Clown outfit yet viera+hroth can't wear the NOSE? Are you serious right now?

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Originally Posted by Iscah

Oh yeah, I remember there were a number of issues early on with certain items turning hair or ears off, or failing to. Was there a list somewhere of all those instances?

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There might be, but if there is I haven't seen it. I only know about the Hempen Coif having that issue because of a thread on Reddit pointing it out. That was well over a year ago, though.

I feel like this is some running dev joke on the community now

Ps3 coof coof ps4 coff ughh.. ps5 limitations please understand and look forward to it on the next moogle shop update.

Almost 1 decade and SE never fixed hair clipping even on PAY CASH SETS and you think they will fix those issues with viera etc

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Originally Posted by AnnRam

Ps3 coof coof ps4 coff ughh.. ps5 limitations please understand and look forward to it on the next moogle shop update.

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I don't think it's anything to do with specific system limitations, but the fundamental design of how characters are assembled. Whatever trickery they had to do to implement their vision of Viera and Hrothgar, it involved sacrificing the ability to equip hats as normal – and judging from what does and doesn't work, specifically sacrificing the ability to split the hairstyle into upper and lower halves.

If it is something inextricably linked to the design, they may not be able to fix it at all, or not without altering some visible part of the character appearance.

If they can't overcome that specific issue and don't want to forcibly alter everyone's existing character to fix it, then for the time being until and unless (and if it's realistically possible for them to implement) a full rework of the character design system, this type of headwear may never be able to work at a technical level that no amount of "it's a special hat that everyone deserves equally" can overcome.

Maybe they'll find a solution to the hair issues and then we'll see a flood of hats working normally. But until we see at least one, any expectation of whether a hat works or not is entirely down to its design and not its origin.

I think it's pretty obvious that they can make a hat usable if they really want to. The reason this clown hat isn't usable is presumably due to the shape of the hat. When it comes to viera/hrothgar headgear specifically, they seem to utilize a small amount of quality control.

Hat hair is also an issue, but at this point I think it's pretty ridiculous if they haven't made anything for viera/hrothgar, considering the low amount of hairs available. It seems to me to be majorly a matter of effort required, and arbitrary quality control. They said viera/hrothgar won't get hats, so they won't budge on that. Unfortunately, they continuously create event rewards that exclude a portion of playable races.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

I think it's pretty obvious that they can make a hat usable if they really want to.

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The hat still first needs the hair to work properly underneath it, and if that's the actual origin of the problem, then they may not be able to make the hat work.

If it's about effort on the individual hat, they surely would have put that into the job gear and not coincidentally ignored every hat that needs to hide the upper hair while implementing the ones that hide it, and also making the Imperial ushankas work.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

The hat still first needs the hair to work properly underneath it, and if that's the actual origin of the problem, then they may not be able to make the hat work.

If it's about effort on the individual hat, they surely would have put that into the job gear and not coincidentally ignored every hat that needs to hide the upper hair while implementing the ones that hide it, and also making the Imperial ushankas work.

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Yeah, I addressed this in an edit, after realizing I'd have to add further. As I stated prior, they have so few hairs, at this point it feels more like they are choosing just not to do it.

This was the thread that made me realize how numb I am to people complaining about this. Whether or not I agree aside, I’m just so numb to the disappointment/outrage/talk in general about it.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

If it's about effort on the individual hat, they surely would have put that into the job gear and not coincidentally ignored every hat that needs to hide the upper hair while implementing the ones that hide it, and also making the Imperial ushankas work.

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Y'know, as much as it bothers me that they made the effort at all for the Reaper hat, that's probably why that specific one is visible on Viera while the rest... aren't. It does appear to completely hide the hair.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

Yeah, I addressed this in an edit, after realizing I'd have to add further context. As I stated prior, they have so few hairs, at this point it feels more like they are choosing just not to do it.

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I don't think it's about the number of hairstyles they need to modify, though – more likely a base level thing that means any hairstyle will not work.

It could be some weird system like that the ear fur is programmed as the top half of the hair, or something like that.

All I have to go on is that they don't work the same as Miqo'te (where the inner ears are part of the body model) and that there was a quote somewhere from Yoshida that to let Viera use hats, their ears would have to be placed like Miqo'te ears.

