Eureka Orthos is a Dead Queue in NA

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

Would anyone care if the Aetherpool grind was cut down significantly?

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I'd be all for it. At the very least it'd mean transitioning from matched play to solo would be a little less painful.

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

While we're on the topic of Aetherpool farming in Deep Dungeon, I'll ask a question that I've been wanting to hear some general consensus about for a while.

Would anyone care if the Aetherpool grind was cut down significantly? It really seems like people don't really like farming it and most of the enjoyable part of Deep Dungeons seems to be done once you're already at max aetherpool anyways. Why not have the cap be at 50 or something, double the power of each aetherpool point (or whatever it would take to compensate for it) so that people can do the content without as much of a time sink beforehand? Don't get me wrong, I can enjoy grinds, but the Aetherpool grind has always seemed rather pointless to me outside of crafting grips for weapons, which could still be done if it was shorter.

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I don’t mind it in HoH and PotD as it is rather fast to level up even on solo. In EO the current problem with aetherpool is not that much the quantity but that the group queue is dead and soloing a set of 10 floors at low levels takes way too long due to the spongy adds. As I mentioned a few posts earlier, even with high aetherpool, level 1-40 adds have too much HP, don’t do much dmg (unless you stand in stupid) and it’s just boring to solo. I’d rather simply reduce the HP of the EO adds on levels 1-40.

Orthos same as HOH and even less POTD give you reasons to actually replay it outside liking the content or trying solo attempts

For both Orthos and HOH after 4 runs you get your mount aaaaaaaaaand... that's about it pretty much, you can try to do some runs to farm some gil, kinda, but mounts are rare-ish and stay at but a stable medium price to make it that worth it, again unless you enjoy it
POTD doesn't even have the mount and while the mount is actually expensive it drags for too long to do it with a DF party

I remember Finh(Deep dungeon enthusiast) rumbling about this and giving ideas, like to add a new title for soloing/clearing with party on each role, and then a conjunt title for having all 4 titles or more
And this time around relics cannot be used as a method to include DD like POTD was with i think was Anima and HOH with Bozja materials, since is just tome dump

We don't need a giga reward just a carrot with a stick so people just jump to do it

This is why I thought putting the TT card in floor 41 to 70 was a mistake. I could get it during the time it was active, but if you missed that few weeks time windows, good luck getting it. I don't know why since ShB, they decided to put TT cards behind higher difficulty lvl (Extremes, freaking masked carnivale - I fear 6.45) or not easy to get into (Eureka orthos, in stage you have to do with a premade - I mean, when you look at other deep dungeons, how did they think it would end). TT cards collection was one of those long running content that takes a while, but clearable in pickup, with not so hard content. Now there is something like a small dozen of cards that are a middle finger to that mentality. Fuck people who just want thing by playing accessible content. Let's go for trials, things never go into and Solo fight that rarely allow mistake.

Maybe the plan was to give more incentive to people to do those things, but it failed, it only made those things feel like they're not worth your time.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

It's unfortunate but the game struggles to develop content that stays relevant and proves to be rewarding.

The development team doubling down on pandering to players who either don't like interacting with other people or only do so through 'venues' only further exacerbates the problem.

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The game does not struggle with making relevant content, the player base struggles DOING said content.

Make something grindy? WAA WAA TOO HARD I DONT WANT TO PLAY THE GAME
^
Average XIV player


I stopped playing the game a few weeks ago, finally unsubbed and put my money where my mouth is. If they cannot develop content that is going to last, or keep me playing the game week after week, ill just go somewhere else.
9 years of XIV down the drain.

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Originally Posted by CNitsah

This is why I thought putting the TT card in floor 41 to 70 was a mistake. I could get it during the time it was active, but if you missed that few weeks time windows, good luck getting it. I don't know why since ShB, they decided to put TT cards behind higher difficulty lvl (Extremes, freaking masked carnivale - I fear 6.45) or not easy to get into (Eureka orthos, in stage you have to do with a premade - I mean, when you look at other deep dungeons, how did they think it would end). TT cards collection was one of those long running content that takes a while, but clearable in pickup, with not so hard content. Now there is something like a small dozen of cards that are a middle finger to that mentality. Fuck people who just want thing by playing accessible content. Let's go for trials, things never go into and Solo fight that rarely allow mistake.

