FFXIV-- the fear of a WoW Clone is real...

What wow clone come on .... Between graphic ..for me Wow is a 1/10 ..when final fantasy is at 10/10 ...i never play wow cos its a childish cartoon game graphic

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Originally Posted by Alerith

And once again, this topic rears it's ugly head... I'm not even sure people know what the definition of a WoW clone even is anymore.


"THEY ARE ADDING STREAMLINED/COMMON/BASIC MMO SYSTEMS TO THE GAME! DOOM I SAY! DOOOOOOOOOOOOOM!"

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WHY DOESN'T SQUARE-ENIX WORRY LESS ABOUT MAKING MONEY AND MORE ABOUT CATERING A GAME DIRECTLY TO MY TASTES?

I don't care.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

there taking samples from the wrong games...that much is certain.

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They're probably contrasting what worked and what didn't, and of the good stuff they find, what would mesh with their vision for XIV, or how could they tweak it to be fresh for XIV.

You know, like how actual game design works. It's not like they're sitting down and copying features.

People are so goddamn alarmist.

They will not make it into a WoW clone, I know that, they will take some things from WoW, GW2, SWTOR etc that worked well and see if they can be tweaked a little and added, whilst keeping it as FFXIV.

Video games have always borrowed things from each other, would Sonic have killed things by jumping on them if it wasn't for Mario? FPS games allow you to crouch, does that mean they are all Quake clones? (idk what the first FPS was) all RPGs have healing does that make all RPGs Final Fantasy clones? hell all games of a certain genre tend to share the same control schemes (racing games on PS used to be X for throttle, circle for brake, R1 and L1 for gears) does that mean they are all clones?

LBP plays a lot like the old Sonic games, does that mean it's a Sonic clone? You can borrow certain elements that worked from games and still make them unique, people are throwing Rift around when that was completely designed to be a WoW clone from day one, FFXIV was not.

I would bet that 99% of the things in WoW are based on other games, but you get people like the OP that seem to think WoW invented everything, WoW's raids are based on the same concept as Dynamis, Limbus and Einhejar just to name a few, and FFXI probably used them from another game. All MMOs must have an auction house now (if you listen to this community) does that make every MMO that uses an AH a FFXI/EQ clone (no idea if EQ used one)

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Originally Posted by Delsus

They will not make it into a WoW clone, I know that, they will take some things from WoW, GW2, SWTOR etc that worked well and see if they can be tweaked a little and added, whilst keeping it as FFXIV.

Video games have always borrowed things from each other, would Sonic have killed things by jumping on them if it wasn't for Mario? FPS games allow you to crouch, does that mean they are all Quake clones? (idk what the first FPS was) all RPGs have healing does that make all RPGs Final Fantasy clones? hell all games of a certain genre tend to share the same control schemes (racing games on PS used to be X for throttle, circle for brake, R1 and L1 for gears) does that mean they are all clones?

LBP plays a lot like the old Sonic games, does that mean it's a Sonic clone? You can borrow certain elements that worked from games and still make them unique, people are throwing Rift around when that was completely designed to be a WoW clone from day one, FFXIV was not.

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Don't reply with logic, you have to pour on the doom and gloom without ever actually playing the game yourself. This game needs to basically be FFXI with new FFXI skins! If it's not FFXI then I'll just keep playing FFXI.

Apart from the part where GW2 isn't a wow clone.

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Originally Posted by Zyph

They're probably contrasting what worked and what didn't, and of the good stuff they find, what would mesh with their vision for XIV, or how could they tweak it to be fresh for XIV.

You know, like how actual game design works. It's not like they're sitting down and copying features.

People are so goddamn alarmist.

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SWTOR literally has nothing new to add to the genre, and what it does have there are better examples elsewhere. GW2 does have a few interesting pieces of stuff but is far to early to tell what will work and what doesn't.

people are so quick to pounce.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

SWTOR literally has nothing new to add to the genre, and what it does have there are better examples elsewhere. GW2 does have a few interesting pieces of stuff but is far to early to tell what will work and what doesn't.

