Prediction: Female Hrothgar will be human-like, not beast-like

I also cast my lot in for a dommy mommy.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Your passion is admirable and understandable. However, I don't make the rules or set the status quo. The predictions I make are based on what I have personally observed in the game and from the many statements and LLs released from the dev team. This does not mean the decision has already been made to make female Hrothgar more human-like in their appearance. They may very well be more beastly like the males.

As for being pretty and popular. This assessment doesn't come from an observation of the game or dev statements. This comes from the fact that most people are not attracted to animals, coupled with how much players enjoy controlling attractive characters across all genres of games. Think about those who do choose to play races such as Viera, Miqo'te, and Au ra. Then think about how most players still choose CC options that make them look more human.

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The AuRa are what they are. We saw early concept art of just Ideas. Nothing was concrete or Finalized (Or they just didnt show us yet)
Hrothgar, are a Beastrace. They Are Anthropomorphic BiPedal Cat People. We have a concrete base, they should follow that base as you would for any structure you are building. Its 100% more sensical to follow that base, rather then drastically deviate into making Miqote 2.0, just case Popular & Money. If either of those things really actually mattered, they wouldn't have made a Beast Race to begin with.
Then the conversation would be: "Man, It sucks we dont have a Beastrace option" instead of: "Man, where is the Female Gender for this Beastrace"

Im not attracted to Animals either, I just find Beastmen Cool and Interesting, always have. A Little Fox Dude that can summon a Meteor Eclipse, A Rat Assassin, or a Dragonlady Crushing her Enemies with an Axe is just more fun and interesting to me then playing a Human-looking girl or Guy With Bunny or Cat Ears.
I dont want to play a Female Beastman / FemHroth to Stir My Loins, I want to play a Non-Human / Human-Looking Character because its Different from the Abundance of Humanoid Options we already have, and I think the Aestetic is just really Cool.
Every Fantasy Game should have at least 1 or 2 Beastraces. We Always get Humans, Orcs, Elves, and sometimes Dwarves. But hardly ever something not Human-Looking, much less a playable Beastman.
Just because a playerbase for a Niche option is small, doesn't mean it doesn't exist or shouldnt exist.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

I wouldn't say the devs are lazy, but I do agree that the proper amount of time should be taken to make the races they release complete so that all races have equal access to CC options and glamour choices. I'm also totally on board for more race specific gear, but the dev team doesn't get a whole lot of love for restrictions on gear.

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Them not doing it and just leaving the Hrothgar out to dry...to me is Lazy. Especially because of the amount of time they have had to address this issue. Im not trying to be an Armchair Dev here, but I think either Creating some Race Unique Lv1 gear to makeup for the lack of headgear to the 2 Races. Or just taking the extra time to make a Hrothgar Version, even adding earholes for the Viera, would have been the best if not optimal solution to Hrothgar missing out on Headgear.

So...is it remotely true that Roe and Hrothgar players are more likely to be a part of a certain demographic than other races? I read that and thought it sounded odd, but idk, I've been wrong before.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

So...is it remotely true that Roe and Hrothgar players are more likely to be a part of a certain demographic than other races? I read that and thought it sounded odd, but idk, I've been wrong before.

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Statistics show that they're more likely to be part of the "Roe/Hrothgar Player" demographic.

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Originally Posted by TheMightyMollusk

Statistics show that they're more likely to be part of the "Roe/Hrothgar Player" demographic.

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Don't forget all Hroth/Roe players are flat earthers.

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Originally Posted by Boblawblah

So...is it remotely true that Roe and Hrothgar players are more likely to be a part of a certain demographic than other races? I read that and thought it sounded odd, but idk, I've been wrong before.

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I'd argue every race in the game appeal to different demographic, but yes, in my (anecdotal) experience, Hrothgar are indeed played by a lot of gay men. (Which isn't surprising when it's widely known that a large portion of furries are gay men in the first place).

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Originally Posted by Kyrj

Don't forget all Hroth/Roe players are flat earthers.

