Less and less SE interaction with forums community over time

I miss seeing them around too. It was nice to get some acknowledgement from time to time that "hey, we'll pass this on to the devs" (even if they actually did or didn't).

I don't understand those that say that "the first page on General Discussion is why they avoid the forums," because that's indicative of a problem that needs to be addressed. If it's such a perceived cesspool, then they should have moderators reevaluate what is and isn't working. There should be an expectation set on what is appropriate conduct and moderate as necessary.

If the current expectation is that the forums are a mess, because there is little to no moderation, then it should fall to the forum mods to change how they interact with the community (be it with more intervention, more mods, or both). A mess isn't cleaned up just by staring at it.

And to add, a little interaction from community reps would go a long way. I get it's volatile to respond to one thread vs another, but it does overall give people the knowledge that they are seen and heard.

Part of the issue is everyone feels their opinion is important and deserves it’s own thread when square and yoshida have said time and again they go based on 1 thread with many likes for feedback and replies. We the English section just refuse to take that on board and still post many smaller threads on the same topic than one other one and throw it a like

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Originally Posted by Wavaryen

I mean the game keeps getting better and better. If that means not talking with NA players. That is OK in my books. We are not really needed, and we will keep playing no matter how "wrong" we feel by the developers. So just do you developers.

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This is highly debatable and I’d argue SHB is a step down, with a creeping trend of accessibility to the point of pointlessness. Dungeons feel like tutorials, jobs are getting dummer ect

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Originally Posted by Jirah

This is highly debatable and I’d argue SHB is a step down, with a creeping trend of accessibility to the point of pointlessness. Dungeons feel like tutorials, jobs are getting dummer ect

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This is such utter nonsense. There isn't a SINGLE hard dungeon in the entire game. They've always been tutorials to trial and raid mechanics.

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Originally Posted by Jirah

This is highly debatable and I’d argue SHB is a step down, with a creeping trend of accessibility to the point of pointlessness. Dungeons feel like tutorials, jobs are getting dummer ect

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Have you seen some of the players you encounter in dungeons? If it was any harder there'd be vote abandons and dismiss everywhere. I had a run of Pagl'than last week where it took us an hour to reach the end because DPS were that bad. They died to everything, didn't figure out mechanics, their DPS was really low...I give credit to the tank for not leaving, because I was almost pulling out my hair in frustration just healing it.

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Originally Posted by Jirah

This is highly debatable and I’d argue SHB is a step down, with a creeping trend of accessibility to the point of pointlessness. Dungeons feel like tutorials, jobs are getting dummer ect

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The community proved back in 2.1 that it didn't want hard dungeons. Everyone balked at pharos Sirius, left, or never unlocked it so they wouldn't get it in the roulette.

Surveys back before ARR launched, yeah. They might have happened, but not so much after 2.0 went live. Why? To keep interest in a 'dead' game that was being rewritten. I've looked at surveys from that time period. I have never seen one the 2.0 forums over the last 7 years.

Dev items on this Forum ... I think that SE decided spending a lot of time here saying "nope. not gonna comment" would have been shooting themselves in the foot. After all, if you can't say something nice [expected answer to question #2956 'How are Summoners, exactly, going to change in 6.0?'], don't say anything at all.

Why respond to a thread where people are laying out a whole new Healer regime when it has zero chance of arriving in game in that format? Why respond to a thread where players are redeveloping battle jobs, including rearranging oGCD/GCD rotations 'because it would be cool'?

Even a simple "thanks for your feedback" would be taken to mean "We're working on it".

I absolutely agree that it would be extremely nice to at least be acknowledged as existing by the community team(s). It's all well and good for the them to look to twitter, reddit, etc. for the few interactions that do occur but these are the official forums for the game. We should be getting at least as much as the third party, off-site, non-affiliated sources do.

I also agree with the moderation issue. This isn't actually too bad a place to be after they go through and nuke the place in a massive moderation sweep.. but then they just disappear until the exact same people with the exact same MOs pop up again a couple of months later so the board can become a useless cesspool that prompts mass reporting another moderation nuking. If the team was actually here all the time they'd be able to not only foster discussion but also keep the board functioning and functional, and they'd be able to instantly blast the usual suspects as soon as they slithered back out from under their rocks rather than let them rule the forum for weeks.

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Have you seen some of the players you encounter in dungeons? If it was any harder there'd be vote abandons and dismiss everywhere. I had a run of Pagl'than last week where it took us an hour to reach the end because DPS were that bad. They died to everything, didn't figure out mechanics, their DPS was really low...I give credit to the tank for not leaving, because I was almost pulling out my hair in frustration just healing it.

