The current formula of gear progression NEED CHANGE

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

How many copies did xi sell, vs how many still play? Probably around the same %.

You keep trying to use that number to show something it doesnt mean.

Did you know that like, only 60% of players earn the first trophy in most games on PSN? That means that 40% of people who buy nearly every game never play it to the first trophy, which is usually within 15 minutes.

Also, if you are so tired of this game, why do you have 3 different accounts that you are subbed on?

---

How'd you know they have so many accounts? :O

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Raldo

And of course, my biggest hangup with it is that FFXIV doesn't allow you to swap gear mid-fight (though admittedly they could change that if they really wanted to). In FFXI at least, that was a critical aspect.

---

swapping gear mid-fight can die off, imo. other than huge amounts of RNG hoping to get the gear for your build, this is major reason I don't care for horizontal progression anymore.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dav2017

After 3.5months, you know your Eureka weapon will be junk again, you can simply get a better weapon from market board.

Spent months just for a GLAMOUR? Why bother doing it then? What's the point of playing this game?
Pls give us a reason to do it!

Or give us a better glamour system:
You can not only change the appearance of a weapon, you can also add special effect to it,
for example :Add 5% Regen potency, or shorten 0.5sec Raise cast time, or heal 3000HP when casting Esuna, by using a old relic glamour

---

For fun I think.
The glam is the end game getting old.
Sadly we only get it more simple .

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Yeul

Err, dunno where u take that info, but FFXIV number are actually increasing over the last few months. A lot of players coming from other games, and most of FFXIV players are still playing even in the end of STORMBLOOD

---

Where is anyone getting any of their numbers at this point? SE has been real hush-hush with all of this.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

How many copies did xi sell, vs how many still play? Probably around the same %.

You keep trying to use that number to show something it doesnt mean.

Did you know that like, only 60% of players earn the first trophy in most games on PSN? That means that 40% of people who buy nearly every game never play it to the first trophy, which is usually within 15 minutes.

Also, if you are so tired of this game, why do you have 3 different accounts that you are subbed on?

---

https://jp.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../blog/4034425/

Currently(10/2/2019), XIV has 597,100 active players
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...4/e48dee97.png


In 1/1/2019, the number is
608,109
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...4bba536c-s.png


1/27/2018: 826,126
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...f/8f389427.png


3/27/2017： 560,003
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...1/919db587.jpg


FFXI had 500k subs during its prime time

Even WOW ,has more interesting gear stats

XIV is just using the laziest design. it's the most uninspired design I've seen in a mmo,

Why?? Because the developers have no MMO design experience??(Yoshi mentioned it before)
oh..:(

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dav2017

Even WOW ,has more interesting gear stats

XIV is just using the laziest design. it's the most uninspired design I've seen in a mmo

---

SE isnt changing its gear progression 5 years into its life. If you want a different system you're going to have to play another game. But remember the grass is always greener on the other side. Wow isnt perfect either and those players want our system.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Insertcoins

SE isnt changing its gear progression 5 years into its life. If you want a different system you're going to have to play another game. But remember the grass is always greener on the other side. Wow isnt perfect either and those players want our system.

---

In real world， if a guy doesn't try to improve himself, he picks the most safe & comfortable route, because he is lazy.
what will happen? He will be eliminated.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Insertcoins

How'd you know they have so many accounts? :O

---

Because they used another one a few months ago, similar name same argument. They also stated they didn't post using their main accou t cuz they were afraid to get banned from the game.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dav2017

https://jp.finalfantasyxiv.com/lodes.../blog/4034425/

Currently(10/2/2019), XIV has 597,100 active players
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...4/e48dee97.png


In 1/1/2019, the number is
608,109
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...4bba536c-s.png


1/27/2018: 826,126
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...f/8f389427.png


3/27/2017： 560,003
http://livedoor.blogimg.jp/luckybanc...1/919db587.jpg


FFXI had 500k subs during its prime time

---

That doesn't answer my question tho, how many copies of XI were sold VS how many still play? I bet it's retention rate isn't over 95%.

