Handling Cheaters Gracefully vs Hardline ToS + Questionable legality of bans

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Originally Posted by StealthPaladin

What I'm saying is that not all problems matter. SE has no business decided what is moral.

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Wrong.
SE has every right to decide what is moral inside the grounds of their own software and their own servers. If you want to play on their servers you play by their rules or you lose that right.
SE and GMs are the arbiters of morality, what is right, and what is wrong inside the confines of their game, end of story. If you don't like that then you are absolutely free to stop paying your subscription and leave to play another game.

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Originally Posted by RitsukoSonoda

Do we really need yet another thread of "I why they shouldn't be allowed to penalize me for ignoring the parts of the ToS I find inconvenient even though I said I agree'd to all terms in the document in order to use the service."?

Some things are more noticeable or impactful yes. However it's just like laws. Take speed limits for example. People are prone to violate the speed limit on a daily basis. Most in the US do this by a margin of 5mph or less and it's normally overlooked. Yet one day you do get pulled over and given a ticket. They aren't going to accept "everyone else does it" or "other people are doing worse things" as an excuse not to issue the fine.

You install these software modifications at your own risk. If it compromises your client so that it no longer works as intended or your account ends up compromised then its on you. If it sends questionable data packets into the game server resulting in a ban then that's also on you. You agreed on installation to use the service per the terms given and chose not to uphold your part in that agreement.

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To be clear, I am not saying that at all. I am saying the terms of service should change

Specifically I post this they should change because:
1. It would reduce SE's liability
2. It would clear up recurring chaos and confusion in the player community regarding tools
3. Simplifying these aspects of the ToS, not necessarily in the ways I've offered but in SOME manner addressing the same concerns, will reduce SE's support headaches
4. Indeed I do not like being forbidden from making simple tools myself, and I hope SE just cares because I'm a customer
5. I've aggregated many opinions from many sources, as I know folks scared to speak up in fear of banning. I have long wished to make a mod but currently have not done so, therefor I felt it gave me an easy position to reflect on it

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

Wrong.
SE has every right to decide what is moral inside the grounds of their own software and their own servers. If you want to play on their servers you play by their rules or you lose that right.
SE and GMs are the arbiters of morality, what is right, and what is wrong inside the confines of their game, end of story. If you don't like that then you are absolutely free to stop paying your subscription and leave to play another game.

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Having a right to do it is a long debate, which would not mean much. I have the right to do the chicken dance dressed in a suit of armor in my front yard during a lightning storm. I'm not going to because it is not a good idea.

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Originally Posted by Kes13a

ah, now this makes sense. this is regarding Adventure Plate bans isnt it?

in that regard, you are aware that FFxiv is in more places than just the US and all thos eplaces have different rating standards that SE and FFxiv must conform to. you have a problem with it, I recommend you take your outrage on morals to those governments, SE is just trying to make money.

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Seems like the plates are more hassle than they are worth as it is now. I can see them removing certain emotes and limit how much you can zoom and angle the camera

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Originally Posted by StealthPaladin

Having a right to do it is a long debate, which would not mean much. I have the right to do the chicken dance dressed in a suit of armor in my front yard during a lightning storm. I'm not going to because it is not a good idea.

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There's no debate, follow the TOS you signed or get banned.

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Originally Posted by Kes13a

ah, now this makes sense. this is regarding Adventure Plate bans isnt it?

in that regard, you are aware that FFxiv is in more places than just the US and all thos eplaces have different rating standards that SE and FFxiv must conform to. you have a problem with it, I recommend you take your outrage on morals to those governments, SE is just trying to make money.

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There is an adventurer plate ban?
I did not know. My adventurer plate is tame and I am generally polite in game. I do not use parsers or any of that. I tend to scold people that are harsh to other players over performance.

No, this is about feedback I have after talking to lots of gamers. Please stop trying to twist my words and at least once look at them with the idea that perhaps I am, at least in my own conscience, trying to suggest what I believe is going to work for the game long term. Because I love this game.

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Originally Posted by VerdeLuck

There's no debate, follow the TOS you signed or get banned.

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Obviously there is a debate, as I am presently debating it

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Originally Posted by StealthPaladin

There is an adventurer plate ban?
I did not know. My adventurer plate is tame and I am generally polite in game. I do not use parsers or any of that. I tend to scold people that are harsh to other players over performance.

No, this is about feedback I have after talking to lots of gamers. Please stop trying to twist my words and at least once look at them with the idea that perhaps I am, at least in my own conscience, trying to suggest what I believe is going to work for the game long term. Because I love this game.

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you brought up morals, the only thing in my memory that SE bans on recently.. have been the adventure plates.

I do not think you are here in good faith since you think you want to do it, and you should be allowed.. period. SE doesnt matter and it doesnt matter if its cheating, you should be accommodated. I mean you are allowed to think however you want, however, someone else's IP is likely not a good place to try and push that agenda.

glad you love the game, just remember, the people against the cheaters... love it too ^^

have a good evening

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Originally Posted by myahele

Seems like the plates are more hassle than they are worth as it is now. I can see them removing certain emotes and limit how much you can zoom and angle the camera

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This is why we can't have nice things, as they say lol. I HAD seen some of the drama though didn't know that it came that far. There's no issue for me if they did take those actions tho. It's just I am software dev that has to deal with a lot of regulation myself and I have also listened to many folks over the years about these issues. This is just my consolidated feedback for the team if they may find any value in it.

If you think it should stay as it is or go another way, that is OK I dont mind haha. But my own goals are as stated and for no other reasons

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Originally Posted by Kes13a

you brought up morals, the only thing in my memory that SE bans on recently.. have been the adventure plates.

I do not think you are here in good faith since you think you want to do it, and you should be allowed.. period. SE doesnt matter and it doesnt matter if its cheating, you should be accommodated. I mean you are allowed to think however you want, however, someone else's IP is likely not a good place to try and push that agenda.

glad you love the game, just remember, the people against the cheaters... love it too ^^

have a good evening

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My adventure plate is very tame. I personally feel like it would be a good rule to require spicy plates to tag themselves NSFW and be hidden similar to the chat filter on cussing. But I have no major dog in that fight, they could make any feature however they want and everyone gets the same level of service so there is no liability issue there