Merlwyb, Kan-E, Raubahn, Cid: Dead or Alive?

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Originally Posted by Kallera

I say make it interesting and kill em off...except for Kan-E-Sama....

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If we wanted to make things interesting why would we keep the least interesting one?

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Originally Posted by Charismatic

If we wanted to make things interesting why would we keep the least interesting one?

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She's interesting to me. Then again, I'm partial to that form of speech/character.

More or less, all three leaders are the same if you think about it. Charismatic, wise, powerful and strong leaders. Some just don't throw their fists up in the air~

Don't get me wrong, I like all three of them... Merlwyb is a woman of action. Kan is a woman of words.
Raubauhn is THE BULL!

Plus, I mean... Merlwyb's speech cutscene sealed the deal for me. I mean who catches a throwing axe and tosses it back mid-speech without even skipping a beat? The Admiral. That is who.


That said, what is more pressing is whether or not Raya-O-Senna survived! She better have.

I think any NPCs of any significance, with the exception of Louisoix, will make a return in ARR.

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Originally Posted by Thebard

They deserve to die, they did f*ck all in that battle.

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Raubahn and Merlwyb may have been capable, but they are Generals/Leaders of the Grand Companies..
Someone in a position like that can't risk themselves in a conflict when there could be more to come.

Like now..

If (I'm relatively sure they are alive) they were on the main battlefield, they could have easily been killed from the the fall of the "key" out of Dalamud, the initial debris from Dalamud, or just gotten cut down in general.

You (the player) may be "important" but as far as I see it you are like a champion, and are meant to be in high risk battles like that.

Plus, its obvious at the end that Louisoix knew something of how the battle would turn out, so they probably had forewarning of some sort (that Dalamud would open), even if they didn't know the exact outcome.

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Originally Posted by Thebard

If Admiral Fishwife lives she needs a patch on one eye a hook hand and a peg-leg.

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I actually think she would look awesome with an eyepatch.

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

I see you're gonna make me dig the interview up...


Source: http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...l=1#post900910
There's also more in the interview about what the story in ARR will actually entail.

There's no official translation, of course, but this is evidence enough, and more recent than the old statement you're referring to.

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They scrapped most of the original 1.0 storyline (path of the twelve and all that pacifist crap), but the circle of knowing is officially part of the grand companies storyline, and they aren't scrapping that.

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Originally Posted by Thebard

They deserve to die, they did f*ck all in that battle.

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Originally Posted by Exn

At least Kann-E got off her choco and took a somewhat battle-ready stance!! Grid was READY! As for them other 2 clowns...

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This is just a shot in the dark, but I'm pretty sure that as military leaders, their role on the battlefield is to survey the war as it happens and call the shots for their armies, much like van Baelsar was doing from the air.

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Originally Posted by Obsy

This is just a shot in the dark, but I'm pretty sure that as military leaders, their role on the battlefield is to survey the war as it happens and call the shots for their armies, much like van Baelsar was doing from the air.

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Hopefully we'll see more of the Van Generals in the future. (Van as in the front of the army.)

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Originally Posted by Obsy

This is just a shot in the dark, but I'm pretty sure that as military leaders, their role on the battlefield is to survey the war as it happens and call the shots for their armies, much like van Baelsar was doing from the air.

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He wasn't here to give commands in the battle, he was just an observer to see which site win.
He want to conquer Eorzea without Dalamud destroying everything.

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Originally Posted by Felis

He wasn't here to give commands in the battle, he was just an observer to see which site win.
He want to conquer Eorzea without Dalamud destroying everything.

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What with the air superiority he seemed to have over the cities its a wonder why he didn't just beat dalamud to the punch.

I'm sure they will be alive as Yoshi-P has said (will find quote) that the opening sequence and beginning storyline will explain what happened in the moments after the end of an era trailer and the fates of Louisiox and Co. The real mystery will be in how they survived. Its like watching the end of a cliffhanger TV show where the main Chr is laying in a pool of blood then the episode ends "Tune in next week for the exciting conclusion of End of an Era!" It would be like ending the first Iron Man movie after Tony got blowed up.

