Are they getting rid of the job system?

I think we are about 2 pages away from someone saying "Just do what WoW did!"

Oh wait I just posted that. Nevermind!

:P

Happy April fools all you folk! :D

Another thread ? ? ?

I'm sorry but what is the point of all these threads you're making lately?

Wasn't the 'Cash-Shop' one enough lulz for you?

/endtrollthreadplease

But if by a slither A SLITHER of a chance you are being serious:
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/about/game/jobs

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lovztzBbbb1qai9up.gif

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Originally Posted by ClausL

That's fine if you want to just keep playing and 'just deal with it' but I think SE wants to get a larger audience than just the hardcore fans who will just 'deal with it'/'get used to it'

so if something is stupid, convoluted, and confusing and serves no purpose, I think they SHOULD consider changing it . I know for a fact the job system in place will lose them customers.

maybe I would agree with you about 'getting used to it', if it ended up being a good system once you understand it.. but that's not the case... it's a bad system

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If said customers include you than that would be a trait I'd plaster on the front and back of the box.

The dev team clearly believes in the armory system to provide options to solo and party play, a stepping stone to the job that the player will have to work for, and a basis for lore.

Oh, and provide your "facts" with evidence.

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Originally Posted by Shioban

Another thread ? ? ?

I'm sorry but what is the point of all these threads you're making lately?

Wasn't the 'Cash-Shop' one enough lulz for you?

/endtrollthreadplease

But if by a slither A SLITHER of a chance you are being serious:
http://eu.finalfantasyxiv.com/about/game/jobs

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a slither?!

but yeah, I'm aware that for now there's no news on whether job/armor system is staying as is

I'M ASKING IF YOU GUYS LIKE IT.

There was the post that Denmo posted a while back with all those pages of whether people liked it or not. That will be the best way to figure it out without people raging at you.

For the record I like it. It adds a bit more diversity to the game.

Jobs = Party. Classes = Solo

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Originally Posted by AmandaHuggenkiss

http://media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lovztzBbbb1qai9up.gif

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/comfort Amanda

Please keep this thread going... it's a masochistic type of pain.
http://i.imgur.com/a2cyCap.jpg

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Originally Posted by ClausL

I'm talking about how you start off as a class and turn into the job later and can 'unequip' your job and go between job/class is what needs to be removed, its too convoluted and pointless

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Whatevs. To me, that's one of the things about FFXIV that make it a different beast from other MMOs.

In most other MMOs, you can only be one or, at most, two classes. In ARR, you can be any and everything you aspire to be. All you have to do is put in the work. You aren't stuck with any class, and you can achieve more. Why would anyone want to change that?

I'm sorry if my response is something different from what you'd like to read. But calling people "white knights" because they disagree with your opinion really invalidates the point you're trying to make. Well, if you are, in fact, trying to make a point and are not really trolling.

Like if u do not like clausl

just because something has been brought up before does not mean that further discussion is unnecessary

The fact that it's not changed yet proves that more discussion IS necessary

This board is entirely white knights and blind fanboys. You really don't care what they do to FFXIV because you are going to play it regardless.

some people like me who have standards would realize how bad the armory system is, and want it to be changed. if you want to sit idly by and accept whatever horrible game mechanics are left in ARR, be my guest -- some people need a QUALITY PRODUCT if they're going to give it their money.

There was zero point in the armory system in FFXIV, the people saying class=solo, job=party are wrong. Nobody ever used classes. The whole system is pointless, convoluted and needs to be removed.

if you disagree, once again, you probably just don't care either way.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

just because something has been brought up before does not mean that further discussion is unnecessary

The fact that it's not changed yet proves that more discussion IS necessary

This board is entirely white knights and blind fanboys. You really don't care what they do to FFXIV because you are going to play it regardless.

some people like me who have standards would realize how bad the armory system is, and want it to be changed. if you want to sit idly by and accept whatever horrible game mechanics are left in ARR, be my guest -- some people need a QUALITY PRODUCT if they're going to give it their money.

There was zero point in the armory system in FFXIV, the people saying class=solo, job=party are wrong. Nobody ever used classes. The whole system is pointless, convoluted and needs to be removed.

if you disagree, once again, you probably just don't care either way.

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The thing of it is, you are not stating facts, merely opinions.

In your opinion, having multiple classes/jobs is a bad thing.

In your opinion, the armory system is bad.

