Ban Service Accounts with more than 1 FC house

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Originally Posted by Burmecia

I have several leveled up characters on several servers, across 3 dcs. I like my fcs as private crews of few friends. I have bought my houses fairly, so I kinda disagree with this statenent

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Yeah. To me, housing is my favorite thing to do in the game during patch lull. I only have two houses— one from my three people FC that I paid for myself, as well as my personal - but if the game let me and I was more dedicated to farming gil,, I'd get more.

It gets kinda ridiculous honestly

Something should be done about it, but calling for people to be BANNED is sort of going too far.

I wouldn't mind if people lost these extra FC houses though. They don't need compensation. They already made a trillion gil or so from their submarines.

It'd be more reasonable to say people should be allowed to own 1 fc house and 1 private estate (the restriction is silly), but only one per server per account, and applied retroactively

I have 3 fc houses and 3 personal houses across 3 servers. Low pop servers were really easy to get a plot in and largely still are. I got the houses to decorate them, although I am stuck waiting for this fabled but always next patch item limit increase. Kinda wrong to assume everyone with multiple houses is a gold farmer, one fc plot I gave use of the subs to a friend who wanted to play with them, one goes unused and the main fc house when any of us can actually be bothered to send out subs we split income between the fc members as I guess is kinda the intention. Other people run many fc houses for the sake of RP venues. People want to engage with housing and social aspects of the game.

If they wanna shoot dead the gil income from subs I wouldn't really mind, I think it would open up a lot of FC plots that are used by a small number of ppl to generate a lot of money. But setting up subs as a solo person is also no small task either so someone having made the effort shouldn't eat a ban or have the home taken from them by force. If the reason to take the house goes the way of the dodo they will jus ditch the plot themselves since decorating isn't really their intention with the houses. They could put FC based gil generating tasks to be something actually active for members to do together, that could be fun. Some content that can only be done with FC members for example, actually encourage some social interaction in the game.

Stop looking to punish players who worked within the games boundaries. SE are responsible for the crappy state of housing. You're just being spiteful looking to take from others who have because you have not.
I'd like to see them add instanced housing or FC wards like wow has done, that'd be really cool. I'm not holding my breathe on it ever happening though.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

I have 3 fc houses and 3 personal houses across 3 servers. Low pop servers were really easy to get a plot in and largely still are. I got the houses to decorate them.

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Low population worlds being easier in the past doesn't invalidate the issue right now. The plots are permanently removed from circulation once claimed. Decoration intent also isn't relevant to availability. An FC plot used for decoration uses the same finite slot as one used by an active FC.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Kinda wrong to assume everyone with multiple houses is a gold farmer,

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No one made that claim. You're strawmanning. My argument is about concentration of plots:service accounts. Not motives. The impact on availability is the exact same.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Other people run many fc houses for the sake of RP venues. People want to engage with housing and social aspects of the game.

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RP venues aren't exempt from scarcity either. Just because you want to engage socially doesn't justify one service account controlling many FC plots where others cannot obtain even a single one. RP venues are important, but they should absolutely not be given free reign here.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

But setting up subs as a solo person is also no small task either so someone having made the effort shouldn't eat a ban or have the home taken from them by force.

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Honestly with things such as Teamcraft the effort is just a time sink more than anything. Plenty of systems in the game involve sinking time and effort and later balance changes come in. No one here is seriously arguing that normal players get banned over this, moreso a discussion about hard caps & reclaiming plots. Losing surplus plots is not a punishment, it'd be a correction.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Stop looking to punish players who worked within the games boundaries. SE are responsible for the crappy state of housing. You're just being spiteful looking to take from others who have because you have not.

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This is just a personal attack rather than an argument. You're not engaging with the actual issue at hand - FC plot accumulation for some (early birds).

If people want to argue for instanced housing, FC-only venues or a full redesign, great, be my guest, many of us agree. But until then, pretending the current system is fair simply because it was technically possible/allowed then you're just being facetious.

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Originally Posted by neia

Low population worlds being easier in the past doesn't invalidate the issue right now. The plots are permanently removed from circulation once claimed. Decoration intent also isn't relevant to availability. An FC plot used for decoration uses the same finite slot as one used by an active FC.


No one made that claim. You're strawmanning. My argument is about concentration of plots:service accounts. Not motives. The impact on availability is the exact same.


RP venues aren't exempt from scarcity either. Just because you want to engage socially doesn't justify one service account controlling many FC plots where others cannot obtain even a single one. RP venues are important, but they should absolutely not be given free reign here.


Honestly with things such as Teamcraft the effort is just a time sink more than anything. Plenty of systems in the game involve sinking time and effort and later balance changes come in. No one here is seriously arguing that normal players get banned over this, moreso a discussion about hard caps & reclaiming plots. Losing surplus plots is not a punishment, it'd be a correction.


This is just a personal attack rather than an argument. You're not engaging with the actual issue at hand - FC plot accumulation for some (early birds).

If people want to argue for instanced housing, FC-only venues or a full redesign, great, be my guest, many of us agree. But until then, pretending the current system is fair simply because it was technically possible/allowed then you're just being facetious.

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Early birds, aka veteran players in most cases having earned a lot of stuff doesn't much bother me. They were there at the time and put in the effort, oh no...? They were allowed at that time to purchase many houses, if it was still the case I would be working myself to buy up a ward for sure and set themes for each house. The idea sounds fun. It'd be a constant motivator for me. Since I got my houses I have next to no motivation to grind gil anymore.