Maybe the plan was to give more incentive to people to do those things, but it failed, it only made those things feel like they're not worth your time.

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I didn’t mind the Ex trials so much… you fight the boss you get their card, albeit at a random drop rate. And it’s always unsyncable later for those who don’t want to do it current. But it annoys me that EO’s TT card doesn’t drop from its boss instead of a silver sack. The boss pictured on the card is pre-30, but you have to do 31+ for a chance at a silver sack that might have it in it? If I’m going for a TT card, I’d much rather duel a challenging NPC at the actual card game than run content that isn’t even relevant to the card’s subject.

Just frustrated because before EO came out, I had every single card, including the rares. Now I’m missing that one and drop rates have been terrible for the latest ones too. I look for PFs on Crystal but rarely see them. I could care less about clearing at this point, because I doubt I’d find a group that would have the patience. I just want my silver sack for the TT card.

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Originally Posted by AwesomeJr44

If you add new rewards to old content, people will go back to that old content to earn the rewards. (It should be noted that this would require a new currency type to prevent people from simply using what they have stockpiled) It doesn't necessarily have to be made soloable.

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This quote reminded me of a discussion I had with someone a long time ago where, in essence, we were exactly talking about that but also regarding the cash shop items and how such focus is put on making items for the cash shop - which is another thing entirely, but follow me here - and my idea was "well, why not add these new things into current OR older content instead of cash shop? People do older content all the time, people constantly repeat ad nauseam that "old content is still content", so there are no negatives on making, say, any of the cash shops mounts an actual in-game reward, right? Literally decillions of people do older content for mounts to this day, so adding new mounts to older content would just be a beneficial thing, right?"

I don't remember the exact answer, mainly because it was an extremely hard logic to follow and gave me a migraine, but they essentially said that "unless it was meant for NEW raids and NEW content- which will become old and therefore, older content - it would simply lose all the value it has and it wouldn't be good, especially when people can solo old content, and if everyone can get <item> that easily then it has no valuable purpose."
Or something along those lines.

So in other words, it's better to add new glamours, new mounts, and new emotes in the cash shop for a fixed price, so that everyone can purchase it, and have no value because everyone can easily earn it with money, rather than just have it in older content (i also mentioned criterion, which could really use extra rewards as of now!), let people play older content that they already do but with an additional reason, maybe enjoy older content even more via synch if it's a required, and have less value instead. In other words, no value is better than low value...I just quit the conversation because I was having a headache, but apparently adding new rewards in older content isn't a good idea, despite said people still do old content for said rewards.

Oh, and there was also the "theme" factor where it's far more important to add rewards that "fit" the theme, rather than just HAVING the damn reward in it. But by then I had a headache and I had to carry on and get an aspirin. Just unbelievable what I had to read...

Just play XI.

And the devs put the Triple Triad card (that represents the floor 10 boss) on floor 40 where you're REQUIRED to pre-form groups.

Terrible design decision.

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Originally Posted by Deceptus

And the devs put the Triple Triad card on floor 40 where you're REQUIRED to pre-form groups.

Terrible design decision.

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I thought you could get silver sacks from 31+… it has to be 40? What a pain… especially when the boss on the card was floor 10!

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Originally Posted by Khryseis_Astra

I thought you could get silver sacks from 31+… it has to be 40? What a pain… especially when the boss on the card was floor 10!

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You have to be able to clear floor 40 to actually claim any treasure from floors 31-39.

Maybe I'm just a weakling but I tried it once and found it too brutal to have to get through 20 floors of Orthos just to attempt the boss fight once and then get kicked out if you die.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

You have to be able to clear floor 40 to actually claim any treasure from floors 31-39.

