Enough with 'Hunt trains'

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Originally Posted by savageink

Dude, if I had been on Diabolos and was in the proper area when you shouted, I would have showed up.

Trains are server cancer.

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There you go, OP. There are those that will support you if you look hard enough. No need for you to try and force others to accommodate your play style.

Had to watch an odin time out because only 4 people showed up in the time limit even though shouts happened and a call on discords. Apparently I should have harassed people on the streets into coming or something, wasnt trying hard enough.

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Originally Posted by Yllania

Had to watch an odin time out because only 4 people showed up in the time limit even though shouts happened and a call on discords. Apparently I should have harassed people on the streets into coming or something, wasnt trying hard enough.

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I love doing Odin. It's pure chaos.

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Originally Posted by savageink

I love doing Odin. It's pure chaos.

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I just want to experience it once at least lmao, either Im not there when odin spawns or no one else comes the like 2 times I managed to catch him. We tried it with the 4 we had but there was just no way.

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Originally Posted by Yllania

I just want to experience it once at least lmao, either Im not there when odin spawns or no one else comes the like 2 times I managed to catch him. We tried it with the 4 we had but there was just no way.

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You could have 50 people and your healers would be crawling through the bodies trying to do raises to get it done before the last tick on the clock. I'm so happy that it's synced. It really keeps the experience alive even after all this time.

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Originally Posted by Yllania

I just want to experience it once at least lmao, either Im not there when odin spawns or no one else comes the like 2 times I managed to catch him. We tried it with the 4 we had but there was just no way.

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If your server doesn't have an active group of players to do these FATEs then hard luck. People have gotten their rewards from these FATEs long ago so their incentive is gone for it. And with 4 only, that's a fun tale to tell lol.

I mean the thing with hunts in general is that there's nothing stopping you from downing the hunts (that you can solo or do with a friend). Hunt trains are certainly nice and I enjoy joining them myself, but sometimes I'm too lazy to wait for the train or try to start one up and so I just solo the hunt and scurry on my way. From what I've seen, especially with older hunters, most people will just show up from the map if there's a hunt up when you make the call.

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Originally Posted by Alucard135

If your server doesn't have an active group of players to do these FATEs then hard luck. People have gotten their rewards from these FATEs long ago so their incentive is gone for it. And with 4 only, that's a fun tale to tell lol.

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Well, it should start getting easier soon, as people come in for the xpack and all the new alts start getting levelled up after the server reorg

Saw someone kill A rank that ones from train scouted and when found out who was there was huge fight and think GM had to get involved before it was over. Trains make the hunts way easier. Just don't get mad if most of server blacklists you from it and kicks you from every hunt ls.

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Originally Posted by hynaku

Saw someone kill A rank that ones from train scouted and when found out who was there was huge fight and think GM had to get involved before it was over. Trains make the hunts way easier. Just don't get mad if most of server blacklists you from it and kicks you from every hunt ls.

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Or you could just kill the thing and leave and let them complain to the zone. They can't kick anybody from a hunt. If you hit it you get rewards whether the train is doing most of the work or not.

Come to Balmung, ppl dont wait for anything here lol. Except when its an A rank in Stormblood areas, then they start asking for help xD.

i only get 3-4 seals a kill so i dont bother

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Originally Posted by savageink

Or you could just kill the thing and leave and let them complain to the zone. They can't kick anybody from a hunt. If you hit it you get rewards whether the train is doing most of the work or not.

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You'd only get the minimum reward if you couldn't get a party when the entire train is downing the hunt. But in the end, everyone should play the way they like. No one can force others to follow the train and no one can force the train to stop.

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Originally Posted by Alucard135

You'd only get the minimum reward if you couldn't get a party when the entire train is downing the hunt. But in the end, everyone should play the way they like. No one can force others to follow the train and no one can force the train to stop.

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if you are mount hunting, a kill is a kill.

My advice to you is to step up and take the initiative to join hunt linkshells. They may not be at your beck and call all the time. But with teamwork, perseverance, and willingness to communicate, you shall be rewarded for your hunts more often.

Hunt trains may or may not get to the targets on time. You might not always have the allies ready at the moment you find a hunt. But a hunt linkshell or two might alleviate your issues. Just be sure to communicate (and probably update the Ariyala and/or other hunt sites when you do beat an A/S).

I have done all of the above. I managed to get at least the "Mark of the [A rank/S rank]" achievement for all of the areas. In addition, I have earned extra hunt seals and end game tomes to help buy what I want going forward in the game.

Hunting is like social norms, there are no laws for them, so you either abide by the social norms or you dont.

You may not like how the community does things,they might encourage you to do things their way, but its your choice. Nothing is stopping you from killing any hunt mob by yourself or with your fc grp/friends.