The plots on new servers got eaten up because they were vacant for extended periods. The demand for FC housing, esp small plots, was not there in the general player base plain and simple. There was not a supply issue, there was over availability that a few people made use of. You having troubles now doesn't change much, demand for FC housing is still hardly there vs private housing. I see plots going up regularly still. Play the lotto like the rest of us did. If you don't get lucky it sucks, but at least in an FC you can get a bid for every person in the FC to stack odds in your favour.

There's no straw man, a lot of peoples justifications in this thread for yoinking legitimately earned houses is "but gold farmers". In any case be it for gold farming, rp venues or just decorating. The use for the houses are all legitimate under current rules, taking the houses away from people by force because of a rule change is terrible precedent to set and is by no means a "correction". Other games have no issue supplying near infinite housing, SE could do so if they cared too. So stop trying to punish the playerbase for SE's poor management. Again, you're just spiteful.

Lastly you can turn every single thing in the game into "just a time sink". If you don't value your own time that's your problem, I value my time not being devalued. And I can't say I care for spiteful players trying to devalue it either. I didn't get the houses over night it took literal years. Not to mention in my case it's well within their intended design, one personal and one fc house per server. Players like yourself looking to take from others rather than just pushing for many sensible options other games have deployed is beyond me.

We've all been under the same rules, the lotto system is the most fair one we've had and remains to be so. I don't miss seeing blatant auto clickers in the old days. It's my hope they improve the housing system and let it dynamically scale and do something about sub farms to stop rampant inflation that would surely cause with infinite plots.

you snooze, you lose bud

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Other people run many fc houses for the sake of RP venues. People want to engage with housing and social aspects of the game.

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I'm only going to respond to this, but A single person should not be controlling multiple RP venues, There I said it, I had the chance to control a venue on Maduin and Behemoth but I forfeit my Maduin plot because I did NOT want to be greedy.

Others have the right to try to make their own RP Venues not just rely on a single person having multiple Venues at least not multiple FC plots for venues, 2 Venues aka 2 Plots if fine, 1 Personal and 1 FC there is absolutely not justification to having multiple. You have friends on a different DC, well you DON'T need to have housing there just cause you have friends there. You want your FRIENDS to have a house give them gil if they can't make it themselves but a single person does not need CONTROL of all the houses.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Early birds, aka veteran players in most cases having earned a lot of stuff doesn't much bother me. They were there at the time and put in the effort, oh no...? They were allowed at that time to purchase many houses

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Just cause the original system was flawed does NOT justify it's abuse. Beta 2013 player here, and I did NOT abuse the system just cause "I could" We also didn't have Bidding it was first come first serve back then.

Flaws do not justify abuse

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Originally Posted by s32ialx

I'm only going to respond to this, but A single person should not be controlling multiple RP venues, There I said it, I had the chance to control a venue on Maduin and Behemoth but I forfeit my Maduin plot because I did NOT want to be greedy.

Others have the right to try to make their own RP Venues not just rely on a single person having multiple Venues at least not multiple FC plots for venues, 2 Venues aka 2 Plots if fine, 1 Personal and 1 FC there is absolutely not justification to having multiple. You have friends on a different DC, well you DON'T need to have housing there just cause you have friends there. You want your FRIENDS to have a house give them gil if they can't make it themselves but a single person does not need CONTROL of all the houses.

Just cause the original system was flawed does NOT justify it's abuse. Beta 2013 player here, and I did NOT abuse the system just cause "I could" We also didn't have Bidding it was first come first serve back then.

Flaws do not justify abuse

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I'm well aware how the housing system used be be, I literally mentioned the placard clicking. I had to deal with that nonsense too and my solution to that was waking up at 5am and yoinking a random small to then relocate elsewhere. It was not a great method to obtain a house vs what we have today.

It's lovely of you to be considerate but other players have no obligation to do that, it's not a rule and it's not abuse to have extra houses. I've also been happy to support friends in getting housing of their own, or in the case of the other friend he just wanted to play with subs as most FC's wont let general members play with them at all. Hell that was the reason I even bothered to make my own first FC, I was sick of not having access to a part of the game that had housing items behind it that cost a fortune on the marketboard to buy.

If another player has the time and resources to run multiple venues, more power to them. There is plenty reason to need to have the housing yourself if you wanna run multiple venues, I can count on myself to be subbed and log in to keep the plots, I couldn't say the same for the players who share the house with me. And even if for some RP venue peeps if they just WANT to have it be theirs, that's their prerogative. You can still go out and buy a private plot and start a venue pretty easily especially on the newer servers. I still see the medium next to one of my mansions go up for sale pretty regularly. People are rotating out of the game and plots are coming up pretty frequently. I'm not even house hunting anymore but once in a while I will peep to see if I can swap a cottage location or something for fun and there is at any one time plenty spots open.

SE can improve the housing system and it would solve a lot of problems, removing the gold farm as a motivator for having multiple FC's for instance would do a lot on some servers. No need to prevent people having multiple houses when they wanna use the house as... a house? xD

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Early birds, aka veteran players in most cases having earned a lot of stuff doesn't much bother me. They were there at the time and put in the effort, oh no...? They were allowed at that time to purchase many houses, if it was still the case I would be working myself to buy up a ward for sure and set themes for each house. The idea sounds fun. It'd be a constant motivator for me. Since I got my houses I have next to no motivation to grind gil anymore.