Maybe I'm just a weakling but I tried it once and found it too brutal to have to get through 20 floors of Orthos just to attempt the boss fight once and then get kicked out if you die.

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Yeah, 40 is the hardest boss up until at least 60, arguably 70. Which people didn't watch a guide (or did Bahamut legit), it's probably gonna be a wipe. Only positive thing is that one guy that knows what he is doing can carry the group.

Why are people complaining about not being able to play Eureka Orthos? This is Final Fantasy XIV. We're in the off-season. You're supposed to be playing other games. If you want to play an MMO year-round, go back to WoW. Oh wait, your Shadowlands? Your Bobby Kotick? Your fruit bowl paintings? Yeah, didn't think so. We have it better over here. Switch to FFXIV so that you can unsubscribe during the off-season and play other games. Just not WoW, you can't play that one.

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Originally Posted by BaconBits

Have you tried playing other games yet? That might solve your issues with queue times.

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This killed me hard, I might have to steal this reply for one of my future signature.

Just considering EO only has 30 floors before you have to make pre mades compared to 100 on potd and hoh, it isn't the greatest leveling method. The fact the other two have 70 more floors is more than enough to deter most to not even bother with eo. I went into eo once, wasn't really impressed and it only has 30 floors for matchmaking???? yeah moved on. All three of them need to be a on duty finder by now.

As for those exploratory zones, it was love hate. It was great for capping tomestones but i dint care for lvling again after 70 and 80. In eureka's case, dying and not getting resurrected hurts. Kinda why i haven't gone into ba and not really done anything eureka related in a while now. Yes they could future proof it by adding all those things like bozja but its 6.4 they should of been added in 5.3 like 4.3 dumbed down 3.0 relic. It needs a massive over haul just adding echo doesn't mean you can solo nms. I an can only speak about primal but when i last went in eureka was pretty dead bozja had more prob due to the reaper and sages.

I guess they had their purpose. If there was a current one now i would be devoting some time to it but there are other things to do cap tomes, craft, mount farming, finishing stupid blue mage colosseum stuff, etc

To me it seems yoshiada has been too preoccupied with ff16 and not enough time being spent on 14.

People whined there was no DD in Shadowbringers. now there's whining they didn't want it now in EW. smh

I tried it! I did not have very much fun doing Eureka Orthos. I don't like playing it solo, it makes me feel dumb! I would rather play with my friends! But they don't like it either! The rewards aren't cute or cool either so I don't plan on going back! :>

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Originally Posted by Grimr

Just considering EO only has 30 floors before you have to make pre mades compared to 100 on potd and hoh, it isn't the greatest leveling method. The fact the other two have 70 more floors is more than enough to deter most to not even bother with eo.

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Orthos has the same level structure as HoH. Everyone just ran 51-60 of PotD over and over so they changed "the level everyone will play repeatedly" to be 21-30 with an important boss at the end and no second stretch of basic difficulty before you hit the hard part.

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

People whined there was no DD in Shadowbringers. now there's whining they didn't want it now in EW. smh

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I think that it's rather disingenuous to claim that it's the exact same individuals complaining about both elements.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I think that it's rather disingenuous to claim that it's the exact same individuals complaining about both elements.

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Disingenuous is his middle name. Unfortunately there are many bad-faith posters on these forums.

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I think that it's rather disingenuous to claim that it's the exact same individuals complaining about both elements.

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Also, I don't think I've seen a single person in this thread say they didn't want a new deep dungeon to begin with. So where he pulled that from is a mystery to me.

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Originally Posted by Rosenstrauch

Also, I don't think I've seen a single person in this thread say they didn't want a new deep dungeon to begin with. So where he pulled that from is a mystery to me.

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It was way back either when HoH or PotD was added. There were ppl on here claiming SE was wasting resources on Deep Dungeons instead of doing what ever other thing they personally wanted.

If you've personally been asking for more Deep Dungeons, then you're requesting to see more of a very specific content format. There are little mechanical variations between all of them, but there are set core design elements that make it a Deep Dungeon in the first place. You are very unlikely to see the next release suddenly turn out to be a PvP mini-game or a Crafting mini-game.

