Duty Finder Kick Penalty

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Originally Posted by Sessurea

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I have no problem taking the penalty when they say "no" to my request for a kick and I need to go AFK for RL. The abusers do, as they usually demand a kick.
Unfortunately, vote to kick is also frequently abused to kick players without proper reason. You are in favour "putting salt in the wound" when a player is victim of vote to kick abuse?
That's your opinion, Ok. If such a system was put in place, do not go complaining to the GMs, here on the board, etc.... when you are the victim of an abused vote to kick and suffer a penalty.

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Originally Posted by Spoekes

Can you elaborate on a legitimate reason?

If you have RL stuff to do, do it, eat the penalty, its only 30 min penalty, might be gone when you return or eat the 15 mins or what might be left of the penalty.

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People who have kids, or... real jobs (on-call stuff major BS)

Recent kicks:
- DPS was being rude (after 24-man raid wipe)
- Tank (Pharos Sirius) after the Tank and DPS started arguing after a wipe. Decided the Tank was more at fault since they decided to immediately AFK.

Then there was:
- Tank, after their kid started puking their guts out (which was a vote abandon)

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Originally Posted by KisaiTenshi

People who have kids, or... real jobs (on-call stuff major BS)

Recent kicks:
- DPS was being rude (after 24-man raid wipe)
- Tank (Pharos Sirius) after the Tank and DPS started arguing after a wipe. Decided the Tank was more at fault since they decided to immediately AFK.

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I don't really get which side you're argueing for.
What you are saying proves the point of the "pro-penalty" folks.
The two you kicked can just queue new.
The tank from PS might have been done with it sooner than you that day.

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Originally Posted by Spoekes

I don't really get which side you're argueing for.
What you are saying proves the point of the "pro-penalty" folks.
The two you kicked can just queue new.
The tank from PS might have been done with it sooner than you that day.

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In the case of WoD, DPS still get long queues.

Just to go back to the point...

If someone can be replaced right away (eg DPS), then it is in the best interests to behave. Go right ahead and kick DPS that are mouthing off (harassment), you don't need to take it. Tanks and Healers on the other hand shouldn't get a free pass for this either, but kicking them only penalizes your party, especially if it's content that people don't like to play.

From experience it seems like kicks only happen because of a disagreement on how to play, often between the Tank and someone else, and without any tact. In the case of the Tank/DPS argument in PS (why is it this dungeon always has the worst people...) The tank said he was going to AFK because he wasn't going to play with that DPS. Then when he disappeared, he was immediately replaced in less than a minute by someone in the FC of the DPS that had the argument, which was ... odd timing. I haven't played DPS for a while (other than to get what I needed on Swiftcast from THM) so I don't know if poor behavior is coming from Healers as well. The only healers I've seen are in 8-man/24-man parties, and it's rare for them to get kicked.

As for which side I'm arguing for. I see both sides. I'd rather abuse be curbed, so I'm for-penalties for players that impulsively leave, and not for penalties if the entire party agrees to cancel. Unfortunately DPS are penalized more either way.

As for "in progress" abandon cycling, I've never seen it. I've only seen cases where one player disconnects, only to be replaced by another player who also disconnects. It's not like early 2013's version of the game where if someone disconnects or is kicked, good luck finishing the dungeon.

I don't really know if there should be a penalty, but the same player should not be allowed to re-queue and get the same party. I had a DF group where we were kicking the tank for trolling (didn't have an oath up, didn't flash or attack mobs, basically died, and spammed the party chat with Rick Roll lyrics). We kicked him 3 times (once for each party member and we each got the 4-hour not allowed to kick anyone else penalty that you get) and the tank re-queued for the dungeon and got us. Every. Single. Time. We had to wait for the vote abandon timer.

The reason why I think there shouldn't be a penalty is because in a 4-man run, you only need 2 people to agree in order for you to be kicked. Which means a pair of pre-mades could easily kick you for no reason (even though I think it's stated somewhere that SE doesn't want you to do that and you can get in trouble for abusing it) and I have had it happen to myself before (like, I got kicked out of an expert roulette for being too high of an ilevel for some dumb reason). Why should I be punished because I was kicked? It's not like that was in my control. I understand that there are people who abuse the vote kick because they don't want the penalty, but you have to remember that most people do not.

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Originally Posted by RhazeCain

If you were to be kicked from a group and receive a penalty, then you would be receiving a penalty for something you can't control. Leaving a group however you can control, so it is easier to justify that penalty.

The people asking to be kicked are just gaming the system to avoid a penalty. I don't see any reasonable change to the system that would avoid that.

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because it can be harder and longer to fill in that one role tank healer. And it uses up some ones once every 4 hour ability that can be used for a real reason as in kicking a troll.

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Originally Posted by SerDakota

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If people asked to get kicked and then go afk in a corner. This offense is reportable. I know I have reported them and GMs have always responded to be very* quickly about this sort of issue. Removed the player from the dungeon etc.

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Originally Posted by Squaak

1. Keep the vote-kick penalty-free.
2. Remove penalty for leaving a dungeon after the 15 minute mark. 15 minutes is the clear-time in an average duty-finder group.
3. In dungeons with multiple encounters, make the vote-kick function unavailable to groups that successfully make it to the final encounter.
4. If someone leaves or there was a kick involved, make the in-progress option unavailable for 30 minutes. To avvoid group and player meeting again. Either because the player forgot to unmark the in-progress option, or because he wanted to get back in there to become the obnoxious player.(Unknowingly, or on purpose)

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1. Agree
2. Great idea +1
3. Unsure about this, I would support leaving kick option available open because of in-case reasons; that RL call can and does happen any time. This idea would work great with option 2 was implemented. Thus, RL abandon would not impose the penalty, removing the need for a mercy kick.
4. Respectfully disagree, the group has control of when they initiate the search for a new member.
Additionally, the system should be improved to not allow a player to rejoin the same instance s/he has been kicked from.

So Yeah I was doing Garuda HM, you know getting those last points for my Mahatma. Well I join an in progress garuda hm, unknowingly, and I enter the only one alive and get killed. lol This should have been the first indicator. Then I see the entire party is maybe ILV70, and thats be... VERY GENEROUS. Well What ever, i was once there, i'll stick with it help these guys.

The tank... sucked. didn't know what he was doing, and couldn't keep hate for the life of him. With every attack I have Garuda on me.... Fine what ever the healers are doing an ok job at keeping me alive. the tornados come the tank and the rest of the party don't move out of it, they all get throw in different directions. here I am actively tanking Garuda because the tank is just that terrible, here I am only dpsing the boss, as drgs do. well healers die then we all die.

right before the start of the next attempt, I'm like meh w/e we died big deal.
The Tank goes on to blame me! That "I saw you provoke 4 times!" "you didn't kill the adds" "Vote Kick Azrael!"

I was like... are you seriously? A) DRGS CAN'T PROVOKE. Literally we are unable to use that ability. B) How can I kill the adds when Garuda is on me, am I to take garuda on a walk around town while I'm at it?

LOL He blamed me for the loss and got me kicked!!

only job lvdd to 50 was his tank.
WORST TANK EVER.

But thats beside the point. This Vote Kick function is absolutely broke.
Mob mentality is not the way to go and is starting to to ruin the game. you vote kick someone for unjust reasons they should do a weeks ban or jail or something to that effect.