My opinion on the mater is, the way the hunting community is doing things (linkshells/websites to track,waiting for ppl "a while") is pretty great. Trains, if i can and want to participate are awesome too, since they are very efficient.

Wait, so people are arranging hunting trains for not only single servers but now with world visit across entire data centers and setting times for when people are "allowed" to hit a certain server? Yeah, that's a bunch of crap. If a single server wants to work out a schedule, that's one thing. But people on a completely different server shouldn't get to dictate when people on another server do Hunts.

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Originally Posted by TaleraRistain

Wait, so people are arranging hunting trains for not only single servers but now with world visit across entire data centers and setting times for when people are "allowed" to hit a certain server? Yeah, that's a bunch of crap. If a single server wants to work out a schedule, that's one thing. But people on a completely different server shouldn't get to dictate when people on another server do Hunts.

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That's not what's happening. Even if it was, they can't enforce anything on other servers nor can they prevent people from doing hunts.

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Originally Posted by Doozer

I called out an A rank in Azim Steppe and got told to leave it alone so the Hunt Train could come get it, and that wanting to do it without them "wasn't nice". So I'm supposed to wait for a mob of people to roll up in an hour just to get more than one other person to do it? And most of them are just from other worlds anyway? How is this fair to regular players.

Yes I know I can just do it anyway, and I will, but the entitlement of this mob is really stupid.

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You're welcome to do it on your own if you want. Sum is the easiest to solo of the SB (assuming it was Sum you found and not Giri).

On the other hand, you could join with the hunt community train and kill all 12 in less time than it would take you to kill that single Rank A by yourself. A full train takes 18-23 minutes to complete. One of our trains ran into someone trying to solo Sum a couple of weeks ago - he told us he had already been at it 20 minutes and only had Sum down to about 40%.

It's up to you. Those who asked you to wait are acting no more entitled than you are. They at least are willing to share with others in the community. You just care about yourself.

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Originally Posted by Alucard135

That's not what's happening. Even if it was, they can't enforce anything on other servers nor can they prevent people from doing hunts.

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We've actually run into a few players trying to dictate what trains can be run when. Most of us laugh them off. If the mobs are up, the train needs to be running regardless of what's happening on other servers. I've scouted and conducted trains when other conductors were going to insist on waiting for a train on another world to be finished first (even though in one case said train hadn't even been started yet). The faster the trains get run, the more trains there are overall and the more players that get included. There's zero reason to wait on another world. They're always welcome to hop over and join us for what we have left once their train has finished.

If worlds try to chain trains too much, SE might kill them altogether because they're too lucrative a source of currencies. It's something for the hunt community to keep in mind.

If we aren't careful they may pull a Anemos--> Pagos and make spawning the hunts absurdly ridiculous going forward or/and maybe buff/change current ones..

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Originally Posted by disturbedcobra

If we aren't careful they may pull a Anemos--> Pagos and make spawning the hunts absurdly ridiculous going forward or/and maybe buff/change current ones..

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How about they just make Hunts into "endgame" Levequests instead? Log on, pick up a Levequest, go kill it with your friends, get a drop that lets you pick up the Levequest for a higher tier Hunt, and so on. None of this absurd waiting around or scouting... Hunts have always been one of the most insipid pieces of content in this game, there's never anything interesting or fun about a zerg rush, the whole system needs a rework IMHO...

As someone who is a member of multiple hunt LS and who has gone with the train for years now... it's a good thing! The scouters find each and every A rank several times per day and holler to as many people as possible, then ask them to just hold their shorts for 5 minutes while people gather/form parties before starting. More people get credit for more hunts. That isn't a bad thing...
It brings fellow hunters together for sum fun :)

Sharing hunts should be encouraged not discouraged. It's hard to get everyone to do that but it's better than the early pull scene that was so prevalent on my server for quite some time.

The player base will find the most efficient method of farming something. Hunt trains are the most efficient method. Sometimes this method requires you to hop aboard certain linkshells or discords. With cross world hunts people have started using 3rd party tools even cause it’s so much to keep track off.

I liken it to the Baldesian Arsenal really, players found discord as the most efficient way of entering the dungeon, if you didn’t have discord you got pushed out and hated on if you weren’t apart of it. And the response is always the same “just join us, don’t mess with us”

Content should not be regulated by a large group of players that to actually participate in that content you have to join said group. If not in said group you will inevitably run across them and they will shame you into doing it their way. Ultimately these groups become what people might call “elitist” you do it *our* way the *best* way or gtfo.

I’m not saying all this is terrible, and it can work and it generally does, it just will no matter what leave some people outside and be pushed out of being able to do content, which I think is overall bad for game design.

I think the cross world system really messed up hunts. Hunts were obviously not designed for cross world play and therefore obviously needs some changes. The trains won’t stop till they redesign hunts or just simply remove the ability to participate in cross world hunts which will likely not happen cause that goes against key design choices of the cross world system.