The plots on new servers got eaten up because they were vacant for extended periods. The demand for FC housing, esp small plots, was not there in the general player base plain and simple. There was not a supply issue, there was over availability that a few people made use of. You having troubles now doesn't change much, demand for FC housing is still hardly there vs private housing. I see plots going up regularly still. Play the lotto like the rest of us did. If you don't get lucky it sucks, but at least in an FC you can get a bid for every person in the FC to stack odds in your favour.

There's no straw man, a lot of peoples justifications in this thread for yoinking legitimately earned houses is "but gold farmers". In any case be it for gold farming, rp venues or just decorating. The use for the houses are all legitimate under current rules, taking the houses away from people by force because of a rule change is terrible precedent to set and is by no means a "correction". Other games have no issue supplying near infinite housing, SE could do so if they cared too. So stop trying to punish the playerbase for SE's poor management. Again, you're just spiteful.

Lastly you can turn every single thing in the game into "just a time sink". If you don't value your own time that's your problem, I value my time not being devalued. And I can't say I care for spiteful players trying to devalue it either. I didn't get the houses over night it took literal years. Not to mention in my case it's well within their intended design, one personal and one fc house per server. Players like yourself looking to take from others rather than just pushing for many sensible options other games have deployed is beyond me.

We've all been under the same rules, the lotto system is the most fair one we've had and remains to be so. I don't miss seeing blatant auto clickers in the old days. It's my hope they improve the housing system and let it dynamically scale and do something about sub farms to stop rampant inflation that would surely cause with infinite plots.

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We actually agree on more than you’re willing to admit. Instanced housing, dynamic scaling decoupling subs, allgreat ideas. Where we disagree is that you believe existing accumulation should be untouchable forever because time was spent. I don’t. In a game meant to run another decade, freezing early imbalances permanently is far worse precedent than correcting them. Your entire argument can be boiled down to "Screw you, I got mine" and that's a toxic mindset. If you have one FC plot, that's enough.

If SE were to set a hard cap with a long grace period and require excess plots to be relinquished, that’s mitigation of a design failure, not devaluation of player time. FC plots don't exist for greedy players to buy up. Calling force relinquishment of excess plots a 'punishment' doesn't hold.

The claim that there was “over availability” and no real demand for FC housing just isn’t accurate anymore. They're mostly all eaten up by greedy players hoarding a limited resource.

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Originally Posted by s32ialx

Just cause the original system was flawed does NOT justify it's abuse. Beta 2013 player here, and I did NOT abuse the system just cause "I could" We also didn't have Bidding it was first come first serve back then.

Flaws do not justify abuse

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Very well said. And thanks for chiming in as the perfect juxtaposition to the other kind of veteran player.

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Originally Posted by neia

If it is your only FC house no I don't think your house should be taken or anything. Where singular service accounts have multiple FC houses, that is the issue.

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Literally every single more or less large venue has multiple houses on multiple servers. Some FCs have subdivisions on different worlds. There are also many people who just end up with FC and it's house due to other members quitting.

Impose additional restrictions and you'll just scare off legitimate players away from social activities. They already are extremely thinned out; you think a venue owner wants to constantly maintain some "legitimacy" requirement? No, they'll just quit it and proceed with their life, while their freed up plots will be taken by sublords who will find their way to bypass whichever requirements will be imposed. Require 4 players per fc, you think it's difficult to buy 3 base accounts and stuff a character from each account into each FC?

SE has resources. SE has money. SE puts new junk into mog station regularly. Why are you here in this thread asking for some half-measures that don't even make any sense? Why don't you ask for proper solution, instanced housing?

If they moved the FC workshop into the grand companies, all of these houses would be released instantly as they would no longer serve a purpose.

That is the only reason why these houses are occupied, they’re only used for gill farming.

This would be a fantastic “feature” to add to the game in 8.0.

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Originally Posted by Alicie

Literally every single more or less large venue has multiple houses on multiple servers. Some FCs have subdivisions on different worlds. There are also many people who just end up with FC and it's house due to other members quitting.

Impose additional restrictions and you'll just scare off legitimate players away from social activities. They already are extremely thinned out; you think a venue owner wants to constantly maintain some "legitimacy" requirement? No, they'll just quit it and proceed with their life, while their freed up plots will be taken by sublords who will find their way to bypass whichever requirements will be imposed. Require 4 players per fc, you think it's difficult to buy 3 base accounts and stuff a character from each account into each FC?

SE has resources. SE has money. SE puts new junk into mog station regularly. Why are you here in this thread asking for some half-measures that don't even make any sense? Why don't you ask for proper solution, instanced housing?

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I'm not here to fornicate with arachnids.

Reworking housing is a massive undertaking, I'm simply asking for SE to pull a few levers in the back-end. It's a lot less of an ask, and something that could actually realistically happen within a short timeframe. An entire rework of housing is not happening anytime soon.

If venue owners get "scared off" by not being able to hoard FC houses. I think that's absolutely fine. You can host venues from actual FC houses without a need to hoard multiple. Again it's quiet simple and your argument is borderline facetious.

