FFXIV, please stop clothing your men.

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Originally Posted by Eien713

This has been the life of aiming, striking, and scouting most of the time for ages now. Carbon copies of each other just with different colors and sommmetimes very minor changes. Seeing these new sets really upset me.

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I'm more disappointed than anything, this game makes how much money? And they really want us to believe they can't afford to make more varied gear, or even NEW gear for that matter, the list of shared models dating back to ARR is atrocious.

Sorry, I'm confused here.
The title of this thread is about not giving male characters clothing or outfits that show a bit more skin?

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

Sorry, I'm confused here.
The title of this thread is about not giving male characters clothing or outfits that show a bit more skin?

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Look at the Miqo in the image in the first post, on the center of the group, she is wearing the Fending set of the upcoming series, and shows quite cute short shorts, OP is complaining that those shorts turn into pants when worn by a male character, and they wanted the cute shorts for men as well, that's it.

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Originally Posted by VeyaAkemi

Look at the Miqo in the image in the first post, on the center of the group, she is wearing the Fending set of the upcoming series, and shows quite cute short shorts, OP is complaining that those shorts turn into pants when worn by a male character, and they wanted the cute shorts for men as well, that's it.

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Ah, okay. That's kind of a strange argument to make.
And considering it has not even been released, I'm not sure how he'd know what the armor looks like on men.

Don't we have short shorts for men on the cash shop and trading post?

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

Ah, okay. That's kind of a strange argument to make.
And considering it has not even been released, I'm not sure how he'd know what the armor looks like on men.

Don't we have short shorts for men on the cash shop and trading post?

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Because every single outfit we have ever have demoed on females that looks like that will be baggy pants on males. Same as bikinis on females will be baggy board shorts for males

Males shouldn’t have to go to the cash shop to show some skin when the model is already there and if a female wants to be conservative then she should be able to use the male model for the same reasons.

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

Ah, okay. That's kind of a strange argument to make.
And considering it has not even been released, I'm not sure how he'd know what the armor looks like on men.

Don't we have short shorts for men on the cash shop and trading post?

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I'm pretty sure they chose a male and female in the group shot for the shared armor models of Fending/Maiming to demonstrate how it changes.

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

Ah, okay. That's kind of a strange argument to make.
And considering it has not even been released, I'm not sure how he'd know what the armor looks like on men.

Don't we have short shorts for men on the cash shop and trading post?

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If you have never noticed the devs habit of slapping a pair of office trousers on the male versions of outfits then you've not been looking hard enough. It's a common issue which is why people can tell from the promo picture alone that it's happening again here.

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

And considering it has not even been released, I'm not sure how he'd know what the armor looks like on men.

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The male viera is wearing the male gear in purple. It's a recoloured version of the fending set, probably for maiming or striking classses. The male warrior roe in the second picture is also wearing the fending set and when you look at his legs he's wearing long pants.

Glamour system is complete trash.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Males shouldn’t have to go to the cash shop to show some skin

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Male characters would be ill-served hitting the cash shop to show some skin, there are so many other options in game for 'free', up to and including a tiny speedo.

Otherwise, reasonable point.

I'm hesistant to ask Square to stop doing it, because it'll just lead to muted options where everything appears gender neutral and we'll see a lack of personality in wears. This already happened a little in Dawntrail, where there was very few wears that showed skin.

The best outcome that I'd argue for would be having a toggle between the traditional male and female versions of gear going forward, or even retroactively. Players having options is good. Some people like a more modest or non-modest look, some people would rather conform to tradition or non-conform to it. We don't lose anything by having the options of what gear to wear.

I genuinely don't understand why they keep making genderlocked gear after they basically had a mass "un-genderlock" for nearly all of Endwalker, for both mogstation and some obtained in game. I'm sure mogstation sales were a big motivator, but I'm genuinely amazed at how little they've been listening and learning these past few years when it comes to glamour.

Im still salty...you guys talking about this im still salty dancer doesn't have face veil from back in endwalker.....

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Because every single outfit we have ever have demoed on females that looks like that will be baggy pants on males. Same as bikinis on females will be baggy board shorts for males

Males shouldn’t have to go to the cash shop to show some skin when the model is already there and if a female wants to be conservative then she should be able to use the male model for the same reasons.

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Now that I've gotten a grasp on the topic. I won't say I don't understand the sentiment. For a long time, I've wanted my female characters to have the same style as male clothes. I don't dig booty shorts or skirts when I'm adventuring.

On the same token. Some outfits do 'provide.' 'Barely dressed Male Vibe' people here seem to want.

I also understand why Square doesn't want to touch that particular thing.

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

Now that I've gotten a grasp on the topic. I won't say I don't understand the sentiment. For a long time, I've wanted my female characters to have the same style as male clothes. I don't dig booty shorts or skirts when I'm adventuring.

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The point is far more that things should be equal, as well as variety should be the focus rather than shoehorning options into molds, some people will enjoy wearing skits while out adventuring(I do, Frontier Dress and Valentione Emissary's Ruffled Dress are my top two glams in this game), some will prefer pants, some will want to dress practical, some will want to dress like a slut, you are as valid for wanting practical clothing for your girls as they are for wanting their men to dress like a street corner hooker, so the complaint focus on how the game sparsely enables that.