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Yoshi-P knows what direction he wants the game to go in, so it's not to early, if something looks like it will take him in the right direction he will investigate, if it doesn't he won't.

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Originally Posted by Delsus

Yoshi-P knows what direction he wants the game to go in, so it's not to early, if something looks like it will take him in the right direction he will investigate, if it doesn't he won't.

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yes, i know.....

Have faith in Yoshi-P. I truly believe Yoshi is adding the best part of other MMO while listening to the player base request while at the same time continue to make FFXIV ARR special in it's own way! Believe because they are doing their best not to screw up again.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

SWTOR literally has nothing new to add to the genre, and what it does have there are better examples elsewhere. GW2 does have a few interesting pieces of stuff but is far to early to tell what will work and what doesn't.

people are so quick to pounce.

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I wasn't pouncing on you specifically, but everyone in this thread spelling doom. It doesn't matter what other games did things better than SWTOR, they specifically said they were looking at SWTOR so that's what's being included and cited in this conversation. SWTOR had great storytelling and voice acting. Let's hope SE's drawing inspiration from that.

And GW2's been out 3 months, it's pretty obvious what's working. I can only hope SE's looking at some of the open world play aspects or the concept of multiple paths in a dungeon, each with a unique story to tell and different boss (Toto-rak almost had this.)

But looking at where games failed and succeeded in broad concepts is far different from saying "Guild Wars 2 has two currency types, one for primarily player/player transactions and one for player/NPC transactions, let's do exactly this." They are not the same thing.

SE is a company that wants to make money, and the way companies make games is almost a direct result of what people want in a game. If you are wondering why no niche genres of MMOs can survive you have to look no further than yourself when placing blame. I know there is a small number of us that want nothing more than a nice community that enjoys a very rich and specific game direction where things aren't always handed to us so easily and gear is an actual achievement when obtained. But more and more we are going to see companies go away from those specific ideas that some communities (like the ffxi community) enjoy and hold dear, including myself. We are coming to an age in gaming where in order for a MMO to become and stay successful they must cater to the masses and make games so general that it can appeal to a large number of peoples tastes.

At the end of the day I believe that SE has done a pretty good job so far with 2.0. It's "westerny" enough to appeal to those people who only know and want to play those WoW style button mashers, and Japanese enough to hold the attention of old school XI lovers.

How dare they improve gameplay and customer retention by studying the successful points of other MMOs. The horror.

1.0 was different and everyone seemed to hate different. So now they're giving us something familiar and now we're fearful of it being too similar to something else. Do we really even know what we want?

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Originally Posted by Legado

SE is a company that wants to make money, and the way companies make games is almost a direct result of what people want in a game. If you are wondering why no niche genres of MMOs can survive you have to look no further than yourself when placing blame. I know there is a small number of us that want nothing more than a nice community that enjoys a very rich and specific game direction where things aren't always handed to us so easily and gear is an actual achievement when obtained. But more and more we are going to see companies go away from those specific ideas that some communities (like the ffxi community) enjoy and hold dear, including myself. We are coming to an age in gaming where in order for a MMO to become and stay successful they must cater to the masses and make games so general that it can appeal to a large number of peoples tastes.

At the end of the day I believe that SE has done a pretty good job so far with 2.0. It's "westerny" enough to appeal to those people who only know and want to play those WoW style button mashers, and Japanese enough to hold the attention of old school XI lovers.

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*THIS* I've always believe the same way. And Yoshi P is doing his best to make FFXIV ARR a mixture of both.

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Originally Posted by Eremite

How dare they improve gameplay and customer retention by studying the successful points of other MMOs. The horror.

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10/10 would like again.

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Originally Posted by Zyph

I wasn't pouncing on you specifically, but everyone in this thread spelling doom. It doesn't matter what other games did things better than SWTOR, they specifically said they were looking at SWTOR so that's what's being included and cited in this conversation. SWTOR had great storytelling and voice acting. Let's hope SE's drawing inspiration from that.