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Originally Posted by neia

We actually agree on more than you’re willing to admit. Instanced housing, dynamic scaling decoupling subs, allgreat ideas. Where we disagree is that you believe existing accumulation should be untouchable forever because time was spent. I don’t. In a game meant to run another decade, freezing early imbalances permanently is far worse precedent than correcting them. Your entire argument can be boiled down to "Screw you, I got mine" and that's a toxic mindset. If you have one FC plot, that's enough.

If SE were to set a hard cap with a long grace period and require excess plots to be relinquished, that’s mitigation of a design failure, not devaluation of player time. FC plots don't exist for greedy players to buy up. Calling force relinquishment of excess plots a 'punishment' doesn't hold.

The claim that there was “over availability” and no real demand for FC housing just isn’t accurate anymore. They're mostly all eaten up by greedy players hoarding a limited resource.



Very well said. And thanks for chiming in as the perfect juxtaposition to the other kind of veteran player.

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I realise we agree on plenty, but taking things away from players is a horrific idea in a game from a genre based around long term commitment. What player wants to put years into a game that can at the drop of a hat take away what you worked for because they implemented it poorly, punishing the players for devs poor work. It's awful and a group of players having more houses than others isn't as big a deal as you make out, especially if they actually solve the underlying issues causing the frustration. So no it's not "I got mine" because I'm not against the idea of newer players having the same things as me. And if a person is really die hard about housing they still can do the same as me.

Changing rules and applying them retroactively is a fantastic way to shatter any trust your players have that long term effort will actually last and it's safe to invest your time into. Great way to kill your MMO. Why would you alienate players who've been subbed for years for no reason but newer players being spiteful and jealous of what the older players have? Newer players still have housing available to them, it's not like housing is suddenly deleted content if you're new. I could make an alt on yet another server if I'd the mind too and have another 2 plots in due course. If they end up adding more EU servers I will probably make one alt to grab a little beach side cottage in the mists.

I know there was an oversupply of houses, I was there for new servers being added and a chunk of players refused to move. Those that did got the house they wanted, I got a few dream plots and spent no small amount of time leveling alts, going thru MSQ and leveling the crafters. It took those wards literal years to fill up fully. And since then the player base has gotten smaller due to a lot of people being pretty unhappy with the state of the game. People who held onto houses for years have left. The only reason so many people managed to snag such a large amount of FC houses is because nobody at the time was taking them. They claimed those houses over a prolonged period and the current state of housing still has a decent amount available for people who are hunting, moreso for those willing to server hop.

SE's current solution is shoving more wards in but at the moment there is simply not enough players needing them, especially FC wards. That's not to say that some people are not struggling to find a home, but not enough for SE to justify more server cost. There is no housing crisis atm. Much as you'd hate to hear it. On one of my alts her little plot has 7 houses available on that ward alone, available to FC's and another 2 where her FC house is. That's in the lavender beds, the goblet always always has more plots up for grabs, ishgard is similar. You'll get your FC house in time, it's just not going to be as immediate as you'd like. No need to try and steal things away from other players when housing is there in adequate supply across the servers.

So I still think it's pretty scummy to be trying to take from others when housing availability is not actually in this dire state even with the sub farmers, there are plots just sitting there for multiple lottos in a row. Even a quick glance shows medium plot there for FC's with a whopping two bidders wow.

they need to retire the ward system its just bad and terrible, add in a fully instance house system that can act as shared space between a group of friends with any plot size of choice this will stop the bot farmers dead in their tracks an everyone will be satisfied or happy cause they can own and build something together or alone an share it with others. it WAY past time and long overdue.

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Originally Posted by ShadowyZero

they need to retire the ward system its just bad and terrible, add in a fully instance house system that can act as shared space between a group of friends with any plot size of choice this will stop the bot farmers dead in their tracks an everyone will be satisfied or happy cause they can own and build something together or alone an share it with others. it WAY past time and long overdue.

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I want to see FC's able to buy a ward for themselves and it's members can occupy the houses with one big guild house in the middle, that'd be cool. I don't hold out hope it will ever happen though.
Hell I wouldn't even be opposed to having a ward up bring an additional fee to the FC leader. I'd rather pay for a ward than an extra retainer..

The benefit of wards being that they are always up actually is great, you can pop round the place and check out people's homes and bump into people. But they are not as alive as they should be because, yes, a lot of plots are taken by people using them just for sub income. Removing that issue would bring some life back to them as well as adding more features to them. You can have organic meetings with people in the wards, instanced housing doesn't bring that kind of interaction. You have to be very deliberate in whose house you go to, you don't just bump into people.

I don't see them removing the wards (YoshiP has said he likes them), but they can add instanced housing on top. GW2 housing is solely instanced and it does not have the same social benefits as our ward one does. Needing to be online and potentially send invites to people is a big deterrent to people actually caring to decorate their homes and interact with housing as a whole when they know most people won't see it. A lot of people like to do ultimates and such to have the fancy weapon to show off, players place value in other people seeing their achievements and what they have done in the world. Wards are good for that, instanced housing isn't as great at it. So I would like to see both.

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Originally Posted by neia

--is just a personal attack rather than an argument.

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Seeing any submarine having FC or two, on different servers, as potential gil farms and dividing FCs into "legitimate!" and "bannable!" boxes smell lil bit like an attack, too. SEs rule for FCs+houses are pretty clear. 4 members at the moment of founding and bidding and rank 6. That's it.

