Dailies are complete trash

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Originally Posted by Brightamethyst

Okay, I'll bite. What dailies/weeklies are you talking about? Outside of raid lockout and tome caps (which many people don't even care about), I can't think of a single daily/weekly to "churn through" besides maybe 5 minutes worth of beast tribes societies and custom deliveries.

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Think harder. Dismissing the entire game as things you don't care about of course would result in nothing to do. There may be "Many" people that don't care about anything, but there are "many" that do.

1. Daily roulette for tomes - which I do care about. Like I wrote earlier - finishing these sets and upgrading them is the best gear I have access to without a static.
2. Daily PVP roulette.
3. Daily Alliance if you are levelling old classes, as I still am.
4. Daily level roulette if you aren't done levelling.
5. Weekly Alliance Raid for a coin.
6. Weekly 8 Man for 1/4 items to get a 720 weapon.
7. Daily Society quests.
8. Weekly custom delivery quests.
9. Weekly setup and collection of Island Sanctuary to keep that going.
10. Daily crafting FC deliveries if you still need experience. I check them and will do an easy one if I need the XP.
11. Collecting money from your retainer and sending them back out.
12. Weekly loose ends for Khloe stories.
13. Weekly fashion report.

People even do other things like other daily and weekly gold saucer that I don't even bother with.

Some of these are fast, but all these little chores quickly add up to a lot of time.

A lot of these grinds do have an end point - but if you reached them you likely already got an immense amount of playtime out of the game.

https://i.imgur.com/qCTNP2K.jpeg

This is my favourite video game. Every day I'm allowed out of my enclosure for 9 minutes and 59 seconds and I get to press the button on this device EXACTLY ONCE and watch the number increase by a whole integer and then I put it away and don't look at it again until the next day.

i rather do this than go back with daily quest design of ARR and HW, just overcoplicate for nothing, nobody bother to read all these text just to be real, rank up quest is good, but daily quest can just be random fectch quest 1 minutes long, then we can move out to do other thing

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Originally Posted by ShariusTC

i rather do this than go back with daily quest design of ARR and HW, just overcoplicate for nothing, nobody bother to read all these text just to be real, rank up quest is good, but daily quest can just be random fectch quest 1 minutes long, then we can move out to do other thing

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Yeah like pressing the log out button considering there is nothing else to do

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Yeah like pressing the log out button considering there is nothing else to do

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someone doesn't has game backlog? or anything else to do? the heck you are doing, watching wall

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Originally Posted by ShariusTC

someone doesn't has game backlog? or anything else to do? the heck you are doing, watching wall

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If you started in 2016 and still have a backlog what you are doing…….looking at a wall

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

If you started in 2016 and still have a backlog what you are doing…….looking at a wall

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huh? people buying new game everyday, dude, get a job

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Originally Posted by ShariusTC

huh? people buying new game everyday, dude, get a job

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I’m an anaesthesiologist, I can almost guarantee I work more than you. So I’ll say again if you still have a meaningful backlog in this game from 2016 then you must be spending a lot of time staring at a wall

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Originally Posted by Miguel85NYC

Come on.... you can do better this crap, I did 2 dailies that took less then a minute to do, Talk to a npc and pick up a bag off the floor...
WTF? How is this engaging? I cant believe it took them this long for this patch and thats all we get.. im so close on unsubbing from the game

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Do it! Do it! Do it!
You don't need my agreement, but Do it!

what are you still doing here?

I hear there is one mounted quest, but I haven't seen it. I am mostly getting the same quests I got the first day. They are supposed to change with the ongoing story. It's just lazy.

I always appreciate good storylines and quests so understand where you're coming from. But let's say SE move their writing resources from the MSQ and guild quests, and put them onto daily beast tribe quests. You spend not the average 1.5+hours doing 12 stacked quests, but all of your available play time doing these long elaborate quests with a nice story.

That sounds cool, but you got nothing else done and it's the next day, you have to do those same long stories and quests again if you want to level your beast tribe reputation.

That no longer sounds cool, it sounds like hell.

