Unexplored Class Concepts I'd Love to See in FF14's Future

I've always liked dual pistols. I think there is still a niche for gunner seeing as Machinist is leaning more and more towards gadgets and gizmos these days. could be ranged dps or maybe even caster (Gun Mage?).

I'd also like a caster that doesn't use elemental magic (fire, ice, wind, etc.)

a boomerang/projectile thrower like Rinoa or Hope
Chain-whip
maybe dual handed rapiers or short swords

maybe re-use some of the dress sphere classes from x-2, like gunmage or alchemist

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Originally Posted by Jennah

I want to see them make Calculator and Mime into real, non-limited classes. Somehow.

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Mime would be hilarious if they gave it a Dance Partner type thing where they literally just start copying everything the partner does, lol.

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Originally Posted by Shurrikhan

Neither is new. Holy Paladin has been melee since Legion (well before then, technically, if min-maxing it) or arguably Cataclysm. Mistweaver and Fistweaving (more powerful originally) have been a thing since Mists, when its class (Monk) was introduced. Holy has been meta since. Mistweaver has done fine so long as its damage and healing have also been fine; it's been off meta over 9.x merely because its throughput had been terrible. As the prior has now been melee for 3 expansions (soft-melee for 5 expansions) and the latter has always been melee, they are not likely to go away any time soon.

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They are new in the sense that fistweaving was pulled out at the end of Pandaria, and only put back in full force with Shadowlands where it is now the 'only' viable healer for monks. Fistweaving Monks now have the highest healer throughput in the game, but is #2 on healer DPS after Holy Paladin. and lacks any "utility" spells which are considered mandatory by Max Limit - so it's been ranked F-tier because one YouTuber who's a world firster hates it. He has a semi-point. Imagine if to bring a DPS that had the DPS of a Samurai - you could not bring a Dancer... The "utility" spot in WoW is on the healers - and if you bring a Fistweaver, you have one less utility for any mechanics that might require it. Such mechanics do not exist, at least not before Mythic raiding... but it's a concern nonetheless...

Paladin likewise - you could always melee for rando kicks on a holy Paladin, but now it's a difference of essentially doubling your healing throughput to do so. It's become 'S-Tier' because it's DPS can often beat an actual DPS, and it's healing throughput on anyone with melee range is insanely high. In 'M+' if you can keep your group close together this is very powerful.

In the past - these 2 had melee toolkits, but they were not directly tied to making healing even possible. Now they are, and their caster healing options have been dramatically reduced.

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Originally Posted by Tweed

I'd also like a caster that doesn't use elemental magic (fire, ice, wind, etc.)

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This please.

And contrariwise, I would like a Healer with an actual weapon and not just a token or floating bauble. Monk spade was proposed elsewhere I think it has a lot of potential as a Yuna/Aerith reference with some bonus utility.

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Originally Posted by Sylve

Mime would be hilarious if they gave it a Dance Partner type thing where they literally just start copying everything the partner does, lol.

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At one point, multiple expansions ago before I quit forever, possibly the Panda one - my WoW druid had this skill that targetted another player, and got a new ability based on what their class and spec was. 'Symbiosis' I think it was called. I'd imagine something like that.

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Originally Posted by Tweed

I've always liked dual pistols. I think there is still a niche for gunner seeing as Machinist is leaning more and more towards gadgets and gizmos these days. could be ranged dps or maybe even caster (Gun Mage?).

I'd also like a caster that doesn't use elemental magic (fire, ice, wind, etc.)

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Something I think would be cool is a Sniper Job.
SWTOR has one and its' very unique.
Back when I played it was my favorite class I really wish other MMO's had it, I'd main it in FFXIV easily.

Sorta like a BLM but with a Sniper Rifle and focused on slower cast but high potency attacks.

Bruiser mage job, though reaper /sort of/ treads into that given all the magic they have on attacks. However, I was thinking Golbez and Ex-Death though (so far more general magic focused). As a fun thought experiment at one point was making Geomancer into Geo-knight. With the Suaron, Golbez, and Ex-Death influences. AF armor that is like full plate. Perhaps some gravity magic as well (taking some AST influences, but in line with DD role).

Weapon might be a huge mace (like Sauron), a little 'extra' might be a bell component built into the weapons at the weapon artist's choice (like some might be attached to hilt, others built into the weapon, etc- chimes / bells- something that an animation of giving it a good shake would make sense). While I'm not stuck to a particular element I mentally at least picture everything being very meaty to add extra differentiation from current mage magics.