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Originally Posted by neia

Listing your personal playstyle history doesn't address the core issue here-

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Of course it doesn't; that's just one anecdote about how someone might come to have more than 1 FC with a house. I thought you wanted to give your "FC an actual home", too, though no one but you and your FC cares about your temporary houselessness.

When the system was changed into lottery system, I can't remember where it was but I'm pretty sure YoshiP made comment about leaving the loophole (tho is it loophole if it's intended?), that even a player who already has FC with house can acquire another with-house FC's leadership role; if the FC system recognises the old leader as inactive within limits of the FC system rules, transferring the role to the first FC member to log in.

And yes, the FC leadership role transfer can be abused and it sucks, but even in the current state of the game I'm a fan of presumption of innocence -- rather than supporting this forum with it's ideas as judge, jury and executioner kinda package for this sorry matter.
I'm also all for better system, what I am not for is bans for people who have played it fair at the time we had different rules before this hypothetical better system, again.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

but taking things away from players is a horrific idea in a game from a genre based around long term commitment. What player wants to put years into a game that can at the drop of a hat take away what you worked for because they implemented it poorly, punishing the players for devs poor work. It's awful and a group of players having more houses than others isn't as big a deal as you make out,

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Crafted items, currencies, relic grinds, and progression systems get invalidated or deleted outright. Whole gameplay loops (PvP modes, job mechanics) have been removed despite massive time investment. That is normal in live-service model.

Every single FC ward on Materia is full of greedy players like you who think it's acceptable to have multiple FC plots on their account, or literal gold farmers.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Changing rules and applying them retroactively is a fantastic way to shatter any trust your players have that long term effort will actually last and it's safe to invest your time into. Great way to kill your MMO. Why would you alienate players who've been subbed for years for no reason but newer players being spiteful and jealous of what the older players have?

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Treating early access as untouchable entitlement is far more corrosive to trust than correcting it.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Newer players still have housing available to them, it's not like housing is suddenly deleted content if you're new. I could make an alt on yet another server if I'd the mind too and have another 2 plots in due course. If they end up adding more EU servers I will probably make one alt to grab a little beach side cottage in the mists.

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Great. You live on a region with multiple datacenters that might have this luxury. Every single FC ward on Materia is eaten mostly by people from other datacenters, or a few whales who are legitimately from the region, who own more than one! That's the issue and it's greed no matter which way you try and paint it.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

I know there was an oversupply of houses, I was there for new servers being added and a chunk of players refused to move. Those that did got the house they wanted, I got a few dream plots and spent no small amount of time leveling alts, going thru MSQ and leveling the crafters. It took those wards literal years to fill up fully. And since then the player base has gotten smaller due to a lot of people being pretty unhappy with the state of the game. People who held onto houses for years have left. The only reason so many people managed to snag such a large amount of FC houses is because nobody at the time was taking them. They claimed those houses over a prolonged period and the current state of housing still has a decent amount available for people who are hunting, moreso for those willing to server hop.

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Having more than one FC plot on your service account is just greedy given the current model, no matter which way you try and paint it.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

SE's current solution is shoving more wards in but at the moment there is simply not enough players needing them, especially FC wards.

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These extra wards are not even available here.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

There is no housing crisis atm.

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I challenge you to find this plentiful supply of FC plots you keep talking about, on Materia. It doesn't exist. What your saying is categorically false.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

You'll get your FC house in time, it's just not going to be as immediate as you'd like. No need to try and steal things away from other players when housing is there in adequate supply across the servers.

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Again not even arguing, just resorting to personal attacks. There is a systemic issue with greedy players hoarding this scarce resource.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

So I still think it's pretty scummy to be trying to take from others when housing availability is not actually in this dire state even with the sub farmers, there are plots just sitting there for multiple lottos in a row.

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More personal attacks. But I guess if you feel entitled to half of a DC's housing supply yourself, I can see why you'd come on the forums and attack players who would like a single home for themselves. This is bigger than just myself as this issue affects every single player.

Any real fix requires hard limits. Greedy players are the issue with housing.

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Originally Posted by Burmecia

And yes, the FC leadership role transfer can be abused and it sucks, but even in the current state of the game I'm a fan of presumption of innocence -- rather than voting this forum as judge, jury and executioner kinda package about this matter. I'm also all for better system, what I am not for is bans for people who have played it fair at the time we had different rules before better system

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Forced relinquishment of the excess plots with a full Gil refund would be the bare minimum. Calling it "playing it fair is also just facetious. Hoarding multiple houses is greed no matter which way you try paint it.

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Originally Posted by neia

I challenge you to find this plentiful supply of FC plots you keep talking about, on Materia. It doesn't exist. What your saying is categorically false.

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Sophia/free company; 1804 plots match your current filters.

"We're all gona make it brah."

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

If they end up adding more EU servers I will probably make one alt to grab a little beach side cottage in the mists.

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Welcome, welcome, and feel free to check the old servers too :)
Poor chaos has seen busier times...

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Originally Posted by Burmecia

Sophia/free company; 1804 plots match your current filters.

"We're all gona make it brah."

