Stop hating on players that have housing

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Originally Posted by Heroman3003

The hate isn't against 'people who have housing' but against 'people who have housing, and yet feel entitled enough to demand even more content for their exclusive little club while the lack of space remains an issue.

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This is the most bizarre and pointlessly bitter take you could possibly have. People who own houses are players of the game just like anyone else. They have just as much right to want content for what they enjoy as anyone else. There is nothing exclusive or elitist about it.

And to head any dumb attempts at accusations off at the pass, no I don't own a house either and have never even tried to bid on one. I just think the bitterness some people have over this specific thing has gotten way out of proportion.

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Originally Posted by Heroman3003

The hate isn't against 'people who have housing' but against 'people who have housing, and yet feel entitled enough to demand even more content for their exclusive little club while the lack of space remains an issue.

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There is bad take, and there is worse take. Yours - is the latter.

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Originally Posted by Silvarer

This is the most bizarre and pointlessly bitter take you could possibly have. People who own houses are players of the game just like anyone else. They have just as much right to want content for what they enjoy as anyone else. There is nothing exclusive or elitist about it.

And to head any dumb attempts at accusations off at the pass, no I don't own a house either and have never even tried to bid on one. I just think the bitterness some people have over this specific thing has gotten way out of proportion.

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Sorry for having so little belief in OP's good intentions after they started a thread in General Discussions with this in their preface:

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Originally Posted by DamianFatale

And if you don't have a house I dont want to hear you say "well at least you have a yard" or "INSTANCED housing I dont care" because this isn't your thread.

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This is literally that very elitism. "No landless peasants in my thread where I complain about limited size of my vineyard".

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Originally Posted by Heroman3003

Sorry for having so little belief in OP's good intentions after they started a thread in General Discussions with this in their preface:



This is literally that very elitism. "No landless peasants in my thread where I complain about limited size of my vineyard".

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No, it was very clearly an attempt by them to ward off the bitterness people like you always bring into housing threads to derail the discussion. Should they have worded it in a more polite and less aggressive way? Certainly. But you really need to take that chip off your shoulder and take a look at the way you’ve been behaving.

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Originally Posted by Silvarer

No, it was very clearly an attempt by them to ward off the bitterness people like you always bring into housing threads to derail the discussion. Should they have worded it in a more polite and less aggressive way? Certainly. But you really need to take that chip off your shoulder and take a look at the way you’ve been behaving.

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The only reason they even got 'hate' was that behaviour of elitism of house owners they displayed. And 'hate' is a strong word when its just being called out on way they are acting. And that's why they deserve to be called out same way in this thread as well. Framing of one's demands is important and theirs is framed purely in "I want more resources dedicated to making exclusive content deeper instead of making it less exclusive (which would require those same resources) and I dont opinions of those who can't access said exclusive content." That's what their original post read like, they got justly called out on it, so they made a second one demanding the 'hate' towards the poor abused homeowners stop.

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Originally Posted by Silvarer

No, it was very clearly an attempt by them to ward off the bitterness people like you always bring into housing threads to derail the discussion. Should they have worded it in a more polite and less aggressive way? Certainly. But you really need to take that chip off your shoulder and take a look at the way you’ve been behaving.

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It was a poor attempt. I already covered this. If it started off more polite, we wouldn't be having these back and forths.

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Originally Posted by Heroman3003

The only reason they even got 'hate' was that behaviour of elitism of house owners they displayed. And 'hate' is a strong word when its just being called out on way they are acting. And that's why they deserve to be called out same way in this thread as well. Framing of one's demands is important and theirs is framed purely in "I want more resources dedicated to making exclusive content deeper instead of making it less exclusive (which would require those same resources) and I dont opinions of those who can't access said exclusive content." That's what their original post read like, they got justly called out on it, so they made a second one demanding the 'hate' towards the poor abused homeowners stop.

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And what makes you more entitled? SE answer to the housing shortage has been implementing new servers. What YOU are demanding is putting those figurative 'resources' into implementing unlimited wards, which won't happen any time soon.

Meanwhile, people like me have accepted the situation for what it is, moved on from idealism and are house owners now for taking the appropriate measures, e.g. farming Gil or moving servers.

We were dedicated, we listened to SE, analyzed their past behaviour and acted accordingly.