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Honestly that’s incredibly frustrating, but i don’t think a lot of players should suffer just because some players are lazy and don’t want to learn their job. I’m tired of always having to cater to players because people keep enabling insane laziness(not saying you just period.) It’s why we keep seeing jobs and crafting/gathering getting dumbed down to the point of uselessness and lack of fun.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

Honestly that’s incredibly frustrating, but i don’t think a lot of players should suffer just because some players are lazy and don’t want to learn their job. I’m tired of always having to cater to players because people keep enabling insane laziness(not saying you just period.) It’s why we keep seeing jobs and crafting/gathering getting dumbed down to the point of uselessness and lack of fun.

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SE looks at the bottom line unfortunately, and the money of casuals is just as important as ours. If it had been Holminster I could have chalked it up to people using jump potions, but Pagl'than is literally the FINAL dungeon, we all expect competency by that point. I kinda wish they had just used the Trusts rather than make it take longer than it needed to be.

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Originally Posted by Rhus

Part of the issue is everyone feels their opinion is important and deserves it’s own thread when square and yoshida have said time and again they go based on 1 thread with many likes for feedback and replies. We the English section just refuse to take that on board and still post many smaller threads on the same topic than one other one and throw it a like

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That comes back to active moderation though. If the moderators were patrolling the forum locking/merging threads and saying "nope, join the one that's already active", people might learn that they need to look for the active thread first – which would be easier to find in the first place if it wasn't getting wiped off the first page by recycled drama from months ago.

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Originally Posted by DPZ2

Dev items on this Forum ... I think that SE decided spending a lot of time here saying "nope. not gonna comment" would have been shooting themselves in the foot. After all, if you can't say something nice [expected answer to question #2956 'How are Summoners, exactly, going to change in 6.0?'], don't say anything at all.

Why respond to a thread where people are laying out a whole new Healer regime when it has zero chance of arriving in game in that format? Why respond to a thread where players are redeveloping battle jobs, including rearranging oGCD/GCD rotations 'because it would be cool'?

Even a simple "thanks for your feedback" would be taken to mean "We're working on it".

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That's not what I'd expect to see them responding to here – even if they were active, they'd have no obligation to take those sort of job-redesign posts on board.

But things like community feedback to an event or, as I've seen them do in the past, active responses to errors reported in the Localization forum, would be a good way to show that they're active and listening.

I'd ignore these forums too with the kind of things that go on here XD

Just to add to Icsah:

Mod or dev posting comes with a lot of weight. Were I to post a decent idea and a mod give a thumbs up or otherwise acknowledge me, they would have to then explain themselves.

Like a regularly seen good idea: allow us to color the names of FC members like we do friends. Any recognition, like “nice idea!” would cause people to think it’s a coming feature or has been accepted somehow. It could also cause anger when the mod says they don’t agree with whatever. Basically, 99% it’s just better to say or do nothing, then make a live letter addressing overall issues rather than individual posts.

It wouldn’t surprise me if some of the devs were just regular users going incognito.

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Originally Posted by kaynide

Just to add to Icsah:

Mod or dev posting comes with a lot of weight. Were I to post a decent idea and a mod give a thumbs up or otherwise acknowledge me, they would have to then explain themselves.

Like a regularly seen good idea: allow us to color the names of FC members like we do friends. Any recognition, like “nice idea!” would cause people to think it’s a coming feature or has been accepted somehow. It could also cause anger when the mod says they don’t agree with whatever. Basically, 99% it’s just better to say or do nothing, then make a live letter addressing overall issues rather than individual posts.

It wouldn’t surprise me if some of the devs were just regular users going incognito.

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I guess that's the main problem.
They just can't say anything about the regular topic's because some people will think that it is a confirmation and will become mad when it doesn't happen.

The mod in the German Forum is just writing in the "off topic" thread and only about trivial stuff.
But that small interaction is enough to let us know that they are at least watch in the forum.

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Originally Posted by Curisu

The mod in the German Forum is just writing in the "off topic" thread and only about trivial stuff.
But that small interaction is enough to let us know that they are at least watch in the forum.

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That would be the sensible way to go. Participate, but not in ways that approve or disapprove of any one idea.

It's also worth noting that they may not be able to directly take on suggestions outside of competitions, because that gets messy with copyright and ownership.

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Originally Posted by Kes13a

I disagree.

people will easily be given and inch and run with it for miles. especially on forums. a developer says something, and suddenly its either a controversy or an EXPECTED future implementation simply because a dev mentioned it. look at all the fuss generated over an icon for a job not even in the game yet that has ZERO history.