Sadly, this will never happen. This game has little to depth and complexity that anything outside the normal realms of progression just simply wouldn't work without some overhaul. And after 5 years, I doubt anything will change. Patches come way to frequently for how long it actually takes people to acquire gear (unless you do Savage, but even then it's RNG to get your drops outside of the weekly book), and the content itself just isn't interesting enough to warrant longer patch cycles. And whenever they broke the mold to try and mix things up, they failed heavily (See Diadem and, while debatable, Eureka). At this point, I don't feel like I'm working towards anything, but just doing a checklist before I log off for the day/week.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dav2017

In real world， if a guy doesn't try to improve himself, he picks the most safe & comfortable route, because he is lazy.
what will happen? He will be eliminated.

---

Also in the real world if they just up and change everything for no reason when they have been doing one thing for over 5 years people complain and they lose sales like wow is losing sales. You can't just up and change on a drop of a dime and not upset the balance you built for over 5 years. Companies just dont work that way.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

Because they used another one a few months ago, similar name same argument. They also stated they didn't post using their main accou t cuz they were afraid to get banned from the game.

---

Ooooh. Good eye then. I dont know why they expect a company to all of a sudden change what they been doing for over 5 years but yeah. No company I ever heard of that is successful does that.

I don't know what people expect when they make this complaint? Do you want your gear to be BiS forever? There will be nothing to do a lot faster.

I'm fine with the way gear progression works.

If it's not broke don't fix it.

I find gear/reward structure itself boring, I don't bother doing extremes or Savage because the rewards aren't worth my time to waste for me too keep repeating it for others. I mostly do story and gear ilvl slowly this game make it easy too log out and play other games until a couple patches or more. /Shrugs

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odintius

I find gear/reward structure itself boring, I don't bother doing extremes or Savage because the rewards aren't worth my time to waste for me too keep repeating it for others. I mostly do story and gear ilvl slowly this game make it easy too log out and play other games until a couple patches or more. /Shrugs

---

People from wow say the same thing about their gear. Or rather the RNG is so insane they be happy if they get anything worth wild. Meanwhile they keep asking for what we have in xiv now. There's no better way to do it in this game with the way it's been done for 5 years. Heck we got the other way to get gear but people hate it. Wanna know what that is? Euraka

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Insertcoins

People from wow say the same thing about their gear. Or rather the RNG is so insane they be happy if they get anything worth wild. Meanwhile they keep asking for what we have in xiv now. There's no better way to do it in this game with the way it's been done for 5 years. Heck we got the other way to get gear but people hate it. Wanna know what that is? Euraka

---

And that why I go play other games that do, they can't do it because for this game is pure vertical progression which limits what type of rewards you can add without breaking the rest of the content of the game hence why erukea is what it is a glamour at the end of a mindless grind. /Shrugs

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by odintius

And that why I go play other games that do, they can't do it because for this game is pure vertical progression which limits what type of rewards you can add without breaking the rest of the content of the game hence why erukea is what it is a glamour at the end of a mindless grind. /Shrugs

---

That's the best you can do sadly if you want different from what's here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Reynhart

~snip~

---

The problem is these are largely suggestions for mechanics that simply do not exist in XIV, or, once existed but were then discarded. Players have asked for adding effects to gear for a while now until it was addressed at a FanFest Q&A, saying it was purposely discarded and they had no plans to return to that model.

However, with instances like Eureka, players might get that diversity that they crave and not effect the main game.

As it is, there's no reason to add these things because of features, like jobs, covering bases that you had to go out and farm in older games. Instead of farming fire resistance gear for some encounter, grab a Nocturnal Sect Astrologian or Scholar and have them provide shields. Instead of simply resistance, it can be viewed as fire immunity, provided the shield is strong enough. Adding a regen to gear doesn't help you if the healer still has to stop and apply heals because that damage you took was from a raid-wide ability; it'd probably find itself most useful in the open world. Then you have chocobos and the high recovery ticks to offset that.

Again, the examples being given by you are around features not present in XIV. Gear swapping is not a thing in XIV while in combat. When accuracy was still a stat, data collectors would probably see they missed in the fight and changed their accuracy until they no longer missed. For all we know, those mobs did have differing accuracy requirements. It didn't mean anything in the end because of the lack of ability to swap gear.