What you are demanding is just as 'selfish'. And btw, those resources are likely completely different forms of data storage and like completely different teams.

We shouldn't demand less, but we also shouldn't jump at each other's throat for making demands that don't reflect our own. Especially not, if they are just unscientific, emotional rambling.

Also no, there are no 'poor abused homeowners'. You make us laugh.

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Originally Posted by Hoehenflug

And what makes you more entitled? SE answer to the housing shortage has been implementing new servers. What YOU are demanding is putting those figurative 'resources' into implementing unlimited wards, which won't happen any time soon.

Meanwhile, people like me have accepted the situation for what it is, moved on from idealism and are house owners now for taking the appropriate measures, e.g. farming Gil or moving servers.

We were dedicated, we listened to SE, analyzed their past behaviour and acted accordingly.

What you are demanding is just as 'selfish'. And btw, those resources are likely completely different forms of data storage and like completely different teams.

We shouldn't demand less, but we also shouldn't jump at each other's throat for making demands that don't reflect our own. Especially not, if they are just unscientific, emotional rambling.

Also no, there are no 'poor abused homeowners'. You make us laugh.

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New servers is a terrible answer, as that demands existing players move to said other servers. It doesn't solve the problem which at its core lies in one, simple aspect: housing is limted per world. Demanding someone abandon friends or community just to own a house is unreasonable. They showed themselves perfectly capable of handling huge amount of smaller housing with apartments too. and yet, they are too afraid to stop the few truly housing-exclusive features from being exclusive. There'd be no problem with housing as limited thing if there weren't features only available to house owners, but as long as there are, the very fact that there is no instanced housing that has access to everything current housing does should be offensive to the community.

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Originally Posted by Heroman3003

New servers is a terrible answer, as that demands existing players move to said other servers. It doesn't solve the problem which at its core lies in one, simple aspect: housing is limted per world. Demanding someone abandon friends or community just to own a house is unreasonable. They showed themselves perfectly capable of handling huge amount of smaller housing with apartments too. and yet, they are too afraid to stop the few truly housing-exclusive features from being exclusive. There'd be no problem with housing as limited thing if there weren't features only available to house owners, but as long as there are, the very fact that there is no instanced housing that has access to everything current housing does should be offensive to the community.

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Well, what you have to understand is that ultimately, SE is very slow to act. Your idealism will lead you nowhere, but frustration.

Most people have adapted to being trans-server players nowadays. Also, it's literally 1-2 clicks. If you are playing the MB, and you should if you want a house, you will quickly include it into your daily routine anyway. You can still connect via linkshells, discord etc.

Or you could make an alt on said server and get a house and visit it with friends. Obviously, that isn't optimal, but it won't change for now.

Also, for the remaining housing features: 1. Outdoor Space 2. Gardening 3. Multiple Layer Housing

1. SE said it will think about ways to include Outdoor Items on the IS. Let's see.

2. Gardening is done by a VERY small minority, because it is ultimately not worth it. Gardening prices have been tanking ever since they implemented the new servers. It's hardly worth it anymore. You get a similiar experience from IS. But ideally, sure.

3. Idk why they are reluctant to expand on apartments.

Ideally, this should all be a thing. Surely. But it won't. For now. The sooner you realise this, the better for you.

And so, can we in the meantime not attack people? Did you know that there are about less than 10 trees? Believe me or not, if you have a house long enough, you will understand how limited and bareboned the Outdoor System actually is.

So, yea, can we please stop demonizing housing owners? Just like in RL, there are many different layers to consider. Attacks will lead us nowhere.

Edit bad math inc for our Datacenter:

8x Mats ~30k=240k+5k*8 soil= 280k
thav onion= 80k glazenut= 20k ~5g+3to= 340k

It was worth it when Thav Onions were 200k above and soil was dirty cheap, but those times are gone.

That's why many people drop it, eventually. You can make more money within an hour and without being bound to your garden for 7 whole days.

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Originally Posted by LittleImp

Honestly, there have been allegations over the years that indicate SE isn't exactly free of stuff like that either.

I think it can put people in an awkward spot down the line if any of it ends up going mainstream in the west.

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Really? I'm somewhat new to SE- I'll be 2 years w/ this game come March. I've never heard of this at all.