I'd wager most people stack 12 daily beast tribe quests (when at that level), skip all the dialog and power through them as quickly as possible. Then spend their remaining time doing other things. Except for the story quests during reputation increase, I imagine people enjoy these. It wouldn't benefit SE or players with limited time, to have long elaborate dailies when they'll quickly become repetitious and too time consuming.

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Originally Posted by Doomed_Raven

I always appreciate good storylines and quests so understand where you're coming from. But let's say SE move their writing resources from the MSQ and guild quests, and put them onto daily beast tribe quests. You spend not the average 1.5+hours doing 12 stacked quests, but all of your available play time doing these long elaborate quests with a nice story.

That sounds cool, but you got nothing else done and it's the next day, you have to do those same long stories and quests again if you want to level your beast tribe reputation.

That no longer sounds cool, it sounds like hell.

I'd wager most people stack 12 daily beast tribe quests (when at that level), skip all the dialog and power through them as quickly as possible. Then spend their remaining time doing other things. Except for the story quests during reputation increase, I imagine people enjoy these. It wouldn't benefit SE or players with limited time, to have long elaborate dailies when they'll quickly become repetitious and too time consuming.

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This is a byproduct of the rigid structure made by SE themselves.
Nobody is asking for hours of beast tribe quests.

It takes roughly 30 days to get max rank, right?
Let's say they want to shoot for 5 min questing per day, we're talking 1h30m.
The rank up quests take between 5 and 10 min, so let's round up to 2hs.

So you can make a single quest line that takes 2hs and break that up in small chunks for dailies, but then you have one big quest that will not necessarily be boring repetition, probably have a rising stake and so on, like some side quest lines.

Leave the repeat boring ones for after max rank.

But they're hanging on the word "Daily", but that should only affect availability not Quest Design.

Sense of accomplishment has dwindled each expansion, now its just show up for the day, "winner!"

This sort of radiant quest structure works well enough in plenty of RPGs, the issue for me is the actual engagement is non-existant.

Item objectives are always walk to spot and press X, no thought or variety into what your actually doing (e.g. time limits, working puzzles out, using a bit of intuition to follow verbal clues).

Likewise with combat objectives, overworked mobs are so undertuned they may as well be punching bags made of paper. They have no possible way of hurting you and will die 10 seconds in before you can even start your rotation up. For most RPGs the point of the quest is to give you an excuse to use the combat system more because it's the meat you can bite into while these days for FFXIV you order a burger and just get two slices of bread, maybe some lettuce if your lucky.

It's been like this for many expansions and patch cycles. If you were playing the game in HW, you shouldn't be surprised at where it is (as far as dailies are concerned) now.

Sure, we had multiple beast tribes for DoW/M up through Stormblood. And we had job quests instead of role quests. But all of this is just a natural progression.

If you don't like it, then don't do it. Or deal with it for the easy exp. Or get your exp somewhere else.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

It's been like this for many expansions and patch cycles. If you were playing the game in HW, you shouldn't be surprised at where it is (as far as dailies are concerned) now.

Sure, we had multiple beast tribes for DoW/M up through Stormblood. And we had job quests instead of role quests. But all of this is just a natural progression.

If you don't like it, then don't do it. Or deal with it for the easy exp. Or get your exp somewhere else.

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This is the most baffling type of defense people use. "It has always been bad" is not a good excuse, and even then it has not been THIS bad before. If this is a long standing issue all the more reason to complain about it and bring it up in hopes that it is fixed.

this is the first tribe that i am skipping the rank up quest cutscenes for. i dunno man, its not grabbing me at all. tribes have always been odf varying quality but this time its doing absolutely nothing for me. love the mount tho

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

Think harder. Dismissing the entire game as things you don't care about of course would result in nothing to do. There may be "Many" people that don't care about anything, but there are "many" that do.

*List of things*

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Almost everything on that list is either completely optional, or something you'd already be doing anyway.

If you're still leveling, then non-expert roulettes aren't a chore you have to go out of the way to do. They're things you're already doing anyway as part of the regular leveling experience. Same with crafting turn ins, etc.