Also that hairstyles built for other races need to be specially converted for Viera, suggesting that their hair possibly isn't "organised" in the same way even if the hair looks identical.

I don't have any ability to look at the models, so this is just speculation. But it's my best guess of what the issue might be based on what we have seen of where it works and where it doesn't.

That said, if it really is a permanent technical hurdle, I wish they'd come out and say so instead of leaving people asking every time. But it doesn't seem to be their way of handling things.

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Originally Posted by LauraAdalena

This was the thread that made me realize how numb I am to people complaining about this. Whether or not I agree aside, I’m just so numb to the disappointment/outrage/talk in general about it.

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That's because this has been the same cycle going on for the past over two and a half years. Every time they release an event with headgear, or just more headgear in general, a thread (or several) will pop up, and the same thoughts or arguments are made over and over and over. That doesn't mean people shouldn't complain however, as SE seems intent on releasing event rewards that a portion of the playerbase can't even use - with no alternatives.

I don't even like or want the clown nose but I'm just smh at this point lmao
Disappointed but not surprised

If one guy on twitter can do it for free within 24 hours of it going live, why can't SE design their content with Viera/Hroth in mind?

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I don't think it's about the number of hairstyles they need to modify, though – more likely a base level thing that means any hairstyle will not work.

(...)

That said, if it really is a permanent technical hurdle, I wish they'd come out and say so instead of leaving people asking every time. But it doesn't seem to be their way of handling things.

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Frankly, they need to fix it, or come up with alternatives that do not exclude thousands of their playerbase. Viera/hrothgar don't even get many hairs to offset it. It's ridiculous, in my opinion. Yes, they should come out and say exactly what the issue is, unfortunately even if they could fix it, I think it's really just a matter of priority and effort for them.

If you are angery, why not become the real thing to take out your frustration? apply for a job at McDonalds and become Ronald McDonald.

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Originally Posted by SturmChurro

That's because this has been the same cycle going on for the past over two and a half years. Every time they release an event with headgear, or just more headgear in general, a thread (or several) will pop up, and the same thoughts or arguments are made over and over and over. That doesn't mean people shouldn't complain however, as SE seems intent on releasing event rewards that a portion of the playerbase can't even use - with no alternatives.

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I think I’d be more upset personally if any of the ones I’ve seen people complain about when I see these looked good at all. Like the NewYears hats always look atrocious to me, and as someone who loathes clowns THANK GOD not all the races can wear the nose. Just as an example. But yeah, they’re allowed to and I’m allowed to express I’m numb to it and bump the thread up to keep it relevant to help them out because why not. I mean if they get what they want it means I see less of these am I right? Win win.

At least we can use the clown make-up. Just like the clowns we are for playing Viera/Hroth.

They need to redo the graphics engine, character creator, glamour system and address all character inconsistencies in one fell swoop. I hope they announce this soon.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

I don't think it's anything to do with specific system limitations, but the fundamental design of how characters are assembled. Whatever trickery they had to do to implement their vision of Viera and Hrothgar, it involved sacrificing the ability to equip hats as normal – and judging from what does and doesn't work, specifically sacrificing the ability to split the hairstyle into upper and lower halves.

If it is something inextricably linked to the design, they may not be able to fix it at all, or not without altering some visible part of the character appearance.

If they can't overcome that specific issue and don't want to forcibly alter everyone's existing character to fix it, then for the time being until and unless (and if it's realistically possible for them to implement) a full rework of the character design system, this type of headwear may never be able to work at a technical level that no amount of "it's a special hat that everyone deserves equally" can overcome.

Maybe they'll find a solution to the hair issues and then we'll see a flood of hats working normally. But until we see at least one, any expectation of whether a hat works or not is entirely down to its design and not its origin.

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It might be hair related... though I'm not sure

I remember them saying before Endwalker came out that the way they designed male viera, they didn't have the same limitations as they did when they made females, probably in regard to head shapes. Yet here we are with the males having the same restrictions as the females when it comes to equippable gear (though that might also just be to avoid the backlash of upset female players unable to have certain equipment show on them that can show on the males)

Also there are certain items already that kind of just ignore your hair, and tuck it all up into the hat regardless of what your actual hairstyle is. So I'm more inclined to wonder if this has to do with the ears themselves. I can see certain hats working with the upright ears, but would run into clipping issues if you picked to have flop ears. And still other hats, like certain tophats, where the ears wouldn't stick out from the brim, but instead should poke out through the top of an already tall hat.

