Season 2 Storyline (another 10 years) [discussion]

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Originally Posted by Vyrerus

I mean, I don't have anything against seeing Gelmorra, but it really does only apply to the Shroud and one specific time period. There's not a lot to work with there, in overall story terms, and people who didn't play 1.0 and don't play Duskwights aren't invested. Maybe we'll find the plothread of subterranean civilization visited/lifted with less stone work and more sci-fi in Endwalker in Labyrinthos for under Sharlayan.

I had a Duskwight character for a while that I named a Dark Souls reference. He's an alt back up for my LP character now, though. We at least know that the Mun Tuy Beans were a Gelmorran staple, since the big thing about them is that they need no sunlight to grow and are described as Duskwight food (That everyone loves).

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The thing that gives me hope of 'maybe we'll actually go to Gelmorra now' is more that, once Endwalker's big far-reaching story wraps, that sounds like a perfect chance to loop back home and do some 'housekeeping story', spend some time in the settings of previous expansions. We're actually due for at least one focused around Gridania; remember that Stormblood and Shadowbringers got patches about Ul'Dah and Limsa respectively. And when they do that... honestly, the Shroud's got a lot of weird stuff, but it's all interconnected: Amdapor, Gelmorra, the Padjali, and the Elementals.

Gelmorra may be a bit too in-the-weeds to be the proper core of a story about all of that, but it would make for a very good stage; the birthplace of the Padjali, and the home of both the descendants of Amdapor's destruction and the closest there ever was to actual opposition to the Elementals' whims. If you did a 'Versus the Elementals' trial or dungeon, it would perfectly fit to set it in a Gelmorran site.

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Originally Posted by Cleretic

The thing that gives me hope of 'maybe we'll actually go to Gelmorra now' is more that, once Endwalker's big far-reaching story wraps, that sounds like a perfect chance to loop back home and do some 'housekeeping story', spend some time in the settings of previous expansions. We're actually due for at least one focused around Gridania; remember that Stormblood and Shadowbringers got patches about Ul'Dah and Limsa respectively. And when they do that... honestly, the Shroud's got a lot of weird stuff, but it's all interconnected: Amdapor, Gelmorra, the Padjali, and the Elementals.

Gelmorra may be a bit too in-the-weeds to be the proper core of a story about all of that, but it would make for a very good stage; the birthplace of the Padjali, and the home of both the descendants of Amdapor's destruction and the closest there ever was to actual opposition to the Elementals' whims. If you did a 'Versus the Elementals' trial or dungeon, it would perfectly fit to set it in a Gelmorran site.

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Well I certainly wouldn't mind it. I'd also love an ass pull Foulques of the Mist like... "Yeah, I actually fell into a Gelmorran hole and got saved by some fellow Duskwights. Fight me again!" Course he was already in PoTD so... it kind of already happened, except just... no saving. His undead form, not quite as deranged as Livia or Rhitatyn. *sigh*

I don't know whether to be terrified or not if the Elementals regained enough strength to fight, and to directly exert their will on the forest, heh.

Meracydia seems most likely, but the new world would be more surprising and has even more of a fresh slate for the writers to use and we know yoshida likes to try and surprise

mind you, there's plenty in meracydia to build with. Lalafell tribes, dragons, the countries that created the warring triad and more allagan superweapons lying around for conveniant plot devices. Then again, Allag DID cover most of the world so i guess that last one doesnt count


part of me is wondering if the elementals will be connected to pandaemonium or the twelve. We already know the potd which may or may not include the underworld itself past floor 100 is in gelmorran ruins and the elementals have a tendency to hide things that are incredibly dangerous like amdapori dungeons. Those that they can't destroy they flee from then seal.

Meracydia doesn't seem like a noteworthy "You're going THAT far?!" reaction tbh.
I also immediately thought about WoL dying, or having like a hard power reset, but reading through this thread I understand why there isn't much of a baseline for that theory. To me it seems the most likely option looking at how much shock value it's supposed to have.
I was thinking, what other plotpoints are still open that would be truly surprising? We'll learn more about the twelve in Endwalker so that's off the table, Dragonstar or Omegas homestar would also not really fall under that shock value revelations. the 13th shard is already touched upon, unless they will explore that side of the lore more but I doubt we will repeat a SHB moment so soon. Us potentially losing to the final days and being time traveled back in time would probably be very unpopular to most players. (myself included). People above mentioned Elementals, honestly I would be up for that. But I have a hard time coming up with something that could possibly be as shocking as YoshiP mentions, he seems incredibly confident with his surprises in Endwalker, so surely it can't be something as obvious as exploring the rest of Eorzea.