And the things you do have to go out of the way for are completely optional. No one is forcing you to keep your island running endlessly, or to micro-manage your retainers, or do the Fashion Report every week, or complete every WT book, etc. Those are activities you opt into if you want the (purely cosmetic) rewards. They're not vital player power progression systems that everyone is forced to do every day/week.

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Originally Posted by Brightamethyst

Almost everything on that list is either completely optional, or something you'd already be doing anyway.

If you're still leveling, then non-expert roulettes aren't a chore you have to go out of the way to do. They're things you're already doing anyway as part of the regular leveling experience. Same with crafting turn ins, etc.

And the things you do have to go out of the way for are completely optional. No one is forcing you to keep your island running endlessly, or to micro-manage your retainers, or do the Fashion Report every week, or complete every WT book, etc. Those are activities you opt into if you want the (purely cosmetic) rewards. They're not vital player power progression systems that everyone is forced to do every day/week.

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All dailies are optional. Most of the game's content is optional. Playing the game at all is optional. What you find to be a chore is your own opinion.

You stated you couldn't think of dailies/weeklies. There are many. That they are all optional doesn't change that they exist to be churned through or ignored at your leisure.

I'm not even understanding your point of view. Looking at the job you listed as your main, you are using mostly 700 and 710 gear. So I mean, you already said that power progression isn't even something you care about but now are discerning between "vital power progression systems". The standard of keeping up your power level to outdated tomes / raids suggests nothing in the game at all is important to you.

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Originally Posted by Daralii

The first idea that comes to mind is an option between what we have now and more involved quests(or a single quest, possibly costing more allowances either way) that focus almost exclusively on combat/crafting/gathering. They should obviously give more rewards, but I'm not sure if rep should be one of them or if XP/tokens/tomestones would be enough.

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I believe this was tried (at least for combat) back in Heavensward with Battle Leves. You can still check what was available. I expect it went nowhere after that because of lack of participation.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

I believe this was tried (at least for combat) back in Heavensward with Battle Leves. You can still check what was available. I expect it went nowhere after that because of lack of participation.

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It's non issue, as Large Scale leves are worse than single leves. It was a terrible implementation.

They haven't really shaken ANYTHING up. Same dailies, same treasure dungeon with RNG doors, same custom deliveries, same tomestone lockouts and upgrade item lockouts.

I don't really care how long content takes, I just want it to be fun. There isn't much in this game that feels fun for me and for a long time this didn't matter as much because the MSQ and lore was really cool and suspenseful. But now that the MSQ is trash... I'm looking for the fun in the game and I just can't find much.

It feels like the content is being made for the sake of making content and not because the devs played around with it, had a blast, and then thought it would be fun to implement into the game.

I've never enjoyed the beast tribe/tribal/allied society quests in any expansion, but these really are a new low in terms of how shockingly UNinteractive they are. The reason I pushed through and did a lot of the old quests from the previous expansions was because I either liked the characters and lore enough to try, or there was a reward I wanted. I remember thinking how annoying the Vath would be and then being surprised by how good the writing was and how much the story made me care about them and my little adventuring Vath buddy. Or how the Pixie quests rebuilt a cool dream realm and told the story of the former Titania, that was neat. Were the quests fun? No, not really, but at least there was something interesting for me to find through it.

Maybe these new quests will go somewhere, but from the long and boring preamble to unlock the dailies and the few quests I've bothered to do, I really, REALLY don't care about the Pelupelu at all and this may be just making me like them LESS, to be honest. I also found all the Endwalker society quests annoying and boring (still haven't finished 2/3rds of them), but somehow I'm even more bored than I was from those.

I think...maybe...just maybe...these tribe/society quests have always been bad game design from day one, so for some people, the quests becoming even more fast and simple is an improvement because it was always bad and something annoying to push through to get to the thing you actually wanted (mount), while others just want the quests, if they're going to be here, to be something remotely fun and engaging.

I'm not sure how much CS3 knows how to make fun and engaging content anymore though, tbh...

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Originally Posted by Sinstrel

I don't really care how long content takes, I just want it to be fun.

