I don't know how you scholar mains do it.

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Originally Posted by DynamoAce

Overall, SCH isn't as bad as some make it out to be.

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If you look at it without trying to compare it to the other healers - no, it's not as bad as some make it out to be. Primal wise? Perfectly usable/viable - this does not, however, make it as balanced or stable OR usefull as the other healer classes. And that is the problem... not SCH by itself (it works, and having a SCH in your team won't automatically result in a wipe), but SCH when you compare it to other healers and what those other healers bring to the party which SCH doesn't.

I love SCH and I still consider it my main despite having AST also at 70 now - and let me tell you, clearing dungeons has become a lot more troublesome on SCH than it was before (old tools got nerfed, new tools are wonky as heck), while AST got buffed and got a hundred million cool new trinkets to play with - both DPS and healing wise.

I'm really disappointed in how people keep throwing around words like "viable" and "valid" like they're looking at the job in a void - SCH is indeed still a usable healing class, but when both WHM and AST both do about the same as SCH does and possibly more, SCH just feels unrewarding and unfun now :/

I mean, there isn't a SINGLE job right now that isn't usable, or "viable" as some would say - this however does not invalidate complaints about certain jobs having gotten the shorter end of the stick.

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Originally Posted by Odd2oul

as far as ive been playing scholar, eos has ALWAYS been the way to go. Selene's abilities are niche/borderline useless. Fey wind is only a 3% speed buff (not even as good as aoe Arrow). The only time Selene was used was when the dissipation bug was a thing, or if people were really adamant about that speed buff and would switch once selene was done using it (but its overall an mp waste to do). Eos' regen is so powerful BECAUSE that's the only regen we have, and its on a 1 minute cooldown.

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than you are not raiding that long... selene was way more popular than eos for a long, long time. selene was also recommended for dng runs - noone actually cared for eos at all back in the days. until some worlds first recognized how powerful eos regen was it shifted in the community mindset and eos raised to the top because she was able to take over your healing part, letting you focus on dps. so don't tell me eos wasn't overpowered, if you don't even know how she became superior.

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Originally Posted by Selova

Just don't expect anyone to take you seriously.

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Sadly, again, you seem passive-aggressive and are judging me and what I said, instead of bringing actual arguments, based by numbers and potencies. You want others to take you seriously, but my (different) opinion is worth less? :(
+ You are just repeating the same point of view someone else had. Don't know if you actually agree, if yes you could have simply paraphrased it, but well, double posts happen.:rolleyes:

I stand with my opinion as well: I don't have any issues healing as SCH, even if I have to go full healbot-mode when my random co-heal is an AST and has no clue what to do or when I am in dungeons with squishy tanks that don't know what defensive CDs are for. Therefore I cannot share your opinion. Feel free to call me naive, just because I can handle the class just fine. :p

Can you get off of your high horse, Amelia? You have conveniently ignored my pointing out your illogical reasonings. I can handle the class fine as well, it means nothing. As a PLD you could hold agro fine as well. Doesn't mean anything, does not mean it's balanced to their counterparts of roles. You can stop pretending you know how to argue. Most of your "arguments" do not consist out of numbers or facts, but out holier than though trash that means nothing.

Speaking as someone that reached lv.70 and mains SCH, I think yes, SCH compared to other healer classes seems to have lost on healing potency. Do I hate how they increased cost of Adloquium and lowered the MP restore of Aetherflow, to the point I do have to put Lucid Dreaming on my hotbar to compensate this huge mp management nerf (and to do so I took Cleric Stance out)? Yes. Do I want SE to review SCH job? Most definitely, I'm not 100% happy with how it is now, but since I've also played WHM and AST up to level 60 SCH is still my favorite healer job.

But is it a job that you can't play at all? It's not as bad as people make it look like, though I can see it getting really hard if people don't plan carefully the usage of Aetherflow and its stacks. The Aetherpact skill you get at lv.70 is really interesting imo, helped me a lot at keeping my MT alive at last main story trial while my AST was busy aoeing heal and I had to raise a couple of people. Really the thing that mostly annoyed me so far is the mp management. I have yet to level up my AST and WHM to 70 to properly compare the pros and cons of each job.

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Originally Posted by Starflake

Can you get off of your high horse, Amelia? You have conveniently ignored my pointing out your illogical reasonings. I can handle the class fine as well, it means nothing. As a PLD you could hold agro fine as well. Doesn't mean anything, does not mean it's balanced to their counterparts of roles. You can stop pretending you know how to argue. Most of your "arguments" do not consist out of numbers or facts, but out holier than though trash that means nothing.

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I never said that my opinion are arguments in the first place.
The OP stated his/her experience and opinion, so I did the same, I am sorry if I offended you with that. It was not my intention and I apologize.
I did not compare SCH to neither WHM nor AST, because I haven't played them yet, so I cannot compare in the first place. That's also why I cannot evaluate if your statements are wrong or right, so I did not say anything at all to it.

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Originally Posted by Selova

Sadly, you haven't offered any kind of proof that they are fine on a numbers/mechanical level. Are your arguments are boiled down to "they are viable and I personally have no issue with the job" Paladin was viable pre-4.0 as well, it didn't mean they were completely fine and didn't need fixes. By all means remain in your little bubble where classes don't need adjustments because they are "viable".

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I am wondering where you guys see my opinion as 'argument' or me basing something on numbers anywhere? ö.ö
Also here: I am sorry my opinion offended you, that was not what I intended, I just shared my own experiences, because the thread title intended this is what this thread is for.



Here you can see some maths done.

I usually switch to SCH when I have to enter a dungeon, roulettes or trial for the ques and I've honestly never had a big enough problem to complain. I've had to heal a little bit more rather than DPS and I've had a couple deaths, sure. Also one wipe that was my fault just not doing my job well enough. It's really not that hard honestly.

EDIT: After reading more of the replies in here, I just wanted to point out I'm all for them looking at every class and adjusting to make them comparable. I haven't tried any other healers and don't know how they fare. Don't want want I said to be taken as me thinking it doesn't need adjusting.

It's playable, but both boring and all over the place. You can use all its purposeless tools to somehow do something but its clear role in the party disapeared with cleric stance.

Using Eos to DPS the whole fight is only something that existed in HL speed kills, SCH was more about on point mitigation and instant while pushing the most DPS possible. And even that is only a failsafe mesure as anything is bound to end up solo healed anyway. I'm not sure why every seem to think Eos as some kind miraculous wonder, but it's only doing its as support off a main healer.
Even if you could solo heal as SCH, it's certainly more troubles than benefit.

They should have got rid off every proc based mechanic in healing before reducing DPS possibilities.

SCH is no where near as bad as people are claiming (though they could still use a few tweaks).

Yes, their DPS was gutted, especially AOE. However, that is the only real part I have a problem with. I have no issues healing and I have no MP problems.

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Originally Posted by AmeliaVerves

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I think it's cute that you think you've offended me or angered me in any way, you're giving yourself way too much credit. I'm not sure what point you're trying to make with that reddit link, all that thread does is backup my claims on how scholar is not fine. Please, keep going. This is highly entertaining.