post-Dawntrail even story dungeons are harder and more punishing to heal than ever

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Originally Posted by Granis

but the problem i found with binding letter keys, is you have to take your fingers off of wasd which will get you killed during punishing, fast snapshooting mechanics like this.

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The boss is telgraphing which side he will attack for at least 3 seconds

Tanks and most Dps received skills that heal or mitigate dmg for a reason. Let them use all of their skills. There is no I in team.

This is what happens when healers get nothing but spamming one DPS button for years. They get used to it and cannot handle basic tasks because the game never taught them how or why. This has hurt the game so much I don't even know what to say.
Every healer is equipped with stuff they can do while moving.

If players make mistakes during poison splashes and get hit, it's not the healer's fault if they die. Healers CAN be safety net and compensate for mistakes. In fact, this is one of their main purposes in every party. But playing mechanics always comes first. If for whatever reason you have no instant casts left or are overwhelmed because someone failed a mechanic - focus on yourself first and on everyone else second. Don't feel like you have to compensate for everything. Just keep trying your best and you'll improve at saving players in no time ^_^. Just don't forget to save yourself first!

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Originally Posted by Arohk

The boss is telgraphing which side he will attack for at least 3 seconds

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by the time i see what arm he is raising and i start moving the fast-telegraphing poison aoe in the middle has already appeared and is gonna clip me because it snapshots too quickly... i mean, look at this! how are you expected to handle this if you have cast bars?

https://youtu.be/3xRhxC5rlPI

I've been stuck here for days! been trying to do it with trusts because i can't stand being yelled at and vote abandoned anymore

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Originally Posted by Granis

by the time i see what arm he is raising and i start moving the fast-telegraphing poison aoe in the middle has already appeared and is gonna clip me because it snapshots too quickly... i mean, look at this! how are you expected to handle this if you have cast bars?

https://youtu.be/3xRhxC5rlPI

I've been stuck here for days! been trying to do it with trusts because i can't stand being yelled at and vote abandoned anymore

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If you're going in with trusts why not just follow them? Their spots will always be safe. You can safely stack with them to avoid the poison.

edit:
I also noticed something in your video. You may not know this, because it is kind of counter-intuitive. As soon as the orange AoE markers are gone, you can already move back to the center and the poison will not hit you. Standing in the middle reduces the amount of movement required for dodging, giving you enough time to walk away when an arm indicates the unsafe side. You are waiting too long after the poison spread. Because of this, if your side turns out to be the unsafe one, you have to walk more and the mechanic becomes harder to deal with.

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Originally Posted by Xelanar

If you're going in with trusts why not just follow them? Their spots will always be safe. You can safely stack with them to avoid the poison.

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no you can't, because healers shouldn't be standing that close to the boss, i have to be standing further away but at the same time i can stand like even further back to avoid the puddles that take up so much room because i need to be just close enough for phlegma to make sure i'm trying to use my phlegmas and they don't overcap for too long...

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Originally Posted by Granis

by the time i see what arm he is raising and i start moving the fast-telegraphing poison aoe in the middle has already appeared and is gonna clip me because it snapshots too quickly... i mean, look at this! how are you expected to handle this if you have cast bars?

https://youtu.be/3xRhxC5rlPI

I've been stuck here for days! been trying to do it with trusts because i can't stand being yelled at and vote abandoned anymore

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Clicking skills WILL make you not be able to focus too much on the boss because you would be clicking your hotbar to see if you clicked it right, that's why it's making you not notice the boss's movements fast enough.
If you're running with trust, and you already know it's a two side attack during that phase, just don't cast heals or barriers, focus on the mech first until you get used to the timing, since NPCs can run correctly without them dying.
It's fine to put things down first and learn mechanics or understand them, the more you're anxious to clear the fight the more you're going to make mistakes.
btw I watched your video, the poison DOT is you running into the 2 blobs in front of the boss, not from the orange aoe.

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Originally Posted by Granis

by the time i see what arm he is raising and i start moving the fast-telegraphing poison aoe in the middle has already appeared and is gonna clip me because it snapshots too quickly... i mean, look at this! how are you expected to handle this if you have cast bars?

https://youtu.be/3xRhxC5rlPI

I've been stuck here for days! been trying to do it with trusts because i can't stand being yelled at and vote abandoned anymore

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I have some questions, go deep inside you and try to answer them, i don't need excuses.

Why do you cast your party mitigation AFTER the Boss AOE
Why don't you use sprint to run.
Why do you move to the right, when the boss lifts his Arm to the right instead of left.
Why dont you go back to the middle after the boss has done the first stomp to reduce the walking distance.
Why do you move so far out to the left, increasing your walking distance.
Why do you run through the poison in the middle taking unnecessary damage.
Why don't you heal yourself after taking the first hit.

