Healers Deserve a Male Mascot

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Originally Posted by Ilenya

Alphinaud and Urianger are on the list of most popular characters?

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The official forums are a strange place to express how unaware you are of common knowledge about FFXIV.

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Originally Posted by Shibi

He walks quite slowly in the Doma solos... I can imagine a typical tank going for a wall to wall pull, and Zenos Yae Healer just ambling casually into the room following the party without a care.

"Why didn't you heal me" the now-dead tank cries.
"You shouldn't run ahead, it's boring" Zenos tells him
(Zenos has left the party)

Meanwhile in the thread on the forums about bad dungeon experiences...

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Zenos: You don't pay my sub.

He's just not worked out how to toggle off walk mode and is too proud to admit it.

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Originally Posted by Saefinn

He's just not worked out how to toggle off walk mode and is too proud to admit it.

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Hehe, thank you, a good belly chuckle is a wonderful thing :D

Further on equal representation for sage so far, in addition to the female Viera concept art there's a 3D render of what I am fairly sure is a male Lalafell, plus the male Miqo'te from the showcase video. This article is using both of those and not the Viera.

Healers have quite a few mascots already. Though what would've really been nice is if the WoL picked a healer class in the trailer. Guess he's not interested in casters.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

Healers have quite a few mascots already. Though what would've really been nice is if the WoL picked a healer class in the trailer. Guess he's not interested in casters.

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Healing just doesn't make for great animation. Even in the old World of Warcraft trailers, I think you only ever see one healer rezzing an orc. Everyone else is attacking or running or casting.

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Originally Posted by Edax

Healing just doesn't make for great animation. Even in the old World of Warcraft trailers

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Healing is 90% DPS in this game. We even have Alphinaud going pew-pew gunaroo in the very same trailer. They even have the WoL play a SAM, which has their own casting abilities that requires them to stand still. They even change to a SAM for a single attack in the Shadowbringers trailer and just have them stand still and swing their sword. Same for when they change to DRK. So the lack of movement apparently isn't a disqualification for "This can look cool". I don't buy it. I think it's just the general perception of "Casters/healers are weak/side characters jobs."

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Originally Posted by hydralus

Healing is 90% DPS in this game. We even have Alphinaud going pew-pew gunaroo in the very same trailer. They even have the WoL play a SAM, which has their own casting abilities that requires them to stand still. They even change to a SAM for a single attack in the Shadowbringers trailer and just have them stand still and swing their sword. Same for when they change to DRK. So the lack of movement apparently isn't a disqualification for "This can look cool". I don't buy it. I think it's just the general perception of "Casters/healers are weak/side characters jobs."

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I didn't say the lack of the movement was the problem, I said healing doesn't make for great animation. The act of healing is not a very visually exciting experience as visually not much happens except a glow.

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Originally Posted by Edax

I didn't say the lack of the movement was the problem, I said healing doesn't make for great animation. The act of healing is not a very visually exciting experience as visually not much happens except a glow.

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It could still be done in a visually satisying way, although one that requires derplander to actually be in a more "support/caretaker" role. Say you zoom in on the devastation, people are fighting, "our" side is losing. In walks the WoL, a book in hand. He raises one hand and a burst of light travels forth, engulfing all his tired allies and letting them get up once again. One enemy swings at the WoL, only to be blocked by a magical shield; Derplander lets loose Seraph to heal the wounded as he sends a burst of energy towards his foe.

For CNJ/WHM it could even be walking in to the devastation, a forest burnt to the ground. WoL gets surrounded by voidsent/undead, he raises his staff and Banishes them all with Holy, you get to see how they're literally erased from existence by the bright light. Then WoL kneels down and the Pulse of Life brings the trees and plants back to life. The WoL moves on and, as he walks, Life springs back behind him.

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Originally Posted by Edax

I didn't say the lack of the movement was the problem, I said healing doesn't make for great animation. The act of healing is not a very visually exciting experience as visually not much happens except a glow.

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I already said that 90% of a healer's actions in the game are attacking. But it's a very creatively bankrupt position to take that the act of healing cannot be visually exciting. WhiteArchemage listed a few scenarios where it could definitely work. Saving your comrades from the brink of death with a flurry of spells could be very inspirational. Heals, after all, aren't just 'a glow'. There's a gushing water-shield, fairy dust covering the field, freakin' aether wings shooting out the user's back, fields of water mending wounds while you stand in them. You could have a field of soldiers with their limbs disintegrated recovering completely from their wounds. Hell, Redo of Healer managed to make a healer with exciting combat and that's shoddy hentai garbage. I'd think one of the greatest animation studios in the entire world could make healing look exciting by comparison. But considering derplander hasn't touched any casting classes they're just going with the 'Tanking/melee classes are the manly ones'. Him starting off as an archer must've been a fluke or something.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