Yes, main stats and weapon damage are tied to ilevel. However, that does not mean it is always better. Otherwise, again, you'd not get things like crafted gear that is BiS. While it is not so much as an issue now because of parry no longer existing, we also saw things like the upgraded Shire DRK weapon being BiS over the Alexander weapon, despite having superior WPD, main stat and ilevel. Still, other jobs, like BRD, have to contend with this: if you cannot upgrade the Scaevan weapon, Suzaku's bow is superior despite having 1 WPD, 8 main stat and 5 ilevels less than the Scaevan. You cannot look at ilevel, WPD and main stats in a vacuum; paper and application do not always agree.

You'd be surprised what people will do for glamour and achievements. For a majority of people, no, there might not be a reason to go back and do savage raids 6 months after it launched. For some persons, there's no reason to do side quests. Hell, I know people that don't read the story and literally just mash through it. Does that mean main story quests and side quests shouldn't be a thing simply because people skip it? No, but it's something the XIV team have designed the game around, story, and people do flock to this game for the story. Which, again, I know people that do this; they literally play expansion at launch and not again until the next expansion. To them, this is a game with episodic story that comes out every 2 years. They come to the game for what it offers, not how they want it to be. They play other games that offer them systems they want or enjoy that XIV doesn't offer.

Gear obsoletion will always be a thing, even in horizontal progression unless you give it a completely unique trait. Even then, if stats get higher, and there is no other option for this unique trait or stat, it will still get to the point where a combination of things are better or the unique stat is not useful. Example: a level 1 ring with no stats but gives auto-raise. Unlimited uses in an encounter. Sounds great, right? Well, no. It might be useful in progression and progression only. You still suffer Weakness and Brink of Death and a player that doesn't die can pick up a ring that gives them better attack power (because lacking 450+ total stat is nothing to sneeze at). You also can't swap the item out [at this current time] during combat.

Yes, right now you need to re-farm your gear after a set amount of time. In the games you mention, you spend months getting gear. You might get lucky and it takes a few weeks, or you're unlucky and it takes a year or more. That's the thing about RNG. XIV's model is friendly to people with time constraints. The horizontal model is not; that favors luck and time investment.

We also had a time when accessories weren't restricted to jobs. We had issues where players would have accessories, sometimes even armor, with no combat stats and it was notice-able. It was a problem. It also doesn't touch on, then, tweaking fights to take into consideration that [some] players may opt for even more damage while others stick with the intended accessories. The result of that was the Final Coil of Bahamut's clear time because the creator of the encounters forgot to factor in crafted gear and the kind of stats we could obtain. At the time, it had a lot of backlash and even mockery of raids. Then XIV swung hard to the opposite direction and dubbed it Gordias Savage. That's a whole other story, though, but it is nonetheless still a lesson in game balance and designing content around what you want to give players.

Also, XI was a numbered entry to the Final Fantasy series. It very much did need to keep you engaged for hundreds of days, as does any MMO. For the large part, Final Fantasy series are single player experiences. They can have [other] ways of artificially inflating play-time or replay value.

Still, there have been things SE has tried and either moved away from because of observing competitors, tried in the past, overlooked in their testing, or simply didn't want. We can debate opinions, but I can't find anything you've offered that has yet to change my mind because I've already experienced these systems in other games. There's nothing I could say that could change your mind, not that I'm trying to, because you've experienced it in this game and find it lacking. I seriously doubt XIV is going to completely up-heave their current gearing system, and if they choose to, they'll let us know. We've known the combat system is being reworked for months, if not at year, by now.

Do not misunderstand. I don't hate horizontal gear progression when it is done right and has been fine-tuned. MMOs are severely lacking on both fronts when it comes to horizontal gear progression and for the larger crowd that XIV has already attracted, I don't think it'd work in their favor. One of my favorite game series is nothing but what you've been proposing and that series is called Monster Hunter.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Dav2017

Even WOW ,has more interesting gear stats

XIV is just using the laziest design. it's the most uninspired design I've seen in a mmo,

Why?? Because the developers have no MMO design experience??(Yoshi mentioned it before)
oh..:(

---

What's interesting about WoW gear stats?

Are you talking about azerite traits that force you to pick and choose traits by equipping gears instead of having traits be part of the class system so you can permanently learn them instead of losing those traits as soon as you unequip the gear even though you've already had to accumulate azerite powers to level up your heart of azeroth neck gear in order to unlock those traits in the first place?

Or are you talking about legion artifact traits that...well...no longer exist now that legion is no longer the current expansion?