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Once again you're illustrating how you really don't have anything constructive to add, and how little you actually know about the topic. Go check your link again. Wards 24-30 aren't available on Materia. My point stands, there's no plentiful supply of FC plots on Materia.

The 99.9% of the playerbase should be chosen over the 00.1% of greedy FC plot hoarders.

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Originally Posted by neia

Once again you're illustrating how you really don't have anything constructive to add, and how little you actually know about the topic. Go check your link again. Wards 24-30 aren't available on Materia. My point stands, there's no plentiful supply of FC plots on Materia.

The 99.9% of the playerbase should be chosen over the 00.1% of greedy FC plot hoarders.

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I'm not on Materia, so I'd be kinda madman if I put any energy into worrying about situation out there.
Guess I'm reminded of the fact now: few wards are off-limits in on some other DCs, waiting for new xpack or something. Oops. You learn, or relearn something new every day.

But I know: at least second best way to boost your winning chances is to keep on participating. And since it's FC house you're after, make those bozos sharing the FC with buy tickets as well. Can't get simpler than that.
But having fewer free plots to go around is truly the worst time to try buy house, but no matter: those who wont buy tickets won't even have a chance.

...Wishing SE to come save you by banning and insta-demoing peoples' "less-than legitimate!!" houses seems hardly any better chance than 0.

You could always report them for the script they are no doubt using to change 20 characters into 20 fcs for 60 submarines.
The speed should give it away, so find their route, make a video and send to special investigations.

They're just benefitting from the system legally.
Others are better off challenging the rules (yet again), or begging SE to nerf/outright remove the submarine drops. They grandfathered in previous owners when they did their last set of housing changes, so I imagine they wouldn't want to undo that and upset some people.

I don't think people really know large this problem is.

Shoutout to Slurpee Hi on Dynamis.

I reported this guy around 3 years ago when I saw him doing this on Seraph, since then he's gone on to make at least two to three hundred characters (and this is just ball park from ones that are identifiably him) dedicated to buying and maintaining FC houses on dynamis.

He uses the same surnames for these characters, typically Hi and the numbers Two-Eight, sometimes changing it up for Japanese and Chinese numbers, and the names I've seen him go by, with a varying number of vowels at the end (I.E. slurpee & slurpeee etc.) are: Doraa, Tonyy, Slurpee, and Soratoo.

It's very clear what the rules on this are, they've been the same since Stormblood, you're only allowed ONE private AND fc house per service account per server, and the fact that they go unchecked make it seem like the moderation team is in on it, because this guy owns half of dynamis and is very clearly gold botting (imo) on these service accounts. This is only one bad actor, while this has been a very common exploit for the better part of a decade and it needs to be resolved.

Either the rules need to be explicitly changed to allow this or these players should have their land relinquished, the only reason it wasn't back when the rules were changed in Stormblood was to be fair to those who already had multiple houses.

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Originally Posted by SalamanderIX

You could always report them for the script they are no doubt using to change 20 characters into 20 fcs for 60 submarines.
The speed should give it away, so find their route, make a video and send to special investigations.

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They don't even need automation to do this at scale. Just a lot of time. Once they're set up, they only need to switch between all the different characters on their service account, and enter the plot every so often to keep it active.

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Originally Posted by Sunhwapark

They're just benefitting from the system legally.
Others are better off challenging the rules (yet again), or begging SE to nerf/outright remove the submarine drops. They grandfathered in previous owners when they did their last set of housing changes, so I imagine they wouldn't want to undo that and upset some people.

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Moving the Submarines to Island Sanctuary or Grand Company would be an ideal change. Submarines were meant to be a way for FC members to work together to earn Gil, however in reality, that's not how people play the game.

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Originally Posted by Evo1171

I don't think people really know large this problem is.

It's very clear what the rules on this are, they've been the same since Stormblood, you're only allowed ONE private AND fc house per service account per server

Either the rules need to be explicitly changed to allow this or these players should have their land relinquished, the only reason it wasn't back when the rules were changed in Stormblood was to be fair to those who already had multiple houses.

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Those who know, know, including the people defending the current status quo in this thread. They are the people benefiting from the broken system the most, as they have hoarded plots for themselves.

Honestly I think ONE private AND FC house per service account is enough full stop. Any more than that is unjustifiably greedy given the current conditions.

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Originally Posted by neia

I'm not here to fornicate with arachnids.

Reworking housing is a massive undertaking, I'm simply asking for SE to pull a few levers in the back-end. It's a lot less of an ask, and something that could actually realistically happen within a short timeframe. An entire rework of housing is not happening anytime soon.

If venue owners get "scared off" by not being able to hoard FC houses. I think that's absolutely fine. You can host venues from actual FC houses without a need to hoard multiple. Again it's quiet simple and your argument is borderline facetious.

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You really will not like to see these levers pulled off. At least if they will be accompanied with retroactive actions. Game is in such a bad state that even botters aren't getting banned, and you're asking to set up a precedent where something that people worked for, probably for years, is taken away from them. Do this and end up with a game that is ran just for the MSQ and is being quit for good.

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Originally Posted by Alicie

You really will not like to see these levers pulled off. At least if they will be accompanied with retroactive actions. Game is in such a bad state that even botters aren't getting banned, and you're asking to set up a precedent where something that people worked for, probably for years, is taken away from them. Do this and end up with a game that is ran just for the MSQ and is being quit for good.