And GW2's been out 3 months, it's pretty obvious what's working. I can only hope SE's looking at some of the open world play aspects or the concept of multiple paths in a dungeon, each with a unique story to tell and different boss (Toto-rak almost had this.)

But looking at where games failed and succeeded in broad concepts is far different from saying "Guild Wars 2 has open world quests where you can just kill mobs and gain credit without talking to NPCs, let's do exactly this." They are not the same thing.

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Final Fantasy 14 had dame good voice acting, why would they need to look else where for that? perhaps Yoshi should stop looking outward and start looking in.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

Final Fantasy 14 had dame good voice acting, why would they need to look else where for that? perhaps Yoshi should stop looking outward and start looking in.

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Really? I didn't see voice acting anywhere but the opening, did you? And most of it wasn't dialogue or character development based, it was exposition and quips.

They already said they're doing VA work for the main storyline, so it looks like they've at least got that.

I giggle every time I see different people defining different games a "wow clone" simply because they (most of the times irrationally) don't like them, no matter the fact that none of them is actually a clone of anything.

It's become the "generic MMORPG insult" for when one has nothing logical to express in terms of criticism.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

Final Fantasy 14 had dame good voice acting, why would they need to look else where for that? perhaps Yoshi should stop looking outward and start looking in.

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Did you play the game past chapter 1? Oh, and by the way, the English voice acting in Final Fantasy XIV was one of the worst I've seen in the past few years. The choice of actors was horribly botched, and the lines were delivered in a generally unconvincing way.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

Did you play the game past chapter 1? Oh, and by the way, the voice acting in Final Fantasy XIV was one of the worst I've seen in the past few years. The choice of actors was horribly botched, and the lines were delivered in a generally unconvincing way.

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LIMSA LOMINSA! AH-HAH-HAH! A SIGHT FOR ME SORE EYES!

YOU'D SELL YOUR MOTHER FOR A FEW COINS

I'D SELL MY FATHER TOO

no.

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Originally Posted by Ceravic

LIMSA LOMINSA! AH-HAH-HAH! A SIGHT FOR ME SORE EYES!

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Haha, I will always have that quote in my head

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Originally Posted by Ceravic

LIMSA LOMINSA! AH-HAH-HAH! A SIGHT FOR ME SORE EYES!

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I still remember that line, exactly how it is said from my alpha and beta days, such an awesome line delivered perfectly, also it was pretty much hammered into my head with all the character resets, got sick of LL eventually so joined Ul'dah, Y'stola is my favorite archon by far.

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Originally Posted by Delsus

I still remember that line, exactly how it is said from my alpha and beta days, such an awesome line delivered perfectly

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*facepalms*

The voice acting won't be a concern to us weeaboos though. You guys see the list of VAs they're getting for the JP audio? Definitely one of the things I'm really excited for.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

I giggle every time I see different people defining different games a "wow clone" simply because they don't like them, no matter the fact that none of them is actually a clone of anything.

It's become the "generic MMORPG insult" for when one has nothing logical to express in terms of criticism.



Did you play the game past chapter 1? Oh, and by the way, the English voice acting in Final Fantasy XIV was one of the worst I've seen in the past few years. The choice of actors was horribly botched, and the lines were delivered in a generally unconvincing way.

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an opinion doesn't make it so besides there is more than just 1 FF game that uses VO as well. Starwhores was not the first nor is it the best example of voice acting.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

*facepalms*

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Also if you don't like the English VA, swap to Japanese and use the English subs.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

an opinion doesn't make it so besides there is more than just 1 FF game that uses VO as well.

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You explicitly referenced Final Fantasy 14.

Voice acting quality is no matter of opinion. Sorry. It's a matter of having an idea of what good voice acting is, or not having the slightest idea about it. You quite obviously belong to the second group.

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Starwhores was not the first nor is it the best example of voice acting.