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This is where moderation comes in. They did this kind of interaction for years without issue. People can have their controversy and the devs don't need to pay attention to it at all quite frankly, it's a fairly isolated area for such things. The community managers simply notice things they feel are worth passing on, highlight them to the devs, and we get the odd response. There is no obligation for them to say anything beyond that. If they're going to have these forums, they absolutely can work. They did it in the past, there is precedent for it working absolutely without problem. Only in the past two years have they stopped doing it, and I dare say that the forums are worse off for it, not better.

Regarding the post by kaynide, the things they tended to reply to in the past were always well written and I don't think they ever really had the impact you are stating. I've never seen a mod or dev say they don't like an idea. They only posted about things such as:

1) Reasons why something can't be done (not to say it isn't a good idea)
2) That something is a good idea and they will look into it
3) That they agree and a fix has been implemented
4) Providing lore details

Of course, I've not seen every single post by the devs and community managers but I don't recall any time they caused any problems.

EDIT2: Examples of how mods/devs interacted with the community in the past:

Help/information provided for a user
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post2692500
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...92#post3969492
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...33#post3116933
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...87#post2861187

Confirmation that the team is looking into a suggestion/concern (note: most of these were implemented, from what I know of the game)
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...=1#post1101676
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...56#post3116856
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...02#post3116802
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...10#post3066610
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...66#post3066466
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...70#post3062370
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...46#post3058146
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...90#post2872190
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...29#post2812529
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...40#post2787940
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...37#post2787937
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...61#post2757261

Confirmation that a fix has been implemented for an issue and/or new feature reveals
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...92#post3770692
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...32#post3403632
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...34#post2787934

Clarification on how a decision was reached
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...75#post3684775
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...11#post3655511

Asking to keep a thread on topic
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...15#post3483815

Suggestion to log a bug report
https://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/...87#post2872187

Guys, I think I found the answer to my own thread:

https://i.imgur.com/C6gzqeu.png

https://www.paycomonline.net/v4/ats/...0AB4ECF899F4D0

Anyone in California wanna step up? :D

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Originally Posted by Loony_BoB

Guys, I think I found the answer to my own thread:

https://i.imgur.com/C6gzqeu.png

https://www.paycomonline.net/v4/ats/...0AB4ECF899F4D0

Anyone in California wanna step up? :D

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personally, at this point in time I would not want to hire ANYONE from the California area... especially if they have a certain game developing company on their resume. ESPECIALLY for any kind of "social" position

Oh god, I didn't even think about that.

I'd consider it to be a matter of balance, personally. I don't expect each and every thread to be graced with a response, no matter how popular the thread in question may prove to be...but it does feel as if the game has become a lot more clinical of late which has coincided with the game's rising popularity.

I've been lucky enough to be able to dine at some of the most popular and most prestigious restaurants across Europe. Amongst the most memorable experiences were those with a personal touch. Where, no matter how busy the kitchen may have been, efforts were made to make every customer feel welcome and looked after.

I certainly wouldn't expect the development team themselves to comment directly on threads here - but equally, I do not believe for a second that it is too big of an expectation for someone hired on their behalf to do as much. Even a neutral response to popular threads confirming that feedback has been gathered, translated and fed back to the development team would be very welcomed.

Perhaps it might prevent situations where, for years, people requested more facial hair options for male characters...only for Yoshi-P to express surprise when told in an interview that people were asking for it.

If we take that at face value, it means that the development team were made aware of far more niche requests such as the removal of gender locked gear...but not the people patiently and politely asking for more customisation options for male characters which, in itself, is not a small number.

Now, I'm reluctant to suggest that whoever was hired to gather feedback isn't doing their job but once again I would like to make it clear that there are a decent number of constructive posters to be found here that cannot be found on Twitter. Therefore, only looking at Twitter serves to skew the game's development in favour of 'issues' that a sizeable portion of the FFXIV community do not concern themselves with.

It honestly still blows my mind that Yoshi wasn't even aware that people were asking for more facial hair until then.

Like, what?

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/...256-nqlyaa.jpg

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Originally Posted by Theodric

I'd consider it to be a matter of balance, personally. I don't expect each and every thread to be graced with a response, no matter how popular the thread in question may prove to be...but it does feel as if the game has become a lot more clinical of late which has coincided with the game's rising popularity.

I've been lucky enough to be able to dine at some of the most popular and most prestigious restaurants across Europe. Amongst the most memorable experiences were those with a personal touch. Where, no matter how busy the kitchen may have been, efforts were made to make every customer feel welcome and looked after.