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Again Alicie coming in with facetious arguments that have no grounding in reality.

Your whataboutisms aren't relevant to the title post. An equitable distribution of FC plots, with a system in place to prevent FC plot hoarding on singular service accounts, will not result in "a game that's ran just for the MSQ and is being quit for good". That doesn't hold at all.

Your line of thinking here is flawed.

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Originally Posted by Alicie

You really will not like to see these levers pulled off. At least if they will be accompanied with retroactive actions. Game is in such a bad state that even botters aren't getting banned, and you're asking to set up a precedent where something that people worked for, probably for years, is taken away from them. Do this and end up with a game that is ran just for the MSQ and is being quit for good.

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By this logic someone who starts a drug cartel shouldn't be arrested because they work hard.

In order to do this you have to actively exploit the game, have to know it's an exploit, and you are breaking the rules by doing it.

It doesn't set the precedent that "Your hard work will be taken away" it sets the precedent "If you break the rules you will be punished"

Botters don't get banned often because the software that's used on a small scale uses keyboard inputs, and SE won't take action because it "could" be a player, even if it's obviously not, while this is definably against the rules that SE has set regarding housing.

I don't care about protecting the 20-30 people who own 80% of fc housing, all that does is make the game worse for normal players.

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Originally Posted by neia

Again Alicie coming in with facetious arguments that have no grounding in reality.

Your whataboutisms aren't relevant to the title post. An equitable distribution of FC plots, with a system in place to prevent FC plot hoarding on singular service accounts, will not result in "a game that's ran just for the MSQ and is being quit for good". That doesn't hold at all.

Your line of thinking here is flawed.

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Nah this entire thread is about "I'm too jealous others getting gil but I'm too lazy to set it up myself so take it away from these who have it". Remember, there's no botting or cheating or hacking going on, only intended game mechanics are used. Can't ban for that.

Can implement additional restrictions, yes. Can not take out what's already there, no.

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Originally Posted by Evo1171

By this logic someone who starts a drug cartel shouldn't be arrested because they work hard.

In order to do this you have to actively exploit the game, have to know it's an exploit, and you are breaking the rules by doing it.

It doesn't set the precedent that "Your hard work will be taken away" it sets the precedent "If you break the rules you will be punished"

Botters don't get banned often because the software that's used on a small scale uses keyboard inputs, and SE won't take action because it "could" be a player, even if it's obviously not, while this is definably against the rules that SE has set regarding housing.

I don't care about protecting the 20-30 people who own 80% of fc housing, all that does is make the game worse for normal players.

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Yeah you can't punish someone for doing a cartel business in a place where it's not prohibited. I aint seeing no clause in TOS that would prohibit someone from buying tons of FCs from other players and using them to get some gil, do you see that clause?

Moreover, you not caring about something is definitely not enough of a reason to go after people.

And if we're talking here about things that make game worse for normal players, first thing we should get rid of is MSQ slop.

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Originally Posted by Alicie

Nah this entire thread is about "I'm too jealous others getting gil but I'm too lazy to set it up myself so take it away from these who have it". Remember, there's no botting or cheating or hacking going on, only intended game mechanics are used. Can't ban for that.

Can implement additional restrictions, yes. Can not take out what's already there, no.


Yeah you can't punish someone for doing a cartel business in a place where it's not prohibited. I aint seeing no clause in TOS that would prohibit someone from buying tons of FCs from other players and using them to get some gil, do you see that clause?

Moreover, you not caring about something is definitely not enough of a reason to go after people.

And if we're talking here about things that make game worse for normal players, first thing we should get rid of is MSQ slop.

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Again with the insults, facetious arguments, and whataboutisms - your standing has no grounding in reality. I should expect nothing less from the same person who made the suggestion to remove cast times and animation lock from LB3. It's clear you fundamentally don't really have a grasp on this game, on top of being facetious & rude.

I highly doubt devs intended for singular service accounts to hoard FC plots, locking other players out.

The mental gymnastics you are performing to protect the 0.01% of the population who have hoarded FC plots is astonishing, but understandable if you benefit yourself from the status quo. If you don't stand to benefit and you still think this way, perhaps you should try a single player game, it sounds like that's what you'd prefer to play.

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Originally Posted by Alicie

Nah this entire thread is about "I'm too jealous others getting gil but I'm too lazy to set it up myself so take it away from these who have it". Remember, there's no botting or cheating or hacking going on, only intended game mechanics are used. Can't ban for that.

Can implement additional restrictions, yes. Can not take out what's already there, no.


Yeah you can't punish someone for doing a cartel business in a place where it's not prohibited. I aint seeing no clause in TOS that would prohibit someone from buying tons of FCs from other players and using them to get some gil, do you see that clause?

Moreover, you not caring about something is definitely not enough of a reason to go after people.

And if we're talking here about things that make game worse for normal players, first thing we should get rid of is MSQ slop.

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https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../housing_land/

You can find the rule under "Temporary Changes to Purchasing Land" which has been in effect since patch 4.2.

Msq has nothing to do with what we're talking about.

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Originally Posted by Burmecia

Sophia/free company; 1804 plots match your current filters.

"We're all gona make it brah."



Welcome, welcome, and feel free to check the old servers too :)
Poor chaos has seen busier times...