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Originally Posted by disturbedcobra

If we aren't careful they may pull a Anemos--> Pagos and make spawning the hunts absurdly ridiculous going forward or/and maybe buff/change current ones..

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You do realize that Pagos was already complete before they can take any feedback from Anemos, right? So there wasn't a hidden revenge plan against the Anemos train.

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Originally Posted by Nalien

How about they just make Hunts into "endgame" Levequests instead? Log on, pick up a Levequest, go kill it with your friends, get a drop that lets you pick up the Levequest for a higher tier Hunt, and so on. None of this absurd waiting around or scouting... Hunts have always been one of the most insipid pieces of content in this game, there's never anything interesting or fun about a zerg rush, the whole system needs a rework IMHO...

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The issue is, that's not how they want hunts. Take a look at boss fates. They have timers, weather change, level sync, can't be taken down by a single full party and no player enforced spawning condition. Those are made to be a server kill. But hunts don't have any of that, since they want them to be a first come first serve thing, but with the ability that players might cooperate with each other if they wanted. Even when Yoshi P was asked about changes to hunts after world visit he said player would make up their rules to regulate that.

I love trains. It was my favourite thing to do on Mateus until recently. Now that I no longer need mythic logs to buy Scaevan gear upgrades, I'm taking a break, but I'm hoping to get back to hunting once the community figures out the Shadowbringers marks.

The hunt community is not your enemy. It's, at least on Crystal, highly organised, efficient, friendly and inclusive. All they ask is that you place the collective benefit over your own ego.

I know a couple of people who fly around the map all day just scouting, reporting and organising trains. Why do you think that is? I'm not entirely sure myself but I think they just... enjoy the hunt and want to share it with as many people as possible? Even if most of those people will never show their appreciation, or even realise how much work goes into setting up trains.
With all their intel access, experience and know-how, those same handful of hunt leaders could very easily be monopolising hunt marks and denying them to 99% of the players all day every day. But instead, they're doing the exact opposite - they're making hunts incredibly accessible and convenient to hundreds of people across many servers and timezones. I really cannot imagine any good reason why someone would want to oppose and try to disrupt something so positive and constructive that the community has built for itself.

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Originally Posted by Bonbori

I know a couple of people who fly around the map all day just scouting, reporting and organising trains. Why do you think that is? I'm not entirely sure myself but I think they just... enjoy the hunt and want to share it with as many people as possible?

With all their intel access, experience and know-how, those same handful of hunt leaders could very easily be monopolising hunt marks and denying them to 99% of the players all day every day. But instead, they're doing the exact opposite - they're making hunts incredibly accessible and convenient to hundreds of people across many servers and timezones.

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As one of those people this sums it up. Couldn't have said it better myself. We even call out ARR and SB hunts - which we could easy solo.

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Originally Posted by Bonbori

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This right here is the reason I love the trains. I'm in a LS that does most of the scouting (For A ranks anyways) on the server (Both trains and single callouts for at least HW). Its true that we could monopolize it for one LS and just kill it for our people, but that isn't fun or the right thing to do. I like going out and scouting the hunts, and I just want to make sure they get killed and reported so others can have access to them. The people I see arguing against this type of thing often start with very selfish arguments, "First come, first serve," "Its right there and I found it so I can kill it." I just don't get that. Everyone gets more in this case if its shared, and less if its not.

Its like people arguing for a worse way of doing things.

I'm curious, for those of you that enjoy the current system;

Would you be against something like a Levequest version of hunts being added on top of what we currently have? Perhaps even with what we already have gaining additional rewards in the form of key items to exchange for those "Hunt Leves"?

Honestly, all I want is a system where I pick up a Levequest for a B Rank, it randomizes the locations across the entire zone, I get objectives that simulate an actual hunt a bit better than "Fly around checking the spawn locations", and I kill the B Rank. Drops a key item that I exchange for an A Rank Levequest, and so on. I'd be much more engaged with a system like that, but I'm also not incline to outright remove what we currently have if people actually enjoy that. I think both can coexist though, and perhaps even take some pressure off the existing train to make it a tad more enjoyable.

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Originally Posted by Maneesha

Hunting is like social norms, there are no laws for them, so you either abide by the social norms or you dont.

You may not like how the community does things,they might encourage you to do things their way, but its your choice. Nothing is stopping you from killing any hunt mob by yourself or with your fc grp/friends.

My opinion on the mater is, the way the hunting community is doing things (linkshells/websites to track,waiting for ppl "a while") is pretty great. Trains, if i can and want to participate are awesome too, since they are very efficient.