I like to instead entertain ideas on HOW they were spared. I heard Odin might have come in, that the beasttribes came in with their Primals and temporarily imprisoned Bahamut, among a few others. I think of the old "keys" on Dalamud there were more than 12, they were not just magic seals but technology enhanced ones. For the sake of the planet the Primals and Gods worked together with all the Citizens of Erozea to end the threat (some lore about Nael Van Darnus and the Ishgardians that I'm not remembering off hand.)

They alive just inside the crystal tower

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Originally Posted by Felis

He wasn't here to give commands in the battle, he was just an observer to see which site win.
He want to conquer Eorzea without Dalamud destroying everything.

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Ohhhh right... That's beside the point I was making, but yes.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

They scrapped most of the original 1.0 storyline (path of the twelve and all that pacifist crap), but the circle of knowing is officially part of the grand companies storyline, and they aren't scrapping that.

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The grand companies storyline with the circle of knowing, reuniting the three companies, and trying to stop Dalamud and such was live, one time only content for 1.0 players. So yes, that's getting scrapped too along with the original 1.0 storyline. We aren't getting any of the same missions in ARR.

And like I said, the essence of the story will remain, so the circle of knowing, grand companies, primals, beastmen, the Echo, Garlemald, Van Baelsar, the aftermath of Dalamud, Bahamut, these will all still be relevant in ARR.

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Originally Posted by Vilhem

Um, I actually worry about Limsa and Uldah ;/ I mean...Limsa pretty much took it in the face..not so much from falling meteors as from the tidal waves that erupted from them ><

And Uldah took some hits too, so... Thancred ;-;

Still searching for that confirmation btw

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And that pissed me off. I was wanting to see grid burn to a crisp, but instea limsa gets mowed down, so visually :(

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Originally Posted by Reika

And that pissed me off. I was wanting to see grid burn to a crisp

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HAH! Neva gonna happen..
We wuz the front line of the war.. and we the ones still standin when the dust settled..
GRID4LYFE!!

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

The grand companies storyline with the circle of knowing, reuniting the three companies, and trying to stop Dalamud and such was live, one time only content for 1.0 players. So yes, that's getting scrapped too along with the original 1.0 storyline. We aren't getting any of the same missions in ARR.

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The fact that it's "one time content" has nothing to do with it. It just means that it won't be playable, not that it won't be relevant to ARR's story. The fact that the content isn't playable has really nothing to do with what we're talking about here.

The only part Yoshida talks about when he mentions "scrapping" is the part of the storyline that was in the game at release, IE, most of the characters and organizations that appeared only before the GC storyline won't make a comeback in the new story. He's not talking of what will be playable and what won't.

Reading the original article (and not just a summary) makes it quite clear.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

The fact that it's "one time content" has nothing to do with it. It just means that it won't be playable, not that it won't be relevant to ARR's story. The fact that the content isn't playable has really nothing to do with what we're talking about here.

The only part Yoshida talks about when he mentions "scrapping" is the part of the storyline that was in the game at release, IE, most of the characters and organizations that appeared only before the GC storyline won't make a comeback in the new story. He's not talking of what will be playable and what won't.

Reading the original article (and not just a summary) makes it quite clear.

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So no ashcrown consortium and their beastmen peacemakers?

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Originally Posted by Kallera

So no ashcrown consortium and their beastmen peacemakers?

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"The original story got scrapped, but the essence is still there". So it depends on what they decided to leave unchanged.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

The fact that it's "one time content" has nothing to do with it. It just means that it won't be playable, not that it won't be relevant to ARR's story. The fact that the content isn't playable has really nothing to do with what we're talking about here.

The only part Yoshida talks about when he mentions "scrapping" is the part of the storyline that was in the game at release, IE, most of the characters and organizations that appeared only before the GC storyline won't make a comeback in the new story. He's not talking of what will be playable and what won't.

Reading the original article (and not just a summary) makes it quite clear.

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Alright, well regardless that doesn't make anything I said untrue, we just had slightly different definitions of the term "scrapping."

None of the 1.0 missions will be playable, and also the events and lore from the original 1.0 main storyline may be changed to some degree.

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

None of the 1.0 missions will be playable

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Which doesn't matter in any way to this discussion.

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and also the events and lore from the original 1.0 main storyline may be changed to some degree.