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I believe the Earth to be Spira

Here's the image from the other thread that showcases perfectly what I expect we'll get.

https://i.postimg.cc/g0BMMYzk/A052-F...4086463-FF.jpg

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Originally Posted by Eisi

Here's the image from the other thread that showcases perfectly what I expect we'll get.

https://i.postimg.cc/g0BMMYzk/A052-F...4086463-FF.jpg

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Cat face. With Snout and muzzle.
Exactly what everybody wants.
And what has been the whole debate.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Cat face. With Snout and muzzle.
Exactly what everybody wants

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Not the people who would prefer a more beast-like Femhroth.

Because this is big Miqo + snout.

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Originally Posted by Eisi

Not the people who would prefer a more beast-like Femhroth.

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The point is they wont have a Human Face, and look like Miqote 2.0.
As long as thats avoided, and the FemHroth look like real cat people, and not humans with cat ears, then we are good.

That is the long and short of the debate in a nutshell

Considering SE rejected the bottom right face for looking like a Miqo'te (I can kinda see it, but it's still different enough), I would be extremely disappointed if they went "oh but it's okay for the women to look like them."

https://i.redd.it/wxp19t358zj41.png

I can only hammer a guess it'll end up similar to Malehroth, cat head/tail slapped on Roe body with an alternate posture animations and some patches if fur, Im really not expecting much beyond that Femhorth too...

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Originally Posted by Eisi

Then I hope the devs see it the same way! I'm not gonna be disappointed if they end up more human-looking, cause this is what I expect.

Are there examples of beast-girls from other games that are popular with the playerbase? Cause that's stuff that's gonna be looked at.

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As long as you look at furry art for "anthro", you know what to expect.
There's multiple levels of kemono to kemonomimi art.

Miqote belongs solely to the kemonomimi side (cat ears, but human body). So does Viera (bunny ears, but human body). Kemonomimi is essentially humans with some animal features added into their character. Overall, the separation between human and animal is a clear divide.

Hrothgar is more kemono in style. Kemono is a blend between human and beast body while retaining human-like features. For Kemono, there's varying shades, but most popular ones for avatar creation are usually a beast-like face and body that have human-like qualities rather than beast-like quality. This is also true for Hrothgar, where most players rather not have a hunchback from the beastial side and rather prefer a more human-like straight back, but prefer a more bulkier form as a male. The demographic for male Hrothgars usually prefer the "Bara" look within the kemono style, which is what made a Roegadyn body-type become an easy skeleton with the fur added (although it seems this has been done somewhat shoddily after I look at Hrothgar's customization).

For Female Hrothgar, the first and second depiction where the character is fully furry but retains the human-like nature is the ideal look. I would not be surprised if they went with the more slender 2nd depiction mainly because it retains the societal ideal female human-like qualities (slender/curvaceous body) and yet also radiates a sense of strength from the wild from being a kemono race.

The average furry character art is perfected as much as possible to best fit a mental ideal. Furries prefer to add their ideal quality of their animal race on top of the ideal human-like qualities to create a unique avatar. Ex: A lion (particularly male ones) have the emblematic trait of nobility or regal bearing thanks to their glorious mane, and that usually comes through based on how the avatar pose with their ideal form and strong body (Doesn't that sound like a RP setting for PLD or an Ishgardian Knight if they were furries?). The animal they depict often helps with glam choices and gives a lot more customizability, but it in no way locks a character wanting a different set of looks.

That being said, it would be nice if Hrothgar had some more selections with different animal furs and faces to greatly improve avatar customization (ex: fox or wolf ears and tail with different fur design on the body that matches with said animals) since the customizations options for Hrothgar seems very limiting as a feline race itself. If they were intentionally going towards the route with no headpieces, I rather they didn't limit Hrothgar to be only a feline race as the tail, the head, and the fur design are the only main differences in customization on a furry character.

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Originally Posted by AnotherPerson

There's multiple levels of kemono to kemonomimi art.
Miqote belongs solely to the kemonomimi side (cat ears, but human body). So does Viera (bunny ears, but human body). Kemonomimi is essentially humans with some animal features added into their character. Overall, the separation between human and animal is a clear divide.

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https://media.tenor.com/79zI7e48074AAAAC/this.gif

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Originally Posted by AnotherPerson

That being said, it would be nice if Hrothgar had some more selections with different animal furs and faces to greatly improve avatar customization (ex: fox or wolf ears and tail with different fur design on the body that matches with said animals) since the customizations options for Hrothgar seems very limiting as a feline race itself. If they were intentionally going towards the route with no headpieces, I rather they didn't limit Hrothgar to be only a feline race as the tail, the head, and the fur design are the only main differences in customization on a furry character.