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I'm sure you are aware of the fact that intentionally mangling SWTOR's title identifies you as an irrational hater, pretty much voiding what you write of whatever validity. SWTOR's voice acting is actually, besides a few characters, very high in quality. It has a large number of top tier voice actors and lines are almost always delivered convincingly and realistically.

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Originally Posted by Delsus

Also if you don't like the English VA, swap to Japanese and use the English subs.

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I'll probably do that, but that possibility doesn't excuse a shoddy rush job made with the English voice acting, as Final Fantasy XIV obviously was.

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Originally Posted by Ingolf

YOU'D SELL YOUR MOTHER FOR A FEW COINS

I'D SELL MY FATHER TOO

no.

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Bah! you'd sell your own mother if the coin was good.

My father too!

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Originally Posted by Delsus

I still remember that line, exactly how it is said from my alpha and beta days, such an awesome line delivered perfectly, also it was pretty much hammered into my head with all the character resets, got sick of LL eventually so joined Ul'dah, Y'stola is my favorite archon by far.

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I like the comedic combo of Yda and Papalymo, and their intro is my favorite of the 3. But I do agree... Y'shtola is definitely the badass of them. Love how she smack-talks the guy in the beginning. "Oh, I was under the impression that I would find men here" (or something like that - it's been a while).

For the lol's:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-vAF3eeL0U#t=3m54s

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Originally Posted by Abriael

You explicitly referenced Final Fantasy 14.

I'm sure you are aware of the fact that intentionally mangling SWTOR's title identifies you as an irrational hater, pretty much voiding what you write of whatever validity. SWTOR's voice acting is actually, besides a few characters, very high in quality. It has a large number of top tier voice actors and lines are almost always delivered convincingly and realistically.

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yep i hated it, it was the worse 60 bucks of my life.

Nothing wrong with devs playing other MMOs; in my opinion, They in fact should be playing other MMOs so that they can assess what the other games did right and what they did wrong.

SWTOR's MMO fundamentals were bad and the only thing that made that game enjoyable for me was the interactive cutscenes and story; which is something that would not fit in with FFXIV. So I'll agree they should perhaps not look too hard at SWTOR for ideas. =p

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Originally Posted by Darkhaund

on the recent live letter, it was mentioned that the devs have been playing Starwars old republic and guild wars 2.

Do you guys fear that what made FFXI and FXIV unique will cease to exist and that we will sadlyl endup being a WoW clone?

I REALLY HOPE NOT

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Wait how can it be a WoW-clone if you mention star wars and guild wars 2? >_>; are those 2 WoW-clone? besides this horse was already reduced to dust from the massive beating in multiple threads

i hated both those games so if they copy anything from them or clone them then sadly they will fail. those games failed or will fail, there numbers at the start of launch is what made them special, not the mmo itself. it sucked. and ffxiv had them numbers or at least decent ones in box sales ...they lost them all and will not ever probably get them numbers back but even if they do, they will deminish again right away if copy these mmo's.

you can say good parts ...but not much good in them and reality is what they do copy from mmo's is the casual downfall of every mmo. and if anyone white knights those games then why are they here playing ffxiv or on forums for it? you quit already? no kiddin. some people want to live in a mmo for years not months.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

yep i hated it, it was the worse 60 bucks of my life.

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You're very fond of hyperbole.

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Originally Posted by strallaalaa

i hated both those games so if they copy anything from them or clone them then sadly they will fail.

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"I dislike a game, so if this game will be like that game it will fail".

Yeah, very logical argument.

I'm actually very glad that Yoshida isn't listening to some of the people here, and is giving a serious look to the competition (which is actually part of his job description as a producer, mind you), not doing so is exactly what brought Final Fantasy XIV to disaster to begin with.

It's utterly laughable how some seem to like the idea of him pulling a Tanaka.

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Originally Posted by Abriael

You're very fond of hyperbole.

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For me its far from an exaggeration.

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Originally Posted by Valmonte

For me its far from an exaggeration.

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yeah mate, yeah.

Just like Final Fantasy XIV has a great voice acting, lol.