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He never said this, and it's highly unlikely.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

He never said this, and it's highly unlikely.

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indirectly, he did. When he says "everything about the original story was changed", it implies the missions were changed too.

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Originally Posted by Reika

And that pissed me off. I was wanting to see grid burn to a crisp, but instea limsa gets mowed down, so visually :(

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I bet they didn't blow up Gridania on purpose just to mess with everyone that wanted to see it burn.

After all those over-aspected clusters we gave the Grand Companies (a Raise item), I'm sure they will have no trouble keeping our leaders alive.

I guess it all depends on the "something" that happens after Louisoix fades to white.

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

indirectly, he did. When he says "everything about the original story was changed", it implies the missions were changed too.

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he did not say that. He simply said that the original story was set aside after its conclusion, and not revisited or expanded with the GC storyline and further. In fact the Ashcrown Consortium, the Path of the Twelve and what not didn't appear any more. This doesn't mean that that part of the story did not happen.

He didn't mention any actual changes to the original story. Directly or indirectly.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

he did not say that. He simply said that the original story was set aside after its conclusion, and not revisited or expanded with the GC storyline and further. In fact the Ashcrown Consortium, the Path of the Twelve and what not didn't appear any more. This doesn't mean that that part of the story did not happen.

He didn't mention any actual changes to the original story. Directly or indirectly.

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Yes, he did. Here's the part:

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――『旧FFXIV』をプレイしている人からすると、どこまで以前の物語を残すのかが気になります。
--As someone who was playing FFXIV 1.0 [literally: former FFXIV], I'm wondering how much of the original story is left [in ARR]

吉田：『新生FFXIV』のストーリーは、グランドカンパニーの物語がメインになります。そこに『旧FFXIV』のメインストーリーのキャラが絡んできたりする予定です。できるだけ以前の物語は残そうと思いましたが、結局は全部変えました。エッセンスは微妙に残ってはいますが（笑）。
ARR's main story will be the grand company storyline. We plan to make characters from 1.0's storyline appear in that one. We wanted to keep as much of the original story as possible, but in the end we ended up changing everything. The essence is still present though (laugh)

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From: Dengeki inteview, full summary linked on the first page of Rein's translation thread.

If they made it out then they would be changed to show where the hit happen...and they would have some regret where they (and others) failed to stop Bahamut and far as Lousiux I think he died fighting Bahamut after we got sent off to the void.

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

Yes, he did. Here's the part:

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You're misinterpreting it. He's saying exactly what I say.

ARR's main story is based on the grand company story. They planned to make the characters from the original storyline appear in THAT one (the grand company storyline, that we already saw. With former FFXIV he refers to the Tanaka Story, not to what came after it). What they changed was the plans to include those characters and the plans to continue that storyline that were already in place when Yoshida joined, not the story itself that had already happened in the game.

There isn't a single element in the grand company storyline that conflicts with the already published part of the story of 1.0, in fact the essence of the story of 1.0 has been preserved, and nothing has been actually retconned. Most of its characters simply don't appear anymore and the plans that Tanaka team had for expansion were never applied.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

ARR's main story is based on the grand company story.

What they changed was the plans to include those characters and the plans to continue that storyline that were already in place when Yoshida joined, not the story itself that had already happened in the game.

There isn't a single element in the grand company storyline that conflicts with the already published part of the story of 1.0, in fact the essence of the story of 1.0 has been preserved, and nothing has been actually retconned. Most of its characters simply don't appear anymore and the plans that Tanaka team had for expansion were never applied.

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This was my position from the start. You keep arguing semantics.

The 1.0 missions and Tanaka's story aren't getting used in ARR (other than the core essence) and there will be a new story in place in 2.0. Yes, all the 1.0 missions happened historically, but the mission content has been scrapped and isn't getting used again in ARR.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

You're misinterpreting it. He's saying exactly what I say.

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Not really, the rest of you post reiterates what I translated... how is that misinterpreting o.O
What prompted me to post that part of the interview was this part:

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He simply said that the original story was set aside after its conclusion, and not revisited or expanded with the GC storyline and further.