I support letting men wear short shorts and more revealing armor for everyone who is seeking them.

Also, I just feel like SE won't even consider adding pants options for female gear which is much less controversial.

It's not even the fact that the gear is different on genders that triggers me but the fact that it just feels like they designed around the centerpiece on a female miqo and seemingly ran out of budget/time to design the rest, it's absolutely hilarious how obvious it is. Reminds me of those images where the caption is like: "spot the main character"

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

Now that I've gotten a grasp on the topic. I won't say I don't understand the sentiment. For a long time, I've wanted my female characters to have the same style as male clothes. I don't dig booty shorts or skirts when I'm adventuring.

On the same token. Some outfits do 'provide.' 'Barely dressed Male Vibe' people here seem to want.

I also understand why Square doesn't want to touch that particular thing.

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Why would square not want to touch “that thing”

Some of us would prefer to see more skin on males than females, why should there be a difference

Did you guys know heels and skirts and even dresses were all originally made FOR MEN. Yea. I don't know when modern society turned away from revealing more skin on guys, but can it like.. U turn on that? Woman want it, and men deserve it. Ffxiv doing this is just 1 step in true gender equality

Removing gender-lock was the first step into the wrong direction.

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Originally Posted by lucatracy

I genuinely don't understand why they keep making genderlocked gear after they basically had a mass "un-genderlock" for nearly all of Endwalker, for both mogstation and some obtained in game. I'm sure mogstation sales were a big motivator, but I'm genuinely amazed at how little they've been listening and learning these past few years when it comes to glamour.

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Because it's more work. Making each outfit fit on every race both male and female is the workload of making 2 outfits instead of one. So that would be 4 outfits if you are demanding the male version fit on all female characters and vice versa. That's why the gender"lock" as you call it, which it really isn't, is addressed at later times. Because it's not simply a matter of toggling it on or off. They have to actually make it fit to the male models. I imagine the big hangup is male Hrothgar and Roe specifically since they don't use a base Hyur skeleton

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Originally Posted by Len_

Because it's more work. Making each outfit fit on every race both male and female is the workload of making 2 outfits instead of one. So that would be 4 outfits if you are demanding the male version fit on all female characters and vice versa. That's why the gender"lock" as you call it, which it really isn't, is addressed at later times. Because it's not simply a matter of toggling it on or off. They have to actually make it fit to the male models. I imagine the big hangup is male Hrothgar and Roe specifically since they don't use a base Hyur skeleton

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Simple solution. Design them unisex

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

Simple solution. Design them unisex

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That's not a solution. The ask is for access to the opposite gender outfit, not to genericize the designs.

I read the title first as : "Please make all the men naked" and had a chuckle.

Please, continue the thread *Exits*

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Originally Posted by Hallarem

I read the title first as : "Please make all the men naked" and had a chuckle.

Please, continue the thread *Exits*

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All male characters must now use the full Emperor's New Glam set at all times. Sorry, I don't make the rules.

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Originally Posted by Len_

Because it's more work. Making each outfit fit on every race both male and female is the workload of making 2 outfits instead of one. So that would be 4 outfits if you are demanding the male version fit on all female characters and vice versa. That's why the gender"lock" as you call it, which it really isn't, is addressed at later times. Because it's not simply a matter of toggling it on or off. They have to actually make it fit to the male models. I imagine the big hangup is male Hrothgar and Roe specifically since they don't use a base Hyur skeleton

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Right they they are already making more work for themselves by making gear be booty shorts on females and baggy pants on males because there is no skeleton on males that would block the ability to have them wear the same booty shorts the females do. If they start with the pants then the reverse is also true, female skeletons don’t block pants. Hrothgar’s unique skeletons are a problem whichever version they start with

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

Simple solution. Design them unisex

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Terrible solution. Unisex clothes look equally bad on everyone.

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Originally Posted by Astronis

Terrible solution. Unisex clothes look equally bad on everyone.

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Not true. My wife and her character look good in everything.

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Originally Posted by Astronis

Terrible solution. Unisex clothes look equally bad on everyone.

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Unisex clothing Is clothing that's designed once and nothing more. So some clothing would be a skirt, some wouldn't. God. Most raid gear in ff is unisex

Also can we pleaseeeeee get more stuff for guys with open chest. I wanna show off those glorious pecks. God knows the muscles are the only redeeming feature of male auras

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

Also can we pleaseeeeee get more stuff for guys with open chest. I wanna show off those glorious pecks. God knows the muscles are the only redeeming feature of male auras

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You should but, according to this thread the girls should also be provided an open chest area. We all know that's never going to happen. They're going to taper in the opening and add a very modest bra like they always do. Which is quite the double standard. Most of the time true censorship doesn't even get in the way it's usually the devs deciding make the females version less risque. But many warriors of self expression and exhibitions usually don't have any qualms when that happens...