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You lost me here a little bit, because this IS an Anthropomorphic Feline Race, and should be as such. Having Fox / Wolf Ears is a pretty big Clash of Design. As would having Face Structures outside of Feline.
Now, if they find a way to do it without it being a giant Burden, I 100% support if they were to update the Lupin to make them a Playable Race, as well as Bangaa, and any other BiPedal Anthro Race.

Seems to me like the issue has already been decided. This is all official existing art after all.

https://attackofthefanboy.com/wp-con...ic-weapons.jpg

https://preview.redd.it/a8pjety93al7...=webp&aee6bfbb

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ep2sQuFUcAAF_jU.jpg:large

https://i.redd.it/1okdoii5fp881.jpg

"Rejected for looking like a Miqo'te."

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Originally Posted by Alacran

Seems to me like the issue has already been decided. This is all official existing art after all.

https://attackofthefanboy.com/wp-con...ic-weapons.jpg

https://preview.redd.it/a8pjety93al7...=webp&aee6bfbb

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ep2sQuFUcAAF_jU.jpg:large

https://i.redd.it/1okdoii5fp881.jpg

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Clearly not, since months later they were still discussing Female Hrothgar's design (according to Live Letter 68) and approved only two out of four faces.
Concept arts and intentionally vague murals are not a promise. (remember female Au Ra?)

Heck, remember Viera concept art (back when they were also working on Au Ra)?

https://i.imgur.com/hElLdkS.jpg

I try not to.

This exact post was already proven wrong in the female hrothgar thread.

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Originally Posted by Eisi

There is an enormous amount of development resources being invested into creating a new race - at this point the final race - and they will go with the popular option

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https://media.tenor.com/_GNDH1RBQZwA...rrect-five.gif

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Q: Do you have any updates regarding female Hrothgar?
（04:14:39）

A: With Endwalker-related tasks finally calming down, rough sketches are now being made to solidify their design in earnest. It’ll be a long while before they’re implemented, but progress has been steady.

Some may think, “Won’t only a few people play as female Hrothgar?” but my concerns aren’t really about whether female Hrothgar will become as popular as other races. More importantly, expanding the in-game world with a variety of different races and players of varying characteristics is a crucial step towards making FFXIV an RPG that can be played alone or with friends. As such, it’s not about how many people will use them, but rather about implementing female Hrothgar for the people looking forward to them.

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Source: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/456921


The devs do not care how popular hrothgals are going to be. If popularity were the only factor they wouldn't have added Hrothgar in the first place. Beast-like and other "not pretty" races are almost always less popular, but they are still a wise business decision because they bring in players who would otherwise not play the game at all.

To put it another way, in World of Warcraft the most popular races by far are Humans, Blood Elves, and Night Elves (the "pretty" races) and it's not even close.

https://i.redd.it/umicyvyiwb151.png

However, the game also gives players the choice of being werewolves, minotaurs, zombies, foxes, goblins, trolls and other "ugly" races. If all those other races were deleted tomorrow but everyone was given a free character change to a Human, Blood Elf, or Night Elf, how many do you think would take it? Some probably would, but I'd wager many would just quit the game. I certainly would have back when I was playing, and that's the money you're leaving on the table by only focusing on conventionally attractive popular races.

Yoship understands this, which is why he said:

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After seeing the positive reception of the Lupin characters we introduced in Stormblood, we concluded that, for the long-term health of FFXIV, it was important to implement a greater variety of character types beyond the traditionally beautiful in a future expansion.

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Source: https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/threads/389675


Female Hrothgar are not going to be another Miqo'te/Au Ra. The end.

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Originally Posted by Nestama

Heck, remember Viera concept art (back when they were also working on Au Ra)?

https://i.imgur.com/hElLdkS.jpg

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But wait, Viera predates FFXIV by a long shot, since they originate from FFTA, or did they have the general of "bunny people" before settling on something so close to Viera might as well make it Viera?

Well, obviously it takes them so long to make female Hrothgar because all the interesting races are already implemented.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Just because a playerbase for a Niche option is small, doesn't mean it doesn't exist or shouldnt exist.