I already said that 90% of a healer's actions in the game are attacking. But it's a very creatively bankrupt position to take that the act of healing cannot be visually exciting. WhiteArchemage listed a few scenarios where it could definitely work. Saving your comrades from the brink of death with a flurry of spells could be very inspirational. Heals, after all, aren't just 'a glow'. There's a gushing water-shield, fairy dust covering the field, freakin' aether wings shooting out the user's back, fields of water mending wounds while you stand in them. You could have a field of soldiers with their limbs disintegrated recovering completely from their wounds. Hell, Redo of Healer managed to make a healer with exciting combat and that's shoddy hentai garbage. I'd think one of the greatest animation studios in the entire world could make healing look exciting by comparison. But considering derplander hasn't touched any casting classes they're just going with the 'Tanking/melee classes are the manly ones'. Him starting off as an archer must've been a fluke or something.

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A Black Mage can safe their comrades with a flurry of spells and more likely than not the spells will be more visually interesting and not involve blood or dismemberments. A field of soldiers with disintegrated limbs would be too graphic for FFXIV's rating. For animation, all they could really do with a T rating is show characters in pain, get hit with a glow spell, and not be hurt anymore. It's not something that can be very dynamic in animation.

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Originally Posted by Edax

A Black Mage can safe their comrades with a flurry of spells and more likely than not the spells will be more visually interesting and not involve blood or dismemberments. A field of soldiers with disintegrated limbs would be too graphic for FFXIV's rating. For animation, all they could really do with a T rating is show characters in pain, get hit with a glow spell, and not be hurt anymore. It's not something that can be very dynamic in animation.

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T-rating can show blood and more violence. Hell the Heavensward trailer has someone getting his freaking arm cut off. Besides, you don't even have to show their limbs for the cinematic. Just hide it with clever angles/armor and only show them growing back. Or you should have the WoL getting hit hard by enemy fire and healing themselves to reach someone who's been injured like a badass determined field medic. And I'm just a nobody sitting at a computer chair. Surely these professionals with dozens of years in the industry could manage.

Besides it wasn't even about the actual healing (even though it could and has worked. Just because WoW hasn't done it doesn't mean it can't be done). Just a healing class. Alphinaud is in the very same cinematic as a healing job and it's plenty exciting. So there's really nothing stopping them.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

T-rating can show blood and more violence. Hell the Heavensward trailer has someone getting his freaking arm cut off. Besides, you don't even have to show their limbs for the cinematic. Just hide it with clever angles/armor and only show them growing back. Or you should have the WoL getting hit hard by enemy fire and healing themselves to reach someone who's been injured like a badass determined field medic. And I'm just a nobody sitting at a computer chair. Surely these professionals with dozens of years in the industry could manage.

Besides it wasn't even about the actual healing (even though it could and has worked. Just because WoW hasn't done it doesn't mean it can't be done). Just a healing class. Alphinaud is in the very same cinematic as a healing job and it's plenty exciting. So there's really nothing stopping them.

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Blood and violence alone was enough to give the first Halo game an M rating and I don't even consider Halo to be all that intended for adults.

https://cdn.staticneo.com/boxshots/M...3C1mPXQGOk.jpg

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Originally Posted by Edax

Blood and violence alone was enough to give the first Halo game an M rating and I don't even consider Halo to be all that intended for adults.

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So I guess you're just gonna ignore everything else, including how they had a guy getting an arm chopped off in a cinematic yet it turned out fine for their rating? Like that's not me taking a different game and saying "It should work here". It's already been in this game. The same with them making a healer part of the cinematic and part of the action.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

So I guess you're just gonna ignore everything else, including how they had a guy getting an arm chopped off in a cinematic yet it turned out fine for their rating? Like that's not me taking a different game and saying "It should work here". It's already been in this game. The same with them making a healer part of the cinematic and part of the action.

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That arm getting chopped off wasn't graphic and it would be difficult to show a healer healing that wound without obscuring it, which sort of defeats the point of advertising the healer if you have to obscure the advertisement. If you show the healer smashing things up, that also defeats the point of advertising a healer because healers' aren't great at that sort of thing.

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

It could still be done in a visually satisying way, although one that requires derplander to actually be in a more "support/caretaker" role.

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Sure it can be done. And it is epic. But how often can you do this before it becomes boring?

https://youtu.be/39j5v8jlndM?t=233

Plus this not that epic one...

https://youtu.be/39j5v8jlndM?t=125

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Originally Posted by Edax

That arm getting chopped off wasn't graphic and it would be difficult to show a healer healing that wound without obscuring it, which sort of defeats the point of advertising the healer if you have to obscure the advertisement. If you show the healer smashing things up, that also defeats the point of advertising a healer because healers' aren't great at that sort of thing.

