7.0 Tank Wishlist

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

I mean WAR is literally the best at everything right now (well second to GNB for damage but since you have 2 tanks anyway it doesn’t matter) DRK only passes it in hyper optimised groups that specifically use a DNC to buff its two minute window which is incredibly niche. Otherwise it used to be DRK for damage WAR for sustain, now WAR just gets both

And I don’t mean healers habe literally been removed from the game, I mean tanks have all but superseded the need for healers in casual content and the need for single target tank healing in savage

What if you got a WHM and their holy just infinitely stunned the mobs, or kardia healed you for 1000 potency per hit so you never had to mitigate outside of a TB, having another role so your job for you simply isn’t fun at all

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I mean I get you about WAR but that's just WAR lol. They love WAR, we all know that. WAR has a freaking aoe HoT like there is literally nothing they will not give this job. I've been playing this game so long I'm beyond caring about what WAR does, at this point I just want relatively decent balance and cool thematic stuff for the jobs I play that really lean into the job's identity.

Anyway healers have big problems in this game, but I disagree that tanks are the source of those problems. But I think I've gone back and forth about it enough. There's a healer forum for all that.

I dream of the day I can convince a single tank main (besides goatofwar) that tanks ridiculous sustain is a TANK balance problem not a healer balance problem

Talking about the tank sustain problem is a tank forum problem not a healer forum problem

I mean, I've said the tank sustain on basically anything not DRK is overtuned and needs to be rolled back a long time ago. I was met with more or less the same responses and pushback.

It's ridiculous how much we can do without accounting for healers.

This is what happens when people see the only balance that matters is dps.

The current design of self-sustain on tanks is absolutely a tank problem because it deskills players within the role. Tanks need to know exactly how much damage they get hit for, and the precise timings of incoming attacks including autos. That's what lets you know if its safe to sit at 100 HP for a few seconds while your healer gets to you or whether you need to burn a cooldown to get yourself into a safer range. Inexperienced tanks start panicking the instant that their HP drops below 90% because they have no clue how much damage actually goes out. The rotational regens and on-demand burst heals function as a sort of pacifier, allowing the wailing tank to press a button and soothe their tankxieties. If you want more active engagement with incoming damage outside of the occasional tankbuster, you need to more consistently push tanks to the brink.

It's a bit sad that you don't really see those 'games of chicken' anymore where everyone laughs nervously over how close to death you were. Everything just gets soaked up instantly in a swath of incidental heals. You're either at 100% or 0%.

A degree of self-sustain is fine, but this falls into the bigger problem of mitigation inflation. When you have an excess of defensive cooldowns, you lose the decision-making process around their use. Historically, if you accidentally pressed Hallowed Ground by mistake, not only were you likely to die over the next few minutes due to running out of mitigation tools on tankbusters, but you'd also then be sitting around for a couple of minutes pre-pull to let the cooldown reset. When you have excess cooldowns, there's no thought required around how you ration them. I think if they can't give tanks more of a role in positioning bosses, then they have to make mitigation and survival more interesting than it currently is. If not, there's absolutely no value in playing the role unless you're unable to swap to melee for some reason.

All of these could have been prevented if Bloodwhetting was simply be updated to only heal a portion of the damage dealt... basically, a lesser Bloodbath.

Though like I put in one of the other threads bloodwhetting even in single target alongside WAR’d other healing is still putting out close to 4500 healer potency per minute, the average healer is only putting out about 5500

Bloodwhetting in cleave content is not the only problem

Indeed. Too much healing potency.

taking drk into a levelling roulette is almost always a miserable experience. i'd take a dark mind rework. or add another defensive cd for drk that's not so conditional. also, a mistimed abyssal drain right when you get an insta-heal is just unfortunate and wasteful. have the overheal turn into shields. i don't think that'd be too broken or unreasonable.

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Originally Posted by Alphix

taking drk into a levelling roulette is almost always a miserable experience. i'd take a dark mind rework. or add another defensive cd for drk that's not so conditional. also, a mistimed abyssal drain right when you get an insta-heal is just unfortunate and wasteful. have the overheal turn into shields. i don't think that'd be too broken or unreasonable.

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Subjectivity notwithstanding, it really isn't, and the suggestion you listed with abyssal drain doesn't actually help the period of level 1-50 where I'll somewhat agree that DRK could use something. At most DRK needs a low level tbn, a 15% shield or something. TBN would obviously just replace it upon hitting level 70.

For all that is holy could people stop listing to change Dark Mind's niche with magic damage, changing that to a flat mit for all damage only furthers tank homogeneity. Not to mention in the content where it is used a lot (raids, generally) they would, without a doubt, nerf the mitigation on it if changed to an all-rounder.

Oh, and believe me. If they don't care about Bloodwhetting being essentially 4 benedictions in dungeons, they don't care about Abyssal Drain's overheal.

i'm not calling for dark mind to change into another rampart. though i guess it does sound like that when i used the word rework. i'd appreciate it having a convalescence-like effect, or another "applies slow when struck" effect like arm's length. something small.

it doesn't have to be a dark mind rework, just something would be nice. i wouldn't mind having a weaker tbn instead from 40 - 70, or salted earth giving drks 10% mitigation when they stand on it right when we unlock the skill, even better if we had both.