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Well put. Your views and arguments are just, logical, and make total sense. But will it be enough?

It doesn't matter either way to me. The way I see things though is putting in all kinds of time and effort to appease a small portion of the playerbase vs. creating another attractive race to encourage more fantasia sales while also reducing the workload to make said race more compatible with existing gearsets. At the end of the day FFXIV is a product used to generate revenue for SE. This is what is working against your desires. I derive no pleasure from exposing this truth to you.

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Originally Posted by Zanarkand-Ronso

Them not doing it and just leaving the Hrothgar out to dry...to me is Lazy. Especially because of the amount of time they have had to address this issue. Im not trying to be an Armchair Dev here, but I think either Creating some Race Unique Lv1 gear to makeup for the lack of headgear to the 2 Races. Or just taking the extra time to make a Hrothgar Version, even adding earholes for the Viera, would have been the best if not optimal solution to Hrothgar missing out on Headgear.

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They are not leaving them out to dry. They didn't have to allocate resources towards getting female Hrothgar into the game, but they made the decision to do it. You need to understand that the dev team are human beings under a massive amount of pressure. They also have RL obligations such as family, provisions, and health. To call them lazy is basically to not acknowledge any of those things, and that is wrong. Put yourself in their shoes, or even using your own work ethic to establish how deep it cuts to be called lazy after putting in high effort to appease your customers.

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

This exact post was already proven wrong in the female hrothgar thread...

...Female Hrothgar are not going to be another Miqo'te/Au Ra. The end.

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I hope you're right. Really, I do.

The thing is that in order to comply with this statement, the female Hrothgar simply need not be these tiny, dainty, cute avatars. With that in mind, I believe they won't be. Considering the male Hrothgar are vastly different from male Miqo'te, I think it is a fair expectation for the female Hrothgar to follow the same suite. Hopefully most people are happy with the end result. We'll see.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

Well put. Your views and arguments are just, logical, and make total sense. But will it be enough?

It doesn't matter either way to me. The way I see things though is putting in all kinds of time and effort to appease a small portion of the playerbase vs. creating another attractive race to encourage more fantasia sales while also reducing the workload to make said race more compatible with existing gearsets. At the end of the day FFXIV is a product used to generate revenue for SE. This is what is working against your desires. I derive no pleasure from exposing this truth to you.

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Well if you have read the posts up to now, many people have resurfaced old posts that remind me to have Faith in the Team.
Many Posts that are reminders that they have the best idea in mind for the race.
I do get heated at the idea that we'd just get Human-faced girls, but only because even if its a very stupid idea with a very low possibility...its still a Possibility.
I can still dread that idea, because we still have yet to see a reveal.
I dont believe this will happen, but I cant 100% dismiss it. But I do 100% believe, it will be the dumbest thing they could do.

They would miss out on a pretty great opportunity on their game and its sales, if they were to take that route and utterly Butcher the Hrothgar Race with Miqote 2.0
This would actually hurt them.

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Originally Posted by Gemina

They are not leaving them out to dry. They didn't have to allocate resources towards getting female Hrothgar into the game, but they made the decision to do it. You need to understand that the dev team are human beings under a massive amount of pressure. They also have RL obligations such as family, provisions, and health. To call them lazy is basically to not acknowledge any of those things, and that is wrong. Put yourself in their shoes, or even using your own work ethic to establish how deep it cuts to be called lazy after putting in high effort to appease your customers.

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Im talking about Headgear in this Snippet you quoted, not FemHroths to be Clear.
So I think you might have misunderstood the point and goal of my post here. I was, and still am one of the Biggest Defenders of YoshiP & The Devs on this Subject and situation.
I was there saying we should be patient, to understand the Pandemic was a thing. That everything wrong with the Hrothgar is Temporary and they will work on it...slowly, but surely. I even made the prediction...or WILD Guess, that with the Quality of the Male Viera, and the upcoming 7.0 upgrades, we could see alot of fixes and changes to our Race (The Hrothgar)
I never once dehumanized the Devs over this, I defended against accusations that they dont care about the Hrothgar Community, or anything short of just insulting them. But that doesnt mean that over the past 3-4 years, I cant be Critical that they STILL haven't found a solution or workaround for the Headgear situation.

https://media.tenor.com/ykLon5lXZWAA...tie-peachy.gif

I swear this thread is the gift that keeps on giving.