The female also usually receive very poor fitting on unisex/male crossover outfits. Very frumpy usually not accounting for the smaller waists, smaller shoulders, and reduced bust emphasis resulting in a boxy uni-boob shape. Counterpart development would be appealing if they weren't so lazy. Until then if traditional is the only way to get quality so be it. Also it's not like there aren't alternatives for shorts, skirts, and trousers when they aren't provided in a new set.

This really all started with the blasted mgs bunny suits. Later, Shadowbringers and especially Endwalker went crazy with gender counterpart gear development ("unlocks"). A waste of assets when you have Viera and Hrothgar 5+ bleedin' years without hats.

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Originally Posted by programcanaan

You should but, according to this thread the girls should also be provided an open chest area. We all know that's never going to happen. They're going to taper in the opening and add a very modest bra like they always do. Which is quite the double standard. Most of the time true censorship doesn't even get in the way it's usually the devs deciding make the females version less risque. But many warriors of self expression and exhibitions usually don't have any qualms when that happens...

The female also usually receive very poor fitting on unisex/male crossover outfits. Very frumpy usually not accounting for the smaller waists, smaller shoulders, and reduced bust emphasis resulting in a boxy uni-boob shape. Counterpart development would be appealing if they weren't so lazy. Until then if traditional is the only way to get quality so be it. Also it's not like there aren't alternatives for shorts, skirts, and trousers when they aren't provided in a new set.

This really all started with the blasted mgs bunny suits. Later, Shadowbringers and especially Endwalker went crazy with gender counterpart gear development ("unlocks"). A waste of assets when you have Viera and Hrothgar 5+ bleedin' years without hats.

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The lightheavyweight coat literally has open chest on females. If you want braless tops they will never do that. But they have in the past made exposed chest gear for men and woman . Ureaus coat, lone wolf coat.

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Originally Posted by sindriiisgaming

Unisex clothing Is clothing that's designed once and nothing more. So some clothing would be a skirt, some wouldn't. God. Most raid gear in ff is unisex

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To be picky about it, it's not usually unisex, virtually all of it is made to flatter a man or a woman more, and the other sex characters just have to deal with it.

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Originally Posted by programcanaan

The female also usually receive very poor fitting on unisex/male crossover outfits. Very frumpy usually not accounting for the smaller waists, smaller shoulders, and reduced bust emphasis resulting in a boxy uni-boob shape. Counterpart development would be appealing if they weren't so lazy. Until then if traditional is the only way to get quality so be it. Also it's not like there aren't alternatives for shorts, skirts, and trousers when they aren't provided in a new set.

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It's equally as obvious when an outfit is tailored for a woman and then they fit it to a male model. Especially a Highlander male model. Unnecessary darts to accommodate nonexistent breasts, frills to emphasize my narrow hips, cloth bunching up and clinging in all the wrong places.

I'll happily live with it though if it means they don't go down the road of ignoring that humans come in two standard models and what looks good on one does not necessarily look good on the other. This is a game that's pretty good about presenting idealized human beauty (lack of butts and chest hair aside), to dress those ideals in clothes that don't flatter would be a crime.

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Originally Posted by Len_

Because it's more work. Making each outfit fit on every race both male and female is the workload of making 2 outfits instead of one. So that would be 4 outfits if you are demanding the male version fit on all female characters and vice versa. That's why the gender"lock" as you call it, which it really isn't, is addressed at later times. Because it's not simply a matter of toggling it on or off. They have to actually make it fit to the male models. I imagine the big hangup is male Hrothgar and Roe specifically since they don't use a base Hyur skeleton

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I don't think you're understanding my point here. I'm not "demanding" for toggles or two different versions of gear that fits both genders, I'm insisting that there should not have to be differences in gear *in the first place* if they don't want to put any effort into making said toggles or options. There has been nothing but outcry whenever this happens and there was major praise when they (seemingly) took a step forward when they decided to unlock more old gear.

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That's why the gender"lock" as you call it, which it really isn't, is addressed at later times.

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Not sure what you're getting at here. I'm well aware of how modelling works in this game, regardless of if it's temporary or if they have to put more work in, there's a version of a piece of gear that one gender cannot wear at all. It's locked to one gender. That's what "genderlock" is.

who gives a shit? only glam pvp gears anyway...

Just adding my voice before I can't post anymore. I switched from Lala to Viera to have more flexibility in glamour but I'm stuck with no hats and no shorts.

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Originally Posted by EchoingPulse

Ah, okay. That's kind of a strange argument to make.
And considering it has not even been released, I'm not sure how he'd know what the armor looks like on men.

Don't we have short shorts for men on the cash shop and trading post?

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There's a dungeon screenshot with a Hrothgar wearing the outfit and it's turned into pants.

Buddy, I wanted Tribal outfits in the "New World" expansion and all I got were recolor and neon outfits.

If anything, I am exhausted of all these unimaginative outfits to be fancy like we keep getting. Or Modern outfits, it makes me cringe everytime I see a new "social outfit" or "cutesy casual outfit" with jeans and stuff like that.

Give me Fantasy armor. You know, from the word in the name of the game? If I wanted all this IMVU/Second Life outfits, I would be there.

Gendered outfits is the least of the concerns if all we get is constant garbage. Then again, fantasy armor hardly need to be gendered. So, it would be both wins.