I think there is/was enough evidence with Blizzard that it's past allegations though. What so many of those folks did was just plain monstrous- and as a consumer (and human being), IMO, unforgivable. I'd never support anything with their name on it again.


Heck, the photos and screenshots alone are damning, let alone what anyone had to say about it.
https://kotaku.com/inside-blizzard-d...ite-1847378762

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Originally Posted by Kyssa

Really? I'm somewhat new to SE- I'll be 2 years w/ this game come March. I've never heard of this at all.

I think there is/was enough evidence with Blizzard that it's past allegations though. What so many of those folks did was just plain monstrous- and as a consumer (and human being), IMO, unforgivable. I'd never support anything with their name on it again.


Heck, the photos and screenshots alone are damning, let alone what anyone had to say about it.
https://kotaku.com/inside-blizzard-d...ite-1847378762

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The major difference is that SE is a Japanese based business. American companies would kill for some of the defamation laws that protects business in japan. One example is during the whole blizzard thing was going down someone came out and stated that stuff about SE that strangely enough went nowhere(I think the tread is still up on resetera with pics and stuff.)

It not a question of if its happening, its what has come out in the wash.

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Originally Posted by Thaciscokidd

The major difference is that SE is a Japanese based business. American companies would kill for some of the defamation laws that protects business in japan. One example is during the whole blizzard thing was going down someone came out and stated that stuff about SE that strangely enough went nowhere(I think the tread is still up on resetera with pics and stuff.)

It not a question of if its happening, its what has come out in the wash.

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Ah, I see. This is something I need to look into, I had no idea.

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Originally Posted by Deveryn

It was a poor attempt. I already covered this. If it started off more polite, we wouldn't be having these back and forths.

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I never said it was a good attempt or that I agreed with the way he started his post. Just that was what the intent was and not "elitism" as some people keep throwing around.

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Originally Posted by Heroman3003

The only reason they even got 'hate' was that behaviour of elitism of house owners they displayed. And 'hate' is a strong word when its just being called out on way they are acting. And that's why they deserve to be called out same way in this thread as well. Framing of one's demands is important and theirs is framed purely in "I want more resources dedicated to making exclusive content deeper instead of making it less exclusive (which would require those same resources) and I dont opinions of those who can't access said exclusive content." That's what their original post read like, they got justly called out on it, so they made a second one demanding the 'hate' towards the poor abused homeowners stop.

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So you didn't actually listen to a thing I said then. Got it.

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Originally Posted by Heroman3003

The only reason they even got 'hate' was that behaviour of elitism of house owners they displayed. And 'hate' is a strong word when its just being called out on way they are acting. And that's why they deserve to be called out same way in this thread as well. Framing of one's demands is important and theirs is framed purely in "I want more resources dedicated to making exclusive content deeper instead of making it less exclusive (which would require those same resources) and I dont opinions of those who can't access said exclusive content." That's what their original post read like, they got justly called out on it, so they made a second one demanding the 'hate' towards the poor abused homeowners stop.

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We want instanced housing since 2014. It never came.

Garden space is limited since 2014. How long do we have to wait before asking for any improvements?

It's been almost 9 years!

There will NEVER be enough houses for everyone with the current system. And despite the community voicing their opinions about this failed ward system for many years now nothing has happened to solve the problem.

But I will still voice my opinion about it.

"Island Sanctuary was never meant to be player housing." - Yeah okay... but WHY. It would have been the perfect opportunity.

Endwalker Spoiler:

The Loporrit building holodecks for housing on the moon? That would be perfect! We can decide any look we want, forest, desert, snow... but it turns out the devs were just trolling us.

When we can't have instanced housing - can we at least have more garden space? A quarter of the slots of a small house is spend for basic functions like Chocobo stable, gardening patch, Aetherite, letter box.

I want both! Housing for everyone and improvements to the housing we have.

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Originally Posted by Tint

When we can't have instanced housing - can we at least have more garden space? A quarter of the slots of a small house is spend for basic functions like Chocobo stable, gardening patch, Aetherite, letter box.

I want both! Housing for everyone and improvements to the housing we have.

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Honestly, i'm shocked that the devs have allowed crossbreeding plants to be housing exclusive. I wonder how much of the complaints will disappear if they solve this one issue by allowing crossbreeding in apartments or FC housing. (Let's be real, if it was easy to implement then it would have been done a long time ago.)