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Honestly, I swear people forget this is an mmo. It's built on community, social aspects and despite all the solo content, is still a multiplayer effort. It's not the game's fault hunt LS's were built, it's a byrpduct of the community and hundreds of people can effectively work together for a common goal.

If I'm in a smaller party I'll switch to tank and spam enmity skill for full credit. Not like my damage can compare against the 20 bards hitting the mark at the same time. So really, despite some faults the individual may take, it's a benefit to the larger community and in an mmo, that kinda matters.

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Originally Posted by Doozer

I called out an A rank in Azim Steppe and got told to leave it alone so the Hunt Train could come get it,

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A couple questions:

1. How do you know it's an A/B/whatever rank? I don't see any labels or special markers on them. The only way I can tell if they're special is if I try to attack one and see my health dropping rapidly.

2. If the whole group teleports, and I accept it, do I have to pay for the teleport? (I still won't pay more than 300g for a TP.)

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

A couple questions:

1. How do you know it's an A/B/whatever rank? I don't see any labels or special markers on them. The only way I can tell if they're special is if I try to attack one and see my health dropping rapidly.

2. If the whole group teleports, and I accept it, do I have to pay for the teleport? (I still won't pay more than 300g for a TP.)

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B ranks are non aggressive max level mobs per expansion and are unique to the zone.
A ranks are the same thing but are aggressive and a bit larger in size.
S ranks are aggressive, very large in size and have infinite draw distance (meaning you can see them from any place in the map if there are no obstacles).

As for teleportation, you don't pay if someone else teleported and you accepted.

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Originally Posted by SamSmoot

A couple questions:

1. How do you know it's an A/B/whatever rank? I don't see any labels or special markers on them. The only way I can tell if they're special is if I try to attack one and see my health dropping rapidly.

2. If the whole group teleports, and I accept it, do I have to pay for the teleport? (I still won't pay more than 300g for a TP.)

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B-ranks are non-aggressive (with a blue marker next to their name). A and S ranks are both aggressive.

The primary way to learn them in-game is to talk to the hunter-scholars in each area, who give a description of each of the marks - they're harder to spot in HW/SB zones though, because they just have normal NPC names instead of being clearly labeled.

And no, I don't think you have to pay for the teleport when you're in a group. (But you do get to a point where it's not worth worrying about teleport fees. At least consider revising your limit to 350g which is the cost of teleporting cross-continent to a favourite location, with the FC teleport buff active. 500g without the buff.)

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Originally Posted by Barraind

"i tried to cooperate with people by telling all these guys they should kill it with me and they said 'nah brah, we're waiting until we can zerg 12 of them dead in the amount of time it would take us to kill one' so thats the worst thing ever and i hate people who want to do things efficiently"


cooooooool story

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Some times its not about effeciency, but about adventure and entertainment. Not saying never be effecient, but dont be surprised some rare people want an actual fight.

i will say, people always seem to think the other side is the crazy/entitled/dumb ones, really its usually just a different perspective.

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Originally Posted by Physic

Some times its not about effeciency, but about adventure and entertainment. Not saying never be effecient, but dont be surprised some rare people want an actual fight.

i will say, people always seem to think the other side is the crazy/entitled/dumb ones, really its usually just a different perspective.

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You're right about that. I've solo'ed HW A ranks for the fun of it when SB was out (just dropped them to 5% HP and reset them so that I can relay to others about it). But, each side can be considered crazy/entitled/dumb if they think they have a right to force the opposite side to their will. Other than that, each to their own.

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Originally Posted by Alucard135

B ranks are non aggressive max level mobs per expansion and are unique to the zone.
A ranks are the same thing but are aggressive and a bit larger in size.
S ranks are aggressive, very large in size and have infinite draw distance (meaning you can see them from any place in the map if there are no obstacles).

As for teleportation, you don't pay if someone else teleported and you accepted.

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Thank you.

I personally don't mind the trains, you could always ask where the train is currently and join them? Getting all the monsters plus the one you spotted. Would be a lot more in a quicker time I imagine?

I wish there was something like a fate train, that did the special fates but that would probably be difficult to do.

Still going to wish though. You cant kill my hopes and dreams

I'll leave my two cents here.

First, I don't like how you treated those who were in hunt LS to accommodate your time just because you want to kill it fast. Even if you do attack and tried to kill it solo, hats off, I can't even fight without full party.
Second, hunt LS help notifying people who needs to clear certain mobs for seals. Even I will notify 2 LS related to hunts to clear ARR hunt ranks because I know some may need the seal even one time I had to wait for 2 hours Eorzea Time.
Third, no one stops you from killing the hunt, but they won't bother to let you join their group if they know you tried to ruin the train in the first place.

Well don't call it out if you aren't interested in waiting on people.


Calling it out and then immediately killing it is just trolling and wasting a lot of people's time. Call it out and wait, or don't and kill.