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I already said they can use angles to obscure it in my example. Man you're so freaking stubborn I'm just gonna give up. You win. I wasted my time on you.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

I already said they can use angles to obscure it in my example.

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Which is why I discussed the problems with obscuring it.

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Originally Posted by Edax

Which is why I discussed the problems with obscuring it.

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You obscure the gore, not the healing. Have them have a glowing aether arm for a second before it reforms their arm like regeneration would. It's just so freaking tiring to try to explain to an uncreative person how things can work. And healers are fantastic at smashing things up. About as good at it as a tank, anyway. And the WoL has played several tanks.

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Originally Posted by hydralus

But it's a very creatively bankrupt position to take

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Originally Posted by hydralus

You obscure the gore, not the healing. Have them have a glowing aether arm for a second before it reforms their arm like regeneration would. It's just so freaking tiring to try to explain to an uncreative person how things can work..

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I'm getting a little tired of your insults. You call me uncreative yet your suggestion completely forgets the fact that Raubahn lost his arm and it stayed lost.

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Originally Posted by Tint

Sure it can be done. And it is epic. But how often can you do this before it becomes boring?

https://youtu.be/39j5v8jlndM?t=233

Plus this not that epic one...

https://youtu.be/39j5v8jlndM?t=125

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As many times as you can use a sword before it becomes boring. Which is why Derplander has changed his job and weapon with every expansion (twice for SB). As I said, showcasing a healer needs the WoL to take on a more reactive than proactive stance, focusing on fixing things rather than destroying an enemy. Healer LB3s ARE visually stunning as is; and both of the examples I listed are more than using a (very impressive) shield for 5 seconds and healing someone for half of one.

I mean, if you have a bunch of soldiers dying and the WoL is walking through shooting spells at everyone, they start standing up until he's walking in front of a veritable army, THAT'S impressive.

Shouldn't this be all about, that a class neither seem feminine nor masculine? That was what I thought it's about, I hope I didn't got that wrong.
I think it shouldn't matter which gender a character/class representative have. There should be a man/woman for every classtype in the game.
What I would find interesting would be also more about LGBTQ but not like the "forced" way many series have.
The world of FFXIV is so big, but a lot of things represent the main stereotypes of women and men.
The stereotypes should be ignored.
I think its the combination of the fact that a lot of healing class representatives are female, our thoughts about stereotypes, and the games handeling of stereotypes, which forms this problem, we are talking about right now.

whats Alphinaud chopped liver?

This entire thread is bait, healers have representation for both men and women. Just let this die and be forgotten.

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

As many times as you can use a sword before it becomes boring. Which is why Derplander has changed his job and weapon with every expansion (twice for SB). As I said, showcasing a healer needs the WoL to take on a more reactive than proactive stance, focusing on fixing things rather than destroying an enemy. Healer LB3s ARE visually stunning as is; and both of the examples I listed are more than using a (very impressive) shield for 5 seconds and healing someone for half of one.

I mean, if you have a bunch of soldiers dying and the WoL is walking through shooting spells at everyone, they start standing up until he's walking in front of a veritable army, THAT'S impressive.

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To add, how often do we get entire FMVs featuring derplander? It's not like we want him to be a healer each expansion. If one and done is the caveat, then healers are still waiting for their one. While Louisoix represented quite well what healers go through in the thickness of a battle, he is not derplander whom represents the WoL. I see absolutely no reason why Derplander cannot take on the role of a healer for an expansion.

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Originally Posted by Tint

Sure it can be done. And it is epic. But how often can you do this before it becomes boring?

https://youtu.be/39j5v8jlndM?t=233

Plus this not that epic one...

https://youtu.be/39j5v8jlndM?t=125

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Bring those receipts!

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Originally Posted by WhiteArchmage

As many times as you can use a sword before it becomes boring. Which is why Derplander has changed his job and weapon with every expansion (twice for SB). As I said, showcasing a healer needs the WoL to take on a more reactive than proactive stance, focusing on fixing things rather than destroying an enemy. Healer LB3s ARE visually stunning as is; and both of the examples I listed are more than using a (very impressive) shield for 5 seconds and healing someone for half of one.

I mean, if you have a bunch of soldiers dying and the WoL is walking through shooting spells at everyone, they start standing up until he's walking in front of a veritable army, THAT'S impressive.

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The visual of this is so appealing to my imagination that it hurts. I want this now.

And while we are at it, SE please add an Non-binary mascot. Maybe for tank?

1. Urianger

2. Why do we need "representation" for a class of all things? Are you so uncomfortable with yourself you need some bizarre validation of your choices?

