this existence, and the liveliness of the world. It allows players to become invested, the community to evolve, and in some cases impact the world directly to varying degrees (player towns in some games). It's wrapped into the RP part of MMORPG.

Wildstar has a pretty deep housing system that included a whole bunch of bonuses and conveniences players can make use of including putting a mine on your land to get materials, and so on.

http://www.wildstar-online.com/en/me...ak/#video-1501

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Originally Posted by Bufkus

You are in the overwhelming minority here.

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So since we are the minority, we aren't allowed to like or dislike something. Nice to see the how much the WoW community has permeated my precious FF community :(

Disagreeing is pure hypocrisy, he says. :D

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Originally Posted by Jess_Spark

There are plenty of other games without housing to play. This game is what they call "Sandbox." If you just want to kill things...maybe this isn't the game for you. Kind of an immature attitude to say we are 'girls' just because we enjoy doing things outside of die hard fighting...etc etc etc...

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Originally Posted by Jess_Spark

It is not FAR from being sandbox. Wrong. Sandbox games are games that offer more than just beating up monsters. You can have every profession, the crafting is very detailed and fun. There will be housing. There will be vanity. The characters are beautiful. There is a lot of story depth.

Where do you see this game not being sandbox? I don't think you know the definition of sandbox. Sorry try again.

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Originally Posted by Jess_Spark

Correct. That is what this game does and will do even more in the future. That's what makes this game awesome. I will play this game for years because it is Sandbox.

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FFXIV ARR is unquestionably a themepark MMO.
It defiantly has sandbox elements, but at its core it is a themepark.


You progress from set piece to set piece that the devs have provided, each built to provide a specific experience. A themepark.


A sandbox typically doesn't have that 'leading by the nose' style to it, and the players themselves create most or all of the content.

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Originally Posted by TaranTatsuuchi

FFXIV ARR is unquestionably a themepark MMO.

A sandbox typically doesn't have that 'leading by the nose' style to it, and the players themselves create most or all of the content.

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I have been doing some researching on it and really there doesn't seem to be a label on this game aside from Fantasy. I guess my point would be that this game seems to be headed in a sandbox direction. Having housing which is extremely customizable is sandbox. Having the choice to play any class and every class is sandbox. Yes there are movement restrictions and exploration restrictions that I hope they will open up. IE Swimming, less invisible walls etc...

For me, if there are not enough sandbox elements in a game, I get easily bored. This game thus far has not bored me a bit. There is plenty that I can do outside of just hack and slash and that is my type of game.

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Originally Posted by BlazeChronic

So since we are the minority, we aren't allowed to like or dislike something. Nice to see the how much the WoW community has permeated my precious FF community :(

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I think it's more along the lines that you're not right to think your perspectives are how the game should be. The devs/Yoshi clearly want there to be a lot of immersion/imaginative content included into the game... an MMORPG game (significantly immersion based genre). Be it companions, mounts, housing, gold saucer, chat methods, social functions, "fun" equips/items, etc; they're all immersion related content. But just because there's a lot of it, doesn't mean that equal or greater time isn't spent on the endgame-related content itself.

The prevailing philosophy for the FFXIV team is to have a fun time in GENERAL. This does not mean exclusively focusing on the fun of one area of the game (in your case, endgame). To feel like there's something fun to be found that doesn't deal with number crunching or being in an endgame-only progressive stance. Because despite what some think, the memories that people retain from these games RARELY has anything truly positive to do with the endgame content itself. It's typically something to do with the company you keep, and that is something that can be experienced in more ways than just killing the bosses of the hardest raids.

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Originally Posted by Jess_Spark

I have been doing some researching on it and really there doesn't seem to be a label on this game aside from Fantasy. I guess my point would be that this game seems to be headed in a sandbox direction. Having housing which is extremely customizable is sandbox. Having the choice to play any class and every class is sandbox. Yes there are movement restrictions and exploration restrictions that I hope they will open up. IE Swimming, less invisible walls etc...

For me, if there are not enough sandbox elements in a game, I get easily bored. This game thus far has not bored me a bit. There is plenty that I can do outside of just hack and slash and that is my type of game.

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Please check this out for your own reference. Read in Yoshi-P's own words what his vision for the game is since you dont believe TaranTatsuuchi.

Letter from the Producer XX

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You’ll never hear me say there’s anything wrong with devoting your life to playing games. That’s what I do, after all. But if you keep doing the same thing, it’s easy to burn out, and there are people who can’t keep up. That’s why I think that in the world of the modern MMORPG, which should be everything like a theme park, diverse rides, facilities, and specs are an absolute necessity.

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IN XI housing was a big deal, to every type of player, it's where you change jobs, manage extra inv. space,get your mail, decorate it to your liking, the decorations also played a big role in crafting, Gardening, & Fishing, you could even invite people inside to show it all off.

Housing has been asked to be on XIV since 1.0, so clearly the majority of the old player base wanted it

As for the horse, well Variety is the spice of life. In early 1.0 you couldn't even ride a chocobo, when they introduced the Chocobo, they also said they'd be adding different types of mounts.

and no offense or anything, but just because the housing,different mounts/minions exists, and you don't like it, doesn't mean you have to use it

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Originally Posted by Felis

Never played a FF game before?
If you rage already about it, how would you react to golden saucer?

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Clearly with a heart attack. ;)