Could see the "Go THAT far" also referring to permanent damage to the existing Eorzean citystates. Could be doable with phasing tech. I dunno how you'd handle some existing questlines with that, but there are already things outside the time bubble, I suppose. My mind immediately thought Omega's homeworld/creators. Course, I have a feeling the Sound is ultimately extraterrestrial in origin. And we were told by Ishkawa to complete Omega before Endwalker. So my brain is just naturally leaning towards that.

Regarding WoL dying, if the WoL does pull a Tidus, then dies, they could just be temporarily dead and then come back as themselves (pulling another Tidus, really). So, if you combine both of those things, then you could have the character death for story purposes without losing any of the character progression. And maybe add an overlay/levelsync system that knocks us down to level 1 in the next expac? Cus I've had a thoughts lately about 7.0 and how that can work.

I've loved the journey from ARR till now, but once Endwalker is over, I honestly think the devs may have to come up with a soft reset option of some kind that allows new players going forward to jump in in 7.0. The longer this game goes on (especially 10 years more (woohoo!)), the MSQ requirement for entry becomes more and more untenable. Are we really going to see "Here's super cool expansion 9.0! Now play through 8 other storylines to get here!" ??? Even if they remastered ARR somehow (I don't know how without ruining it), it'd still be a LOT. At some point, I think an upcoming expac needs to start again at level 1 and not require the MSQ. Or maybe start at lvl 50 and only require ARR. Somehow. Like, have the divergence point be 5.0, then you can either pursue 5.1's storyline or x.0. Something.

And yeah, if there was ever an opportunity to soft reset something, its the end of a story arc.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

Yoshi P mentioning that we'd be thinking "We're going THAT far?" kind of suggests me that we'll be going to another continent entirely in 7.x.

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Wait is that how people are thinking of "you'll go THAT far...?" comment? I figured it was more of a storytelling/moral line than a distance one. I mean, we've literally been to another dimension, it's hard to beat going to a place that quite literally doesn't share a physical space with you for distance.

I really, really do not want to go straight to another planet after 6.0. The reason why it feels so good that we're going to the moon/aetherial sea now is because we've built up to it over the past 8 years. Throwing us into another world so quickly would remove that buildup and logical story progression, leaving us with an expansion devoid of any real depth, regardless if it was the Dragonstar or Omega's homeworld.

We need to go back to basics for a bit, especially with how long we've been away from the Source. If Shadowbringers proved one thing at least is that people want and resonate with the high fantasy locations/themes it introduced and as cool as Endwalker is, its theme is more cosmic dealing with the literal end of a world and a battle between gods as opposed to saving and exploring fantasy locations. There is no new "kingdom" for lack of a better word on the scale of what we received when Ishgard was opened up to us and there hasn't been for quite some time.

https://i.imgur.com/ag1rirY.png

(Ishgard city and its vigils are the only traditional European castles in the entire game besides the elven ruins in Lakeland. How??)

Meracydia and the New World could definitely open the door to these themes though, with their own kingdoms and empires to explore. We solve the problems there, then build back up again towards the Dragonstar or taking down the "Sound." I do not want to go around in a space ship jumping to a different world every expansion like what WoW does with its story. How many planets have they been to by now? 3 or 4? And somehow, none of them memorable. We should only be taking to the stars at the climax of a story arc, not in the first episode of Season 2.

https://www.wowchakra.com/wp-content.../08/cosmic.jpg

(This is exactly what I do not want to see)

In terms of characters, reading the mood on social media seems to point towards characters like Estinien and Aymeric being fan favorites (despite Aymeric not doing much since the Heavensward days) while characters like Lyse, Thancred, and a variety of ARR/Stormblood characters not really grabbing people's attention much anymore since there really is nowhere left to go with these characters. Thancred had a literal death scene in Shadowbringers. Only for him to survive. For some reason. G'raha I can only barely tolerate-he needs to get serious real fast if they don't want to exhaust people's patience with him by the end of Endwalker.

A strong 7.0 in my opinion would focus on a setting with similar vibes to Ishgard and with cast members that come from that high-fantasy era of Heavensward. Estinien should stay without question, and I know for a fact social media would largely celebrate Aymeric joining our main party if he were to leave his position in the house of lords. As for the rest of our cast? Thancred needs to retire. Full stop. His character arc is already over. Urianger or Y'shtola can stay to be the party's mage and as a vehicle to deliver lore. As for the twins, that situation speaks for itself. Any missing slots should be replaced by new characters that fit a fantasy theme, like knights, archers/bards, etc. Not machinists or god forbid another gunbreaker.

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Originally Posted by KageTokage

plus we still don't know where the Heart of Sabik vanished off to...