I wish i wasnt at work right now so i could respond to you video better.

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Originally Posted by Granis

no you can't, because healers shouldn't be standing that close to the boss, i have to be standing further away but at the same time i can stand like even further back to avoid the puddles that take up so much room because i need to be just close enough for phlegma to make sure i'm trying to use my phlegmas and they don't overcap for too long...

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Who told you healers are not allowed to stay in melee range? Healers can stay wherever they want as long as they are not obstructing anyone. And during that specific mechanic they are not.

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Originally Posted by Granis

no you can't, because healers shouldn't be standing that close to the boss, i have to be standing further away but at the same time i can stand like even further back to avoid the puddles that take up so much room because i need to be just close enough for phlegma to make sure i'm trying to use my phlegmas and they don't overcap for too long...

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Healers should always be in melee range unless mechanics force them out

Nobody should be in narnia because they are a ranged

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Originally Posted by Granis

no you can't, because healers shouldn't be standing that close to the boss, i have to be standing further away but at the same time i can stand like even further back to avoid the puddles that take up so much room because i need to be just close enough for phlegma to make sure i'm trying to use my phlegmas and they don't overcap for too long...

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Your abilities do not have a minimum range. There is no reason why you can't stand near the boss. In fact, on this particular boss you have to stand very near the boss or you won't have enough time to dodge the AOEs. They're not "quick and snapshotting," they're telegraphed for several seconds by the boss raising his arms. You're just standing in Narnia and not giving yourself reasonable time to move. You are creating this problem for yourself.

Everyone in this thread is trying to help you and you're brushing off their advice with "oh no I can't do that because XYZ." If you're having a massive amount of difficulty with this boss and nobody else here is, maybe you should listen to their advice.

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Originally Posted by Granis

no you can't, because healers shouldn't be standing that close to the boss,

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There's very few fights that you can't stack with the rest of the party in the rear of the mob. Only time it's really an issue is in fights like Alex (think it eas alex) where u need to stay away from the other healer.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

Your abilities do not have a minimum range. There is no reason why you can't stand near the boss. In fact, on this particular boss you have to stand very near the boss or you won't have enough time to dodge the AOEs. They're not "quick and snapshotting," they're telegraphed for several seconds by the boss raising his arms. You're just standing in Narnia and not giving yourself reasonable time to move. You are creating this problem for yourself.

Everyone in this thread is trying to help you and you're brushing off their advice with "oh no I can't do that because XYZ." If you're having a massive amount of difficulty with this boss and nobody else here is, maybe you should listen to their advice.

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but i'm a healer, i shouldn't ever stand near a boss like ever, after the mechanic is over i could just get destroyed the next time it decides to do a cleave or some other mechanic!

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Originally Posted by Granis

no you can't, because healers shouldn't be standing that close to the boss, i have to be standing further away but at the same time i can stand like even further back to avoid the puddles that take up so much room because i need to be just close enough for phlegma to make sure i'm trying to use my phlegmas and they don't overcap for too long...

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I always run that mech like right behind the boss where the melees are when I run healer, there is no rule that healers HAVE to stay out of melee range, as long as it isn't a spread or something that will hit another player.

I don't want to come off rude, but I'll say sorry in advance if this offends you.
Do you have friends who play and teach you in FFXIV?
I only came back to playing FFXIV in around 6.1, so not a very long term time.
Of course people will struggle on certain parts, but I can say that I got my skill levels up fairly quickly by a friend who taught me how to play through the dungeons or raids.

They teach me what my priorities are when I'm a healer, what I should do in occasions that happen during a raid. Like when I get a rez, my first priority is to heal myself before trying to save everyone else in cause of an AOE that happens after my 5 sec Invuln wears off.

Or when I'm a tank, how I should pull, or easier ways to pull, to keep aggro etc.

Or even when I'm a DPS, what time should I get up when I rez, what skills to use to mitigate.

This is a genuine question, and this is why some of us are trying to teach you how to run the mechanics, but you seem to try to find excuses to learn them. People might come off a bit rude, but I'm sure most people in the community are trying to help, and are willing to, I've seen lots of people actively saying they will help out in the few threads that are people complaining about the mechs, as long as you ask.

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Originally Posted by Supersnow845

Healers should always be in melee range unless mechanics force them out

Nobody should be in narnia because they are a ranged

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but if you get too close, how do you not just die if the boss decides to do a cleave after the next autoattack on the tank after the mechanic ends?

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Originally Posted by Granis

but if you get too close, how do you not just die if the boss decides to do a cleave after the next autoattack on the tank after the mechanic ends?

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Stand with the melee, not with the tank

Untelegraphed chariot cleaves aren’t a thing in this game

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Originally Posted by Granis

but i'm a healer, i shouldn't ever stand near a boss like ever, after the mechanic is over i could just get destroyed the next time it decides to do a cleave or some other mechanic!