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Ykno I have jus been living in light since I started the game, maybe getting a little foothold in chaos would be nice. I'll need to decide what race to be, main is hrothy, then I have alt miqo and au'ra.. maybe a hyur?

Also wards not having been unlocked on certain servers just proves my point, supply is fine :)

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Originally Posted by neia

Again with the insults, facetious arguments, and whataboutisms - your standing has no grounding in reality. I should expect nothing less from the same person who made the suggestion to remove cast times and animation lock from LB3. It's clear you fundamentally don't really have a grasp on this game, on top of being facetious & rude.

I highly doubt devs intended for singular service accounts to hoard FC plots, locking other players out.

The mental gymnastics you are performing to protect the 0.01% of the population who have hoarded FC plots is astonishing, but understandable if you benefit yourself from the status quo. If you don't stand to benefit and you still think this way, perhaps you should try a single player game, it sounds like that's what you'd prefer to play.

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But... it's not me being rude and having no grasp on the game, it's you...?

If devs did not intended one player to own multiple FC houses, they would have either removed that possibility completely or added a clause into their TOS about it being specifically prohibited. Yet we don't see either.

You can not ask for a ban. There is no grounds for it. You can only ask to implement technical limitations or a prohibition via TOS.

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Originally Posted by Evo1171

https://na.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../housing_land/

You can find the rule under "Temporary Changes to Purchasing Land" which has been in effect since patch 4.2.

Msq has nothing to do with what we're talking about.

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"Temporary changes" doesn't sounds like rules. Doesn't covers acquisition via purchasing from other players either. Perfectly within TOS, I don't know why people are complaining here.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

Also wards not having been unlocked on certain servers just proves my point, supply is fine :)

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This is an insane take, doesn't hold whatsoever, and is proof that you're not seriously engaging in this debate. You're just happy to benefit from greedy hoarding, and coming in here to stifle discussion with misinformation.

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Originally Posted by neia

This is an insane take, doesn't hold whatsoever, and is proof that you're not seriously engaging in this debate. You're just happy to benefit from greedy hoarding.

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The wards are sitting there waiting till there is enough demand to justify unlocking them. There's not enough demand so locked they shall stay. That simple really. If they unlocked them you would just see more people buying out all the smalls slowly because THERE IS NOT ENOUGH DEMAND and as such the sub farmers can take their time taking all the small unwanted plots. Because most FC's have a home at this point, many are just wanting to upgrade to a larger size.

Stay mad and homeless I guess. I've made my points, you're just too salty to accept reality.

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Originally Posted by Alicie

But... it's not me being rude and having no grasp on the game, it's you...?
You can not ask for a ban. There is no grounds for it. You can only ask to implement technical limitations or a prohibition via TOS.

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Yeah this doesn't track. Every single one of your points has been calmly dismantled & the vast majority of the people coming into this thread clearly do not agree with you.

But sure resume the personal attacks because you have an indefensible position on the topic.

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Originally Posted by Alicie

But... it's not me being rude and having no grasp on the game, it's you...?

If devs did not intended one player to own multiple FC houses, they would have either removed that possibility completely or added a clause into their TOS about it being specifically prohibited. Yet we don't see either.

You can not ask for a ban. There is no grounds for it. You can only ask to implement technical limitations or a prohibition via TOS.



"Temporary changes" doesn't sounds like rules. Doesn't covers acquisition via purchasing from other players either. Perfectly within TOS, I don't know why people are complaining here.

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Just because you think something doesn't "sound" like a rule doesn't mean it doesn't apply, and I don't care about acquisition from other players, it's about having more than one fc house per service account per world, which as you can see it explicitly states you can purchase and MAINTAIN one fc house per world per service account.

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Originally Posted by Aelin_Ashryver

The wards are sitting there waiting till there is enough demand to justify unlocking them. There's not enough demand so locked they shall stay. That simple really. If they unlocked them you would just see more people buying out all the smalls slowly because THERE IS NOT ENOUGH DEMAND and as such the sub farmers can take their time taking all the small unwanted plots. Because most FC's have a home at this point, many are just wanting to upgrade to a larger size.

Stay mad and homeless I guess. I've made my points, you're just too salty to accept reality.

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Another insane take that has no factual basis. Unlocking wards is not inherently tied to demand at all, there literally does not exist any in-game mechanic that unlocks wards at a certain demand, you're making things up to support your indefensible position. The one or two FC plots that maybe come up each week on Materia routinely have 60+ bids each.

Also nice, once again resorting to personal attacks, because once again, your position is indefensible and not grounded in reality. Stay greedy & rude, I guess.

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Originally Posted by neia

Another insane take that has no factual basis. Unlocking wards is not inherently tied to demand at all, there literally does not exist any in-game mechanic that unlocks wards at a certain demand, you're making things up to support your indefensible position. The one or two FC plots that maybe come up each week on Materia routinely have 60+ bids each.

Also nice, once again resorting to personal attacks, because once again, your position is indefensible and not grounded in reality. Stay greedy & rude, I guess.

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I'm sure they've said before the wards will be unlocked when needed, or something to that affect. But I can't be bothered to hunt out a quote so take it or leave it. But the implication is there and obvious. Why would you unlock hundreds of extra plots for 60-100 people looking for shared housing?. One house will service multiple of those 60 bidders. So you just prove again, there's not enough people actually in need of a plot to warrant unlocking those wards. Good job.