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This, all day. If something is fun and engaging, I will want to spend time with it. If it is boring and/or tedious, I just want to get it over with. The problem now is that the beast tribe (as long as the Pelupelu are wearing those stupid duck masks, they will be a beast tribe) dailies are so simplistic, and the stories that go with them so uninteresting, that I don't feel like logging in to do them. They provide nothing more than cheap EXP for jobs I don't play often, with the added detriment that once I get one of those jobs to the level cap I have no idea how to play it since none of the quests required me to develop any skills.

At the very least, I wish there was a good story to go with this. Endwalker's hippo cart delivery company set the bar pretty low, and DT's travel agency is doing it's best to limbo underneath it. It's a silly premise that, like the MSQ, doesn't make a lot of sense under any critical scrutiny. The characters are completely lacking in personality, and it's made worse because all the Vanuvanu and Pelupelu look alike; there is no individual distinction between anyone. And everyone is just so... agreeable. I wish I could get rubes from the city to pay me for the Real Farmer Experience, and I could put them to work doing the crap I don't like to do.

I am tired of the apologists' argument of, "It's always been like this." Yeah, I know. That doesn't mean it was good. It was bad then, and it's worse now. A new expansion is a chance to take a risk and try something new, but instead DT doubled-down on the design philosophy of EW--accessibility trumps engagement. I think the devs look at completion numbers and take away the wrong conclusions; fast and cheap means more people will do it, but they're not asking if anyone is really satisfied with it.

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Originally Posted by Jangles

This is the most baffling type of defense people use. "It has always been bad" is not a good excuse, and even then it has not been THIS bad before. If this is a long standing issue all the more reason to complain about it and bring it up in hopes that it is fixed.

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It isn't a "defense." I have no stock in Square Enix. I've quit the game before and resubbed just to see what's going on. Why did I quit? I didn't find enough "fun" things to do. So, I went somewhere else to find something "fun" to do. If anything, I'd encourage people to leave and try new things if they don't like what's here.

I've also learned that the game IS formulaic. My unsubbing makes no difference. Unless millions unsub. Then maybe they'd do something.

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Originally Posted by dspguy

It isn't a "defense." I have no stock in Square Enix. I've quit the game before and resubbed just to see what's going on. Why did I quit? I didn't find enough "fun" things to do. So, I went somewhere else to find something "fun" to do. If anything, I'd encourage people to leave and try new things if they don't like what's here.

I've also learned that the game IS formulaic. My unsubbing makes no difference. Unless millions unsub. Then maybe they'd do something.

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For me I just realize that OPTIONAL dailies are just low-effort systems most MMOs to either help casual players "catch up" or offer minor rewards. I mean in ESO we had a daily for crafting where the most common approach was having an add-on that was officially condoned do all the crafting for you. People would spend 45 minutes a day logging in alts, autocrafting/turning in" for their daily XP and free mats/money. I can't think of any MMO that didn't have some mundane repeatable daily for some XP or minor reward. Most of these dailies in other MMOs put even less effort into them than this.

Sure the writing could be better this time around but whatever. At least the new mount is cute and I liked the mount-entertainment quest. Rest of them so far have been whatever.

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Originally Posted by Balmung_Griffin

It's non issue, as Large Scale leves are worse than single leves. It was a terrible implementation.

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Thanks for the confirmation that it tanked because players didn't participate.

Man forums always bring in content free of charge. Jerry jerry jerry. All jokes tho. You realize dailes also consist of expert / alliace / trials / normal raids / daily cackpot / beast tribes/ expert dungeon runs.... if your logging in takes up more than that amount of time to do those runs.....your internet sucks and I wouldn't want you on my runs for fear you might dc..... there my joke and sarcasm for the day. Tho keep up the free complaining while we try to figure out why Yawntrail story still sucks.