No, thanks, I'll take FFXIV's "uninspired design" over either of those silliness.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by linay

What's interesting about WoW gear stats?

Are you talking about azerite traits that force you to pick and choose traits by equipping gears instead of having traits be part of the class system so you can permanently learn them instead of losing those traits as soon as you unequip the gear even though you've already had to accumulate azerite powers to level up your heart of azeroth neck gear in order to unlock those traits in the first place?

Or are you talking about legion artifact traits that...well...no longer exist now that legion is no longer the current expansion?

No, thanks, I'll take FFXIV's "uninspired design" over either of those silliness.

---

My favorite thing about this poster is that they bag on Yoshi-P for his "uninspired mmo" because he has no experience, and yet they say legacy 1.23b was the best version of the game... Which was developed under Yoshi-P as producer /director.

They are a hypocrite lol.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Baalfrog

This is a themepark mmo, thats how themepark mmos operate, vertical progression, bigger ilevels, bigger HP pools, bigger everything. If you want something that has horizontal progression instead, you need to go and find another game.

---

Are you like that clueless? just because its a themepark mmo with vertical progression doesnt mean the gearing process is not too fast or that gear is handed out too easy. You could still change those parameters and it would still be a themepark mmo with ilvls. Dont need 200 IQ to understand that.

I disagree with the OPs ideas however. I just think gears is to easy to come by and too fast replaced

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaitoo

Are you like that clueless? just because its a themepark mmo with vertical progression doesnt mean the gearing process is not too fast or that gear is handed out too easy. You could still change those parameters and it would still be a themepark mmo with ilvls. Dont need 200 IQ to understand that.

I disagree with the OPs ideas however. I just think gears is to easy to come by and too fast replaced

---

6 Months is too fast for you?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Razard

6 Months is too fast for you?

---

So you either suggest that the average gear you have last for 6 months, which is factually untrue.
Or rather, i am assuming you trying to build a strawman of a point that i didnt make. As in, the gear you get from the last raid tier until the next expansion last you 6 months by being BiS. Which is redundant anyway because if there is no new content there is no gear cycle.
Try again

Ya know what I hear when people in this game want their gear to last longer, I hear this: Yay for 1 year Content Droughts! I think the current model is good enough at doing what it does. Sure I'm not a savage, extreme, ultimate player, but for what I do the pace is good enough.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaitoo

Are you like that clueless? just because its a themepark mmo with vertical progression doesnt mean the gearing process is not too fast or that gear is handed out too easy. You could still change those parameters and it would still be a themepark mmo with ilvls. Dont need 200 IQ to understand that.

I disagree with the OPs ideas however. I just think gears is to easy to come by and too fast replaced

---

Why do you think gear is replaced too fast? Are you talking about leveling gears or max level gears? Leveling gears are meant to help you level so it's by design that they are replaceable as soon as you do more difficult content. After reaching max level, there are only 3 raid tiers in a two-year expansion, so you really only replace your gears twice over the course of an expansion.

The reason why gears are easy to come by is because different people want to do different things and may not want to do all of them, but they all need the gears to progress through MSQ at the very least. You also have different people that come in at different raid tiers in the expansion, so catch up mechanic is useful to gear your new character.

Finally, the point of gears is to help you do content. Gear itself is not the content, so they are meant to be seen as tools that you replace to better suit the content that you are doing.

Gear in and of itself is useless.
It is used as a soft nerf to the content. All the current content can be beaten day one in the gear from the last tier - there aren't currently any encounters that are tuned over and above the standard gear level.
Obviously only the top % of players will do it in the first lockout - but gradually the rest of us will catch up as our stats gradually increase. It internally nerfs the content by gradually inflating our stats.

The thing I dislike about it is there's no real excitement for any gear dropping - no huge jumps in power. But that's the pay-off for keeping RNG at a minimum. Grass is always greener.

All what i am asking for is to give us an option to obtain bis gear by doing something else than savage raiding.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by linay

Why do you think gear is replaced too fast? Are you talking about leveling gears or max level gears? Leveling gears are meant to help you level so it's by design that they are replaceable as soon as you do more difficult content. After reaching max level, there are only 3 raid tiers in a two-year expansion, so you really only replace your gears twice over the course of an expansion.