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Originally Posted by Iscah

That's not a race-specific issue, at least at a basic "it happens sometimes" level. My Midlander's feet clip through long skirts as well.

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It occurs pretty often for a number of mage gear as a Roegadyn, you are right that it isn't a Roe specific thing but the fact they insist on making robes it pops up more often for a healer/caster main Roe like me, I'd wear more skirts if it didn't seem really aggravated of an issue on a Roe. That is a minor issue tho compared to the other Roe stuff i listed, like parts of my pants clipping weirdly (sinking in) or accessories pulsating as i breathe, sinking and rising through my Roe's skin and the way certain boots and shoes aren't shaped properly, some footwear looks like my legs/feet lose body mass depending on the gear, which I understand why that happens as they're basically lego pieces in a sense but the variance is far too wide and it can throw the whole glam off. I'll shut my yap tho as this isn't the thread for it. Ty though for your kind attention to reply to my initial message.

Edit: In fairness to the Devs though and especially the graphics team they have gotten better at fitting stuff on roes, it's just a shame they can't go back and adjust earlier gear that i like the look of to bring that in line. For example teh 90 BRD AF coat is something I was expecting to clip as I ran in the boots I tend to prefer on the classes that have them, but I'm pleasantly surprised that my feet don't clip through it as I run.

No clown nose but strangely enough they CAN wear the Reindeer antler headband with the rudolph nose
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachmen...14/unknown.png

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Originally Posted by Ath192

They need to redo the graphics engine, character creator, glamour system and address all character inconsistencies in one fell swoop. I hope they announce this soon.

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They need to catch up to the modding scene first

There are already mods that fix/allow most hats to be worn by Vs and Hs .

(On Nexusmods : Hrothgar and Viera Hats)
https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com...-806208576.png



There is already a great armour and weapon texture fix that gets rid of almost all ps3 level jaggies on armour decorations and improves specular detail .

(on nexusmods :Upscaled Armors Equipment BETA)
https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com...-774517135.png




If the mod scene could get access to the world textures they would already fixed SEs sloppy texture work, to have a much better looking world , but they cant , only player/npc models and textures can be altered with the current tools.

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

They need to catch up to the modding scene first

There are already mods that fix/allow most hats to be worn by Vs and Hs .

(On Nexusmods : Hrothgar and Viera Hats)
https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com...-806208576.png



There is already a great armour and weapon texture fix that gets rid of almost all ps3 level jaggies on armour decorations and improves specular detail .

(on nexusmods :Upscaled Armors Equipment BETA)
https://staticdelivery.nexusmods.com...-774517135.png




If the mod scene could get access to the world textures they would already fixed SEs sloppy texture work, to have a much better looking world , but they cant , only player/npc models and textures can be altered with the current tools.

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No unfortunately acknowledging the modding scene in any way will only give them an excuse to stop themselves and a reason not to upgrade the graphics engine. While it’s neat people can do that independent modders should never become a reason they don’t officially upgrade models themselves.

In fact while sometimes it’s commendable that they provide alternatives to the community it also shields the company from backlash they should rightly take note of. The game is overdue for a engine overhaul and they’ve milked the current limited system too much.

Of course this would cause all mods that use the old engine to immediately stop working, and if they have supported the community in this regard and fear upsetting them, we just lost our only chance to make a good case for an engine upgrade.

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Originally Posted by Ath192

No unfortunately acknowledging the modding scene in any way will only give them an excuse to stop themselves and a reason not to upgrade the graphics engine. While it’s neat people can do that independent modders should never become a reason they don’t officially upgrade models themselves.

In fact while sometimes it’s commendable that they provide alternatives to the community it also shields the company from backlash they should rightly take note of. The game is overdue for a engine overhaul and they’ve milked the current limited system too much.

Of course this would cause all mods that use the old engine to immediately stop working, and if they have supported the community in this regard and fear upsetting them, we just lost our only chance to make a good case for an engine upgrade.