And for you to spout off saying anyone who disagrees is simply white knighting the game is, in my opinion, a cheap and rather transparent cop-out. "I'm right, so anyone who disagrees is wrong." Might as well say that, for all the validation your insinuation gets you. People are not going to take such a post seriously. They're just going to shrug and point and laugh at you. I wish I had you as my rival in my college debate class. I would have made a much easier A.

I like the job system. I like that I can go on conjurer and access all my skills and be very versitile: aka a jack of all trades. But then when the situation calls for it, I can pop on my whm and focus strictly on healing and be the best class for it.

The Armory System is fine as is. It's not going away (and we know this because the developers continue to refer to Classes AND Jobs as two separate things). It's not confusing (I have honestly never had a problem with anyone understanding it the first time), and it serves it's purpose well.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

I guess I was just hoping Yoshi-P would fix it =/

to most people it seems confusing and redundant

seriously, try explaining the job/class system to a friend or new player... and explain why it's needed.

would it not just be better if there was just 'jobs', you started as a Dragoon from the get go? the whole class & job thing is bizarre

I'm not against every game mechanic, I'm looking forward to ARR. why are you attacking me? Kind of rude/low class. I asked a legitimate question.

Yoshi-P has changed a lot so I thought maybe he would toss out the job system.

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I've actually explained the class/job system/armoury system to plenty of friends.

It boils down to two things: specializaton and costomization.

So choosing which role to play (specific job) or a more open class, is dependent on the content you wish to do and your role in the party. There were some black mages that opted for thaumaturge vs ifrit for example, as playing the class provided more survivability. Suffice to say that having the freedom to be specialized and to be more open is never a bad thing. XIV handles this very well IMO.

Why is this system necessary? Starting out as the job automatically makes your character be stuck in that specialization. I'm not extremely familiar with how XI handled it, but I do know you could have a subjob, that's about as much as I know about XI since I never played it, nor intend to.

I feel the way it works right now in XIV leaves room for freedom, and as I stated earlier, freedom is never a bad thing.

The class/job/armoury system in XIV encourages people to play multiple classes and combinations without breaking the game and making it necessary to have X class lvld (I'm aware this happened in 1.0 but I'm pretty sure it won't occur in ARR).

I don't think yoshida will change this a lot, but I do think the development team will probably tweak it to make it more balanced. (So that those who want to only level and play one class can without many issues or expectations).

It sucks you don't like it though, as there is honestly a very minuscule chance this system will be changed.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

just because something has been brought up before does not mean that further discussion is unnecessary

The fact that it's not changed yet proves that more discussion IS necessary

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Logical fallacy. This is true if and only if this facet of the game is unanimously in need of overhaul, which it isn't. A vocal minority does not equate to "unanimous", and while there may be even a portion of the player base in favor of change, the fact remains that it doesn't represent the whole. Opinions and arguments for and against an overhaul have been shared ad nauseaum, and the product of said input will be what you see come release.

This is what happens when different viewpoints between multiple consumers and the developers come to a head. Regardless of how many people are involved, you still get only one result. Take it or leave it.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

I see. well, if you personally like the system, I have no problem with that. I dealt with 4 pages of people calling me a troll, telling me to shut up and leave the forum, and personally attacking me, so maybe I got caught up and didn't notice that someone was just giving their opinion.

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I, personally, have no problem with people voicing their opinions. Nor do I feel that people need to "leave the forum" because their opinion is not popular. I just think the class and armory system is great. To me, it makes ARR stand out from other MMOs in a way that I wish other MMOs incorporated into their games. One of the things I hated about MMOs was being stuck in one role, one class, one style of play the entire game, unless you wanted to completely reroll your character. FFXIV allows for exploration not only within the world, but with your character as well. Be what you want, when you want. Experiment. Try playing this way or that. It's one thing I think FFXIV did right from the beginning.

I don't think the subclassing and taking skills from the other jobs needs to be done away with, just the class to job progression. There would still be freedom and options if they rehaul it properly. I stand by my opinion that the way its done currently is needlessly convoluted.

I mean even if you like it, surely you can agree that it AT LEAST needs some work?

well, you already heard my opinion that they should get rid of armory classes entirely. It's hard for me to really make suggestions in favor of keeping the classes and just tweaking them, because I think that's the wrong path to follow.