For example the job may punch the ground causing a huge pillar of earth to pierce the enemy, one punch massive torrent of flame out of their first, claw their hands together causing enemies to be lifted into an orb of torrential water (boss can ignore CC, still takes damage). Given the crunchy and bulky sense, and reference to geomancer, the job might also construct crystal fonts of energy for battlefield effects and perhaps positional combinations that takes them out of the standard melee positional system yet still keeps them not simply another inverse red mage. Of course with bells and such on weapon smacking the crsystal fonts could be a fun mechanic, easy to incorperate for combat purposes but also could have a nice noise :)(which you can play with the weapon type with too, like smacking a pylon of fire crystal would cause a nice sound effect :3).

ANOTHER DARK JOB, HAHAahahAHAHaha-- but this time use less dark elemental magic and like witch, warlock, eldritch, spirit, ravens, etc. Low priority given Reaper came out already (and is cool), I just think it could be a new take as it would depart quite a bit from the current three jobs seen mainly as the 'dark' jobs. Perhaps may consider this one more occult than simply dark. Also I still think a horror focused job questline could be fun :). Horror not simply being jump scares, but could be a sense of unknown and extra mystery to the game with vibes of lovecraft and of course inspired from the few horror elements that already existed in FFXIV (particularly that one bride to be / dungeon).

Light theme'd job but damage dealer, not healer not tank. I think you could have some fun with that, I mean Paladin swords are already loads of fun, and holy is very cool, here now you get to focus on that but with a new angle (damage dealer).

I think this could go well with light themed but otherwise, a job focused on lightning like concepts and animations. I think that is an underused element, with high potential to look cool. Thor inspired maybe ;).

Transformation job, focused on transformation as the gimmick- meaning it happens early in the job's life and it grows. Reaper for example may have been SE's response to that desire, and it is cool to go reaper-mode (and the job is cool overall, I like it), but I'd love to see a job that /transforms/ as a core of it's identity and way of interacting. I mention WoW druid not because I mean copy it, just that is a fast and dirty example. Actually if I was adding specific influence I want to reference Terra Bradford who is Esperkin, Vincet (chaos materia), Yuri (Harmonixer, Shadow Hearts), Dante (Devil Trigger), Illidan (WC3), and now I think a great opportunity (assuming I understood the concept correctly from just a trailer... lol), the recent FFXVI where they use primal powers.

FFXVI could be a good use as you start out with your own power augmented by whatever theme is picked, which could be the primals SE never intends to give to SMN (Sephirot, etc), or the Zodiac, but then later you just go full into that form rather be simply augmented by it (so your human form wouldn't be super detailed or a large presence in your rotation if at all as you level up, the whole point would be to transform).

I'd recommend a system that encourages rotating, not fixed rotation either, explicitly designed to encourage making different decisions based on your own mechanics but also the combat. So you might pick Bruiser DD form due to situation even though the game is tagging ranged DD form as buffed form to be in, but next time you might follow the game's response, it was the situation that dictated you needed the features over the damage boost- a mix of using the right form for the right situation, planning ahead, but also sometimes following the shifting tides of your own mechanics. SMN I think tries to do this a little, with the different egi types and I think that is neat but it would have to be taken to one level higher (SMN doesn't have a system to encourage different rotations, outside of perhaps fight specific mechanics). If it was to be a job focused on transformations you'd want to be sure to nail that system. You might have perhaps 3 semi-permanent (the system may encourage you to rotate for best dps, but you could stay or turn back into them, as long as you need if you 'need' the features of a specific form) and 1 temporary (hyper form), a travel form, etc. I suppose I wouldn't be really upset if it was just 1 really cool and feature complete form, for me the main desire is to be able to change. I love the concept, like from the games already mentioned.

An idea I had to get around a common issue in transformation based jobs, that you can't really customize them, besides what like WoW does (glyphs you can earn that give you different 'looks'), is that the weapon for the job would be able to be used through the different forms.

An example I use is cloak, sash, scarf, similar type concept. I am sure you could come up with others though, from weapons to armor to tattoos. Can be very creative. Lore having something to do with a living beast, primal, demon, what have you cloak (perhaps it lightly animates even when stationary), with the aether (blood, or emotion) soaked cloak acting as a conduit and stablizer as you let other energies run amuck and wild. The cloak wrapping around you and helps you safely transform through the eye of the hurricane that is transforming (not entirely related to creation magic transforming perhaps, for extra lore fun). Of course you might worry about cloaks on cloaks... You'd have to test that out to see how it looks might be silly, might be layering fun lol. The cloaks can help be incorperated in the animation of transformation (like the primary color of the item is used as it creates a thread sphere like animation around you that obscures your character and then reveals to your form). Then in form you can imagine seeing these objects, I think. Like if you turned into a wolf, wolf with a scarf- I think it would look fine. Now your forms are customized a bit, and the color of the weapon might even have a subtle influence on the form. With relic weapons even perhaps adding special skins- if you had a fire inspired relic then you might get a fire wolf remix to your form. Could also use the secondary slot to add further customization / separation, such that the mainhand and offhand inform each other. Or simply just use the off hand, I guess (doesn't mean the off hand even needs stats, could be there just to exist to customize your character further).