I certainly wouldn't expect the development team themselves to comment directly on threads here - but equally, I do not believe for a second that it is too big of an expectation for someone hired on their behalf to do as much. Even a neutral response to popular threads confirming that feedback has been gathered, translated and fed back to the development team would be very welcomed.

Perhaps it might prevent situations where, for years, people requested more facial hair options for male characters...only for Yoshi-P to express surprise when told in an interview that people were asking for it.

If we take that at face value, it means that the development team were made aware of far more niche requests such as the removal of gender locked gear...but not the people patiently and politely asking for more customisation options for male characters which, in itself, is not a small number.

Now, I'm reluctant to suggest that whoever was hired to gather feedback isn't doing their job but once again I would like to make it clear that there are a decent number of constructive posters to be found here that cannot be found on Twitter. Therefore, only looking at Twitter serves to skew the game's development in favour of 'issues' that a sizeable portion of the FFXIV community do not concern themselves with.

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It would be amazing if there were a HelpRace for FFXIV, or something similar to it. It'd be so much more effective than the forums.

Example of what I mean: https://streamelements.helprace.com/...ents/ideas/top

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Originally Posted by BaconBits

It honestly still blows my mind that Yoshi wasn't even aware that people were asking for more facial hair until then.

Like, what?

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/...256-nqlyaa.jpg

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That’s honestly the most obvious indicator that they only look at jp forums and twitter. Where jp doesn’t really care about facial hair and twitter is more busy asking for ungenderocked gear or short male viera

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Originally Posted by EmoPanther

I'd ignore these forums too with the kind of things that go on here XD

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and why do you think "those kind of things" go on here? because there's a complete lack of moderation

I can think of only one solution, and it is by using the translation tool known as DeepL which has way better English to Japanese translation, you all could attempt at some form of communicating if you're not too good with the language by using that tool.

I just don't know how the Japanese Forum on here will react once they realize the language barrier has been somewhat partially broken.

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Originally Posted by KizuyaKatogami

That’s honestly the most obvious indicator that they only look at jp forums and twitter. Where jp doesn’t really care about facial hair and twitter is more busy asking for ungenderocked gear or short male viera

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Ofc JP doesn't care about facial hair. Japanese men don't have any that a 16 yearold European wouldn't put to shame. I personally started shaving my face when I was still in elementary school.

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Originally Posted by Kaliesto

I just don't know how the Japanese Forum on here will react once they realize the language barrier has been somewhat partially broken.

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How would anyone react if their bubble was popped? Although I hope the JP players are more aware of the outside world than the devs...

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Originally Posted by Curisu

I guess that's the main problem.
They just can't say anything about the regular topic's because some people will think that it is a confirmation and will become mad when it doesn't happen.

The mod in the German Forum is just writing in the "off topic" thread and only about trivial stuff.
But that small interaction is enough to let us know that they are at least watch in the forum.

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This is probably the way to go. Just short responses to the “show your au ra” or whatever threads to say “oh that’s cute” or “nice submission, thank you!”. No actual engagement or explanations in thread debates, but just enough to show they are there.

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Originally Posted by TTiscancer

This is such utter nonsense. There isn't a SINGLE hard dungeon in the entire game. They've always been tutorials to trial and raid mechanics.

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Doesn’t mean they should continue being a cakewalk, that’s what you described as “Stagnate”. Also sure no dungeon is that difficult but SHB being easier than what we’ve seen despite being in then 70s+? Yes

They’ve always been tutorials, and makes sense to just let them rot and waste creativity by simply being? No

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Originally Posted by RyuDragnier

Have you seen some of the players you encounter in dungeons? If it was any harder there'd be vote abandons and dismiss everywhere. I had a run of Pagl'than last week where it took us an hour to reach the end because DPS were that bad. They died to everything, didn't figure out mechanics, their DPS was really low...I give credit to the tank for not leaving, because I was almost pulling out my hair in frustration just healing it.

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When your babied for 80 levels and carried by trusts, that can happen. The fact that Pagl’than isn’t even remotely hard makes it even sadder. Your experience isn’t a daily occurrence despite you cladding as if it’s a common crisis.

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Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

The community proved back in 2.1 that it didn't want hard dungeons. Everyone balked at pharos Sirius, left, or never unlocked it so they wouldn't get it in the roulette.

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Now the table has turned, would it kill anyone to add a few more mechs? No it wouldn’t and this over-exaggeration by the community is what I detest. Numb to evolution