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Originally Posted by Raoabolic

Honestly, i'm shocked that the devs have allowed crossbreeding plants to be housing exclusive. I wonder how much of the complaints will disappear if they solve this one issue by allowing crossbreeding in apartments or FC housing. (Let's be real, if it was easy to implement then it would have been done a long time ago.)

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I don't always agree with you, Shadow Lord, but I can agree on this.

iirc when apartments were first announced they mentioned they could always allocate more rooms when they needed to if demand was high - they still haven't done that, and every ward has the same amount of apartment rooms. Even if they walked it back now going "yeaaaah we actually can't, we underestimated how popular they would be and they take up more room than we thought on the servers" I'd at least be glad for an explanation as to why they haven't done so in 6 years or whatever.

I do also think that if they could expand apartments into having a patio for gardening it would alleviate a lot of issues for people who want easier access to gardening even if it's just a small plot or something, or to allow it to happen on their islands (which it sounds like they're aiming for?). Yeah, it's a long way to go through the story to have that ability, but at least it would be an option if it's true. Others just want something to decorate and if we had more control over the island stuff that'd probably satisfy people too. Expanding the way apartments work would be a bigger undertaking, if it's even possible. The way gardening works is probably weird too, so getting over that hurdle of getting it to work in anything other than a gardening plot has probably been weird too, but on things like this I do wish the devs were a little more transparent on "we can't get it to work the way we want to do this, but we're working on getting it to work" would be nice.

No helping the people who just want a house for the sake of having one, though, beyond getting a ton of huge servers just for housing - they said they'd work on expanding the housing instance servers after the DC servers were finished with iirc, so hopefully next year or close to 7.0 they'll have done that. It probably won't give everyone housing, but it'll be a nice step from what we have.

Yeah I don't have a house kupo <3 nor cared to get one really but nobody ever came across to me as saying "I have one and you don't blah blah blah" because my house is Limsa kupo <3 and they can kiss my pom kupo <3

Don't fret don't hate..be happy kupo <3

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Originally Posted by Doc_Seraph

Yeah I don't have a house kupo <3 nor cared to get one really but nobody ever came across to me as saying "I have one and you don't blah blah blah" because my house is Limsa kupo <3 and they can kiss my pom kupo <3

Don't fret don't hate..be happy kupo <3

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If I had any Kupo Nuts...I'd give you the lot of them. You are always very positive. You would be the one spared the moment my inner Dark Knight takes over and the great Moogle Culling happens.

Thank You Kupo <3

I read a snippet of the OP and my keys just had to fire...

The real problem is that the developers won't admit to the player base that there will never be a solution in FF14 to the housing shortage. Never.

I don't blame them. I'd hate to admit that to the player base.

If you're a former coder, especially if you have any experience with database design, you can tell that this game is built on something very, very amateur that cannot be scaled. This game was not designed with western software engineering philosophies. Things western customers expect simply cannot be executed without rewriting major portions of game infrastructure. Oh wait! That happened once!

See?

I guess they did admit it.

In light of this... it sure WOULD be nice for house-owners to understand that a game avenue open to them, is not, and will never be open to a majority of players.

Just be aware of that...

I wouldn't put on all my best clothes and jewelry to go to a soup kitchen and talk about jewels.

The above are opinions and as such are just as valid or invalid as any other opinion. Truly. Just opinions.

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Originally Posted by Elizabetha

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I do also doubt they will "fix" anything in regards to housing, other than brute forcing it with more wards.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

I do also doubt they will "fix" anything in regards to housing, other than brute forcing it with more wards.

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If they would do that on a regular basis so there's a relatively short wait before players have a chance to purchase, I think a lot of complaints regarding availability would stop.

They definitely seem to be doing some minor backend changes at the very least if they're adding plots to all worlds but make them unavailable for purchase on the worlds considered to have enough available plots. That's a positive step even if it's going to upset those looking to relocate to a better plot.

Once 6.3 drops we'll have seen the addition of 12 new wards plus a whole new district, plus the not-housing island that satisfies some people's need for a space AND 12(?) new worlds. Brute force is more akin to people's idea of just adding instanced housing for all. This is a more methodical and efficient approach.