I think it's good they have it this way, because this way you can use the same classes mixed with others to make new jobs. I think it adds a sense of accomplishment to leveling up a job, because it takes work. It adds customization to characters.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

I don't think the subclassing and taking skills from the other jobs needs to be done away with, just the class to job progression. There would still be freedom and options if they rehaul it properly. I stand by my opinion that the way its done currently is needlessly convoluted.

I mean even if you like it, surely you can agree that it AT LEAST needs some work?

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Elaborate on how the system is comvoluted. I think It's very straight forward. You equip a job stone and become a specialized role with a few new abilities. You don't equip a job stone and you stay as a class with much more freedom of costomization and play style.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

Anyone know if they're getting rid of the job system for ARR?

the class/job system is totally pointless and confusing.

they should just combine classes and jobs into one thing.

who agrees that this is a horrible system which should be scrapped? :mad:

it's a real turn off to new players, because it makes no sense.

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LOL it definitely does make sense. It's not that bad at all.

It's explained to you when you start the game...Isn't that enough? It's practically spoon fed! Did you play XI? Probably not...I'm sure you'd be even more confused about subjobs....

You must be Trolling. You must be.

XI had a pretty great job system, if you ask me. It was way better than this garbage.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

I guess I was just hoping Yoshi-P would fix it =/

to most people it seems confusing and redundant

seriously, try explaining the job/class system to a friend or new player... and explain why it's needed.

would it not just be better if there was just 'jobs', you started as a Dragoon from the get go? the whole class & job thing is bizarre

I'm not against every game mechanic, I'm looking forward to ARR. why are you attacking me? Kind of rude/low class. I asked a legitimate question.

Yoshi-P has changed a lot so I thought maybe he would toss out the job system.

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ummm most new players get the class/job system...its not all that hard...in fact its easier then what your making it out to be....You would have to be like....8 years old not to figure out how to work it >.>

As soon as you used insults, you lost any chance of proving your point. Although it's also true for those who bruttaly attacked you.

Here's an argument against you, though...new players don't have access to jobs, and by the time they hit their first level 30 class, they probably understand how the game works, so the jobs won't confuse them.
So, your major point is...pointless

It's not entirely the matter of whether it will confuse people.

why is it necessary to begin with? It isn't. it's just a useless crappy system that shouldn't even exist anymore IMO.

It's funny how Yoshi-P is so willing to scrap tons of 1.0 elements that weren't really that bad yet they're holding onto the armory system which most people never liked.

The armoy system and the job system are two different things.

Even if you could chose you class regardless of your weapon, you could still equip a soul crystal that restricts your cross-classed abilities and gives you job specific ones.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

which most people never liked.

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[citation needed]

Still think you're trolling, OP.

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Originally Posted by Obsy

[citation needed]

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well, MOST people never liked XIV in its entirity, at least based on the active subscriptions/server populations before 1.23 was taken down... I think that much should be telling that the armor/job system wasn't loved, as it's a big part of the game.

if you want specific examples that most people don't like it, look at any other XIV related forum for proof. You'll find dozens upon dozens of negative posts regarding the system.

you just won't find much criticism for FFXIV on the official forums because it will get greeted with similar responses that are ITT; gtfo, troll troll troll, dont feed the troll, it was perfect, fanboy comments.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

well, MOST people never liked XIV in its entirity, at least based on the active subscriptions/server populations before 1.23 was taken down... I think that much should be telling that the armor/job system wasn't loved, as it's a big part of the game.

if you want specific examples that most people don't like it, look at any other XIV related forum for proof. You'll find dozens upon dozens of negative posts regarding the system.

you just won't find much criticism for FFXIV on the official forums because it will get greeted with similar responses that are ITT; gtfo, troll troll troll, don't feed the troll, it was perfect, fanboy comments.

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But where is the specific proof that the armor/job system was not liked? Did Yoshi or any of the other devs say that got a lot of criticism? Are there numerous records that show it wasn't liked (polls, journalistic editorials, ect.) Just saying it wasn't liked because the game didn't do well is like saying nobody likes chocolate because you don't see anyone eating chocolate covered used socks. Where is the specific proof that the armory/jobs system was even close to universally reviled in the game? I think that's what Obsy was trying to ask.

again, a very short venture into any FFXIV board ... the ARR board, FFXI/FFXIV/FF fansites, discussions on public forums like Reddit etc... should give you some incite on whether the armory system is liked or not. People hate it.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

well, MOST people never liked XIV in its entirity, at least based on the active subscriptions/server populations before 1.23 was taken down... I think that much should be telling that the armor/job system wasn't loved, as it's a big part of the game.

if you want specific examples that most people don't like it, look at any other XIV related forum for proof. You'll find dozens upon dozens of negative posts regarding the system.

you just won't find much criticism for FFXIV on the official forums because it will get greeted with similar responses that are ITT; gtfo, troll troll troll, dont feed the troll, it was perfect, fanboy comments.