3. ... the role isn't exactly "masculine" in any way shape or form. Of course it's going to be perceived as a feminine role. You're trading personal "glory" for helping others. So what? Been playing healer roles for almost 20 years on MMOs. Friends and even my wife now gives me smack for it. Who cares? I prefer healing. Same way I went into the psych field despite it being 80-90% dominated by chicks. Doesn't. Bother. Me.

Ya'll need to be more comfortable in your skin. No amount of pandering to these requests are going to make you a happier person.

What I'd really like to see is for an expansion to feature one of the healing jobs as the "protagonist" in the opening cinematic. Like how derplander was Warrior for ARR, Dragoon for Heavensward, Monk for Stormblood, Dark Knight for Shadowbringers, Paladin for Endwalker. Why does it always have to be a melee class?

Need a vote kick feature to boot people like OP off the forums. MPK! TitanMen! Where are youuuuu!? Time to send the signal...

I expect that the WoL is often a DPS is because nearly 70% of the players use DPS as their main and the jobs look fancy doing their thing. DPS characters look cool on a software box and most likely sell more boxes.

As a healer main for nearly 21 years now, even I admit that a healer on the box art does not look as cool as a BLM with a fiercely glowing staff or a PLD with their shiny armor and glowing sword.

In the end, it’s all about money and the SE marketing team has done their research. Best healers can hope for is another good looking back to back shot like was shown in the Kugane artwork for Stormblood.

Just remember DPS and tanks, we healers make all of you look good. /whm_victory_pose

Man or woman doesn't really matter. Just put your pretty dress on and heal me.

The Healer role should be gender locked to men.

Just kidding! I do like male representation for healers though.

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Man or woman doesn't really matter. Just put your pretty dress on and heal me.

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FOOLSSSSS! KILL THE ONE IN THE DRESS!

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Originally Posted by Goji1639

Man or woman doesn't really matter. Just put your pretty dress on and heal me.

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Burn the heretic !

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Originally Posted by Keramory

Same way I went into the psych field despite it being 80-90% dominated by chicks. Doesn't. Bother. Me.

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Right, let me dig it up.

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Originally Posted by Keramory

Just so I understand, after this party you got so upset you looked up this persons profile to see all the jobs they leveled. Then you try and play mental arbiter over whether or not they deserve the right to play based on not being sound of mind enough because of a potential headache. Then you try and decipher some crazy hidden meaning behind "^^", to only conclude it has to be malicious trolling because you think... THEY think... you're having an existential crisis of control. Then of course you report them over the slightest of inconveniences.

And I'm to believe this silly drg is the real problem with this games community?

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I actually pity your patients if you have any.
Being wrong with confidence is the field you went into. Psychologists are experts, not some clowns that diagnose people over the internet at game forums.

With that reply, you showed me that you are actually really bad at figuring people out. The way you filled in the pieces of missing information was poor and most probably was affected too much by your own (past) decision making.

I hope you are still learning the basics.

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Originally Posted by Roeshel

Right, let me dig it up.



I actually pity your patients if you have any.
Being wrong with confidence is the field you went into. Psychologists are experts, not some clowns that diagnose people over the internet at game forums.

With that reply, you showed me that you are actually really bad at figuring people out. The way you filled in the pieces of missing information was poor and most probably was affected too much by your own (past) decision making.

I hope you are still learning the basics.

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Wow, that's a lot of inferring for someone claiming someone else is inferring. Wasn't aware anything I said in an exaggerated reply to poor behavior was anything close to a diagnosis in the comment I made in that another thread, entirely unrelated to this topic. I'm also pretty sure you don't need much experience in any field to realize someone stalking a person's post activities and bringing up unrelated arguments from other threads... probably isn't the most emotionally stable person out there. But go on and explain to me how a normal person is of sound piece of mind while simultaneously dragging up some bizarre grudge from an MMO forum. Finally I'm a little confused what your point even is, outside of just blatant insult and stalking. I could be the single worst human being in the field, the field is still overwhelmingly filled with a particular sex. That was the only point in relation to this topic. I'm feeling an increased amount of pity for that dragoon you harassed now.

Going back to the actual topic, one thing I didn't mention. Despite loving healing even though it isn't exactly the most masculine thing in the world, I would love more options outside of our selection of robes that isn't strictly glamor gear.

I don't have time for stalking. Initially, when I read your post yesterday I even liked it but today I recalled that Keramory was that guy with the crazy assumptions about me on my first thread. I went back to check and confirm if it is the same person and it was.

The statement "I went into the psych field" really tempted me into going offtopic and bringing up your previous exaggerated reply. I just couldn't let this moment pass.

At least now it is established that you are prone to exaggeration when you are attacking someone on a personal level. So we all learned something meaningful from this short offtopic discussion.

We do have a male healer. Alphinaud is a healy scholar and will be going Sage in EW.