I want to see a Nymian themed Deep Dungeon with limited light fueled by oil lamps and giant Tonberries chasing you around. You can make thematic changes like that. But it's still just going to be a Deep Dungeon at the end of the day, and the target audience is still going to be the same. If you weren't excited by PotD or HoH, then you weren't going to be the target audience for EO either. I'm really not sure what your expectations could have been.

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Originally Posted by DrWho2010

People whined there was no DD in Shadowbringers. now there's whining they didn't want it now in EW. smh

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The problem is not the deep dungeons itself, it's the fact they didn't fix the way they work while both PotD and HoH are both dead content, because of the way they work. The "only two save" is one of the reason to that. Finding someone eager to do a DD AND have free slot available is a nightmare. and since the stages with interesting content can't be queued it's a pain to just get in. There is also the "if you don't have a premade team of friends, you'll have to commit yourself for a whole afternoon" problem (the deeper I got in EO is 83, and boy it took us nearly 4 hours to get there, I just wanted to quit because it was a pain, but since it was not only my run, I stayed). The content by itself is not the problem. It's the limitation introduced to get into it that are. It's designed without taking in account the players (peer pressure, not having a team of friends, ...). Fix those access problems, and it would still be a content I don't like, but I wouldn't mind doing for the things I actually want.

The issue I had with it was how unforgiving it was and how elitist people in the runs were to mess ups. I hadn't done a deep dungeon since Stormblood. So when I did it, I did fine, but one of my teammates wiped the group. And I felt like I was playing Wow with how toxic they reacted to this person. It was new, but god forbid you be new to it. So, in a lot of ways, that mentality killed it for me. I decided to just give up and not run it anymore.

I don't think it's Orthos per se or all floors. You find parties pretty fast in POTD 50+. HoH 21-30. However, you can power level in POTD and HoH, perhaps the position of Orthos is wrong/weird right now and we may see more activity in 7.0.

For people farming accursed hoards EO isn't worth it either. If the dread beast drops counted towards the 10k/20k achievement EO would probably be the best place to farm. As it is Potd is still best for yield vs time.

I'm going to burst some bubbles here, but if you TP to mor dhona there's a fellow near the aetheryte you can talk to who will whisk you right there. No need for any flying/walking.

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Originally Posted by Rosenstrauch

Honestly, I think the main reason Eureka Orthos is so dead is just that it's out of the way.

With Palace of the Dead and Heaven on High, the entrance is a few feet from the nearest aetheryte. You can zone in and queue in about 2-3 seconds, plus whatever the loading time was to teleport to the aetheryte. Contrast that with Eureka Orthos, where you have to teleport to Mor Dhona, fly over to Syrcus Tower, click-enter the Syrcus Tower map, which causes another loading screen, and then walk for about 5-6 seconds before you can talk to the NPC to enter the Deep Dungeon itself.

Trusts also clearly cut into it as a resource for EXP Grinding, since they're available on demand and are effectively effortless content, whereas Deep Dungeons require some degree of situational awareness even in matched parties.

My point being that they should be a bit more convenient to enter, since their Path of Least Resistance alternative is too.

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Originally Posted by XiXiQ

I'm going to burst some bubbles here, but if you TP to mor dhona there's a fellow near the aetheryte you can talk to who will whisk you right there. No need for any flying/walking.

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Oh wow, if thats true I hate myself for missing him XD

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Oh wow, if thats true I hate myself for missing him XD

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He's in the spot where Koh was

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Originally Posted by BaconBits

Have you tried playing other games yet? That might solve your issues with queue times.

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low effort bait post with Karen level logic.

Using the queue for orthos is sad. That I agree. But just make a party finder. You don't even need the full 4 people. Go with 2 or 3 and you'll still be fine.
Once you have like 50/50 aetherpool you can solo 21-40 in like an hour if you're optimal.
Those floors aren't hard. It's just a knowledge check to know the 1 shot mechs.