The reason why gears are easy to come by is because different people want to do different things and may not want to do all of them, but they all need the gears to progress through MSQ at the very least. You also have different people that come in at different raid tiers in the expansion, so catch up mechanic is useful to gear your new character.

Finally, the point of gears is to help you do content. Gear itself is not the content, so they are meant to be seen as tools that you replace to better suit the content that you are doing.

---

Such an arbitrary and forced point.
If gear is no content and not important at all, why not just auto sync to everything and getting all the necessary stats through leveling? Why is there gear if its neither content nor should be something we should care?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nedkel

All what i am asking for is to give us an option to obtain bis gear by doing something else than savage raiding.

---

You technically can already do that. Some savage gear is straight up junk, while some 24 man gear is BiS. Heck, Tank accessories BiS are crafted gear if I'm not mistaken.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TitaniaZero

Ya know what I hear when people in this game want their gear to last longer, I hear this: Yay for 1 year Content Droughts! I think the current model is good enough at doing what it does. Sure I'm not a savage, extreme, ultimate player, but for what I do the pace is good enough.

---

Having gear last an entire year does not mean the XIV wouldn't push out content. It would just be content that doesn't include gear acquisition, but may just be story or activities. Not agreeing with armor lasting that long, just pointing out simply acquiring gear isn't content. Otherwise, you could log in, be rewarded gear for logging in and that's legitimately being labeled as content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Nedkel

All what i am asking for is to give us an option to obtain bis gear by doing something else than savage raiding.

---

That's honestly what I was hoping relic weapons and artifact armor would turn out to be. However, instead we got them tied to Eureka and no story that was previously tied to A Realm Reborn and Heavensward. It's also why I don't think relic and artifact armor should be so far behind savage raid gear, it should be released at the same time, or very close to. Worse yet, they made the customize-able stats completely RNG instead of picking and choosing as it were in ARR and HW. For those that don't want to do that grind, there's still the tomestone gear that will have its upgrades unlocked eventually from hunts and the 24-man raids. People will always do EX primals for the mounts and they could offer alternative drops, like accessories, that they once did in the past, since there are no artifact accessories. Just don't lock relics and artifacts behind things like Eureka.

Item level cap increases only happen on even patches. Lets look at Stormblood.
4.0 - 6/15/17 to 4.2 - 1/29/18 about 7 months
4.2 - 1/29/18 to 4.4 - 9/17/18 about 8 months
4.4 - 9/17/18 to 5.0 - 7/2/19 about 10.5 months

So gear lasts between 7-10 months before it is replaced that is a lot of time for you to use your gear you get.

I think gearing system is betterin ffxiv, than any other mmo. It is still not perfect. I especially hate how big advantage players can get during first weeks only by grinding gil for crafted gear, but I guess that is the way how crafters can make their billions.

Some gear are also relevant whole expansion, if you run ultimate, because that content have level sync and it is still fun content.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Kaitoo

Such an arbitrary and forced point.

---

How so?

Quote:

---

If gear is no content and not important at all,

---

Gear is a tool that helps you do content, so it's important in that regard.

Quote:

---

why not just auto sync to everything and getting all the necessary stats through leveling?

---

For the sake of game progression. It allows each expansion to pause leveling while still allowing your character to continue to increase in power to be able to do newer content.

Quote:

---

Why is there gear if its neither content nor should be something we should care?

---

Gear is a tool that helps you do content, so you should care about it in that regard.

Quote:

---

I think gearing system is betterin ffxiv, than any other mmo.

---

I much prefer having tangible options where spreadsheeting gear options and upgrade paths leads to a rewarding result.

I look at EQ's gearing from Planes of Power until they consolidated secondary stats as the absolute best for how gearing (stats, not acquisition) should work.

You had, at any given time, 4-5 different possible best in slot items per slot, where the newest, shiniest one might not actually be better for everyone, and having to figure out which piece(s) you would use to get which secondary stats or mods. As a Paladin, I had to have 2 tank secondary stats (with different caps), 1 or 2 melee secondaries (was almost impossible to get all 4 of them, as they were the lowest priority), 4 or 5 casting focuses, mana regen, 2 weapons and 2 ranged slot items, and there were 2-3 different builds each endgame zone that I had to pick between and figure out upgrade paths, so I didnt magically lose 10% mitigation by gaining 30 hp.

I dont think any game has better managed player preferences in how they want to gear up and in what order they want to gear up.