Arithmetitian:
Caster with non-elemental, time and space based spells. A utility centric DPS caster that focuses on buffing allies and debuffing enemies, and a rotation based on distance and timing. Visually, I'd would use clear geometric patterns with mathematic formulae.
It would use Rulers or Abaccuses.


Ranger:
Physical Ranged dps, with a crossbow and a Falcon pet. (Wouldn't be a true pet, more like an animation, like SMN egis. But could have some form of interactivity for poses and emotes. )
Would use mechanical traps, nets, caltrops and such, reminiscent of a hunter or a trapper. Would probably be a selfish dps, like machinist.

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Originally Posted by Jennah

I want to see them make Calculator and Mime into real, non-limited classes. Somehow.

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THIS. ^^

In particular the Calculator/Arithmetician from Final Fantasy Tactics.

Weapon: Abacus
Leveling / Skill Unlock: As the player progresses up the levels, unlock a full array of DPS, Support, and Healing spells
- Note: I don't mean minor/meager spells like how RDM has meager healing spells but is primarily a DPS, or healers have some DPS with a primary focus on Healing, but FULL ON SPELLS FOR BOTH
The Plot Twist: In addition to picking which spells to cast, before the spells actually trigger the player then needs to input CALCULATIONS, which depending on how well the player does them, could affect the players team, the enemies, or a mix of both
- The Job would likely still need to be listed as a DPS primarily, but with having powerful healing spells, could assist in assisting / redirecting problematic shifts in battle more than most current Jobs do (I mean, how many comments have we seen in the Roulettes thread about people seeing fights going pear-shaped but being able to do nothing about it???)
- Plus maybe it would be better to choose calculations first, then pick a spell based on what the target array looks like?
- Getting into spells more, there would need to be a cap of some sort, like possibly not having -the- most powerful spells from the other jobs, BUT being able to cast the powerful single target spells across multiple targets at the same time (so maybe no AOEs but still being able to hit multiple targets with hard-hitting dps spells or heals)

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Originally Posted by GrimGale

Arithmetitian:
Caster with non-elemental, time and space based spells. A utility centric DPS caster that focuses on buffing allies and debuffing enemies, and a rotation based on distance and timing. Visually, I'd would use clear geometric patterns with mathematic formulae.
It would use Rulers or Abaccuses.
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Apologies in advance, while I thoroughly appreciate your own interest in supporting the Arithmetician, if it was solely focused on doing just support spells/abilities then I would die a little inside, lol. To me the real majesty of the Arithmetician job was that it was able to cast ALL types of spells, it had open access to everything but depending on how the current calculations worked out, had to decide whether to attempt dps, healing, or just proffering support to the team / debuffs to the enemies.

Sometimes it was worth killing a teammate if it meant you 1-shot 2/3 of the opposing forces, especially since you could usually rez them a moment later if you were thoughtful and planned accordingly XD

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Originally Posted by Alxyzntlct

THIS. ^^

In particular the Calculator/Arithmetician from Final Fantasy Tactics.

Weapon: Abacus
Leveling / Skill Unlock: As the player progresses up the levels, unlock a full array of DPS, Support, and Healing spells
- Note: I don't mean minor/meager spells like how RDM has meager healing spells but is primarily a DPS, or healers have some DPS with a primary focus on Healing, but FULL ON SPELLS FOR BOTH
The Plot Twist: In addition to picking which spells to cast, before the spells actually trigger the player then needs to input CALCULATIONS, which depending on how well the player does them, could affect the players team, the enemies, or a mix of both
- The Job would likely still need to be listed as a DPS primarily, but with having powerful healing spells, could assist in assisting / redirecting problematic shifts in battle more than most current Jobs do (I mean, how many comments have we seen in the Roulettes thread about people seeing fights going pear-shaped but being able to do nothing about it?


Apologies in advance, while I thoroughly appreciate your own interest in supporting the Arithmetician, if it was solely focused on doing just support spells/abilities then I would die a little inside, lol. To me the real majesty of the Arithmetician job was that it was able to cast ALL types of spells, it had open access to everything but depending on how the current calculations worked out, had to decide whether to attempt dps, healing, or just proffering support to the team / debuffs to the enemies.

Sometimes it was worth killing a teammate if it meant you 1-shot 2/3 of the opposing forces, especially since you could usually rez them a moment later if you were thoughtful and planned accordingly XD

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You do understand how that is never going to work in FFXIV right. Were this a single player game, an Arithmetitian with the potential to sabotage your own team wouldn't be a problem, but in a multiplayer game, we don't want classes that have the potential to mess things up. Just look at Rescue and how much problems it can cause, and it has like a long CD.