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FFXIV 1.0 had many issues, the armory/class system wasn't one of them. the only gripe I recall some people having was having no jobs available, that was resolved once they released them.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

again, a very short venture into any FFXIV board ... the ARR board, fansites, public forums like Reddit... should give you some incite on whether the armory system is liked or not. People hate it.

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I've been to plenty of numerous sites, and I haven't really seen any evidence that the armory/job system in FFXIV was universally reviled. I've read just about everything Yoshi and others have fed to us by way of info, and they have made no mention of the job/armory system not being liked either. It might help if you could give some direct links to proof that the job/armory system was not liked by most.

I would need to PM it, and there's no PM system. sorry.

point is removal of the class->job progression is probably the biggest request by people for ARR,. most people want Yoshi to get rid of it.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

I would need to PM it, and there's no PM system. sorry.

point is removal of the class->job progression is probably the biggest request by ARR testers, countless people want Yoshi to get rid of it.

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Forgive me for being skeptical, but I know a lot of gripes being made about this game, and not one of them is about the job/armory system. And without being able to provide some kind of proof... well... how can you expect your argument that the job/armory system in the game is mostly not liked to hold any water?

Claus, even the gametrailers.com review that gave the 4.3/10 said that one of the few good things about the game was the armory system. The job system however, wasn't even released back then.

And I'm gonna point out that 500 post thread again over this very same subject that I linked for you earlier. It was hotly debated already to death.

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Originally Posted by SkyeWindbinder

I've been to plenty of numerous sites, and I haven't really seen any evidence that the armory/job system in FFXIV was universally reviled. I've read just about everything Yoshi and others have fed to us by way of info, and they have made no mention of the job/armory system not being liked either. It might help if you could give some direct links to proof that the job/armory system was not liked by most.

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It would be easier to build a bridge for him to live under rather then send him to find proof...but to each his own lol jk

well... again, you'll just have to look around.

I'm not trying to prove to you that a lot of people agree with me (but they do), I'm just saying that the class to job progression is useless and poorly designed.

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Originally Posted by Denmo

Claus, even the gametrailers.com review that gave the 4.3/10 said that one of the few good things about the game was the armory system. The job system however, wasn't even released back then.

And I'm gonna point out that 500 post thread again over this very same subject that I linked for you earlier. It was hotly debated already to death.

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I'm specifically talking about the class->job progression

Yes, the class system was okay... they need to keep classes, or keep jobs, having both is meaningless and unnecessary.

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Originally Posted by ClausL

well, MOST people never liked XIV in its entirity, at least based on the active subscriptions/server populations before 1.23 was taken down... I think that much should be telling that the armor/job system wasn't loved, as it's a big part of the game.

if you want specific examples that most people don't like it, look at any other XIV related forum for proof. You'll find dozens upon dozens of negative posts regarding the system.

you just won't find much criticism for FFXIV on the official forums because it will get greeted with similar responses that are ITT; gtfo, troll troll troll, dont feed the troll, it was perfect, fanboy comments.

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Fyi When that person said citation needed they didn't want your word for it they're wanting tangible proof ergo give us a direct link to said url that specifically says all that. Otherwise your defense is bs...

btw is it just me or is this almost like the grass thread all over again or the gil reduction thread >.<

As people have said there isn't anything wrong with having specialization and the class/job system. No matter what it opens up abilities (especially a lot of the ones they took out when they were revamping the system to begin with and it was acceptable), and from my memory this isn't the first time it's been done like that though not under the same name. The Original Final Fantasy game you went from White mage to White Wizard, Black Mage to Black Wizard so on and so forth. People early on from MY memory were always bitching because there WERE no jobs and lo and behold Yoshi-P said, "You wanz jobz you can haz jobs!" and it was good... we're still waiting for the seventh day so he can rest.