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I wouldn't care if the current mods stopped working ,and neither would SE Anyone including the genuine mod makers would welcome great engine updates even if it meant the end of texture/gear modding of FF14

The only ones that would be upset are the modders who sell their mods , and quite frankly who cares about them .

The thing is, I wouldn't be as annoyed if SE publicly announced their plan for Viera/Hrothgar... But instead, they're leaving us in the dark and just excluding us from certain event rewards without an explanation.

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Originally Posted by Izar_Chillen

I wouldn't care if the current mods stopped working ,and neither would SE Anyone including the genuine mod makers would welcome great engine updates even if it meant the end of texture/gear modding of FF14

The only ones that would be upset are the modders who sell their mods , and quite frankly who cares about them .

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What does great engine updates have to do with modders making clothes and hair for the game that Square would never make even if they had the ability? Also, side note, the only way modding is going to end is if they put a way to detect it onto our PCs....which they already said they will not do because it's illegal in several countries.

And frankly, a lot of people care about the modding community and those who provide them. If you have some personal issues with mods, sort that out with yourself. Lol.

They've already got a mod for both Viera and Hrothgar to have the hat and nose combo working. I'm sorry but I'm gonna have to chalk this up to pure laziness. It's actually really sad they seem to care very little about these races after over 2 years.

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Originally Posted by goldenophanim

Like, dude, this isn't even about viera or hrothgar limitations anymore. Hide the top hat part of the model if it's so hard to fit, whatever, but what is the point of giving a CLOWN OUTFIT reward and locking out two races from wearing the literal most identifying part of the costume?

Don't try to justify it with model limitations, the nose itself is a literal sphere that could have been fitted onto the limited races the same as literally any other. Feels bad, man.

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Yeah, that seems... disappointing.

There's literally no excuse to let us wear the hat with the ears hidden. They did it with Miqote.

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Originally Posted by LianaThorne

What does great engine updates have to do with modders making clothes and hair for the game that Square would never make even if they had the ability? Also, side note, the only way modding is going to end is if they put a way to detect it onto our PCs....which they already said they will not do because it's illegal in several countries.

And frankly, a lot of people care about the modding community and those who provide them. If you have some personal issues with mods, sort that out with yourself. Lol.

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apart from mods not being able to function if the engine got updated so far that the tools to allow them to work stopped working , you know hence my response to the person i responded to about an engine over haul

I dont have any issue with mods

are you confusing me with someone else?

I think at this point people wont mind if the ears just clip through hats and helms. I dont play Viera or Hrothgar but I feel very bad for these players missing out on some of these glams.

lol, Vieras and Hrothies gipped yet again on glams. I feel so bad for y'all seriously. There's not even a point to glamming when a good portion of it is locked out for those two races

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Originally Posted by SenorPatty

Should've held those two races back until full completion.

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Should have not made them at all and used the resources to improve the other races character creation.

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Originally Posted by Thi

Should have not made them at all and used the resources to improve the other races character creation.

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Thank you.

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Originally Posted by Juun

We should lock out Lalafels from equiping the head and nose too. Its way to scary.

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https://ih1.redbubble.net/image.1732...000,f8f8f8.jpg

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Originally Posted by Haruka_R

Are yall seriously upset that you can't wear a clown nose?

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It's funny because they are the clown themselves.

I don't get why they even brought out half-finished races and not completed ones. SE has had a few years to completed them.

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Originally Posted by Thi

Should have not made them at all and used the resources to improve the other races character creation.

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its so sadge but true. Whats the point of playing as these races when your customization options are limited compared to others? Im sure there's people who just dont care regardless and fully content with what they got but I wish SE took more time to fully implement them.

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Originally Posted by Haruka_R

Are yall seriously upset that you can't wear a clown nose?

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Envy-outrage is a thing when you see other people with something you can't have, especially in the current climate of Everyone Must Have Exactly The Same As Everyone Else Or It's WRONG! Twelve forbid someone choose a race that has well documented limitations and not be allowed their rightful outrage when said limitation actually limits something.

As a Viera, I was really looking forward to wearing this outfit. Another disappointment from SE. I should have known better by now.