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Alright, this has to be a troll account. I'm out.

C-can I just confirm that this isn't a troll post? Your join date is 2014 and if I were to go by that, you've played for a decade, and the video you've posted sort of looks very forced into making bad decisions. So far, you've evaded answering absolutely everything by cooking up the lamest excuses.

You've completed InnoEX before which is harder than most dungeons and even Origenics which is making me suspicious as heck.

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Originally Posted by Granis

but i'm a healer, i shouldn't ever stand near a boss like ever, after the mechanic is over i could just get destroyed the next time it decides to do a cleave or some other mechanic!

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https://y.yarn.co/f197d44b-5564-4e60...3e4b3_text.gif

Well RIP me for trying to help or give out advices if it is a troll account lol.

Yep. I also fell for it, but they gave it away. Made it too obvious because the boss we're talking about does not even cleave xD.

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Originally Posted by Granis

no you can't, because healers shouldn't be standing that close to the boss, i have to be standing further away but at the same time i can stand like even further back to avoid the puddles that take up so much room because i need to be just close enough for phlegma to make sure i'm trying to use my phlegmas and they don't overcap for too long...

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Untelegraphed boss mini-cleaves and tank busters went the way of the dodo bird multiple expansions ago. (On a day to day basis, I'd swear that this is a problem only in Labyrinth of the Ancients.)

You can hang out with the trust's DPS. They're just as squishy as you.

If you've truly been stuck on this one for days, then to repeat myself: break your casts and let Phelgma overcap. Seriously. The first goal in any encounter is to clear it or see the enrage (if there is one). After that, you can start worrying optimizing your damage.

Healer community literally wanted harder content. It's posts like this that makes Yoshi P stay up at night cause this player base can't decide what they want. They should honestly stop listening to us when we complain about difficulty. We're in lvl 100 now. Why are we not holding ourselves better accountable for our own actions or inactions? Why are we expecting square to cater to us every time we wipe a few times to a dungeon? You're not expected to clear every piece of content first try with no deaths. You understand how the mechanics work so why not play around it? All this energy to write a post when you could be learning how to heal it properly.

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Originally Posted by noelregnard

I went to watch a gameplay video of the dungeon again because I couldn't remember which boss that was and I didn't see a single poison stack despite people getting hit multiple times. Are you talking about touching the 2 tiny puddles in front of the boss? That are static? If people somehow manage to touch them then honestly I have nothing to say lmao

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I've accidentally touched one once because I'm normally a ranged player and was leveling viper; literally I think my big toe touched it lol. It wasn't too bad though as the healer saw it and healed me a bit more. I apologized.

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Originally Posted by Granis

but i'm a healer, i shouldn't ever stand near a boss like ever, after the mechanic is over i could just get destroyed the next time it decides to do a cleave or some other mechanic!

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Alright then, get hit more often I guess. Maybe dying so many times should tell you that you're doing it wrong but hey.

nah healing is not only boring but piss easy as well sadly the only time healing was ever fun in this game is when cleric stance was around.

I took a quick look at OP's recorded footage.

A boss raising a limb to indicate that it's about to pound that side of the arena is old news. It's a mechanic you've seen before and you should be able to intuit. The only difference here being the poison puddles and AoEs that shrink the availability of safe spaces to be in. All you need to do is to be closer to the middle and ideally on the boss.

Main issues here being: 1) you run too far to either side which greatly extends the travel distance needed to get to safety; 2) you're generally very slow to react when a boss raises a limb. That Eukrasia can wait for that very moment; just get your butt over to safety first; and 3) I don't know why you're running straight through a poison puddle on more than one occasion. Like of course you're punished with a nasty DoT for it.

This boss isn't very demanding. It just asks for a modicum of situational awareness. And that's all there is to this dungeon and its boss mechanics: basic situational awareness.

You haven't done a single savage, so don't act like you're an expert. Besides, P10s isn't even hard because of the poison, the poison is avoidable 100% of the time if you do the mechanics correctly. P10s was hard because of the clunky lasers and the cramped room to spread/stack the dps and healers/tanks and the web mechanic that sometimes worked and sometimes didn't that is followed by a huge raidwide. P12s was 20x harder compared to it, but you wouldn't know because you haven't done anything. I find it hard to believe that the poisons in origenics are that bad, and even if they were, you don't have to dodge Cages and Lasers while also spreading/stacking on a side platform and healing raidwides + puddles at the same time. You have time to weave an ogcd between your 1-1-1 rotation because almost nothing happens in dungeons. I'm dps main, and I play healer to help my new friends and I fall asleep in dungeons.

...you guys bring healers?