Quote:

---

Heck, Tank accessories BiS are crafted gear if I'm not mistaken.

---

Yeah, accessories fall on a strange point in the stats/ilvl curve. They provide no armor and are weighted with tanks primary stat as its second primary slot, so overmelding fully can win out over the raid drops. If they had armor, or if str was prioritized over vit on tank accessories, you would use the savage or tome (or both for rings).

Quote:

---

What's interesting about WoW gear stats?

---

I enjoyed once upon a time trying to figure out the best balances of defense, block, block value, raw HP and other defensive stats as a tank.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Yeul

Err, dunno where u take that info, but FFXIV number are actually increasing over the last few months. A lot of players coming from other games, and most of FFXIV players are still playing even in the end of STORMBLOOD

---

Source on that? The highest sub count that we know of was the Stormblood launch thanks to Yoshi-P and as far as the Census goes we only see active characters. This doesnt take into account alternate characters meaning part of that playerbase count are the same person counted twice. So my guess would be we at least have 400k active subs and maybe 500-520k if we want to be generous.

As for growth there has been almost none since the launch of SB, if you keep up with the B.Census you’ll notice a trend of numbers going between 550k-620k with a rare drop/increase every now and then. All this can imply is the population stabilizing itself, hell the latest Census itself only has NA gaining (~1100) members while EU lost around 300 and JP lost 12k but it hasnt fallen under the 550k count. I do think if ShadowBringers does nothing to bring value to gear and keeps to the same old formula then we might see the average drop due to burn out.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Noodle_Trinidad

Source on that? The highest sub count that we know of was the Stormblood launch thanks to Yoshi-P and as far as the Census goes we only see active characters. This doesnt take into account alternate characters meaning part of that playerbase count are the same person counted twice. So my guess would be we at least have 400k active subs and maybe 500-520k if we want to be generous.

As for growth there has been almost none since the launch of SB, if you keep up with the B.Census you’ll notice a trend of numbers going between 550k-620k with a rare drop/increase every now and then. All this can imply is the population stabilizing itself, hell the latest Census itself only has NA gaining (~1100) members while EU lost around 300 and JP lost 12k but it hasnt fallen under the 550k count. I do think if ShadowBringers does nothing to bring value to gear and keeps to the same old formula then we might see the average drop due to burn out.

---

If we go by the same census data from 3.0, the average player counts are much higher per patch cycle.

Not that I believe they are accurate. I also doubt that how interesting the stats are on the gear is tied to how many people are playing. The game could have the most interesting gear options ever, but if the game itself sucked no one would play.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Valkyrie_Lenneth

If we go by the same census data from 3.0, the average player counts are much higher per patch cycle.

Not that I believe they are accurate. I also doubt that how interesting the stats are on the gear is tied to how many people are playing. The game could have the most interesting gear options ever, but if the game itself sucked no one would play.

---

They are hence the growth was seen in Stormblood. Anything after 4.0 has been mostly stabilization at least going off the numbers but youre right as a Census they should be taken with a grain of salt even if theyre the closest we’ll have to a safe guesstimate.

While I do believe interesting stats can convince people to play more my point is more around the lines of players finally tiring of the same old grind for what is essentially a +1 and that if ShadowBringer does nothing to alleviate this then we’ll probably see a drop off instead of an increase like Stormblood had. If you experience one full raid tier then you’ve essentially experienced them all in terms of gear progression and you will get to understand why many people don’t think the game respect’s your time grinding in the long run.

The description for horizontal gear is pretty accurate in this thread. However on a positive side, take note that As the way this game allows, there would be a lot more farming parties for that gear, Which would give you more to do in the game and eventually you would have a better chance to obtain it also. Horizontal gear in this game I would imagine would have a similar drop rate as the mounts in extreme trails.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Driven

The description for horizontal gear is pretty accurate in this thread. However on a positive side, take note that As the way this game allows, there would be a lot more farming parties for that gear, Which would give you more to do in the game and eventually you would have a better chance to obtain it also. Horizontal gear in this game I would imagine would have a similar drop rate as the mounts in extreme trails.

---

The problem with that, is that then you have to hope it's for your job, and then that it's a piece you want.

Layers of rng on top of layers.

Imagine the alliance raids, but with extreme mount drop rates on the gear...

No thanks...