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Originally Posted by NekoMataMata

https://media.tenor.com/ykLon5lXZWAA...tie-peachy.gif

I swear this thread is the gift that keeps on giving.

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Mochi cat or mitao cat :3

It's interesting to see how the others imagine how they see them already.

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...087&height=612

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...087&height=612

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Originally Posted by Arrius

It's interesting to see how the others imagine how they see them already.

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...087&height=612

https://media.discordapp.net/attachm...087&height=612

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Big ew. Cute bikini doe :3

That face does not fit on that body. Very uncanny.

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Originally Posted by Eisi

Everybody who wants fierce beast-like lionesses, prepare to be disappointed!

What we will get is not a female pendant to male Hrothgar but instead big female Miqote.

https://i.imgur.com/Dn83GIU.jpg

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God if only we could get the far left one, but I also fear the 'i want cutesy uwu waifu' section of the playerbase will swing it. We could have had 7ft fierce demon girls for the Au Ra, and instead we have 'tribe of nomadic warriors' who have emotes and voices straight out of a slice of life anime. Imagine if Sadu was as tall as a male Au Ra, and if the Male Au Ra for the white scaled ones were also short. Rather than 'sexual dimorphism', having it as 'clan dimorphism' like Mid/Highlander differences

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Originally Posted by Eisi

And finally the biggest nail in the coffin if you don't believe me.

This is an official artwork for "The Queen" from the Shadowbringers Artbook:

https://i.imgur.com/52PQZvO.png

Sure they might change course in the future, but this is a big Moonkeeper.

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If this is an indication of what we'll be getting, what a waste of time. Their head isn't even 'beastial shaped' enough to use the 'sorry we can't let them use helmets' rubbish either. All I can do is huff copium and say 'look at the mural of Hyadelyn kicking Zodiark' and how different those mural representations look from the actual appearances of them

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Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe

imagine if Sadu was as tall as a male Au Ra

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https://media.tenor.com/pie0F2e9Z4MA...e-drooling.gif

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Originally Posted by VeyaAkemi

But wait, Viera predates FFXIV by a long shot, since they originate from FFTA, or did they have the general of "bunny people" before settling on something so close to Viera might as well make it Viera?

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Kinda. The reason we got them is likely the players poll from 1.0 where they asked what new races we'd want and used Viera as an example.

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Originally Posted by Naoki_Yoshida

https://i.imgur.com/fJH1bmG.jpg
Mammalian demi-beastmen proved to be the most desired new race, though I wonder if they received an unfair advantage because I dropped the name “Viera.” :p

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Originally Posted by ForsakenRoe

We could have had 7ft fierce demon girls for the Au Ra, and instead we have 'tribe of nomadic warriors' who have emotes and voices straight out of a slice of life anime.

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Yeah it's always very jarring when the story tries to play off a female Au Ra as some kind of badass when they all look like this:

https://rare-gallery.com/thumbs/9769...ighs-dress.png


If they added the fierce design as another clan similar to how Hyurs can be Midlander/Highlander, I'd fanta in a heartbeat. They look so good! :eek:

https://i.imgur.com/JKxenqz.jpeg

To stay on topic, I don't doubt Hrothgals will be beast-like but I have no idea what their general demeanor and vibe will be. Male Hrothgar are pretty goofy but I'm hoping the females are fierce like that Forbidden Au Ra or this fanart.

https://i.imgur.com/87OwgNW.jpeg

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Originally Posted by CidHeiral

https://i.imgur.com/87OwgNW.jpeg

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https://media.tenor.com/5dqbkdEYTecA...eproducers.gif

Watch it just be femroe with fur.
No hats.

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Originally Posted by Avoidy

Watch it just be femroe with fur.
No hats.

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FemRoe Body? Yes Please.
No Hats?...well, unfortunate but its consistent with the males.

Just hopefully there is a solution or workaround sooner rather then later.

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Originally Posted by Avoidy

Watch it just be femroe with fur.
No hats.

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I dun think I've seen a femroe with hats, IN GAME that is.

I totally expect them to be Human-like so that they'll be popular.

They don't want to put in the effort to a race/gender that will be more unpopular that the Roes.

Though I don't think that they will reach the levels of the Au'ra or Miqo'te.