I didn’t I notice the difficulty in dungeons. I was pulling wall to wall and the bosses just had extra AOE attacks combined. It was easy. I noticed they nurfed ascian prime, moogles hard mode and Brayflox's Longstop with the poison dragon which is disappointing.

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Originally Posted by Granis

but i'm a healer, i shouldn't ever stand near a boss like ever, after the mechanic is over i could just get destroyed the next time it decides to do a cleave or some other mechanic!

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I'm sorry man, but that's just not true. Even ranged players benefit from standing in max melee range for in-out mechanics. The only time you're ever gonna get cleaved is if you're behind the tank when a tankbuster goes out, and they're always very clearly telegraphed.

I'm also a healer, by the way. I generally tend to max melee.

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Originally Posted by Granis

by the time i see what arm he is raising and i start moving the fast-telegraphing poison aoe in the middle has already appeared and is gonna clip me because it snapshots too quickly... i mean, look at this! how are you expected to handle this if you have cast bars?

https://youtu.be/3xRhxC5rlPI

I've been stuck here for days! been trying to do it with trusts because i can't stand being yelled at and vote abandoned anymore

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My brother in christ, you start of the first poison mech by immediately going to the wrong side, then being late moving out. Like others said, hang around near middle after every puddle, hell if u stay under the boss model just moving max melee on the opposite side of the arms guarantee's ur safety

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Originally Posted by Granis

no, they're literally complaining that healing is currently "too easy" from what i've read, which doesn't make sense to me, healing has never really been all that easy in terms of room for error, but dungeons used to be more chill than the suffering that is healing in harder content... but now it feels like healing dungeons is way more stressful than it used to be...I'm scared to even see the Expert dungeons just going off of Origenics, let alone the overtuned nightmares we're likely going to see in the raid if this is what they're doing with dungeons...

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Um if healer in dungeon is if you dont dps you have to stand there for 3 seconds doing nothing , sometimes over 7 seconds Its not good. I am happy they changed it or well made it closer to what it used to be. People forget how healer had to stance dance back in the day. there was healing stance and damage stance. They changed this to make it easier now people want it so brain dead easy. NO lets go back to where it was . not stance dancing of course but if people want chill being the most important person they should play another job.

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Originally Posted by Davixxa

I'm sorry man, but that's just not true. Even ranged players benefit from standing in max melee range for in-out mechanics. The only time you're ever gonna get cleaved is if you're behind the tank when a tankbuster goes out, and they're always very clearly telegraphed.

I'm also a healer, by the way. I generally tend to max melee.

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Dont forget it also adds minimal more dps from book smacks or rod smacks lol.

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Originally Posted by Granis

yes but consider this:

finding the button and clicking on it takes time,

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you should know where your buttons are by level 100

So, I gotta ask, why did you take that screenshot while standing in orange circles in the vid? That was time you could have used to move, after doing that mechanic twice correctly.

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Originally Posted by Granis

but i'm a healer, i shouldn't ever stand near a boss like ever, after the mechanic is over i could just get destroyed the next time it decides to do a cleave or some other mechanic!

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Patently untrue. You go in melee so you cover the entire party with your healing. Being conscious of your heal range and how to utilize it is a core healer skill and the fact that you don't have it doesn't mean things are hard. If it's cleaving something, you will probably know, and if you don't know you're probably standing in front of it/on the tank and deserve to get blasted.

EDIT: Actually, on the topic of cleaves, I hope you realize that if you're getting targetted with a cone cleave it literally is easier to dodge if you're close to melee range.

Depends on gear mostly I feel. it was fun when everyone was low geared, but during recent roulettes, I have noticed I am going more and more back to pure glarebot status in the new content.
Give it time, and you can go back to sleepomode as healer

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Originally Posted by Granis

but i'm a healer, i shouldn't ever stand near a boss like ever, after the mechanic is over i could just get destroyed the next time it decides to do a cleave or some other mechanic!

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Can you tell me how you finished the Seat of Sacrifice Trial? The last boss in Mailkah's Well?The Magus Sister bosses? Omega Normal Raids? Or any other MSQ/Casual content that definitionally requires you to stand inside the bosses hitbox or near them with donut-shaped AOEs or magnetism mechanics?

Are you saying the developers are putting mechanics in that they are intending for your role to ignore? Because right now you're either objectively wrong OR you're saying the developers are under tuning the content to the point of being completely ignorable, which means you're advocating for content for be harder and ESPECIALLY so for healers, right? Which one is it?

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Originally Posted by Granis

Except the first boss of Origenics literally punishes you hard if you try to cast a GCD, you aren't getting a cast off during the 4 poison attacks, you need to CONSTANTLY move, you don't have time to use a GCD, but then again, if you don't heal someone is either gonna die to a poison tick or to the spread right afterwards.

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If you have to move constantly, you are moving too much.