I figured I'd have the calculation flavour in built into the job's mechanics rather than trying to make it super loyal to its FFT version. It has to fit into the DPS caster role, so it can't heal as much as a healer. It can provide buffs and apply debuffs tho, so as to be the caster version of Dancer, in a sense, where most of its contribution is in the form of augmented damage for party members.

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Originally Posted by GrimGale

You do understand how that is never going to work in FFXIV right. Were this a single player game, an Arithmetitian with the potential to sabotage your own team wouldn't be a problem, but in a multiplayer game, we don't want classes that have the potential to mess things up. Just look at Rescue and how much problems it can cause, and it has like a long CD.

I figured I'd have the calculation flavour in built into the job's mechanics rather than trying to make it super loyal to its FFT version. It has to fit into the DPS caster role, so it can't heal as much as a healer. It can provide buffs and apply debuffs tho, so as to be the caster version of Dancer, in a sense, where most of its contribution is in the form of augmented damage for party members.

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Eh, anything can be made to work with enough creativity. I'd rather them be creative about it and explore options rather than dumb it down into something that wouldn't actually be fun. And again, being brutally honest, having the powerhouse job that Arithmetician was but distilled down into a buff/debuffer would make it both pointless and disappointing. I'd rather just not have it at all at that point.

(And to be even more brutally honest, plenty of jobs already have the ability to "mess things up" and they are what they are, I refer you to the roulettes thread again)

I get it, you're trying to be thoughtful about pre-existing standards. I can respect that to a degree. However, I also see a LOT of folks asking SE more and more to step out of their pre-defined boundaries a little more to explore options in the game, and the Arithmetician is an amazing job to do that with.

Edit: In fact, if it meant it had to be a Limited Job, I'd be 100% fine with that as well. I know some folks don't like Blue Mage for that limitation, but I don't mind at all. I'd rather have an option to play the game in fun and amazing ways than not at all.

I just popped in here
to plug Cannoneer~

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Originally Posted by Alxyzntlct

Edit: In fact, if it meant it had to be a Limited Job, I'd be 100% fine with that as well. I know some folks don't like Blue Mage for that limitation, but I don't mind at all. I'd rather have an option to play the game in fun and amazing ways than not at all.

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Limited jobs have thus far meant to be able to play only part of the game, under a less cohesive/engaging kit than average--as gate-kept by long grinds in exchange, perhaps, for side-content--and all other parts of the game not at all.

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Originally Posted by Fyrebrand

What are "slow attacks" in FFXIV? Melee attacks with a cast bar? Or a 4-second GCD? Why do we want to be slow? There's room for it, sure. We have BLM after all, with all their build-up investment, and Ley Lines discouraging movement. There could be a melee/tank that operates on the same concept. I don't think it would appeal to me personally, but perhaps some would like the flavour.

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Honestly, probably a 1.2-1.4x (3 to 3.5s) GCD on certain skills and, more importantly, longer animation locks (not movement locks, as present on Jumps, Dives, and Primal Rush, but simply the period during which no other skill may be cast, GCD or oGCD, and thereby clip the preceding skill's animation, allowing more of that animation to resolve).

Think of the latter as, if balanced around being able to weave fewer attacks into raid buffs (or having fewer attacks it would need to weave into raid buffs), being particularly ping-friendly and having less of the flailing, half-animated "do-all-the-things-now!" feeling of, say, DRK's optimal opener (a giant two-handed sword attacking as if weightless despite most animations individually still being reasonably weighty). Likely duller to many, but smoother and more visually satisfying to others.

Realistically, I'd assume scouting dps since maiming has RPR now. I guess perhaps a more "selfish dps" if they intend on NIN being more utility-based.

I could see Spellblade/Mystic Knight with En- enchantments on their blade with varying effects similar to rotating BRD song.

I'm really hoping for caster dps and I think we will get another caster. As someone else mentioned, Time Mage could fill that dot-based role with emphasis on properly extending their dots to build up/access a big burst (eg. Demi/Quarter). They could be a utility-based DPS with their own version of Expedient. Quicken to either increase the rate of the dot ticks (finicky with server ticks) or doubles the potency. Basically a dot class with maybe three to four dots. I know SE doesn't like dots but honestly they can remove dots from jobs that doesn't really need them or just there for busy work and give those other jobs something in place (better creative design tbh).

Personally dps is the only way for Time Mage to work as healer would be a literal slap to AST's face and just bring back things that they lost (lazy).

Though I feel that Geomancer is the next caster dps candidate as they're a popular choice and would be cool as well. Probably with rotating elements.