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This is correct, however the news about the old story being changed completely is newer. So even though we already completed those missions, it doesn't mean the new players won't be playing them in a new form. An introduction to the Echo and who gave it to us still has to be done for the new players. So depending on how differently they want to do it, we might see the old missions in a slightly different form, or not see them at all.

Basically, for me "former main story" includes both missions released in 1.0 and those they planned to introduce later.

Going back to the original topic though, AFAIR YoshiP mentioned the GC leaders are safe. As to why and how, we will have to wait till ARR.

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Originally Posted by Inaaca

That being said, I don't believe it's likely that the GC leaders or the Circle of Knowing members have perished, because fantasy like this is more likely to spend moments with a character when they perish to create emotional impact, as was done with Louisoix.

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Highly agree with this. The storyline has thrown a few 'holy crap wtf' moments my way, so I'm not going to make any assumptions here, anything can happen. But I do feel that the Generals are too loved to just kill off. They are strong characters, lots of personality, and very popular with the playerbase. I feel that the team would be hard-pressed to create characters to replace them in our hearts, and I think they would probably recognize that.

Plus, getting back to what Inaaca said, they weren't really showcased in the trailer the way Louisoix was. iirc there were only a couple brief shots of them. And I feel like if they were going to be killed off, they would have been killed on the battlefield, fighting til the bitter end, so we would remember them as heroes much like the way we do Louisoix. (as opposed to the 'omg they were cowards not doing anything' opinion somebody had)

As for Cid.. he's Cid, and I agree with everyone who said there can't be a Final Fantasy without Cid.

Edit: apparently this is off-topic now because everyone is arguing about the storyline. Oh well. Maybe this can bring the thread back on-topic.

It was possible for Cid to die in VI so it isn't without precedent to kill him off in XIV.

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Originally Posted by Soukyuu

Not really, the rest of you post reiterates what I translated... how is that misinterpreting

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Applying the "changed everything" to the story that has already been published, and not to the plans Tanaka had to expand the story.

Yoshida reiterated many times that the story in ARR is a direct sequel to that of FFXIV, so quite obviously players won't replay the old missions in any form.

They don't really need to, in order to introduce the echo they can simply make them discover it otherwise, this assuming that the echo will appear at all in the new story, which is definitely not a given.

If they weren't willing to sacrifice the design of the lukewarm minfilia, they won't toss the GC leaders.

lets just hope cid died a horrible death and reincarnated into a better designer non surfer cid.

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Originally Posted by Majidah

If they weren't willing to sacrifice the design of the lukewarm minfilia, they won't toss the GC leaders.

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Didn't they actually do that?

I foudn her kind of cute though...

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Didn't they actually do that?

I foudn her kind of cute though...

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If anyone has followed the GC Midlander thread, you'll see Minfilia is much deeper than just Path of the Twelve. She's actually Ascilia from the main Ul'dah storyline. Topic wise, it wouldn't make sense for the GC Leaders whose leadership inspire hope and courage to participate in a battle that doesn't even have a major threat in a Legatus leading it. There's many and more battles to come, no reason to sacrifice themselves and leave the GC companies leaderless when the war has just begun.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Didn't they actually do that?

I foudn her kind of cute though...

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She's confirmed for ARR. She got a bit of a makeover, though.
http://f.cl.ly/items/423g090F1r0n250I3I0P/minfilia.jpg

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Originally Posted by NoloeTazier

If anyone has followed the GC Midlander thread, you'll see Minfilia is much deeper than just Path of the Twelve. She's actually Ascilia from the main Ul'dah storyline. Topic wise, it wouldn't make sense for the GC Leaders whose leadership inspire hope and courage to participate in a battle that doesn't even have a major threat in a Legatus leading it. There's many and more battles to come, no reason to sacrifice themselves and leave the GC companies leaderless when the war has just begun.

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GC Midlander thread?
Ascilia ?

I have no idea what you're talking about.
Ascilia is the name of the little kid who's father is killed in the main uldah plot AFAIK. Which happens in the same timeline as the main storyline, thus it'd be impossible for Minfilia to be Ascilia...

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Originally Posted by Bowen

She's confirmed for ARR. She got a bit of a makeover, though.
http://f.cl.ly/items/423g090F1r0n250I3I0P/minfilia.jpg

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oooh love her new design :D