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Originally Posted by Kennar

(as long as the Pelupelu are wearing those stupid duck masks, they will be a beast tribe)

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what if i told you that the reason for the duck masks is to hide the fact that pelupelu are just repurposed child models from arr

Can we talk about the fish meal models that appear upon reaching the currently highest available rank (I think it's rank 6)? The Grapes in EW were one thing but holy hell what is THIS:

https://i.gyazo.com/15f2d7b78361d370...be0ddc401a.png

This texture is after the graphics/texture updates, too. Did they attach the normal map from one of the Hanuhanu or something why does it look like that

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Originally Posted by Jeeqbit

They don't take long because things in MMORPGs used to consume your whole life to the point of not eating/sleeping.

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There's a happy middle ground between both extremes, you know. In a vacuum, having some quick and simple EXP methods is perfectly fine. The issue is when it's all they have on offer. 7.1 is utterly barren for content unless you're a raider. Which makes these 5 minute "chores" stand out worse because they're essentially telling everyone else "just wait another five months for your content!"

Not to mention, it's a fair criticism to say CBU3 simply sucks at world building quest objectives when these exact same menial tasks were put into a multi-hundred million flagship with FFXVI. For reference sake, I'm playing BG3 right now and I've had side quests where I've been sent searching all across the map, exploring areas I'd otherwise have no reason to look at and stumbling into surprise encounters along the way. All with fully voiced NPCs while the main cast only comments. Basically, in an hour playing that game I've had a more immersive experience with random NPCs than anything XIV or XVI offers in most of its side quests combined. And these types of side quests in BG3 are the supposed "low end". There are a handful more that a massive in what's offered.

None of this is to say XIV should match what a single player game can do but when even their single player game equivalent in XVI also struggles, maybe it's time to look at the design philosophy itself. I'd rather less quests on the whole but with better quality than 50 quests of "busywork".

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Originally Posted by ZephyrMenodora

For me I just realize that OPTIONAL dailies are just low-effort systems most MMOs to either help casual players "catch up" or offer minor rewards. I mean in ESO we had a daily for crafting where the most common approach was having an add-on that was officially condoned do all the crafting for you. People would spend 45 minutes a day logging in alts, autocrafting/turning in" for their daily XP and free mats/money. I can't think of any MMO that didn't have some mundane repeatable daily for some XP or minor reward. Most of these dailies in other MMOs put even less effort into them than this.

Sure the writing could be better this time around but whatever. At least the new mount is cute and I liked the mount-entertainment quest. Rest of them so far have been whatever.

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That's a great way to describe it.

If there's one thing SE does well, it is give options. Don't want to just grind highest level dungeons for exp? Here are a multiple of ways to earn exp on your character doing other content. Don't want to grind the crafting log to level up your crafter? How about Allied quests? How about collectables? Need to earn MGP to buy some glam/mounts/etc? Here's a dozen mini-games. Here's a weekly low-effort thing you can do (fashion report). How about a near-bare-minimum way to get MGP by just doing a few mini-games and getting like 10k.

The list goes on and on. There are even other ways to earn raid-equivalent gear without stepping foot in Savage - if you are willing to wait.

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Originally Posted by Dorito_Burrito

So my appreciation of the quickness of FFXIV's daily quests makes me lazy? I didn't know saving time was a bad thing, but here we are.

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Lazy people tend to appreciate lazy design

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Originally Posted by iVolke

Lazy people tend to appreciate lazy design

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I mean, for just this one minuscule part of the game that I'll probably forget about entirely once I've reaped all the rewards? Sure why not.

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Originally Posted by Miguel85NYC

And this is why we get crappy content, is people like you.

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and if it were longer, i'd probably see people like you come complaining they were chores

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Originally Posted by Bellybell

and if it were longer, i'd probably see people like you come complaining they were chores

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Great so since we know an element of the population will complain either way the rest of us can agree that “more” is better since it’s optional

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Originally Posted by iVolke

Lazy people tend to appreciate lazy design

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I'm lazy af and I actually appreciate being engaged by anything but lazy.

I like them being short.

That's what it's supposed to be, yeah. I don't want to spend a bunch of time grinding. Grinding is the most boring part of any game and the reward you get wouldn't even be worth it either.

It's just a quick easy 5 minute catch up mechanic for people that didn't level all their jobs to 100 during the first month of the expansion.