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I thought it was pretty much presumed that the Heart of Sabik was destroyed along with the Ultima Weapon, given it was the Weapon's power core, so it literally blew up and the Ultima Weapon along with it (as it obviously took the brunt of the player's attacks and well, something had to give, creating a massive explosion, but smaller than the Ultima spell itself - presumedly there wasn't enough aether left in it to result in another Ultima-spell-level catastrophic explosion).

This is why Lahabrea was so annoyed with Gaius immediately after - he didn't just lose, he lost the Ultimate Magic as well which Lahabrea "entrusted to him".

Hence this is also why Ultima will never be a player castable spell - it's now lost forever, unless it was hidden away in some Amaurotine archive or something...

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Originally Posted by Nanchi

Meracydia doesn't seem like a noteworthy "You're going THAT far?!" reaction tbh.
I also immediately thought about WoL dying, or having like a hard power reset, but reading through this thread I understand why there isn't much of a baseline for that theory. To me it seems the most likely option looking at how much shock value it's supposed to have.
I was thinking, what other plotpoints are still open that would be truly surprising? We'll learn more about the twelve in Endwalker so that's off the table, Dragonstar or Omegas homestar would also not really fall under that shock value revelations. the 13th shard is already touched upon, unless they will explore that side of the lore more but I doubt we will repeat a SHB moment so soon. Us potentially losing to the final days and being time traveled back in time would probably be very unpopular to most players. (myself included). People above mentioned Elementals, honestly I would be up for that. But I have a hard time coming up with something that could possibly be as shocking as YoshiP mentions, he seems incredibly confident with his surprises in Endwalker, so surely it can't be something as obvious as exploring the rest of Eorzea.

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I want to echo this, because I think we are thinking narrowly on the "You're going THAT far?!" comment. What if that he was talking plot wise, not actual distance.

For example, 6.1 starts with a celebration the WOL and Scions are invited to. We all attend only to watch said city-state leader be assassinated, showing clearly there are large problems already afoot.

Or, instead of the WOL dying, we're lost into the life stream at the end of 6.0 and everyone who lives retires. Only to have the story move forward 5 years (so no fact about your identity needs changed) and you are suddenly pulled out by a character we may or may not know (just to spitball, what are the implications of an older Ryne wearing an apocalypse like outfit, carrying Thancred's old gunblade is the person and says "We need you old friend."?).

Or the plot devise of shards fail in ending of the Hydaelyn and Zodiark and we've all come to live in a world where everyone has been rejoined. New people and continents will have appeared out of nowhere over night. The amount of exploration, potential new villains, and problems to fix has multiped by however many shards were left and the potential new frontiers are unending.

Easily it feels like they could go "THAT far".

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Originally Posted by aveyond-dreams

Meracydia and the New World could definitely open the door to these themes though, with their own kingdoms and empires to explore.

A strong 7.0 in my opinion would focus on a setting with similar vibes to Ishgard and with cast members that come from that high-fantasy era of Heavensward. Estinien should stay without question, and I know for a fact social media would largely celebrate Aymeric joining our main party if he were to leave his position in the house of lords. As for the rest of our cast? Thancred needs to retire. Full stop. His character arc is already over. Urianger or Y'shtola can stay to be the party's mage and as a vehicle to deliver lore. As for the twins, that situation speaks for itself. Any missing slots should be replaced by new characters that fit a fantasy theme, like knights, archers/bards, etc. Not machinists or god forbid another gunbreaker.

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Meracydia is supposed to be a jungle wasteland filled with tribal people and heavy Africa themes so I don't think you'll find what you're looking for there. Any story there will definitely have dragons, but there will likely be a lot of Allagan tech and chimeras. Ilsabard has some high fantasy kingdoms that were mentioned in the Bozja storyline, with spellblades and wizards and such, but a lot of that ended with the Garlean invasions and any place we could go in Ilsabard would be heavily Garlified and covered in tech and guns so there's not really any place left in the world left that fits the "high fantasy" theme.

As far as the characters go, I thought I heard Yoshi-P or someone else on the dev team mention that the current MSQ characters are being retired after Endwalker.


The biggest hope that I have is that the next storyline is completely disconnected to everything we've done up until now so that new people coming in won't have to slog through or pay to skip even more content before catching up. FFXI was nice in that you could still at least visit most expansion zones without having done the story, depending on the expansion. The content itself could also be started before finishing the original story and the barrier to entry was often quite low.

As far as what Yoshi-P could mean by "going that far" I can totally see Hydaelyn being killed at the end of 6.0 to partially depower us and we start a new storyline fresh without having to keep escalating the stakes past what we've already done.